can't figure out what's wrong

[creature]

For the life of me I can't figure out what I'm doing wrong. I'm not getting a good fill with my two molds. I've tried low heat(650), high heat(800), and in between. One mold is a NOE 9mm 135gr 5 cavity mold and the other is a Lee 45 230gr 6 cavity. I'm getting fins on the NOE mold and have detail cleaned the inside of the mold to remove any little pieces of lead that would prevent closure. No dice.

Here is my process:

Clean mold
Spray Frankfort arsenal bullet release
Heat lead(Lee 20lb bottom pour)
Place mold on rim of pot to heat up
Apply NOE lube on spree plate per instructions
Pour probably 20-30 bullets and discard them to further heat mold
Cast at approximately 700-750

I spent probably 5 hours tonight trying to figure this out to now avail. The 45s fill in better than the 9mm NOE mold at this point but there's still a little spot that is not filling out(see pic below).

Please help, this is very discouraging.

http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/u614/hellhound1983/101_2316_zps3d59598d.jpg (http://s1324.photobucket.com/user/hellhound1983/media/101_2316_zps3d59598d.jpg.html)
http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/u614/hellhound1983/101_2318_zpsae17d72a.jpg (http://s1324.photobucket.com/user/hellhound1983/media/101_2318_zpsae17d72a.jpg.html)
http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/u614/hellhound1983/101_2319_zps068af52f.jpg (http://s1324.photobucket.com/user/hellhound1983/media/101_2319_zps068af52f.jpg.html)
http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/u614/hellhound1983/101_2321_zps36811ee7.jpg (http://s1324.photobucket.com/user/hellhound1983/media/101_2321_zps36811ee7.jpg.html)

[Sensai]

I don't see the "pic below", but have a few thoughts. First, dump that Frankfurt Arsenal bullet release. Cleaning it out of your molds is going to be a challenge, but get as much out with brake cleaner or the like as you can. Boil both molds in a pot of water with some dishwashing soap in it, then scub them with a toothbrush. Your objective is to get ALL foreign material out of those molds, especially any type of oil. The sprue plate lube should be applied VERY sparingly. If you can see it, you've used too much. A drop at the hinge pin with the sprue plate open, and then run your finger over the hinge pin screw and onto the bottom of the sprue plate. If your doing it right there will be just a slight change in the color/hue of the bottom of the sprue plate. If you get any lube into a cavity, start all over with the boiling in water! Second, I assume (and you know what that means) that both of your molds are aluminum. Aluminum molds both absorb an release heat faster than steel or brass molds. This doesn't make them better or worse, just different. I find that placing my aluminum molds on the edge of the pot doesn't help a lot. I had to get a hotplate (thrift store - $12) with a sheet of steel on top to get, and help keep, my molds hot enough until the correct casting tempo was attained. Third, check your alloy content. There are enough posts on this forum for even an old dummy like me to learn a little about the metalugy envolve in our hobby/holy calling. I hope that this helps, and you can rely on the fine folks on this forum to help however possible. There are some very learned people on here that are happy to help. I've only been doing this for around 45 years, and I learn something every time I log in!

I forgot to address the fins on the NOE mold boolits. Check the locator pins and see if they may be keeping the mold from closing completely. If you got the mold new, it should have had instructions for doing this and heating it in an oven a few times, etc. The pins can be driven in, carefully, if that's the problem.

[btroj]

Bet you got the sprue lube in the cavities.

Get rid of the mould release entirely. Not needed, will just lead to undersized bullets in many cases.

Melt temp isn't that important for fill out, MOULD temp is what matters. A faster casting tempo may help, keeps mould temp up. No dumping bullets then stopping to look at them, it allows the mould to cool too much.

[ku4hx]

Ditch the mold release
Clean the mold thoroughly
Flux your melt
Remove the dross
Heat up you mold
Start casting again

[cbrick]

creature, chalk this up as a valuable learning experience. You now know what happens when you get oil in the cavities. As was mentioned already, the sprue lube (Bull Plate) that came with your mold is great stuff but a little goes a very long way. It's not so great inside the cavities as you have learned.

Also already mentioned, throw away the mold release gunk. If you don't tell the garbage man it's in with the trash he may take it off your hands for you. You don't need to smoke the mold either, that is nothing more than an old wives tale. The very best casting mold is a clean mold.

