Need some garden help.

[Adam10mm]

Not much of a garden. Have a really lousy yard with not a lot of good spots for a garden.

I've got a pair of tomato plants, a green pepper plant, some radishes, and a bunch of sugar snap pea plants. The peas are what I need help with.

I know I should get some of those tomato cage things, but for the peas they are very tall, started climbing up the fence and are now growing off to the side. What do I do? Do I leave them or to I need to build something so they keep growing up? First garden and I have no idea what I'm doing.

766647666376662

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

The Peas will want to climb to about 4 feet tall, then it seems the plant puts more energy into the fruit then the stalk growth.

the rest of it looks OK for a small garden.
Keep it watered and keep the weeds at bay, you'll be fine.
Jon

[hoosierlogger]

If they dont have something to grow on, they will make a tangled mass as they try to grow on each other. It wont affect their production, but they can get dirty and rot if they lie on the ground too long. Pole beans do the same thing.

[WRideout]

I read in a book that some people use "pea brush" that is a dead branch stuck in the ground that they can climb on. It's cheap and effective. Works best if you put the branch in the ground when you plant the peas.
Wayne

[Cosmiceyes]

You can get some 6-8 foot stakes,and put them in the ground next to where they're climbing.Tie some strings from the top to your fence to let them climb.Do the same with green beans.Next year change ends of the garden,because peas,and beans add nitrogen to the soil at their root growth area.Everything else looks fine!

[41 mag fan]

Heck you could take 2 2x4's, strap them to that fence, take some string like trot line or similar and tie from one 2x4 to the other. Make several lines, then make it look like a fence, tying a piece from top string to bottom string. Works great this way. I, when I had a garden did my pole beans, cucumbers, watermelons, cantaloupes, and any climbing veggie or fruit this way. Melons I would pantyhose to the strings. Saves space, makes the veggies or fruits grow better.
I used to do 20' long rows this way.

[dagger dog]

A trellis is great, either a broken branch from a tree as stated in the previous post, some small saplings woven together, or a piece of used chain link or hog fencing.
Need to plant peas early, the height of the growth period tops out at June, much later and they get pretty woody.

[DougGuy]

You could get a piece of lattice from Home Depot or Lowe's and stand it up, tie it to that fence you have there and arrange the peas on it they will grow on that for this year and it should be good.

[gbrown]

Last couple of years, I planted cucumbers along my 4 foot hurricane fence. Grew all over those, into the neighbors yard which has all sorts of cane like plants, elephant ears and the like. Lost a few cucumbers because they were so well camouflaged in the foilage. Thought about it and did some planning. Made 2 6X6 trellis this last year and planted the cucumbers under them. Take up a space about 12 foot by 2 foot. Getting a lot of cukes out of that and not losing any, either. A week or so and I'll be making pickles. A well thought out, small, intensive plot can produce a lot of food for the family. Still working on how to situate peppers (hot) and tomatoes. Small backyard with a lot of activity in it. I'll figure it out. The trellis is the way to go, a 4 foot long, 2 foot wide area can produce some food for you. Find some scrap wood and build a frame and stretch string or whatever is cheap to make the trellis.

[Adam10mm]

A trellis is great, either a broken branch from a tree as stated in the previous post, some small saplings woven together, or a piece of used chain link or hog fencing.
Ok, so it's better that I prop them up and let them grow up? Cool.


Need to plant peas early, the height of the growth period tops out at June, much later and they get pretty woody.
Well, the area I'm in we are lucky if we can plant before the first of June. We had snow on the ground through the end of May. Started seeds in the house and then moved them outside after about a month. Think the first weekend in June is when they went in the ground. That's our growing season up here. Snow comes October and first frost about early September. Sometimes sooner. We get three full months on average. Four if we're lucky.


You could get a piece of lattice from Home Depot or Lowe's and stand it up, tie it to that fence you have there and arrange the peas on it they will grow on that for this year and it should be good.
Sounds like a plan. I'll see what I can do.

Thanks for your help all! I am trying to learn so I can scale it up next year and just keep going.

[WILCO]

This is a great book to have:

http://www.barnesandnoble.com/listing/2689846963397?r=1&cm_mmca2=pla&cm_mmc=GooglePLA-_-Book_15To24-_-Q000000633-_-2689846963397

Answers lots of questions on gardening.

[w5pv]

It looks as if you may have a tad to much nitrogen under your peas.I didn't see blooms or peas but a lush vigerous vine growth.Peas are a legume and don't require much nitrogen.The only draw back to letting them grow up through brush is keeping the weeds at bay in a larger plot.Tie your tomatos to your fence with a stripe of 1" or larger cloth.Old tee shirts,sheets etc.Good luck on your garden.

[nagantguy]

Yep they like to climb 4 feet or so, they don't care on what some stakes a string would do.

