Malcolm Ballistic Tool (MBT) long range rifle

[Love Life]

Hello all. Awhile back I began pestering Tim (Goodsteel) to make me a long range rifle. Right after making the phone calls and talking everything through, Murphy (the bad luck guy) came and made himself at home on my couch. Fast forward to today.

Today the clouds parted, the sun came out, and the planets aligned. My reamer is shipping, AND the barrel I needed was in stock (thank the lord).

What Tim is working with as a base is a FN SPR A5m chambered in 308 Winchester. Now this is a very accurate rifle, and it has everything I was looking for in a rifle, but the 308 has become boring. The barrel is chrome lined so I can't cut it to make the rifle more fun or interesting. Plus it is really only good for target shooting and hunting coyotes and up.

Now to the plan. This rifle will be rebarreled to .243 winchester. The barrel will be a 26 inch (upon completion) Krieger with a 1 in 7.5 twist and 6mm. The plan? I want to still shoot far, but with a .243. I will get about 20 ft less drop at a 1,000 yards shooting the .243 Winchester and 100-115 gr bullets, brass is very available, I can use it for pounding our ground squirrel and jack rabbit population at long range, and it is just cool.

Add in some Retumbo, Win 780, or some 4831 SC and I can really make them heavy 6mm bullets move.

I am starting this thread so Tim can detail his work for all to see. Below is what the rifle looks like now.

[Lefty SRH]

Nice, is that the factory stock?

[Love Life]

That is the factory stock. A Mcmillan A5 with adjustable cheek saddle. Very nice stock with spaces for me to change length of pull as well. It also has a bajillion places to install sling swivels (6).

Tim will be using a PTG reamer and a Krieger 6mm barrel that is 1.250 at the action and will taper to .900 at the muzzle.

[Love Life]

Bump.

Rifle has been shipped to Tim along with hopefully everything he needs!!

[jmort]

"Will soon be playing the "Lets see how fast I can burn out a barrel" game."

The .243 is a beautiful thing. Low recoil and long range. With that twist the 115 VLDs should work real good. And an underrated killer.

[Love Life]

I contemplated a muzzle break to further reduce recoil for uber fast follow up shots, but I felt it would make me a girly man. I'm hoping to get the wife into shooting long range with this one as well..

[Artful]

You calling me a "Girly Man" - really?
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v355/rowdyfisk/Payson%20June%2011/0611111403c.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/rowdyfisk/media/Payson%20June%2011/0611111403c.jpg.html)
And just an FYI try IMR4350 powder for lighter pills in your 243

[Love Life]

No Artful. I referred to myself as a girly man.

While a comp makes a bunch of sense, I don't want to fool with the noise. Lighter pills for me are going to fall in the 70-95 gr range. BLC-2 and Benchmark should cover those right nicely. I hope to have it back with Tim by the beginning of 2014 for a barrel setback...

[TheCelt]

How much you want for that pulled .308 barrel???

[Artful]

I'm using 80 grain winchester PSP - and IMR4350 worked very well.

1000 yard stare
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v355/rowdyfisk/FAL/P1020503.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/rowdyfisk/media/FAL/P1020503.jpg.html)

closeup of the targets
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v355/rowdyfisk/FAL/P1020502.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/rowdyfisk/media/FAL/P1020502.jpg.html)

107 SMK
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v355/rowdyfisk/Misc/David%20turns%2050/1000YD2-4001.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/rowdyfisk/media/Misc/David%20turns%2050/1000YD2-4001.jpg.html)

Some days you don't take the 10th shot cause you can tell it's just going to be a waste

[Love Life]

I'm looking forward to the fun!! It always amazes me how far 1,000 yds is. The 1,000 yd mark is my favorite! I'm just waiting until the day I shoot a 3 inch group at a 1,000 yds with no witnesses around...like every rifle ever on a certain forum.

Right now I have the Hornady Match 105 gr and Nosler Custom Comp 107 gr to play with. I'll branch out from there. I wonder how light I can go with the V-Max, and I'll have to watch speed to keep from shredding them.

[jmort]

I wish I could do that. Photo says 107 grain Sierra SMK, which makes sense. Getting an 80 grain bullet to do that is impressive,

[Love Life]

I need to play with the bergers and Precision bullets as well. Heck, by the time I get done playing with all the bullets it will be time for a setback.

Nah. The ladder has always done well for me.

[M-Tecs]

I contemplated a muzzle break to further reduce recoil for uber fast follow up shots, but I felt it would make me a girly man. I'm hoping to get the wife into shooting long range with this one as well..

I use these http://www.wittmachine.net/ on my 223 AR's for faster follow-up shots on parire dogs. These are clamp on with no threading required. I must be a girly man.

[Love Life]

If I go with a break it will be threaded on. Still debating that one. I just don't see enough benefit for it to be a worthwhile addition to the .243 or this rifle. This thing will be heavy as it is and that weight will mitigate what recoil their is. All I see is more noise.

[M-Tecs]

On smaller caliber heavy rifles the brake allows for self-spotting and watching the impact. For me that’s the only benefit a brake offers. I am not recoil sensitive I don’t do brakes on the heavy recoiling big game hunting rifles because of the increased noise mandates hearing protection.

Most of my long range hunting rifles or prairie dog rifles are dual purpose rifles. I build them as NRA Match rifles and use them for other things. As such they all have .750 or .812 straight sections turned on the front of the barrel for the match sights. The Witt Machine clamped on brakes are ideal for me. I also have one for my 6mm BR and my 6mm XC but I have not had time to shoot them since I purchased the brake.

I just came back from a two week prairie dog trip with about 1,500 through the AR. It was the first real outing for the brake. My ability to self-spot and to see the impacts was greatly enhanced by the brake. For an application that self-spotting or seeing the bullet impact is required I am sold on brakes.

[Love Life]

That was my thoughts on the break. Although, if you load the bipod well, you can self spot at distance without a break.

I am still mulling the brake over. I'll chat it out with Tim, as it's only one REAL benefit is a HUGE benefit. If I get a break I will change my name to Shirley!! :bigsmyl2:

What POI shift are you seeing with the clamp on brake? Any? What are the torque specs for the screws and does it mar the barrel?

[Artful]

As long as Tim has the barrel in the Lathe just have him thread it and make a Thread protector that blends in with the barrel, that way if you don't screw on anything it will just look "normal".
Mine is threaded 5/8x24 and I use my 30 caliber can on it - sounds like a 22LR High Velocity round due to .243 sonic crack.

107's were because of the wind - same reason only 9 shots - you can use the 80's in still air. Putting the Can on the 700V still changes the POI from without it, and it depends upon which load your using how much it changes things.

[M-Tecs]

30 inch pounds on the screws, no change in accuracy, about 1 moa change of impact in both elevation and windage and I have only had it off once but no maring .

[dragonrider]

LL if you get a brake you can have Tim make a threaded cap to install if you chose to not use the brake.

[Love Life]

I'm going brakeless. I just see no need for a brake on this gun. It will weight 15 lbs or more when scoped. If it were an uber magnum, then I would look into brakes, but since it is a .243 I don't see a need for one. I've always shot without brakes so why change up a good thing?

[Artful]

You know more than just brakes screw on barrels... - just saying you never know when you want to hide a flash or shush a gun.

[Love Life]

True. Very true.

[MBTcustom]

If you want threads, I can make that happen. However, I really like to have the thing that is getting screwed in place in hand before I do that.
There are two reasons for this.
1. It allows me to match the threads to the thing I am screwing on.
This is extremely important to me as I believe that consistent accuracy comes from having the exit hole of said apparatus running true to the centerline of the bore within .0005 inches, and yes, I really can hit those numbers.
2. It allows me to clock the apparatus so that it is correctly lined up radially.
I despise crush washers with a passion. It's a mickey mouse way of doing a precision operation without having to do it right. I can clock that baby perfectly so that the words, holes, slots, etc are perfectly aligned and everything looks like it grew there.

Now, I have brass, dies, a barrel, and a reamer. All I need now is a rifle.

[Love Life]

The rifle is on the way to your house. No threads at this time, Tim. The barrel is long enough as it is, and I really don't want to screw a suppressor on it. I feel no need for a compensator on it either.

[Artful]

Tim, you might find this interesting
http://www.silencertalk.com/AAC-thread-guide.pdf

[Love Life]

Great link Artful!!


Right now I'm trying to decide which varmint bullet to play with. Looks like the 55 gr Nosler will get the nod. Should do the trick for ground squirrels at roughly 3700 fps and up. Boom...WHACK!!!!

[MBTcustom]

Couldn't hit "print" fast enough! What a link! I'm going to staple this to my booklet of barrel and action threads.
You should post that in gunsmithing tips and tricks section.

[Love Life]

4831SC from Gamaliel and Retumbo from 3rd Gen. Ordered last Tuesday, and delivered tonight!!

500 68 FBHP match bullets
500 107 SMK and I have a line on some more!!

Bad A$% scope to be super tacticool.

All I need now is the rifle.

[geargnasher]

Ya, Tim brings new meaning to the term "Precision Riflesmith". Spend a couple hours on the phone with him and you'll get an education in how far outta whack most guns are, and what he has learned to do to overcome the inherent alignment obstacles.

Gear

[Love Life]

Yes siree!!! He usually loses me right after "This is Malcolm Ballistic Tool."

[Artful]

Which bad a$$ scope is that?

[Love Life]

Steiner Military 4-16X50

BOOM....PING!!

[Artful]

NICE! Give us a review after Tim gets done and you have it all back together

[W.R.Buchanan]

Tim: take notice of the alignment registers on the 13.5x1LH, 14.5x1LH and 16x1 LH threads in these drawings.

Note that the front registers on all of them are -.001, plus 0. Rears are +/-.002

These threads are IMHO the only correct way there is to thread a barrel for a silencer or flashider, muzzlebrake etc.

The registers align the part with the axis of the bore, and all the threads do is take up the slack fore and aft and the accessory eventually butts up against the front of the barrel to stop its rearward movement.

I just removed an ugly Muzzle Brake from a friends SKS that was used to modify the gun so you couldn't launch grenades with it. The thing was screwed onto the muzzle threads and then tack welded on the underside of the brake.