Rick

[creature]

Thanks a bunch for the responses guys. I will get to work on cleaning the hell out of them tonight. Also, I've heard of guys just submerging their molds into the lead for a few seconds until it comes out without lead on it. Would that work? I don't have access to a hot plate at the moment. Can a mold be heated too hot(obviously aside from heating it to the point of )?

I forgot to mention, I'm using 100% wheel weights . It's all I have access to right now.

Pics are up, can you guys see them?

[btroj]

Don't submerge the mould. Placing a corner in the melt can speed up heating the mould. The mould needs to be hot, well over 300 degrees, to cast well.

That sprue lube will burn out pretty quick with regular use of the mould. Probably with in 50 pours or so.

I would scrub the mould well with an old toothbrush and some Comet. It will remove the oil and some of the lube release.

Make sure mould is totally dry then use it more. Dip one corner of mould 1/4 in into the melt for 30 to 45 seconds. A small drop of water placed on opposite end of mould should sizzle instantly when mould is hot enough. Just don't get water on the melt. A drop on end of finger tough he'd to mould tells you what you need to know.

Photos told me sadly what problem was. Classic look of oil in mould bullets.

[44man]

Everyone is correct. The only stuff I trusted in a cavity was Rapine Mold Prep, microfine graphite. A clean mold is best.
I heat my molds in my little furnace set to 500* and never get a bad boolit, the first pours are perfect. Dipping the corner of the mold in the melt helps but the sprue plate can sill be cold, play a propane torch around on it and get it hotter.

[DrCaveman]

See the pics. Both molds seem to have the same problem, whatever it turns out to be.

The usual guess is that molds are too cool. Dipping my aluminum molds in the melt is standard practice anymore...the first few pours after dipping the mold usually take 15-20 seconds to solidify. Then, using my handy damp-rag-in-a-plate I am able to control the temp

I've over lubed many molds and a very hot melt accompanied by a hot mold has gotten rid of the excess. Others probably have more sophisticated methods but that has worked for me

[runfiverun]

those pictures showed the mold as being plenty hot.
like waay too hot actually.
the oil in the cavity's is what is causing you all the grief.
you can see the solvents gassing off and causing the squiggles on the bottom
band of the boolits.

[creature]

I don't have a hot plate so would it be acceptable to dip my mold in the melt? Also, I'm going to scrap the Frankfort arsenal bullet release. Should I smoke the molds with a match?

Thanks for the help guys!

[docone31]

If you really have to smoke the mold, use a propane lighter. Invisible and it works.
I was reluctant untill I tried it.
Heat the mold, and pour.

[knifemaker]

NO! do not smoke the mold. I have the same 45acp 6 banger mold and I get perfect bullets from it. Get your mold as clean as you can in the cavities. If you use bullplate, apply it with a Q-tip to the sprue plate bottom to prevent galling the alum. mold and to the alinement pins. Just enought that no excess will get into the cavities.
I use a hot plate to pre-heat my molds and get perfect bullets right from the start. If you get a cheap hot plate with the coils, be sure to get a metal plate to put on the coils so your mold is not in direct contact with the coils. No need to screw up a good Alum. mold being in contact with red hot coils if you accidently turn up the heat too much.
I turn my hot plate up to medium and put my mold on it at the same time I start heating my Lee 20 lb. pot. When the pot is up to temp and lead melted, the mold is also ready to go. If you heated the mold a little too much, it will take a few more seconds for the sprue to harden and turn dull gray before opening the mold.
I do not like dipping the mold as the front cavities may get up to temp, but the rear still needs more heat to be up to operating temp. You will see this more in the longer 6 cavity molds. I want good bullets from the first or second cast.

[DrCaveman]

those pictures showed the mold as being plenty hot.
like waay too hot actually.
the oil in the cavity's is what is causing you all the grief.
you can see the solvents gassing off and causing the squiggles on the bottom
band of the boolits.

Really? Why would running the mold & melt at a hot temp NOT cook away the excess oil? Sure maybe a dozen or two pours would be fodder for the cleaning but it seems as though the OP has sorta tried this.

Since he is still asking whether to dip the mold, and has not mentioned a hotplate, cool mold is still a possibility. And wouldnt a waay too hot mold get rid of excess oil?

Maybe zinc contamination?

[creature]

I cleaned the hell out of these molds and am getting ready to go round two. I think that Frankfort arsenal **** might have had some build up inside the mold as well. I can't believe how bad that stuff caked up on the inside of the cavities. I had to scrub the hell out of them over and over to get it out. Wish me luck. Thanks again for the help gents!