[snuffy]

Adam, here's another alternative to in-ground gardens;

http://www.agardenpatch.com/3-Grow-Boxes-For-Only-105.00-and-Save-5http://photos.imageevent.com/jptowns/cannont2ifolder/websize/44%20mold%20008.jpg.70.html (http://www.agardenpatch.com/3-Grow-Boxes-For-Only-105.00-and-Save-5.70.html)

The grow box system works well, and they're portable/location optional. I'm on my third year with my first 2 boxes, they will last for at least 3 times that long with minimal care.

http://photos.imageevent.com/jptowns/cannont2ifolder/websize/44%20mold%20008.jpg

http://photos.imageevent.com/jptowns/general/websize/garden%202012%20009.jpg

A simple 5 gallon plastic pail is also another way to garden in small back yards. All those used potting soil mixed with regular black garden soil. The miracle grow soil has one season worth of fertilizer already in it. After the first year, I use the dry miracle grow mixed with water to fertilize every 10 days.

[Adam10mm]

See, my first idea was to use 55 gallon plastic drums/barrels from work. I was going to cut them in half the long way, drill a few holes in the bottom for drainage so the roots don't rot, and then build a raised platform for them. My FIL came over with a pickup truck full of dirt and dropped it alongside the garage before I woke up. That kind of changed plans on me and I just used that pile to make the garden I've got. Put some 2x4s to border the soil in, then took some decorative fencing we don't use to make a critter fence, then took chicken wire on the inside of it to keep rabbits out. Works pretty good so far.

Don't worry about contamination of the plastic barrels I was going to use. The chemical in them was hydrogen peroxide, 60% concentrated, and the barrels were triple rinsed per environmental law. Hydrogen peroxide breaks down into water, so it's the safest barrel we have at work (trust me, we've got NASTY stuff I work with). I've got three of them in the basement.

[Adam10mm]

This is the backyard I have to work with. Not much room to do anything. The trees provide some awesome shade during the summer, but also limit the sunlight. The side yard to the left of the picture only has 2-3 hours of sunlight a day. It's 1130am when this pic was taken, so you can see how much sun the garden is getting. Sunshine usually hits about 7-8am and turns shady around 3-4pm.

76727

[waynem34]

+1 on string. Weav and make a net, wow just noticed the pic of your place and wow is the standing seam tin? Very nice old place.

[Adam10mm]

Not tin, just metal roofing on the two main peaks of the house. Built circa 1904. Was like that when we bought it in 2007. Just need to get the garage done like that and we're all set. The original house is just those two peaks. The black roofed area is a laundry room and one car garage that was added just after 2000.

[DLCTEX]

My best gardening tip for tomatoes was gleaned from the old Porter and Sons web page (no longer in existence) is to make a cylinder about 18' in diameter from concrete reinforcement wire. It will be about 5' tall and wrap with clear plastic sheet. Roll the edges of the plastic and staple with a desk stapler to form a mini greenhouse. I dig a hole about 10" deep, insert the wrapped cylinder, fill in dirt around it. This will make a free standing green house that needs no other support. In our dry climate I add good soil to fill the inside 4" below the ground level to leave a reservoir to hold water. In wet climates fill above ground level to make a raised bed. Cut a square hole the size if the squares in the re-wire on the North side close to the bottom to allow access for planting and weeding. Close the opening with Duct tape to hold in heat and humidity. This creates a warm, humid environment like the native tomato plant came from. When daytime temps get into the 90's remove the plastic down to just above the soil level. Windborne and soil splashed diseases are kept at bay.

[bob208]

put a stake about 5'-6' at each end of the peas run some chicken wire or what ever between them the peas will do the rest.

[mauser1959]

First of all , peas should be planted in a wide row system , keeps the soil much cooler , and retains moisture better ... plus the added benefit of more plants . The book "The Joy of Gardening " by Dick Raymond should be on every gardener's shelf ( he was the master gardener for troy built ) .

[DougGuy]

This is the backyard I have to work with. Not much room to do anything. The trees provide some awesome shade during the summer, but also limit the sunlight. The side yard to the left of the picture only has 2-3 hours of sunlight a day. It's 1130am when this pic was taken, so you can see how much sun the garden is getting. Sunshine usually hits about 7-8am and turns shady around 3-4pm.

76727

I'd be all over that.. We have red clay here, nothing but trees and weeds like to grow in it. I buy lumber and treat it with Eco treatment (minerals, no chemicals) to preserve it from bugs and rot, and build beds 16" high, 42" wide, some 8' some 12' and some 16' long. The tomatoes I built an enclosure with salt treated 2x2s and wildlife netting. It keeps the squirrels out and the ones that do try to bite their way through I have "re-educated" with the pellet rifle. They totally avoid our back yard now. For soil, we use a commercially made organic mulch/topsoil mix, and we buy organic composted horse manure for $20 a whole trailer load and mix it in the soil. Any vegetable matter will work good, you can fold in leaf mulch, garden trimmings, eggshells, coffee grounds, and any vegetable trimmings from the kitchen we compost and use it in the soil. We make sure there is worms in the soil and if the moles get too many of them we add fishing worms from the bait store.

http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb374/DougGuy/2012Garden/2012-06-03183159_zps6f5b0fe2.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/DougGuy/media/2012Garden/2012-06-03183159_zps6f5b0fe2.jpg.html)