After removing it and seeing that the threads were on the loose side I realized that when the weld shrunk as it cooled, it cocked the brake on the barrel to the extent that the bullets were actually hitting the top of the exit hole of the brake..

Owner had previously not been able to understand why he couldn't hit anything with the gun. Literally.

Relying on threads to align a muzzle accessory is a bad idea, as you can never predict what the actual clearance in the opposing threads will be. If both the ID and OD threads are made to the bottom end of the threads "book tolerance" then they will be tight. However if the barrel threads are on the low side and the accessory's threads are on the high side then you've got .006-.008 of slop to deal with.

Which is exactly what occurred with the SKS.

With the Metric threads I indicated, the front register is -.001+0 and the rear register is +/-.002 so everything gets lined up pretty well.

There are also several other threads illustrated that have large shoulders that the accessory can butt up against to insure the axis of the accessory is at least parallel to the bores axis. We would want "coincident" but could settle for a few thou off axis but parallel.

The register method takes care of all of this. I can not for the life of me understand why you would not put a close fitting register in front and back of a muzzle thread for accurate indexing of muzzle accessories. seems like a no brainer?

My .02.

Randy

[Love Life]

Barrel is on the lathe...

[Artful]

Congrat's - may all your turnings be true.

[MBTcustom]

Thought some pictures might be in order.
I got the barrel trammed in with my fixturing and here I'm indicating the bore with a range rod I built for this barrel:
84362

84361

84360

I got the tenon cut and it's ready to thread:
84363

Scratch cut, and checked to be the correct pitch:
84364

It's a peelin!:
84365

Good fit:
84366

Bolt lug relief cut:
84367

That's the way I like it!:
84368

More pictures to follow.

[Love Life]

That's a whole lot of barrel!

[btroj]

What chassis system? Going suppressed? Should be a sweet LRP rifle........

[Love Life]

I challenge you to a duel, Btroj.

[btroj]

Uh oh. My wife always said I need a suppressor for my mouth.

[MBTcustom]

Bring the freakin popcorn. I've got a game to watch.

[btroj]

Tim, I may just put myself on injured reserve now rather than wait.........

[MBTcustom]

Brad, I thought better of you. :cry: (just between us, I wouldn't shoot against Dick either LOL!)

OK, the shop was a revolving door tonight, but I ended up in front of the lathe again. The moment of truth had arrived. I ran a drill bit in the barrel and started the chambering process.
Now, let me just say that I fully realize that there are guys out there that ream 30 target rifles a day, and most of them shoot cloverleafs at 100 yards. I'm not one of those guys....yet. I take my good sweet time, and I don't get in a hurry. I need to know that it's right, so just bear with me while I do my thing OK? thanks.
Next, I took my sharp little bitty boring bar, and slipped it in the chamber till I heard it touch the mock shoulder. I fed outward .005 and fed the tool out of the hole. I repeated this process till I was hearing a good, smooth cut all the way out. Then I checked the runout. The needle was fluttering at .0005 TIR. Pretty good.
Then it was time to ream.
I checked the reamer for sharpness. Once again, PTG reminded me of why I love them! Man those reamers cut smooth!
Anyway, I mounted the reamer in my self designed truely floating reamer holder, and soaked it with dark cutting oil.
84453
My reamer holder is so flexible that I have to guide it into the barrel by hand. Any pressure on the reamer creates an instant effect, and it is allowed to drift effortlessly wherever it wants to go. So far, it's the next best thing to a pull through.
84532

I continued working it into the barrel 1/16" at a time. Once I got within 1/2" of full depth, I started checking that the chamber is cutting correctly by indicating TIR on the reamer, and also observing how much I can wiggle the reamer in the chamber when it's fully seated. Throughout this chambering, the reamer had less than .0002 TIR and less than .0005 lateral and vertical play when pressure was applied to the shank.

I stopped reaming .015 short of the headspace, and removed the barrel from the lathe. I mounted it in the barrel vice, and used a toothbrush to apply valve grinding compound to the threads on the tenin and the action. I used Q tips to carefully remove all traces of lapping compound from the action face, and the thread shoulder on the barrel. I lapped in the threads with the action in the action wrench, until it would stop suddenly and repeatably. Then I lapped a little more by hand.
84454
The next part is to cut the extractor cut in the tenon, then cut the barrel off, cut and grind in the crown, then polish the tool marks out. The new bolt handle also needs some attention.
Details, details, God is in the details.

[Lefty SRH]

What caliber are you chambering the barrel for? What action is being used?

[Artful]

First post says .243 on FN SPR A5m

[gcollins]

Love Life,
It is getting close!! I have been reading along since the start! And it is looking AWESOME!! Good Steel is doing you right!! Keep us up to date on it, I can't wait to see how it shoot's!! I hunted with a Ruger #1B in 243 W
that was a real tack driver for a un touched out of the box rifle. I can't tell you how many boxes of Serria 85gr BTHP's that I shot threw it, it really like the 85gr bullet and IMR 3031. It has been to long ago because I can't remember how many grains of 3031:oops: Sad Thing was I thought I knew as much about reloading as anyone :shock: For the last 2 years I have been reading any and everything I can about ADVANCE reloading :shock:
I have found that you have to filter threw a lot of stuff, but even a dumb old hick like me can re learn new things!!!
G

[Love Life]

Did you put the chamber in the end closest to the buttstock...

It's looking great!!!

[MBTcustom]

Did you put the chamber in the end closest to the buttstock...

It's looking great!!!

Wait......that's the skinny end right?....no, my other left.....darn it, you got me all turned around! LOL!

I didn't get as far as I wanted to tonight. I had a feller come over to learn how to cast boolits. I realize I don't know everything about this hobby, but the advantage of teaching rank newbs is that I am quite confident that they will forget most of what I say, and they will come here to improve, at which point the heavy hitters can set them straight. LOL!
My favorite part of teaching someone is when they say "that's easy!!!" at which point, I smile and say "and it's cheap too!!!" I know I shouldn't tell bold faced lies like that, but you gotta rope 'em in some way right? Ignorance is bliss....

ANYWAY, back to the project at hand....
I cut the extractor slot tonight.
First I set it up in my barrel vice and seated the action to the barrel with the wrench. A little tighter than I will actually seat it, but I have learned to give myself some room to wiggle in case the threads crush a little. The clamps were loosened, and the rifle was twisted until it was dead level, then the clamps were tightened again, and the barrel was marked to the blocks to assure myself that it didn't spin when I broke the action threads loose.
Then the vice was turned 90 degrees, and the bottom edge was indicated in parelel to the table.
I cut the extractor slot with a 1/4" carbide endmill, to the same depth as the original barrel.
84515

Layout blue was applied. (I swear, I'd be lost without that stuff!)
84516

The action was spun onto the threads, and checked for alignment. This shot was taken through the action, to observe how the cut lines up with the bolt races.
84517

Next, the bolt was inserted and closed several times, and then the action was unscrewed and the blue was observed for interference. The only place that touched was the bolt lug, and it is only .004 away from the barrel, so I'm not surprised it touched a little.
84518

Next, I carefully filed and stoned all the sharp edges, and then used the dremel with the woven abrasive tip to "melt" all the edges.
84519

Next I went back to the stones and removed all the machining marks.
84520

I'm pleased. I'm also convinced that the brass/bullets will not be scratched up by the edges of the chamber, but also has plenty of support.
84521

Next step is to cut the barrel to length and grind the crown in there, but I'm going to buff out all the little dings on the spinner before that happens, because that's the last time anything is going to touch that crown except a bullet.
After that, we'll modify the bolt, and get the reinforced swivel stud in the stock.

So far, so good.

[btroj]

Tim, it is nice to see what work done by a true professional looks like.

I sure hope Dick is up to shooting a rifle that nice.[smilie=s:

[Love Life]

If I'm not I'll lie about it and say I am. :bigsmyl2:

[btroj]

I would expect nothing less?

Are you picking the rifle up or Tim going to "send it"?

[Love Life]

I would expect nothing less?

Are you picking the rifle up or Tim going to "send it"?


:groner:[smilie=b:

He is going to have to "Send it"

And what is this thing?---> :bootgive:

[Hamish]

:groner:[smilie=b:

He is going to have to "Send it"

And what is this thing?---> :bootgive:

All of a sudden, there seems to a lot of LRP Talk in this thread,,,,,sending this,,,,,sending that,,,,,

Tim, thanks very much for including the pictures in most everything you post, it's a real treat, we know time is money.

[Artful]

:groner:[smilie=b:

He is going to have to "Send it"

And what is this thing?---> :bootgive:

It say "give a boot" when you roll your cursor across it

[Love Life]

It'll be odd at the range when I ask random shooters if they'll stand behind me and say "Send it" before I fire. If I'm at the range alone then I guess I'm screwed as nobody will be there to say it. Maybe I can call somebody and they can say "Send it" over the phone.

[btroj]

Ah, the iPad doesn't have a curser. That may explain my lack of understanding, Steve Jobs never did have a sense of humor.

Hamish is right, those photos tell such a story. Keep them coming Tim.

[runfiverun]

definitely keep e'm coming this is like better than hot-rod T.V.

so Richard you are gonna use those high speed low drag bullets in this rifle...... right?

[Artful]

1:7.5 twist must want to shoot missiles out of it - those VLD Berger's are nice but pricey

[Love Life]

Lamar- As low drag as possible!!! I'll be sticking to jacketed in this one. 107 gr SMK for target, 87 gr VMax for shorter range target and crushing ground squirrels, and 68 gr FBHP for making itty bitty holes in paper out to 300 yds or so.

Artful- I've heard great things about the new Berger 105 gr hybrid, but have yet to find any in stock to play with. As it stands now I have enough bullets to work myself to a setback by early next year.

Sure will be fun!!