[wallenba]

I tried that stuff when I first started casting. What a mess. I don't know how they can even market a product like that.

[runfiverun]

you can cook the solvents off and still leave behind the lubricants.
the arsenal mold stuff will also gas off.
look at what happens when guy's use non stick pans to make ingots in.

[leadman]

Also the Bullplate lube should only be applied tothe sprue plate when the mold is hot with boolits in the cavities. If you can find the instructions to your Lee mold it tells you it is ok to dip the corner in the alloy to heat it.
I recently purchased several new Lee molds and cleaned them with dish soap and boiled, brake clean, alcohol, and carb cleaner. Still got wrinkled boolits so smoked the cavities with a match and this cured it. The carbon will absorb and cutting oils that seep out. After that there were no more wrinkled boolits and I did not have to repeat the smoking of the cavities.
Lee must have changed their cooling fluid recently because the cavities are much smoother and the fluid does not like to come out of the cavities.
Also make sure any alignment pins are lubed as unlubed pins can hold a mold open. I use a touch of Bullplate lube on a q-tip that I just wipe some oil out of the bottle cap with. Don't want it wet with oil, just damp.

[davegalesr]

Frankfort arsenal drop out must be sprayed on from a distance of at least 100 feet to ensure that the correct amount gets on the mold

[creature]

Just wanted to give you guys an update. I cleaned the molds and did some casting. Everything went a LOT better. The bullets aren't 100% but are pretty close(acceptable for me). I kept getting fins on some of the bullets so I started squeezing the handles together more in an effort to stop it. It turns out that made it worse. I took a lighter grip on the handles and the fins went away, weird.

The molds still might need some fine cleaning but I think they're GTG for the most part. My Lee Handles came apart though. I was thinking about using some JB Weld on them and sliding them back on. Anyone know if this would work? I'm unsure about how the heat would effect it.

Thanks a bunch everyone, I really appreciate it!

Here's a few
http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/u614/hellhound1983/castinggood3_zps8217f789.jpg (http://s1324.photobucket.com/user/hellhound1983/media/castinggood3_zps8217f789.jpg.html)

[Mk42gunner]

creature,

Much nicer looking boolits. What a difference a clean mold makes, eh?

The wooden dowel slipped off the metal on your Lee handle, right? If so, yes you can use JB weld to help stick things together.

Robert

[runfiverun]

that's the first thing most guy's do when they get a set of lee handles.
looks like you have a handle on the casting part.

[10mmShooter]

Good Job Creature, nice boolits

A clean mould is a Happy mould, ps I tried the mould release agent when I started casting too..... then learned that if your moulds are working correctly no coatings or smoking of any kind is necessary its just masking other issues if you do that.

[creature]

Thanks guys.

I found another flaw in my bullets after casting a few thousand, urgh. The base of the bullet is flared out a little. It's like a small lip. It's facing out and then down once I size them. This leaves a little excess on the edge of the bottom of the bullet.

It is happening right were the sprue plate contacts the mould. Could it be too tight?

Also, can squeezing the mold together real tight cause fins? It seemed to happen more when I had a tight grip than when I barely squeezed.

[Lights]

My guess would be when squeezing the handles tight, the mold is not venting properly.

[Bigslug]

JB Weld should be fine for holding the wood handles onto the metal tongs. All the real heat's in the molds.

[dondiego]

In my experience, squeezing the handles hard causes fins to occur in the far cavities because it opens them up a little on that end, especially LEE 6 cavity's. Try it with a cold mold and you can see what I mean.

[leadman]

You might look for a piece of lead caught on the face of the mold and/or lube the mold alignment surfaces.

I file a couple of notches in the handles to give the JB and area to lock into.

If the flare is on the base of the boolit it could be a small area of lead under it by the pivot screw. Hold the mold up to the light looking at the sprue plate from the side. If you see light between the plate and mold something is wrong.

