compression plug for .357 mag?

[Matt85]

any one know where I could find a compression plug for .357 mag? I intend to start loading 38 sp and 357 mag cases with bp but I would prefer to use a lee expander die with a compression plug for reliable repeatable compression. the smallest one offered by track of the wolf is meant for 38 cal rifles.

thanks
-matt

[mazo kid]

I have cut the head off the proper thread-size bolt and turned the diameter down to what I need.

[bigted]

for 19 dollars or such ... 'Buffalo arms'... has em for 38 cal pistol... intended specially for 38/357 cases. they fit Lyman or RCBS dies.

[dagger dog]

Track of the Wolf has a compression plug, fits into a Lee powder through expanding die, under 3 bucks, you may have to chuck it in a drill press and use a file to turn it down a bit as I think it's for 38-55 rifle cartridge.

[joec]

Here is Track of the Wolf's and it works with the 45-70 powder through expander die as near as I can guess but not sure. http://www.trackofthewolf.com/Categories/PartDetail.aspx/1222/1/DIE-38-COMPRESS

[Don McDowell]

Have you tried simply using the expander die you normally use to flare the case mouth?

[Nobade]

That's what I do in 357 and 32 H&R. Works great - I leave it adjusted to flare the cases and unscrew it some to get the right powder compression.

-Nobade

[Matt85]

I went ahead and ordered one from buffalo arms, a little spendy but it will do what I need.

-matt

[bigted]

matt ... what firearm do you plan on using the 357 in? ive loaded a few 357's with black powder and all I do is just dump it in and compress around 1/8th inch with the boolit. cant remember the charge but it is definitely a hoot in my ruger double action revolver. it is really pretty accurate in the revolver when loaded thusely and oh my what fun!

[Matt85]

the gun is a used Ruger Blackhawk 6.5" I just picked up off gunbroker. my goal is to use the heavy revolver to play around with 4F black powder (yes, im aware most people say its a bad idea). basically im trying to make a BP magnum cartridge, this means cramming as much 4F powder as I can fit into a .357 mag case under a 158g biglube bullet and then firing it out of the heaviest single action 357 I could find (and afford). my theory is that even a heavy load of fine 4F powder will have vastly lower pressure levels then the top end modern .357 magnum cartridges this gun is capable of firing. being that "common knowledge" says 4F is unsafe to use as a propellant, ive become curious as to what velocities I will get.

-matt

[Nobade]

You will find, as I have, that once the powder is compressed enough to become one solid piece of rocket fuel it gives very low performance and is quite disappointing. It needs a certain amount of compression to work well but past that performance drops off sharply. Try it and you will find out for yourself. You aren't going to hurt anything doing so, but will waste time and money. Also remember that if you compress the powder enough, the case will start to swell and won't enter your revolver's chamber any longer.

-Nobade

[Matt85]

im not new to compressing powder, i load 45-70 bp catridges for my 1888 trapdoor rifle. the 45-70 cartridge uses some rather extreme compression at over 0.5". i will play around with various powder amounts and find the limit where performance meets overcompression. im betting that the limit for the .357 4f load will be around .125" since the very fine powder wont have as much of a gap between granuals as 2F.


will waste time and money
remember its not a waste if your having fun!

-matt

[Nobade]

remember its not a waste if your having fun!

-matt

That's for sure! That's why we all do this stuff, right?

-Nobade

[HDS]

Is it too much if you simply fill up the case to the brim and compress that with the bullet? ATM I fill it up to a little bit above where the bullet I use will come, so it provides a little bit of compression, comes to about 17.2 grains of 3FG swiss in a .38spl case when I measured it.

[HDS]

Chrono'ed the rounds just now, not bad performance, getting 1440-1460fps out of my 20" barrel with these 147gr bullets.

[Nobade]

Chrono'ed the rounds just now, not bad performance, getting 1440-1460fps out of my 20" barrel with these 147gr bullets.

Wow, how much and what kind of black powder are you using to do that?

-Nobade

[bigted]

I also would be interested in such performance with bp in a 38 special cartridge. sounds way high to me but do tell...

[HDS]

It's the charge I specified in the post above, 17.2 grains of swiss 3FG powder. And the bullet is 147gr so a bit lighter than the nominal 158gr.

I am not sure if they where false readings, I took 5 of them with my chrono 3-4 yards away and all the shots chronoed close to each other.

[HDS]

This is the powder I am using:
http://i.imgur.com/4DQJjRP.jpg

Been asking around it does seem I am getting quite high velocities compared to what would be expected. I am not sure if the combination of this powder, a compressed load and the heavy crimp I put over a lighter than normal bullet is the reason, or if I need to shoot further away from my chronograph.

I did notice when looking at other people loading 38spl that when people fill up their cases some have required as little as 13 grains with GOEX and most others get 15-16 grains worth of BP in a case. I am getting 17.2 grains, so maybe this swiss powder is denser than what most people use?

[Nobade]

With 158gr. I get just under 1200 fps from my 20 inch barrel rifle using 21.5gr. Swiss FFFg (no.2) and 357 mag cases. 38 spl. cases will hold 20 gr, and are only slightly slower. This is not very hard compression, maybe 1/8 inch. I would check your chronograph against a known load, perhaps some 22LR?

-Nobade

[bigted]

my cronno calls for 8 to 10 yards from the muzzle and I know that when it is very bright mine gives inconsistent readings compared with an overcast day but im the student here so maybe you have a great load/firearm combo that gives a super run. im definitely interested in your results.

also reread your results and noticed the '20' inch barrel...I stupidly held the belief that this was thru a short pistol ... at any rate this seems like a very good load from a 38 sp.

thanks for your reply's and im looking forward to your next. I loaded some 357mag cases with a 158 boolit over 27 grains GOEX cartridge last nite and im looking forward to giving them a try. the compression is around .250 inch with these so it is def. a FULL case.

[HDS]

I'm going to redo the tests at a later date with the chronograph further away and with the screens in place and we can see whats this all about. Given what everyone else has said of their loads I am leaning towards my chronograph being a fluke due to distance/weather/no screens. They all where just so close to each other rather than all over the map as is usually the case when the chrono misreads.