This small box for hot peppers:

http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb374/DougGuy/2012Garden/2012-06-03182753_zpsf644a4f6.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/DougGuy/media/2012Garden/2012-06-03182753_zpsf644a4f6.jpg.html)

My garlic bed:

http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb374/DougGuy/2012Garden/2011-11-16161736_zps418b14f0.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/DougGuy/media/2012Garden/2011-11-16161736_zps418b14f0.jpg.html)

http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb374/DougGuy/2012Garden/2011-11-13140919_zps0a2a5b77.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/DougGuy/media/2012Garden/2011-11-13140919_zps0a2a5b77.jpg.html)

Blackberries in rt bed, red potatoes in left. Wildlife netting is a must have where squirrels and birds would not leave you one single berry to eat. 100% predation without it. These are new blackberries, they made good fruit this year but wait til next year, we will need a stepladder to reach the berries, and of course a much larger enclosed trellis:

http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb374/DougGuy/2013%20Garden/20130604_193943_zps5263981e.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/DougGuy/media/2013%20Garden/20130604_193943_zps5263981e.jpg.html)

Black raspberries enclosed:

http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb374/DougGuy/2013%20Garden/20130509_192236_zps951734eb.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/DougGuy/media/2013%20Garden/20130509_192236_zps951734eb.jpg.html)

One day's fruit out of this tiny little berry patch.

http://i1202.photobucket.com/albums/bb374/DougGuy/2013%20Garden/20130619_123637_zpsa797a3ae.jpg (http://s1202.photobucket.com/user/DougGuy/media/2013%20Garden/20130619_123637_zpsa797a3ae.jpg.html)




Not meaning to hijack the thread but to give some ideas as to what works for places with lousy soil and high predation from birds and squirrels. There are many ways to box garden, this is just what works for us, locate the beds by how much sunlight they will get, your sunny patch in front of the garage would likely do quite well.

[Adam10mm]

I'd love to be able to turn the whole backyard into a garden but #1 I have two young kids that would be very upset and #2 we get so much snow up here I couldn't have a permanent setup like what you have.

When the neighbor plows for me to have a parking spot in the backyard for my Blazer, the snowbanks are 5-6 feet high and 12-15 feet deep. When I need to shovel off the garage roof, I just walk right up the snowbank to the roof. This pic was taken in late April of this "spring".
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v239/freakshow10mm/DSCN0033_zps12462179.jpg (http://smg.photobucket.com/user/freakshow10mm/media/DSCN0033_zps12462179.jpg.html)

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

No doubt, space management for snow is important to us northerners. but if you have good soil, you wouldn't need to make the raised beds. I plow all my snow onto the eastern half of my garden...by march, there can be 8 feet of snow piled up. But then you mention the kids...they need space too.

[Adam10mm]

OK, I've got some pea pods on my pea plants. When do I harvest them? Do they have to be a certain length? Some are 2-3 inches long, but the plants aren't "covered" with them.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

If they are edible pod "snap" Peas.
I pick them when they the individual peas are about Half the size of what you think they'd be.
Otherwise,
regular Peas, I'd pick them when the individual peas just become full size, be sure to Shuck them right away and refrigerate...Or Process them...or cook them.

[snuffy]

[QUOTE=freakshow10mm;2314702]OK, I've got some pea pods on my pea plants. When do I harvest them? Do they have to be a certain length? Some are 2-3 inches long, but the plants aren't "covered" with them.[/QOTE]


When they feel full. You should be able to feel each pea in a row, average is 6-7 peas in each pod. When they feel pregnant, snap the pod off the vine, then snap the stem backwards toward the tip This allows the pod to be opened by squeezing the pod across the back to the bottom, it should pop open.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BOV1BFPq34w

This gal starts at the other end, it's been several decades since I shucked peas, maybe that's how I did it too.

[mauser1959]

when they are the size of a robins eye ... eat the first ones fresh out of the garden .

[Adam10mm]

If they are edible pod "snap" Peas.
I pick them when they the individual peas are about Half the size of what you think they'd be.
Otherwise,
regular Peas, I'd pick them when the individual peas just become full size, be sure to Shuck them right away and refrigerate...Or Process them...or cook them.
The seed package said "sugar snap peas". That's all I know.

I'll have to head out there tomorrow and check things out.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

The seed package said "sugar snap peas". That's all I know.

I'll have to head out there tomorrow and check things out.
That's all you need to know, that's my favorite variety.
you can eat them as tiny as you can find them.
and they are delicious til the individual peas reach that "half-size" I talk about. Afterwhich, the pods start to get tough and stringy. and if you let them grow to full size (by accident or by choice), you can just shuck them like standard Peas. BUT, what I've noticed is that Snap peas that grow to FULL size are never as sweet as standard peas grown to full size...I suspect they were bred to share some sweetness with the pod.
Good Luck,
Jon

[popper]

concrete reinforcement wire, vertical. When the peas are done you can burn or pull the vines off. String works good too, you can cut the vines at ground, roll up & toss the whole works out. I did bush beans cause the weather down here won't let peas set fruit. I cut back my tomatoes in hot weather and got a good fall crop, if I could keep them darned horny worms off.