[MBTcustom]

Well! It was an interesting night! There were three fellers that showed up and decided to stay and watch me breath life into the rifle.
I was too busy focusing on what I was doing to take detailed pictures.
The barrel was cut to 26 1/4". Then set up, lined up, and crowned. I didn't stop tweeking on those adjustments until there was no discernible movement in the indicators. I cut the crown while three grown men held their breath. Once the cuts were made, I inserted the range rod again and double checked that nothing had moved, and it hadn't, so I slipped it out of the lathe, and took it over to the barrel vice. I torqued the barrel to the action gently, and checked the bolt. It was golden.
I removed the bolt, and spent the next hour reaming out the last few thousandths till the bolt just closed on the headspace gauge. The bolt dropped at 10:15PM and a new rifle was born.
Here she is, the Fat Lady:
84609

84610

84611

[Lefty SRH]

I can't get the pics to open up.

[btroj]

Damn Tim, you tease us with commentary like that and post photos that won't open? There should be a law about this.

[MBTcustom]

You still can't see 'em? I loaded them right off of photobucket like the others. Weird.

84613

84614

84615

There they are again. Somebody tell me if you can see them!

[Sweetpea]

Might see them better if it wasn't so purty and shiny...

Looks good!

[btroj]

Tim, thank you. I was losing sleep, couldn't eat, and was about to kick the cat.

Nice looking rifle there. I think he is gonna like it.

[Love Life]

Oh man. I better start working the dumbells!!

She looks fantastic, and with all that weight recoil should be a non-issue.

Just beautiful.

I know the stock has a barrel channel you can drive an 80's model buick through, but how is the clearance between stock and barrel? Is it still free floating with pressure on the bipod?

[jmort]

That will reach out real good. Interested to see how the 105 VLDs work. You will rightly be proud of that beauty.

[MBTcustom]

Oh man. I better start working the dumbells!!

She looks fantastic, and with all that weight recoil should be a non-issue.

Just beautiful.

I know the stock has a barrel channel you can drive an 80's model buick through, but how is the clearance between stock and bipod? Is it still free floating with pressure on the bipod?

Well, I think it has plenty of room left in the front end of the barrel channel.
It get's real close in the rear, but I will definitely be checking it out. I finished sticking it in the stock at midnight last night, so I checked the float with a slip of paper, took some pictures, posted them, then took a 4 1/2 hour nap before I got up and went to work at the day job, so I really didn't have time to check it to the enth degree.
I'll hit it again tonight.

[Love Life]

I love it and thank you for putting your heart and sweat into it. A bolt knob, some bedding, a better bipod mounting solution, and make it look like a tumble weed threw up on it!! It's going to be great.

It'll be kind of odd in Georgia though. People will give me weird looks at the range wondering why I'm sitting behind a tumble weed...

ETA- Who is left handed in your area?

[runfiverun]

hey Tim, you might wanna make up a bunch more of those sling stud/bi-pod holder thingy's you made a limited run of.

give me a few day's notice before you attempt the first "tactical entry" into the house with your long range rifle [err long range precision tactical sniper set-up] I wanna see how it goes through doorways and down the hall. :lol:

[MBTcustom]

I love it and thank you for putting your heart and sweat into it. A bolt knob, some bedding, a better bipod mounting solution, and make it look like a tumble weed threw up on it!! It's going to be great.

It'll be kind of odd in Georgia though. People will give me weird looks at the range wondering why I'm sitting behind a tumble weed...

ETA- Who is left handed in your area?

Dick, would you like me to have my brother paint I for this area since you know that's where you are going to land?

[Love Life]

Dick, would you like me to have my brother paint I for this area since you know that's where you are going to land?

Nope. Stick with the tumble weed paint scheme. I'll wrap some mcnetts around it for Georgia, or I'll take the paint off with citric strip and hit it with some Krylon to match the Georgia area. I've still got a whole winter of desert hunting in front of me.

ETA- Actually I wouldn't need to strip it. I'm sure it will blend in fine since I used to slaughter deer while dressed like an orange hi-lighter.

[Love Life]

hey Tim, you might wanna make up a bunch more of those sling stud/bi-pod holder thingy's you made a limited run of.

give me a few day's notice before you attempt the first "tactical entry" into the house with your long range rifle [err long range precision tactical sniper set-up] I wanna see how it goes through doorways and down the hall. :lol:

I agree with the sling studs. A much better solution than the threaded in sling studs. Much better.

[MBTcustom]

hey Tim, you might wanna make up a bunch more of those sling stud/bi-pod holder thingy's you made a limited run of.

give me a few day's notice before you attempt the first "tactical entry" into the house with your long range rifle [err long range precision tactical sniper set-up] I wanna see how it goes through doorways and down the hall. :lol:

Already in progress.

[MBTcustom]

Tim can I breathe now???

LOL! Wasn't so much talking about you as I was Jason. I think he was holding back tears as I ran the saw through that Kreiger. LOL!

[gcollins]

LL, Tim did you right!! The crown on that barrel :shock::shock: Awesome!! I can't wait to see how it groups??
LL, I have a question : I believe that you posted 2 bullets that you are going to use. I should of went back to the beginning of this topic and found the thread instead of my babbling on! I really think that you are going to love those longer projectiles, and it should group the 87gr pretty tight!!
I do wonder on the 68gr pills, with the fast twist is, if you can get them to fly strait for the first 50 feet, you will have it made!! Twenty years shooting the same 243 rifle, and it didn't take but a couple trips to the range, and I had my bullet, all my powder data, plus case length, bullet seating depth, ect.
Please don't take anything I have stated the wrong way!
I would love to have someone to shoot and also to shoot the breeze with!
Keep us up to date?
G

[Love Life]

I guess I could use this rifle for tactical entry, and you'd be able to see it from Idaho since it is so long.

Unfortunately this rifle does not qualify for LRP.

It is not FDE
There is no rail on my scope rings to mount a red dot
There is no bipod rail
There is no rail to mount night vision
It is not threaded for a 20 ft long suppressor
It is not compatable with MOLLE systems
There is no stock pack with the following inside: Data book, wind meter, mil-dot master, spare ammo, chapstick, a snack, spare socks, reading material, etc.
There is no buttspike for that 3rd point of contact
there is no 10 rd magazine hanging from it...yet.

[Love Life]

LL, Tim did you right!! The crown on that barrel :shock::shock: Awesome!! I can't wait to see how it groups??
LL, I have a question : I believe that you posted 2 bullets that you are going to use. I should of went back to the beginning of this topic and found the thread instead of my babbling on! I really think that you are going to love those longer projectiles, and it should group the 87gr pretty tight!!
I do wonder on the 68gr pills, with the fast twist is, if you can get them to fly strait for the first 50 feet, you will have it made!! Twenty years shooting the same 243 rifle, and it didn't take but a couple trips to the range, and I had my bullet, all my powder data, plus case length, bullet seating depth, ect.
Please don't take anything I have stated the wrong way!
I would love to have someone to shoot and also to shoot the breeze with!
Keep us up to date?
G

I too am interested to see how the 68 gr bullets shoot. They are close to 70 gr...:bigsmyl2:

I should be safe with them, and they should fly well. I hope. They were cheap enough to experiment with and if the gun hates them I'll sell them. I think my biggest concern is shredding them if I send them screaming from that 1 in 7.5 barrel.

I've got 107 gr SMK, the 68 GR FBHP, and 87 GR V-maxes which are long enough that they should be fine. I also have 105 gr SST's to play with. Whatever the gun doesn't like will go for sale.

I don't expect to have to do much load developement. I'll zero at 100 yds, and do load developement at 200 and 300 yds. I might even shoot a ladder test (gasp)!

I have so many different bullets just to play with. I could 107 SMK for everything, but that VMAX screaming down range will cause quite the hydraulic disruption...

[Love Life]

Oh, and with my new duty station there is a 200 yd range not far.
There is an 800 yard range in Fort Gordon I can hit occasionally and the FIL has quite a few acres with fields and stuff in Aonia, GA.

I reckon this rifle will get shelved most of the time in Georgia unless I plan a trip to the FIL's place or fort Gordon. Plus the FIL has mucho coyotes and deer on the property!

I reckon I need a benchrest gun built next so I can go back to chasing bug holes with the 200 yd range. I believe I still have all of my .222 stuff still kicking around.

[btroj]

But he didn't mention a lack of a chassis system.

Someone has a wanna be rifle!

Tim, am I gonna get in trouble for throwing salt in a wound?

[Love Life]

Chassis are lame. Super lame. Heavier and flat out suck in cold weather. I'm going to laugh at the first person who freezes their hand or face to their aluminum chassis.

My guns hunt. They don't go from the safe, to the truck, to the bench, to the truck, to the safe. That is for the birds.

[btroj]

Why wouldn't anyone want an Al frame on a gun that could be used in hot or cold weather? Not very hand or face friendly.
Maybe LRP guys are about fashion, not function?

That rifle should shoot very well off the bipod. Yotes aren't gonna be happy.

[Love Life]

I have to give the Chassis credit where it is due. It is rigid and allows use of aftermarket mags without having to buy bottom metal. They are true bolt ins (for the most part) that seriously upgrade the capabilities of the weapon. They just suck in the cold. I'm not peeing on my hand to unfreeze it from a stock.

[btroj]

I would pee on your hand to unfreeze it from a stock. Just saying.

[Love Life]

Well played. Well played indeed.

[Balkandom]

Dick, I think the best thing you can do is just send it to me and I'll replace it with a good single-shot Handi-rifle in .243 so you won't have to get new brass. It's all shiny and perfect and all, you don't want that sort of thing.
Tim, good work. Dick has probably been around more of that sort of rifle than me, but I am good at telling poop from Shinola, and that's definitely not poop. Great job man.
The rest of you folk-get in on Goodsteel's work while it's still relatively cheap. He's doing amazing things, and once he gets the exposure he deserves, his days of amazingly incredibly affordable services will come to an end.

Just my 2 cents.

[Love Life]

Good try Mike, but I will be needing a nice walnut Remington 700 LA stock in the future.

Ya'll wait until I get this fat rifle back. 1st thing I'm gonna do is hike it to the top of a mountain just because Tim said I wouldn't. Then I'm moving into the Douglas County range to shoot itty bitty groups at distances farther than 100 yards. Then I'm hiking it back up the mountain to scream it from the hill tops.

Oh, and I need to get some moleskin...