[johntkd]

ok i seen someone posted that smoking the molds was an old wives tale well I smoke all my molds, bullet and sinker I have been casting sinkers and certain bullets for 35+ years the smoking WILL help fill out and release provided you get a solid cover up of the carbon i also smoke the sprue plates, I have never ever heated a mold and use aluminum molds almost entirely, and I can absolutely tell when my molds need to be candled again the bullets quit falling out without a tap or shake same with sinkers and jigs, as far as the fins go I would check your line up ins and see if they have moved out a touch from all the heating and cooling.
by having to release some pressure its indicating you have a pin that has prolly moved a bit and is keeping the mold cocked when you hold it tight,
in all my years of casting I have prolly had to remelt down a dozen bullets and about as many sinkers all were due to how i was pouring at the time ( using a small cooking pan) i purchased finally a bottom pour furnace and have not had an issue since the key is to keep the same flow going from start to finish dont worry about a slight spill slowing the pour down as bullet fills is generally what causes a miss fill.....in the case of a bottom pour furnace letting up on the handle slightly...

[creature]

You might look for a piece of lead caught on the face of the mold and/or lube the mold alignment surfaces.

I file a couple of notches in the handles to give the JB and area to lock into.

If the flare is on the base of the boolit it could be a small area of lead under it by the pivot screw. Hold the mold up to the light looking at the sprue plate from the side. If you see light between the plate and mold something is wrong.

Is it better to have the sprue plate tight or loose? I imagine somewhere in the middle. Is it better to error on the side of tight or loose?

[johntkd]

Is it better to have the sprue plate tight or loose? I imagine somewhere in the middle. Is it better to error on the side of tight or loose?

Keep in mind when things heat up they expand the mold if aluminum will cool faster than the steel sprue plate,I keep mine to where they move well but will not move on their own with a twist, and when my molds get hot the plate tends to drag more which is usually after casting 30 to 50 bullets at that time i usually set the mold down for a few mins to cool off with the sprue plate off to the side. but its your own preference.....like i said i never preheat my molds when thet sprue plate starts sticking it's the bullets after if i keep going i always have to run thru the size die

[fcvan]

I smoked Lee molds with Ohio blue tips back in the 1980s and swore by it. After joining here I read so many comments from folks who just cleaned well with hot soapy water. I bought a new Lee mold, and a Lyman too, and preheated, both of those molds dropped awesome boolits the first pour.

I also read here about folks using Bullplate and 2 cycle oil to lube the molds. I now use a wooden chopstick to lube with 2 cycle oil. The small end is used to lube and the large end is used to scrape/clean surfaces. Those disposable sticks soak up the oil some so when I'm lubing the sprue plate I can just rub the plate and the heat causes a very small amount of oil to be deposited. I love this site, I've learned so much from everyone here

[cbrick]

ok i seen someone posted that smoking the molds was an old wives tale well I smoke all my molds,

If your happy using oily candle smoke in your molds you should by all means continue to do so. That however does not change the fact that it is an old wives tale. If it helps anything, and that's a big if, it is only covering up a problem. It is far better to fix the problem as opposed to an attempt at covering it up. The simple truth is that a clean mold is the best casting mold, molds do not need a layer of soot or anything else to drop bullets. Bullets fall out of the mold because as they cool they shrink.

Many of us here have worked pretty hard to dispel many, many casting old wives tales such as smoking the molds, if you wish to continue doing so have at it but it would be much appreciated if you wouldn't make posts that keep old wives tales going. Just because great grandpa did it that way does not mean there isn't a better way.

Rick

[PS Paul]

I have NEVER smoked a mold in nearly 30 years of doing this. Ever. I HAVE had oil in a cavity which caused me the headaches you experienced..... More than once. he he.

I have found squeezing Lee handles together (especially taking a tight grip on the sprue cutoff handle) WILL move the molds apart at the far end and cause those other finned issues. Hold up to the light and you will see this right away when you take a "super-tight" grip.

Above all else, pay attention to what CB Rick tells us. You'll succeed with just that little tidbit alone.

[41 mag fan]

Ricks correct on the smoking of molds. It's an old wives tale, that while it works, it also masks what the problem truly is.
When you smoke a mold, there is the possibility of too much soot in the cavity, whereby causing the boolits to drop undersized.
With the higher end molds, there's no need for anything but a good cleaning, taking an eye loop and inspecting the cavities for burrs, inspecting the sprue plate for any burrs, and heat setting the pins.
With a Lee 2 cav, you're looking at a little more QC, but with the proper QC, you'll have a mold that can drop satisfactory boolits.
All my molds regardless of maker get leemented, just as a precautionary and as a final polish to the cavities.
I've got molds that using my techniques that I've learned on here, actually get to the point of frustrating because they are falling out quicker than I can get my molds open, causing dings and such and making me cull them out.