P.S. Get down there and help Tim do the barrel break in, Mike.

[MBTcustom]

Yeah Mike, I'll buy you three beers. ;)
Dick, you did say to leave the trigger alone right? This baby is almost 4lb. It's a very crisp 4lb, but dang! A timney would be a huge improvement. I can't believe you shot that tiny 300 yard group with a trigger like that.
Think I'll start calling you "Iron Finger".

[Love Life]

I like that trigger. As you have felt, it is very crisp and gives me more control when my fingers are numb, or I'm breathing heavy, if I'm playing "I'm up, they see me, I'm down". I've looked into 2 stage triggers, but that one just aint broke.

[MBTcustom]

You got it. I'll probably like it a lot better when I shoot it.
Also, powders are still pretty scarce around here. I'm going to try to lay my hands on retumbo, but I have several here that may work good as well. What other powders do you plan on using?

[btroj]

Tim, when he wants to send it he needs to feel the trigger.

Isn't it amazing how we can learn to deal with a harder trigger pull thru repetition and experience?

[Love Life]

I've got Retumbo and H4831SC on hand for the heavies with BLC-2 and benchmark on standby for the lighter bullets.

Just use whatever suitable powder you have on hand. Just hit the Hornady's as hard as your powder allows and see what they do. The should fly fine throughout the charge scale as the twist is for them.

As for other powders I plan to use? I'll use whatever is around to be honest. Accurate rifles shoot accurately with the majority of stuff you can put in them.

[MBTcustom]

Triggers are dark art. I have no problems with a Mauser trigger that breaks at 8 Lb, but I have a M700 here that I'm working on for a local client that has an 8lb trigger that will dang near make you pee down both legs from utter frustration! I can't shoot worth a dam with that ***!
It's not all about weight. There's a lot of feel to it. But just like adding weight is the hulk smash method of adding accuracy to a rifle; removing weight is the hulk smash method of adding accuracy to a trigger.

[Love Life]

Tim, when he wants to send it he needs to feel the trigger.

Isn't it amazing how we can learn to deal with a harder trigger pull thru repetition and experience?

I have no idea how many tmes I have dry fired that rifle, but it numbers up in the thousands of times. Work bolt, fire, work bolt, fire. All while focused in on a little orang dot on the wall.

Lots of practice going from standing to dropping into the rifle as well. I'm used to her, and she treats me well.

[Love Life]

My Remington 700 came from the factory with a horrible trigger. I had to literally put all of my focus ad effort into squeezing that thing. First thing I did when I got back from the range was adjust it down to a crisp 3 pounds.

[runfiverun]

I try to get every trigger I have to about the 3 pound mark, this includes shotguns...
i'll take a nice 4 pound trigger though over a hinky 3 pound one any day.
especially one I might be wearing gloves to shoot [gloves alway's seem to make the trigger pull feel lighter to me]

man I really feel old now, rails and computer stuff to shoot with......siiigh.
I wonder what my old T.I would have said if I told him I wanted rails and a computer on my rifle back in 82.

[Love Life]

Didn't computers in 1982 require a whole room?

Once Tim shoots it he'll see why I love that trigger. It is very predictable if that makes any sense.

It may be a big fat rifle, but it isn't a bench gun. It will be carried around and hunted with.

[Artful]

Didn't computers in 1982 require a whole room?

Mainframes yes - Desktop units were starting to crop up
my first was a Radio Shack TRS Model 1 powered by Z80 chip - 16 K of RAM memory
http://www.mailsend-online.com/wp/trs80.jpg

Apple, Commodore, Amiga, and others were available.

Cassette Storeage for Data drive on most - you could find 8 inch floppy disk then the improved life 5 1/4 floppy - then double sided floppy - then 3 1/2 came out - Winchester Hard drives were hugely expensive - we sold one to an architect - Then IBM hardware hit the market and some dweeb named gates bought the best operating system (DOS PLUS) and shut it down and the world got Smoke and Mirrors Windows and blue screens of death.

[runfiverun]

I think I still have one of those cassettes somewhere...

[btroj]

And he uses it to play music while he is casting. His daughter laughs all night long at Run and his pathetic little cassette tapes........

[MBTcustom]

I am going to try to get out to the range today and stretch the barrel.
I've got a couple buddies that shoot F class that are going to help me out. One has the powders and the Hornady bullet length gauge, and the other has a scope that's better than what I have available. (I loaned out my Leupold to a client to see if his scope is causing the problem with his groups) I didn't expect to get this far this fast. Couple of late nighters really makes a difference. :coffeecom:shock:

[Love Life]

Dang. Makes me wish I had sent my scope, but UPS can go suck an egg. $85 to ship a 3 pound package...

[MBTcustom]

I dug around and found a Leupold VXIII 14X. That will do nicely.
Fixin to head to the range. I hope I'm having an "on" day.

[geargnasher]

I "dug around" last night looking for a scope for my new Savage .308 piggie blaster and all I came up with was a Weaver muzzleloader scope (NIB). Your boxes are deeper than mine! Happy shooting today, Manos!

Gear

[btroj]

Dig around and "found" a VXIII? I wish.

[Love Life]

I dug around and found a Leupold VXIII 14X. That will do nicely.
Fixin to head to the range. I hope I'm having an "on" day.

When I dig around in stuff I get black widow spiders. They really like 45 Colt brass.

[Love Life]

We'll see. All he has to work with are Lee dies and Hornady 105 gr HPBT match and Nosler 107 gr Custom Comps.

Moving to a new caliber during a reloading equipment/shortage is not the best idea...

He does have Nosler brass though. It's like Jewelry!!

[Love Life]

Nothing wrong with hoarding!! That's why I have 45 Colt brass.

[Artful]

God I am Old, I remember those being cutting edge and used a slide rule versus a calculator which was huge. The slide rule could fit in your back pocket.

I have no idea where my slide rule went - it had a belt case - woo hoo

So I expect we won't see any report until midnight about how it did.

[Love Life]

I hope, for his safety, that he put the chamber in the end closest to the buttstock!! :kidding:

I also asked him to break the barrel in for me. I know, super lazy.

[runfiverun]

wow, have him break in the barrel?
I think I have some 243 stuff kickin about and no 243 type rifle I coulda broke the err broke in the barrel.
I probably only have stuff to make up some hunting type loads though, I guess we coulda tried it on a deer and seen how it rode in the truck for a few day's before sendin it on.
maybe that woulda helped break it in.

[Love Life]

I read in a gun magazine that breaking in the barrel was paramount!

Are you saying that gun magazines aren't always right? :-P

I always do the shoot, clean, shoot some more, clean, shoot some more, clean, then shoot it until accuracy falls off.....

What can I say. It gives me a warm fuzzy.

[MBTcustom]

Well, I just got back. I didn't have an "on" day, and nothing really went perfect about the whole trip, but the rifle shot pretty good. Turns out my buddies powder stash wasn't as extensive as I had hoped. In fact, the only powder that he had that was close was R15. Went looking for data, and good ol Aliant doesn't know that you can shoot 107 gr bullets in a 243, so I had to guess based off the data they had for 90 grainers. (Thanks Aliant, your website sucks rock salt!)
Oh well! I decided to run a tame load of 36 grains.
I seated the bullets .002 off the lands and loaded 10 Hornady, and 10 Nosler.

I took her out to the "Field of Dreams" and set up a target at 100 yards. I couldn't get a good rest on the table we set up, so I decided to shoot prone on the ground.
The rifle preferred the Hornady bullets and after shooting 5 sighters, this was the next five from that batch (The one on the right was a called flier).
I was aiming for the hole in the 6:
84887

The Nosler bullets did similar, but not as well. Had about 7/8" groups.
They chronographed at 2730 fps.

The R15 gave about 75% case fill, and is really a touch too fast for this cartridge. After pouring over the data, I feel that I should have done what I was tempted to do in the first place and load up some with IMR7828 because that's a powder I have in my cabinet. It's right up there with retumbo and H1000 and should do quite well.

I'm very pleased with the results so far. Now I have some fire formed brass, and tonight I'm going to neck size it, check case length, and prime it up, and tomorrow I'll go back out and see what it does.

Here's a cool shot of the rifle on the machine that created it:
84888

[btroj]

Well done Tim, well done. Can't wait to see what Dick can do with that rifle. Sadly, we will need to wait, at least until he gets off the mountain top with his pile o'yotes.

[MBTcustom]

Indeed!
I would like to throw it out there for what it's worth, that I'm not a competition target shooter, and I have never had any formal training on how to shoot. There are going to be fliers and hurky jerky BS that I can't control, and a guy like Dick would trounce me in a real competition.
I'm doing the best I can to satisfy myself that this rifle is all that and a bag of chips, but Dick will undoubtedly make it's capabilities shine much better than I can.

[MBTcustom]

Just loaded up 15 with IMR 7828 and the Hornady HPBT. I trickled every charge.
I swabbed the barrel with JB, windex, and Hoppes #9 till it came out clean. I'm wasted. Put a fork in me I'm done! Time for bed.

[Love Life]

I believe you will be pleasantly surprised with the 7828. It was going to be my fall back if I could find nothing else.

Were you shooting prone from the bipod? I bet if you were at a solid bench with a front bag that you would have cut the hole out of the six.

A random load with non optimal powder fired from the prone with a bipod. That group is solid for that.
A rifle you have had no time behind until you built it. That group is solid for that.
No specific aimpoint. That group is solid for that. I bet if you were using a 1 inch orange pasty, aiming at the black diamond, with the POI about 1 inch to the left, it would be close to 1 ragged hole.

Also, the location of the cheek saddle screws indicate a wrong handed shooter meaning you had to completely rebuild your shooting position between shots.

What I'm saying is, is that group is just the tip of the iceberg and I am in no way disappointed or dissatisfied with it.

Have you bedded the rifle yet?

[btroj]

:killingpcWoah, bedded the rifle yet? That is a over the top, intimacy with at rifle isn't something I need to hear about:killingpc

[Love Life]

I've slept with many a rifle...

That rifle looks so sweet!!! I can't wait until it looks like a tumble weed and is rolling up song dogs!