[johntkd]

Great Grampa didnt do it as far as I know, I learned the trick myself commercially making sinkers, now when you get paid money to cast well then by all means feel free to cut me down but until you have banked about $400,000 in 35 years of casting as a hobby please dont waste your time trying to insult me...the carbon BY all means lets the bullets fall from the mold without a shake,rattle or tap, how many non fills have you had in your life? i have had about a dozen bullets and maybe 15 sinkers of assorted sizes ( mostly split shot from a homemade mold) not fill fully in 35+ years trying to disprove what you call an old wives tale is merely your ego

I suppose i should add I mic a lot of my bullets and they are very very consistant my lee 309-170-fp drops bullets never any larger than .310 my lee 429-208-wc has been dropping all at .429 my lee 356-124-2R drops at .357 the lee 356-124-TC drops at .356


If your happy using oily candle smoke in your molds you should by all means continue to do so. That however does not change the fact that it is an old wives tale. If it helps anything, and that's a big if, it is only covering up a problem. It is far better to fix the problem as opposed to an attempt at covering it up. The simple truth is that a clean mold is the best casting mold, molds do not need a layer of soot or anything else to drop bullets. Bullets fall out of the mold because as they cool they shrink.

Many of us here have worked pretty hard to dispel many, many casting old wives tales such as smoking the molds, if you wish to continue doing so have at it but it would be much appreciated if you wouldn't make posts that keep old wives tales going. Just because great grandpa did it that way does not mean there isn't a better way.

Rick

[creature]

Aside from smoking molds, should i keep the sprue plate tight or loose?

Thanks for the help guys! I shot some bullets today and they worked great. I was smacking a 8"gong at 50yds with a glock 19(with after market barrel for shooting lead). I did have a considerable amount of leading in the barrel. Could this be from too hard of lead? I've been using wheel weights and just started quenching them. Is that making them too hard and causing excessive leading?

[cbrick]

John, if it makes you feel warm & fuzzy to think I was trying to insult you go right ahead and feel warm & fuzzy. If it were my intent to insult you, you and everyone else reading this thread would certainly know it.

As for old wives tales it does sound like you should continue making use of them but there are other new casters reading these posts and they should know the truth, a clean mold is the best casting mold, not a gunked up one.

Rick

[PS Paul]

Sigh........

[cbrick]

creature, I like the sprue plate to be just shy of being able to flip open on it's own. If it's loose enough to do that it's possible to get high spots on the boolit base, tighter is more wear on the mold. I also use Bull Plate to help.

There is no need to quench WW alloy for the 45 ACP, it's a low pressure, moderate velocity round and air cooled is plenty hard. Is it possible that they are too hard and that's causing leading? Yes, it is and more so with reduced loads. I shoot 8 BHN HP's in my 1911 all the time without leading, hard is way over rated, fit is far more important.

Rick

[creature]

There is no need to quench WW alloy for the 45 ACP, it's a low pressure, moderate velocity round and air cooled is plenty hard.

Rick

What about 9mm? I'm pushing them around 1080fps and it's a 135gr bullet.

[MtGun44]

No need for quenching in 9mm in my experience. Straight wwt alloy in Lee 356 120 TC conventional
lube, air cooled shoots fine at full power in multiple 9mms.

Bill

[creature]

I used the Frankfort arsenal spray release on my ingot molds. Works pretty good for that.

[winelover]

Never quenched a boolet yet. I cast for 9mm, 38/357, 44 Mag, 45 LC (Ruger only loads) and 338 Win. Mag! Hardest alloy I use is an approximation of Lyman #2, however most my casting is done with 50/50 mix of pure and recycled boolets from my personal range. I strive for the softest alloy possible with minimal or no leading.

Winelover

[Fishman]

Creature, if you are still getting finning, the alignment Pin bushings on your NOE mould may have backed out, as Sensai mentioned in the first post. I had this very problem because I didn't heat cycle my mould before casting with it. You can feel them above the surface of the mould with a fingertip (while it's cool). This prevents the mould from closing all the way. Swede will reseat the bushings for free if you mail him the mould back, and that is what I did.

[lka]

Just wanted to give you guys an update. I cleaned the molds and did some casting. Everything went a LOT better. The bullets aren't 100% but are pretty close(acceptable for me). I kept getting fins on some of the bullets so I started squeezing the handles together more in an effort to stop it. It turns out that made it worse. I took a lighter grip on the handles and the fins went away, weird.