I will say a few things on the FN SPR- FN did it right. As a baseline rifle, they are not cheap at all. I snapped that one up because the deal on it was impossible to pass up. It comes with one of the best stocks out there- A McMillan A5. The flush detachable magazine is easy to insert, remove, and doesn't hang up on stuff. It is CRF and smooth. Just a very well thought out rifle, and they can be found brand new for $1500 or so.

At first I wanted to hate the rifle because it wasn't a built up Remington, or Remington footprint aftermarket action, etc.

I have come to love that rifle. FN just did it right!! Now think on the little nugget that FN owns Winchester. I know what brand of rifle/action I'll be buying in the future.

[gcollins]

Tim,
After all those years that I had not shot any rifles and then I put that 243WSSM AR together I went to reading and there were guys talking about shooting 107gr bullets threw there 243's, I thought it was a typo or they were drunk, because when I had quick shooting my 243 the biggest bullet for a 6mm was a 100gr!! WOW, I just can't believe how stuff has changed!!
G.

[MBTcustom]

Yes, things have changed dramatically. I've only been reloading since 1995, but it was my father who taught me, and I never bothered buying new reloading books, so in essence, I'm a modern shooter with a vintage education. I find myself going through the same motions as shooters who got out of the game in the seventies and are just getting back into it in the last 10-15 years LOL!

Now, back to the project!
The rifle is not bedded. I'm a big proponent of "if it ain't broke don't fix it" and this rifle wasn't broke when it came here, so I figure I'll give it a chance to crack me a grin as is. If it needs pillars, then I'll strip out he bedding and do it my way no problem.
Now, I've got good news and bad news.
Bad news is its raining.
Good news is I scored a pound of Retumbo!

[Artful]

So did the rain slack off?

[MBTcustom]

Yep, I managed to get back out to the private range last night. I won't be able to really bench it up on sandbags till Friday, so I'm still shooting off the bipod. I was losing light fast, but I managed to get set up in time to shoot four groups before dark. I was set up on a slight angle and the rifle would jump to the left each time I shot, so the previous groups showed horizontal stringing and weren't good for much (although still under an inch) but I buckled under and changed my hold and shot a .350 group with one flier. Once again, I was in an uncomfortable position, and I punched the trigger on the third shot, and sent it wide left, but I was pretty happy with that.
85154

[Love Life]

That 4 lb trigger will teach you a thing or two about trigger control and follow through!!!

Once you ditch the abomination that is known as a bipod (not making fun of your bipod, but all bipods) I'm sure things will be fantastic.

[MBTcustom]

Iron Finger speaks truth!
Yeah, I think you're right. I've got a Caldwell rock rest, and I'm going to go set up on the public range. I would have done that in the first place had it been any other time of year, but around hunting season, you're going to stand there sucking on your rifle barrel for 3 hours waiting for a bench. [smilie=b:

[Love Life]

Hey man, free brass!!!

[MBTcustom]

Hey man, free brass!!!

3 hours of my time? That brass aint free. LOL!

[runfiverun]

3 hour wait ?????
I can go get my tires swapped over, stop at the bank, get the mail at the p.o., have lunch, fill the truck with gas, get my car registered, get my drivers license renewed, stop by and talk to a couple of my friends in town, and reload 50 rounds of ammo.
oh and still stop by the range and shoot some groups in 3 hours.

[Artful]

... shot a .350 group with one flier. Once again, I was in an uncomfortable position, and I punched the trigger on the third shot, and sent it wide left, but I was pretty happy with that.
85154

Yep, I'd be happy with that as well - was this the Retumbo or 7828?

[MBTcustom]

That was actually a Berger 95 VLD with 7828. Retumbo was too slow to get in the "node" (according to quickload) so I went with the 7828.
I'm sure the rifle is shooting well, Im just real bad out of practice. Now that primers and powder are back on the shelves, I need to get out there more with my rifles.

[runfiverun]

just pictured a guy with a walkie talkie watchin tim's truck just waitin for it to head towards the range.

[Love Life]

just pictured a guy with a walkie talkie watchin tim's truck just waitin for it to head towards the range.

Was the guy wearing a Gilligan suit? A boonie cover perhaps?

[MBTcustom]

I'm going to try to get there early, before the hoard of 30-30s and AR15s show up!

[Love Life]

Who shoots the 30-30 anymore? Everybody knows that the 30-30 isn't powerful enough to kill rabbits, let alone deer.

[MBTcustom]

I've got it! I will distract them by throwing a handful of 5.56 green tips out in the parking lot, and grab a bench before they notice!

[Love Life]

I heard that deer have evolved over the years and now have Kevlar skin.

[btroj]

Kevlar deer don't bother me, it is the Kevlar skin over AR500 muscles that but me. I get tired of using API for deer hunting. Last year I ignited the forest when I missed.

[btroj]

When SHTF will zombies be Kevlar protected too?

[Love Life]

:groner:[smilie=b:

That group looks nice. I wonder f 90's will be the sweet spot.

[MBTcustom]

Alrighty then!
I took the rifle apart, pulled the barrel and inspected everything carefully. I made a few adjustments, lapped this, scraped that.
Finally, I got to work on the bolt knob.
Sweet mother of all that is holy and sacred, WTH do they make these bolts of?!?!? I ruined two endmills, and had to resharpen my boring bar about a dozen times! That is some tough stuff!
Anyway, I got the darn thing threaded and sculpted out a bolt knob.

So Dick, what say you? thumbs up or down?
You said you wanted to be able to grip it with gloves. Not only do I think you can grip it while wearing gloves, I highly recomend you do so to keep from filing off your calluses on the knurling!
85402
85403
85404
85405
85406

[Love Life]

That bolt knob looks fantastic. If I can't grab old of that then I need to reevaluate my ability to own firearms...

Just fantastic. Looks like it has plenty of clearance so I won't knock it up on accident shoving a gloved hand into place. Nice a grippy as well. Just perfect.

[MBTcustom]

Thought you might like that.
Made it out of 416SS.

[Love Life]

I don't know how you did it, but you pulled my idea of a bad *** bolt knob out of my head and made it into reality. That knob is 100% legit. Strong, functional, and beautifully executed.

[Artful]

Are you going to darken/color it or leave it natural stainless steel?

[Love Life]

It's going to get painted to look like a tumbleweed with the rest of the rifle...I think. Yeah, that sounds good.

[tomme boy]

The bedding job on these rifles are done by GAP rifles. How does it look?FN sent all of the rifles to them as they could not do as good in house.

[Love Life]

Not this one. The A3's were bedded by GAP, the A5 is bedded by FN. Looks a bit like hot glue...Hence Tim bedding it if needed.

[tomme boy]

OK, I knew they were doing some of these. These rifles were really cheap a couple of years ago. The barlled action was like 399$. I wish I would have got a few of them. It looks great! You are going to like the 243. I used to shoot the 87gr HPBT Hornady out of my Rem VLS. I never could get it to shoot the 100+ gr. bullets very well. It would stack the 87gr into a 7 round group of .13" Don't overlook this bullet if you can find some. It kills deer really well too.

[Love Life]

TacOrd has the best deals on FN SPR rifles right now. I think they are selling the A4 (only difference is the stock).

Wasn't it CDNN that had the barreled actions cheap? Now just an action is $650.

The price tags on the A5 can be a bit shocking, but used ones can be had for much less. You get a $600 stock, $600 action, sweet barrel, and detachable bottom metal. They are not for the faint of heart or weak bodies though. They are heavy.

FN SPR rifles are what Remington rifles want to be like when they grow up...

Hell, the PBR is a CRF, sweet barrel, etc and sells cheaper than a comparable 700.

[tomme boy]

Yes it was CDNN. Mike at Controlled Chaos Arms bought a bunch and put them back together. Made a bunch of $$ off of them from what he said.

[MBTcustom]

Well so far, I am impressed with this action. It's well designed, well thought out, and extremely well executed.
It doesn't suck.
It's no Surgeon, but it's the next best thing I'm here to tell ya.
One of the things I am most impressed by is the way they did the CRF on this rifle. Most CRF rifles are very picky about feeding. They must strip from the magazine. This rifle is different because you can just slap a cartridge in there on top of the magazine and when the bolt hits it, it just kicks up and tucks under that extractor perfectly. Very nice!
The bedding is the hotmelt glue stuff, but it was done correctly, and seems to work fine. The action tucks in tightly, and the fit is superb.

[MBTcustom]

Here's a group fired last Saturday by yours truly with LL's rifle. Turns out I just needed to get a long enough bullet for the 7.5 twist. Buddy of mine hooked me up.
85826

That's an honest 1/2MOA even with the flier. If I discount the flier at 7:00 it's a 1/4" group.
85827

I was pretty impressed with that. I was satisfied down to my socks that this is a shooter. Now we can move on to paint, although I am going to load a few more of that bullet and see what It does at 600.

[Love Life]

That'll do it!!

[Artful]

Sounds like you got it put together real good.

[Sweetpea]

Updates???

[Love Life]

Hopefully shipping this week. Humidity is playing heck on the painting process.

[Sweetpea]

I'm curious to see how those lightweights do with that twist.

I've got some loaded up for a ladder test for my 243, but I won't be able to make it to the range until next weekend at the earliest.

Everybody tells me it's good to be busy, but when you go to work in the dark, and come home in the dark...[smilie=b:

[Love Life]

It'll probably shred the lightweight bullets if I smack them with a full charge. I have to know though. The 87 Gr V-Max bullets should be fine as they are usually long for weight. If none of those two don't work then I'll sell em' and invest in some more 107 SMK. There is something nice about shooting 1 bullet only out of a gun.

[Artful]

I haven't had any problems with 85-95 grain j-words in my 243 with full power loads.
Just punching paper haven't done any game shooting.

[Sweetpea]

I haven't had any problems with 85-95 grain j-words in my 243 with full power loads.
Just punching paper haven't done any game shooting.

Dick and I both picked up a slew of 68 grain FBHPs a while back...

Gotta be gentle with those and a 1:7.5 twist.

I'm running a 1:9 1/8 twist, in a rifle not quite so nice...