The molds still might need some fine cleaning but I think they're GTG for the most part. My Lee Handles came apart though. I was thinking about using some JB Weld on them and sliding them back on. Anyone know if this would work? I'm unsure about how the heat would effect it.

Thanks a bunch everyone, I really appreciate it!

Here's a few
http://i1324.photobucket.com/albums/u614/hellhound1983/castinggood3_zps8217f789.jpg (http://s1324.photobucket.com/user/hellhound1983/media/castinggood3_zps8217f789.jpg.html)

Jb weld doesn't jive well with heat,,

[snuffy]

I kept getting fins on some of the bullets so I started squeezing the handles together more in an effort to stop it. It turns out that made it worse. I took a lighter grip on the handles and the fins went away, weird.

Are you holding that lee 6 banger with all 3 handles?DON'T" The third handle is simply for cutting the sprue. It is NOT to be held while casting. ANY pressure from your hands on the top handle/sprue handle will cam the sprue plate away form the top of the mold, and begin to open the mold cavities. That where your fining comes from. The sprue plate should be snug against the top of the mold blocks. It it's too tight, it can cause problems with base fill-out, by NOT allowing air to escape at the base of the boolit.


Keep in mind when things heat up they expand the mold if aluminum will cool faster than the steel sprue plate

Well ALL my lee 6 cavity molds have aluminum sprue plates. The lee 2 cavities have steel SP. So do the Mihec brass molds.

The main reason Lee says to smoke their molds is; most of them have tiny burrs on the edges/parting lines of the cavities. Smoking the mold masks those burrs, allowing the boolits to drop out. Now, using a candle puts oils from the wax in the cavity along with the carbon. Butane from a cigarette lighter has no oil, just carbon. If you must smoke your molds, then use a cig. lighter.

Smoking molds will also plug vent lines on the face of the mold blocks. This makes fill-out more difficult. Smoking HAS to make the boolits smaller. It can't help but take up space in the cavity. To say it another way, removing the smoked carbon will result in casting bigger boolits both in diameter and weight.

[41 mag fan]

Great Grampa didnt do it as far as I know, I learned the trick myself commercially making sinkers, now when you get paid money to cast well then by all means feel free to cut me down but until you have banked about $400,000 in 35 years of casting as a hobby please dont waste your time trying to insult me...the carbon BY all means lets the bullets fall from the mold without a shake,rattle or tap, how many non fills have you had in your life? i have had about a dozen bullets and maybe 15 sinkers of assorted sizes ( mostly split shot from a homemade mold) not fill fully in 35+ years trying to disprove what you call an old wives tale is merely your ego

I suppose i should add I mic a lot of my bullets and they are very very consistant my lee 309-170-fp drops bullets never any larger than .310 my lee 429-208-wc has been dropping all at .429 my lee 356-124-2R drops at .357 the lee 356-124-TC drops at .356

Jon...question on this. i'm not out to start a pi**ing match, but I got a true question to ask. Why do you feel the need to smoke your cavities of your boolits?
On the jigs and all yes i could see maybe the need. But why would you want to smoke your boolit cavities when you could get them to drop without smoking?
Reason I ask is way back, I smoked the cavities of my Lee 501 mold as they wouldn't fall out, unless I smoked them. Well I ended up warping the sprue plate, and bought another one.

So I bought me another, and then got into really researching what people on here were saying about how to get a mold to drop without smoking the cavities.
When I recieved my new Lee, I took a magnifying glass, seen where there was burrs, from Lees lack of QC, took an exacto knife to them.
I then heat treated my mold, got it up to heat, and my first casts were perfect. BUT I had to smack the handles to get them out of the cavities.
I cast IIRC 5 sets, set the mold off to the side and let it cool.
In the meantime, I took 1 of my good casts, drilled a hole into the base, and put a screw in it, cut the screw head off.

Next i got a little bit of water, put some comet in it, and made a paste.
Once my mold was cool enough for me to hold, I put the shank of my screw into my drill and put that comet paste on my boolit, closed the mold around the boolit and slowly started turning it.

I did this forward and backwards, stopping and putting more paste on, till I felt like I had accomplished my goal. Maybe 5 minutes total for each cavity.
Washed my mold again in hot water with some Dawn, scrubbed the cavities and went back and started heating my mold up again.
Very first cast, they fell out, dinging the bases, as they what looked liked jumped not fell.

This went on for the next 30 min. Towards the end they started sticking again, which I went in and "leemented" again.
What I didn't realize at the time, was my casting rythym was off, it didn't need another touch up.