Brandon

[MBTcustom]

This is a picture of the rifle, that was just sent to me a couple hours ago by the painter.
89271
It has been cold and rainy here for quite some time. He has kept the environment at 98*F (20* weather notwithstanding) and will not shoot unless he can get the humidity below 50%. As a matter of fact, that's his humidity gauge there on the chair (I swear that guy watches the humidity like we watch the wind, and that gauge follows the rifle parts everywhere.
He told me that he was very careful to mask off the bedding surfaces so as not to change the way the rifle shoots.
I think he managed to get the final coat on today because there's another round of rain coming up tomorrow.
I sure do like his work!

[Love Life]

I like it. That aught to work very well here.

I'll be keeping a shooting log of this one so I'll be able to document when it loses gilt edge accuracy, when it loses varmint accuracy, when it looses steel accuracy, and when it finally just takes a dump.

[Love Life]

I've just been informed that it's finished!! Now comes the hardest part...waiting for the mailman!

[MBTcustom]

Yep. It's dry enough to ship. I'm happy, my brother Alex is happy (he's the painter), and we give it the Malcolm stamp of excellence.
I almost don't want to look at it too close because I think I'll decide to do it all over again.
You got best effort Dick. Absolutely best effort from me and my brother. This rifle is a milestone for me, and I hope it serves you well, as I believe you deserve every bit of it.

For those of you who don't know the back story, let me give you the details:
Back about a year and some months ago, LoveLife had a rifle for sale in S&S. It was a Sako AV, and I desperately wanted it. I have wanted a Sako rifle of my own for years, and that particular model was the best I could have hoped for because it was made the year I was born. LL was asking a ridiculously low amount for it, but unfortunately, I didn't have that much money to spend.
I decided to go for broke, throw my pride out the window and beg for a favor from a guy that I barely knew. I offered LL an absolutely pitiful amount of money and told him that I would make up the difference with labor via gunsmithing.
He accepted, much to my astonishment and joy, and I got the rifle I wanted but could not afford.
I made up my mind that when LL brought me work it was going to be my best, bar none, and this is the fulfilment of that pledge.

My friend, good things happen to good people, and you are one of the best. You deserve the best, and this is absolutely the most accurate rifle I have ever built for anyone (far more accurate than I am I assure you).
I hope it serves you well.

[Love Life]

Thank you for the kind words Tim. It has been a great experience and I'll do a full write up here shortly.

To everybody else: The rifle has shipped!! Should be here Thursday, but I won't be able to pick it up until Saturday. I will get some test loads with the 107 SMK made up Saturday, and hit the range Sunday. Full report coming!

At this point though, I'll go ahead and talk a little about the Gunsmith and his communication/timeliness on the build.

The Gunsmith- Communication in rifle builds, to me, is HUGE. Nothing like sending a couple thousand dollars worth of stuff to somebody and getting put on mute. I've had good work done before, but refused to give those places any more of my money because I didn't enjoy chewing my nails while being in the dark. I don't call everyday to chew the fat, so when I do call I expect to speak to somebody...period. Lack of comm is just flat unacceptable with the amount of money involved in rifle builds.

Nothing bad here to say at all. Tim has taken the time to answer any phone call I made, and every PM I have sent. I called, he answered, we talked through my ideas, and went from there. Same for PM's. If I pm'd him a question, he responded in a timely manner.

Tim was also able to save me some money, even though it may have cost him money. As I played on google and found the next best thing I would run it by Tim. If it was sound, he said so. If it was a fluff item. He said so. I appreciated that. Now, he could have nodded his head and added this and that and run up the tab, but he didn't. He kept ME focused on the purpose of the build.

Interpreting the customer's wants and executing them into reality: Tim was the man here. I would throw out a vague description of what I wanted on something, and he would build it better than I pictured it I my head. You can't beat that!!

Timeliness: Tim held very close to his timeline. Weather pushed things back a bit, and that is really all that delayed anything. I'd rather have Tim alive and kicking (and building rifles) than risk himself trying to make it to the PO during an ice storm.

All in all it has been a great experience. Tim has done his part building the rifle, and now I have to do my part shooting the rifle. Soon...

[btroj]

Awesome! Can't wait to hear about how it shoots.

[MBTcustom]

It's going to like heavy, long bullets. 7 1/2 twist is smokin fast.

[Love Life]

Next longest made are the Berger 108-115 gr class and DTACS.

[btroj]

What about the RPM threshold.......

[Love Life]

We'll see. According to the proponents, if the rifle is perfect then the treshhold goes up...or something. I'm pretty sure I'm going to vaporize the 68 gr bullets. We'll see though.

[MBTcustom]

Smoke if ya got em.......
LOL!

[runfiverun]

I guess I could go into a three minute tirade about the spin thing, but I just remembered you-tube is up and running so I think i'll go watch a hyper-crush video.
can't wait for the pictures of the yotes.

[Love Life]

I don't talk spin, seriously.

Bergers and Sierras allow me to ignore all that jazz. The coyotes are thick this year, I have my range cards, and nothing is safe where I plan on hunting. I just have to find a solid load, shoot it at a few distances to confirm, and then it's off to the races.

[btroj]

The yotes won't be happy this year.

[Doc Highwall]

Tim and Love Life what 6mm caliber is it chambered for?

[Love Life]

.243 Winchester.

[Doc Highwall]

I have a 6mm XC with a 30" barrel on a CG Millennium single shot action made for shooting the 107gr. Sierra and 115 DTAC bullets.

[Love Life]

How are you liking the 6XC? I went with .243 because brass grows on trees. I can use Norma or Lapua if I want to for range duty, and other brass for hunting and funning.

How's the barrel life on the XC and what twist rate are you using? Sure wish some DTAC bullets would come in stock...

[Love Life]

Picked up the rifle today. Getting ready to mount the scope now, and off to the range Saturday!!

[Love Life]

Ok, a bit more on the rifle now:

Weight: She is a pig. Scoped and with a sling the pig weighs 18 lbs. I knew this going in, and the sling makes carrying it pretty easy. She is long though....

Fit and finish: The fit of things is awesome. No complaints what so ever. The paint came out really well, and I am very happy with the paint scheme on it. The colors are just right to blend in well to the environment here. Kudos to your brother, Tim. He did his homework on my environment, and it paid off well.

Function: It fed my dummy rds just fine. It worked fine single loading it and feeding from the magazine.

Cool stuff: Tim makes a bipod mounting stud that is awesome. One of my major complaints on the rifle (as it was) was the sling stud for mounting a bipod was a screw in. Over time that screw would work loose. So, what Tim did is remove that and install his custom bipod stud. That thing is rock solid!!

Bolt handle/knob: Perfect. It looks huge in the pictures, but is very well thought out and proportioned. It clears my scope just fine, and with fat gloves on it is easy to grasp and there is plenty of clearance between the bolt knob, my fat gloves, and the scope when working the action. Just a superb job on the bolt handle. It is smaller than it looks and is smaller than most tree stump sized "Tactical" bolt knobs you see floating around. Also keep in mind that the only guidance Tim had for the bolt knob was to make it bigger, make it of steel, and make it grippy. He took that and turned out the perfect bolt knob for me.

Balance: It is a smidge front heavy. Now this isn't Tim's fault at all. I mean, we stuck a 26 inch Heavy Varmint tube on there. Tim, brought this up, but I waived off adding weight to the stock for better balance. I was playing with the rifle in the sitting and knealing positions and it wasn't unbearable at all. Now for standing I am going to need to eat a large breakfast and drink a can of man before shooting it!

I will get pictures later of her all scoped up.

Thoughts so far: The rifle came out perfectly for me. Tim took my stock rifle that I bought because it was close to what I wanted, and turned it into MY rifle that is exactly as I want it.

Great job Tim, and your brother as well. So far I am very happy and I would consider it as my money very well spent. Now I have to hike it to the top of a mountain.

[Sweetpea]

And how was range day?

[geargnasher]

OK, it's dark on Sunday night in Texas, my nails are nibbled short. Tell me you got some range time!

Gear

[Love Life]

No range time until this weekend. The matriarch is in town.

[Doc_Stihl]

Lovelife, if you don't have the 105gr Amax's on your short list of things to try, you should. My wifes rem 700 with a 9.125" twist sends those plastic tipped beauties out to 500 with authority. I shot a few different bergers, sierras, noslers through and nothing shot as accurately as the 105's. BC is outstanding as well.
Nice rifle you've got there.

[Sweetpea]

Dick, I know every rifle is different, but I got a chance to take mineto the range Saturday.

68 gn fbhp seated .010 off the lands.

Ladder test with Big Game, first seven rounds went under an inch. They started to climb out after that...

Brandon

[btroj]

No range time until this weekend. The matriarch is in town.

That is the perfect reason to get in range time. Just saying

[Love Life]

Sheesh. Getting everything ready and will be hitting the range Saturday.

Found my jam depth so now I just need to start powdering and primering.

Something cool I noticed? When finding my jam depth using 107 gr SMK, the jam depth fits my magazine. Sweet. Just sweet. Anywho, not much to report and now I'm rambling.

Guess I need to break out the weather meter and fill out my data book as well.

[btroj]

Send it

[geargnasher]

I gotta get to powdering and primering tonight myself. Not to be confused with powdering and primering myself tonight.

Gear

[Sweetpea]

I gotta get to powdering and primering tonight myself. Not to be confused with powdering and primering myself tonight.

Gear

PLEASE don't update us on the latter...

[Love Life]

107 gr SMK make a nice crunching sound when seated over a charge of 49 gr of Retumbo. Now to measure them in the morning to make sure they aren't growing....

[Doc Highwall]

Love Life, when I had my 6mm XC put togather I bought IMR-4350 to use as it was the go to powder for the 107-115 grain bullets, then Reloader 17 came out giving 150-200 fps more with the same pressures.
That will be my next purchase for this gun and is suppose to work as well in the 243 Winchester.

http://www.accurateshooter.com/cartridge-guides/6xc-for-competitive-shooting/

[Artful]

for heavies in 243 4831SC seems to be working well, give it a try

[Love Life]

Initial testing done. Woke up late, hit the desert for hours of uncomfortable prone shooting, no breakfast, to much coffee and cigs, got shooting late so the wind came in. More to follow as I'm currently eating ham sandwiches and measuring groups.

[Love Life]

A day at the range:

Read in its entirety.

The day started out bad with me waking up late. I was supposed to be at the range NLT 0630 and completely set up. The range I was supposed to go to has metal tables anchored into the concrete. Since I woke up late I ended up driving into the desert, and started shooting about 0930.
Rds fired: 74
Distance: 115 yards measured with LRF
Target: 3 inch Shoot N C on a blank piece of white paper
Front rest: 2 range bags stacked up, covered with an ISO mat, with a sandbag on top
Rear rest: Non firing hand, and towards the end an empty cartridge box under my hand
Shooting position: Prone and uncomfortable due to target location
Cleaning regimen: None. The barrel was not cleaned the entire time. I’ll clean it at some point.
Barrel cool down regimen: A smoke and some sips of coffee between groups while I worked the kink out of my neck
Shooting conditions: 0930-1100 crystal clear with a 1.8 MPH full value left to right wind. Mirage was significant. 1100-1200 13 MPH Full value L to R wind.
Caliber: 243 Winchester
Bullet: 107 gr Sierra Match King COAL 2.300 Case head to ogive. Jammed.
Brass: Virgin Norma for zero and 46.0 gr group
1X fired Norma for 46.5 gr- 49.0 gr groups
Primer: CCI 200
Powder: Retumbo
Special actions: Bullets sorted by base to ogive length. No wind flags.
Group measurements: I did not subtract bullet diameter from any measurements, and measurements are outside to outside. H=Height of group. W= Width of group. There are pulled shots in the groups, but they are not annotated here.

Group 1: 46 gr Retumbo and 7 shots fired. All I had was 7 shots after zero. H: .921 W: 1.152.
91210

Group 2: 46.5 gr Retumbo and 8 shots fired. H: .714 W: 1.48791209

Group 3: 47.0 gr Retumbo and 8 shots fired. H: .989 W: 1.228. I’ll be retesting this group .010 off the lands and at a better range with comfortable shooting position.
91212

Group 4: 47.5 Gr Retumbo and 8 shots fired. H: .901 W: .991. I’ll retest this group as is, .010 off the lands, and at a better range. Nice and round.
91211

Group 5: 48.0 Gr Retumbo and 8 shots fired. H: 1.292 W: .765. I may or may not retest this one, and this is the 1st group where the wind really came into play. A 13 MPH FV came in and stayed through the rest of the testing. I should have packed up and went home, but oh well.
91214

Group 6: 48.5 gr Retumbo and 7 shots fired (I shot a rabbit so fresh rabbit for dinner tonight). H: 1.242 W: .779 I’ll retest this one with no changes. Hard to gauge this group due to conditions and shooter fatigue.
91213

Group 7: 49 gr Retumbo and 9 shots fired (had 49 pieces of brass so the math added up this way). H: 1.112 W: 1.559. I’ll retest this one with no changes. Hard to gauge this group due to conditions and shooter fatigue.91215

Thoughts: There was a whole lot going wrong for my shooting this morning. I consider the coffee and cigs a non-factor because I always smoke and drink coffee. I started late and ended up getting hit with the wind. Those last 3 groups are pretty much me tossing primers, powder, and bullets in the trash. The combo of wind and shooter fatigue ( quite uncomfortable position) makes those groups unreadable. Sucks, but it is what it is.

Retumbo is a dirty powder. The crown looks like I just shot a mad minute with cast boolits full of wax lube. 91216


Some groups showed promise and I’ll be retesting them at the legit range. I also have 4831 SC to test next… All in all I am quite happy. The rifle performed as expected, and with a little tuning along with a better shooting spot I’m sure the groups will be much better. As it sits, the only loose screw on the rifle today was pulling the trigger.

[btroj]

Sounds good. If it will do that prone then I can only imagine what it will do from a proper rest.

Most important things as that YOU are happy.

[Love Life]

Man Retumbo is funky stuff. Case necks were dark with soot as well. Oh well. I see a node from 47.0 gr-47.5 gr. I'll work that node and see what happens. I'll shoot 47.0 gr and 47.5 gr .010 off the lands and I'll work 47.2 and 47.4 jammed. Should be fun.

Pizza time and back to the garage to load some up with H4831SC.

[btroj]

Is Retumbo dirty or is it just a bit slow for your use? Could you be seeing signs of low is pressure?

I do like the fact you can't really over charge the case with it, you run out of case space first.

[Love Life]

Seems too slow, and that is why it is dirty. I don't think it's getting a good burn. I talked to Tim about it, and the SMK probably aren't providing enough resistance in the bore for it to get a good burn, where as the VLD's did. Maybe a magnum primer will help, but I'm going to work out a good load, and then shelve it. 7828 SSC may be next on my purchase list. Maybe I need to buy a 300 WM to use it up...

[btroj]

I'm sure Tim will build you one.......

[Love Life]

Nah. Where I'm going a sling shot is more appropriate considering the extreme lack of public lands for shooting and all those stupid green things that grow tall and block your view...

A little more drift here, but where the heck are all the heavy 6mm bullets? 30 cal stuff everywhere, but try to buy some 105 hybrids, 107 SMK, or 115 DTACS and you are SOL.

[Artful]

Try
www.brunoshooters.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=CTGY&Store_Code=BSS&Category_Code=berger-target-6mm

[geargnasher]

Switching to 4831SC seems to be a good solution to me.

Magnum primers may have a negative effect on your accuracy.

If you want to use Retumbo with the shorter BL boolits, try standard primers and replace a small quantity of the main charge with some booster.

Gear

[Love Life]

Thanks Artful!! Got me some 105 Hybrids on the way!!!

I just hate having to switch bullets at the 800 rd mark as I have 800 SMK...

[Doc Highwall]

Love Life, if the outside of the case necks sooted maybe the case necks need to be annealed even though they are new.

[Love Life]

My brass just had it's 3rd firing today so I'll be annealing tonight, but I hadn't thought of that and thank you for the tip.

Things went quite well with the H4831SC, but I really need to remember to bring my sunshade and mirage tape next time. I would really love an overcast and wind free day.

Also, 7 shot groups suck. Sometimes you just don't want to take shots 6 and 7. Boo.

Below are today's groups measured outside to outside. H= height W=width. Pulled shots are counted in the groups even though they make me angry...

All shots were fired form the prone using a box of magazines with a sandbag on top for the front rest, and my hand against the shoulder for a rear rest. I'll post photos when I return from the movies.
Powder: H4831SC

38.0 gr- H: .649 W: .506
38.5 gr- H: .576 W: .659
39.0 gr- H: .894 W: .542
39.5 gr- H: .602 W: .551
40.0 gr- H: .431 W: .719
40.5 gr- H: .947 W: .671
41.0 gr- H: 1.037 W: .696

[Artful]

Also, 7 shot groups suck. Sometimes you just don't want to take shots 6 and 7. Boo.

Below are today's groups measured outside to outside. H= height W=width. Pulled shots are counted in the groups even though they make me angry...

41.0 gr- H: .1037 W: .696

is that 0.1037 or 1.037?

And that's why I usually do 5 shot's or 10 shot's

[geargnasher]

MUCH better!

Gear

[Love Life]

1.037. I fixed it in the post as well. Christmas eve I'll be at the range with the benches running the new loads.

I am changing aiming points as well. The Shoot N C are cool, but with the red bull surrounded by black, it's hard to keep the crosshairs in sight. I'll be switching to 1 inch orange pasties with a black diamond aiming point.

ETA: The important thing is the 1st group. The clean, cold bore, shot is right there in the middle of the group. That is nice!!

[btroj]

Sounds like Tim did you right. Well, it also shows you know how to shoot.

[Love Life]

Tim did very well indeed!!! There are two things on a rifle that are every bit as important as group sizes, to me. Cold bore shot needs to be in the group, and the group needs to stay consistent through a string of shooting without a 5 minute cool down between shots. I'll do my final load work this week, and then it's time to stretch things out.

[Doc Highwall]

Love Life, one of the things I learned in small bore shooting with a scope is I place the crosshairs at 12 o'clock on the X ring with the bullets hitting the center so as not to destroy the aiming mark.

[Love Life]

That's what I was trying to do here, but I was using center bull with the POI below the bull. It's jut hard to pick up the crosshairs on the shoot N C targets. I'll try your method at my next shoot.

[geargnasher]

White paper and orange stickies with the diamonds work for me.

Gear

[Doc Highwall]

Love Life, see if you can get some of the white target pasters to use as a aiming point to show the cross hairs.

[Love Life]

Thanks for the tip Doc Highwall. I will try that as well. As it sits, my new targets have a 1 inch orange pasty with black diamond for tomorrow's shoot.

This rifle makes me angry (in a good way). Looking at the groups from the last couple of days, they all look good. There are only 1 or 2 real stand outs (they don't stand out far) and I'll load .3 gr below that load to .6 gr above that load in .3 gr increments to see where things shake out. Then it's time to stretch things out.

I may adjust seating depths after tomorrow's shooting, but maybe not. As it stands, this is an easy sub 1/2 inch gun for 5 shot groups, and a sub 3/4 inch gun for 7 shot groups. It's really hard to do load development with a gun that shoots like this. Especially from an improvised front rest with my hand as the rear support. As I say though, I've never been hunting and had a perfect bench with sweet sandbags magically appear before I took a shot. I think I'll have to dig out the old Sinclair front rest and see what happens, but in reality I'm just nit picking and chasing unicorns.

[Doc Highwall]

I also learned to lay down prone with a sling and a sand bag under my right hand ( I shoot left hand, blind in my right eye) for load development as the way the rifle is held affects point of impact as well as group size. The best way (my opinion) is the load development and sighting in for various zeros should be the same way that the gun will be used.

[MBTcustom]

You gotta try the heavies Dick. That's what that rifle wants. Once I fed it some 115gr bergers, everything came together rather suddenly. I was jumping them about .020 too.

[Love Life]

Wait until I post today's groups, Tim.

[Love Life]

20131224: A Day at the Range…again
So there I was, larger than life, hitting the rifle range. I woke up early-ish and headed to the range with metal tables bolted to the ground. My first group went down range at 0740. Enough of that gibberish and on to the shooting!!

Gun: Fat lady
Scope: Steiner military 4-16X50 Mil-Dot FFP Blah, blah, blah
Cal: .243 Winchester
Bullet: 107 gr SMK BTHP
Brass: 2X fired norma brass for the Retumbo groups. 3X fired Norma brass 1st anneal/1st trim for the H4831 SC
Primer: CCI 200 LRP
Distance: 105 yds measured with LRF
Temp: 40-55 degrees F
Wind: 0-2 MPH FV R to L
Sun: 9-3 start and ended 11-5

Shooting position: Sitting at steel bench in a folding camp chair. Table is metal and bolted into concrete

Front rest: Caldwell sand bag with a folded up deerskin stacked on top to add front elevation
Cleaning regimen: Barrel was not cleaned at all between strings per powder. The only cleaning occurred when I switched from the H4831SC loads to the Retumbo loads.

Rear rest: Rolled up piece of deer skin used for fine POA adjustments

Groups: H4831SC- 8 shot groups, last group 9 shots
Retumbo- 6 shot groups, last group 7 shots

How groups were measured: Outside to outside. Pulled shots included in measurements. Bullet diameter not subtracted from measurements. H=Height W=Width

Barrel cool down regimen: No time allowed between shots in strings. Shots for each powder charge were fired as fast as I could load them and acquire a solid aim. Half a smoke and a few sips of coffee while I filled out the data book between strings (with each powder and powder charge) was all the barrel cool down allowed. After I finished all 6 groups with the H4831, I cleaned the barrel with Butch’s Bore shine. I ran two soaked patches down the bore, allowed to sit for five minutes, and then ran two dry patches down the bore. Once the barrel was cleaned I started in on the Retumbo groups.

Notes: I pulled a shot in every group. The pulled shots weren’t the CCB/CB (clean cold bore or Cold Bore) shot on any group. They are honest to God pulled shots.

The results:

H4831SC

39.0 gr H4831SC 8 shots- 1st group of the day and I shot what I call an “Admiral of the Fleet” group. This was from a clean cold bore. Experience shooting this rifle so far shows that this is the shooter, and not the rifle. The good news is that the CCB shot is right there in the 6 shot string. H: 1.055 W: 1.299
91491


39.2 gr H4831SC 8 Shots: CB shot is in the tight cluster. Pulled shot hanging out there in the middle of space. H: .681 W: .926
91492


39.5 gr H4831SC 8 Shots: CB shot is in the cluster. Pulled shot makes me want to fight dinosaurs. H: .522 W: .914
91493


40.0 gr H4831SC 8 Shots: CB shot is in the 6 shot cluster to the left. H: .530 W: .755
91494


40.2 gr H4831SC 8 Shots: CB shot in 7 shot cluster. Pull-o-potamus… The important thing about this group is that after shot #3, I stopped shooting to allow a newcomer to go down range and set up his targets. That took about 5 minutes. Shot #4 was smack dab in the group!! H: .599 W: .902
91495


40.5 gr H4831SC 9 Shots: CB shot in 7 shot cluster to right. H: .744 W: .831
91496


RETUMBO

47.0 gr Retumbo 6 shots: Jammed at 2.300 Case head to ogive. This group was shot after the barrel was cleaned and allowed to cool completely. CCB shot is in center with 1st 5 shots. Shot 6 made me want to kick my range bag, but I played it cool. H: .695 W: .590
91499


47.0 gr Retumbo 6 shots: Jumped .010. COAL 2.290 CH to Ogive. I tried my hardest, but the 107 SMK didn’t like to be jumped with Retumbo. H: .883 W: .990
91500


47.5 gr Retumbo 6 shots: Jammed at 2.300 CH to Ogive. CB shot is in the cluster. Yes, shot 6 is the pulled shot… H: .668 W: .940
91497


47.5 gr Retumbo 7 shots: Jumped .010. COAL 2.290 CH to Ogive. Once again, I tried my best, but the 107 SMK didn’t like to be jumped. H: .631 W: 1.162
91498


Summary: The rifle shoots. Nothing more to really say about it. The pulled shots were all me. It’s hard for me to concentrate that long…. Still, my rifle shoots better 8 shot groups (pulled shots included) than a lot of rifles do shooting only 3 shots. Neato!! The clean cold bore and just cold bore shots are all in the groups. No 1st rd fliers either way. The barrel hits consistently when hot and dirty. I have also yet to get a blue patch when cleaning with butches, just powder fowling (Thanks Krieger!). So the verdict is out. Not only can Tim build you a classically styled rifle that shoots, but he can build you an uber tacticool ninja rifle that shoots as well. I’m also still loving the bolt knob. No slipping once you grab that beast!! I know where this girl is going once I shoot the barrel out. Now I need to quit playing grab *** and start shooting farther and working on my drop table.

THANK YOU TIM!!!

[Love Life]

Fat lady fully dressed.

[Artful]

Nice build and shooting - :drinks:

is it me or does that scope need some color [smilie=1:

[Love Life]

Yeah, it doesn't blend in so well...

I plan to order some mcnett's camo tape for it.

[MBTcustom]

Nice build and shooting - :drinks:

is it me or does that scope need some color [smilie=1:

Yeah, about that.......
Coulda been a contender.

It bears mentioning that Dick is shooting these groups with a 4.5lb trigger, and the rifle is ill balanced and very front heavy.
Seriously, think about letting me correct these things when you send it back Dick.

[Love Life]

Yeah, about that.......
Coulda been a contender.

That one went over my head.

[MBTcustom]

It's a line from "The Godfather".
I wanted to have the scope painted to match.

[Love Life]

A) UPS wanted $85.00 to ship my scope. I'll wrap it in tape.
B) The trigger is legit.
C) It is front heavy, but I knew that going in. If people look at those groups, shot from what I was shooting from, and say you built a piece of ****, then I will slander them. I'd even offer to let them shoot better groups with the same rifle, load, shooting setup, etc. You built an accurate rifle. The limit is/has been/will be the shooters of the rifle. That's a compliment.

I wouldn't change a thing. If I weren't too lazy to drag my heavy front rest out, then the groups would look different.

If I did what everybody else does and discounted the flyers and subtracted .243 from each group then it would blow people's socks off. It's fine as is. It'll shoot better, but I can't shoot it better without going to a mechanical front rest. All the tom foolery at 100 yds is done and it's time to stretch it out.

[MBTcustom]

Git-er-done Dick!
I was just musing about a couple of inconsequential details that only matter to me. If you are happy with it, thats all that matters.
You've got a good rifle with a good load. Now wrap your booger pickers around the bang switch, and burn that baby out! I'll be waiting in the wings to catch the smoldering remains and build it back into something more suitable for Georgia. LOL!

[Love Life]

A muzzle loader?

On a serious note, I'll probably keep it .243 Win once I burn this one out, but switch to a 1 in 8 twist and a 24 inch tube.

[MBTcustom]

I could turn it into a 358 Winchester.
Quite simply the most awesome 308 based caliber for this area.
Just sayin.......
Did I ever tell you that was my most favoritestst, belovedest cartridge of all time???

[Love Life]

338 federal looks and sounds cooler.

[MBTcustom]

I like to think of 358 Winchester as a precision 200 yard lightning strike.........

[geargnasher]

I'm still waiting for you to build an M1 in .35 Wheelen. Reach out and touch someone. :bigsmyl2:

Gear

[Love Life]

35 wheelen? Make sure you use a good bbl and get a scope with exposed turrents.

ETA- Speaking of turrets, after the 47.0 gr jammed group, I made an adjustment .2 mils right.

ETA2- Brass is FL sized.

[Love Life]

As expected, the 68 gr bullets turned into dust...

[Sweetpea]

No surprise there...

[Love Life]

I had to try them. You want to buy the rest of them?

[Sweetpea]

Times are tough...

Tell me what you need for them.

[Love Life]

I sent you a PM. I'm sitting here nit picking my way through some Bergers with the comparator, and man do they make a consistent bullet. I've got enough heavies to give this barrel heartburn, so I'll probably offload the 87 gr Vmax bullets as well.

Also, the Berger 105 match hybrids have a shorter bearing length than the 107 SMK. About .010 shorter.

[Artful]

I've got enough heavies to give this barrel heartburn, so I'll probably offload the 87 gr Vmax bullets as well.


Think of me if you decide to offload those.

[Love Life]

Will do. PM coming your way.

One odd thing I've noticed is from the starting load, to the max load, I am getting cratered primers with Retumbo.

With H4831SC I have seen no pressure signs anywhere in the load ladder. I plan to push beyond the max charge and see if I can find a node in the upper reaches.

[Love Life]

I pushed it out to 200 yds to confirm loads today. It was a bit ridiculous, but I am selecting 47.0 gr of Retumbo as my load to start working farther.

On Tim's advice, I am finally going to budge and lighten up the trigger. I'm going to adjust it down to 3 pounds.

All 4 of these groups were fired at 200 yds from 0830 this morning-1030. I wasted a lot of time waiting for the barrel to cool between groups, and for residents of planet Methlandia to set up their pizza boxes, water bottles, a couch cushion, etc. I swear they wanted to go down range and look after every shot. They are ridiculous:

[Sweetpea]

.36 moa...

Nothing to complain about there!

[Love Life]

Those are measured outside to outside, fliers are included in the measurements, diameter of bullet has not been subtracted.

[Sweetpea]

Yeah, I thought about that, but calling it what it really is is just showing off...[smilie=1:

[MBTcustom]

I would set up shop with 47gr if I were you. Other than that one that's outside the group, that was absolutely amazing for 200 yards.

The trigger: Call me a wuss, but that was pretty hard for me to control. However, if you drop it to 3lb, you will be forfeiting your pet title of "Iron Finger". LOL!

[Love Life]

True. Now, in the tradition of all things great, I'll never shoot groups like these again. I was in the zone...

[MBTcustom]

You certainly were. I love it when that happens.