What I did realize, after looking at my casts from my old mold and my new "leemented" mold, was my new casts were so much better looking.
I then experimented, and took my old mold, cleaned the cavities, cast me up some and did the same thing with them. Even though the bases had fins from the warped sprue plate, they fall right out....no smoking needed. And they look better..better fill out, esp around the lube grooves.

That first Lee mold, was a cheap lesson, I learned to not smack the sprue plates with a wooden dowel rod, I now open all my molds with my gloved hand.
I learned the smoking molds is not needed, that Lees due to being cheap, are low on QC. But you can take one, spend maybe 20 minutes with it and have casts fall out that look better all the way around than from a cavity thats been smoked.

I learned if you have to smoke a mold, whereby placing a release agent on the cavities, then there is a problem with the mold that a little home QC will take care of.

I also learned, that each mold has a sweet spot temperature wise, that when it's at that optimum temp they will fall out and be perfect. No rounded lube grooves, bases or voids in the mold.

I also learned that Lee being cheap on quality, when they cut their cavities, the leave little pits, voids, ect that when you pour your melt in, will grab hold and cause releasing problems. Smoke covers these spots up.

A good Leementing will smooth and polish these pits and voids out which will then cause the boolits to fall out as they have nothing in the matrix of the melt to grab ahold of and to solidify to.

I don't buy many Lee molds anymore, as I stepped up into the Accurate, NOE, and Miha molds of the world.
I will still leement these molds, but I've found I really don't need to. I do it as a just because, due to what I've learned on here yrs ago, from people who has alot more experience on casting than I did, and that perfected it.

There's alot of members on here thats been on here for quite awhile, that are very passionate about how their boolits look. It's a sense of pride thing.....I have that pride now myself and have since my 2nd Lee 501 mold.

Like I said, i'm not wanting to start a pi**ing match, it's just that it's been shown and proven you don't need to smoke your cavities to get the perfect boolit or to get them to drop.


Aside from smoking molds, should i keep the sprue plate tight or loose?

Thanks for the help guys! I shot some bullets today and they worked great. I was smacking a 8"gong at 50yds with a glock 19(with after market barrel for shooting lead). I did have a considerable amount of leading in the barrel. Could this be from too hard of lead? I've been using wheel weights and just started quenching them. Is that making them too hard and causing excessive leading?

Creature...have you slugged that barrel? Rule of thumb.....001 to .002 over bore diameter on your casts to get an obturation of the boolit base to seal your bore. Without the obturation of your boolit base, you'll have gasses bypassing and cutting your boolit which leads to leading.

[Frozone]

I use high temp silicon on my handles, works very well.

[johntkd]

41 mag fan

I will agree with what your saying to a point as you said many people on here have their own way of doing things, what you did with your mold is fine, However on that note you asked why do i smoke my molds here is the answer you asked for,
I get a smooth even flow that fills out completely the bullets look really nice no waves,pits etc, the second reason is i cut the sprue open the mold and the bullets fall out no shake, no rattle not tap,the most i ever have to do is tip to the side of the mold they are on, on that note on a new mold such as the 401-175 I got today after 200 bullets i had to resmoke a spot and could tell right away as the mold had to be given a lil shake to drop the bullet. I have always had to resmoke a mold from new 2 to 3 times and then not again for years..
3rd reason you stated you preheat your molds! I took my brand new mold today out of the box while lead was heating up cleaned it with a starting fluid and carb cleaner mix i use, smoked it and had to set the mold down for another 10 mins or so waiting for my lead to finish heating, while waiting i changed the dies out on my progressive press, came back stared casting bullets 1 thru 7 were perfect no preheat the 8th one my lee bottom pour furnace dripped as i slid the mold under right into the sprue plate ( still getting used to this furnace as I have used a pan and a propane stove forever)anyways I started with the other hole to cast and when i got to the one that received the drip of course it wouldnt fill out and caused me to have to cull that bullet, firsat bullet in 2 years i have had to melt pissed me off to but was my own fault I seen the drip but didnt think to start pouring to follow it.....

anyways I never have to preheat a mold when they are smoked to pour excellent bullets and as a matter of fact when the mold gets really hot say after 65 or 70 bullets the sprue plate starts dragging a bit excessivly as well if i do not set the mold down and let it cool i will have to resize every bullet i make after that, I keep my bullets separated by 20 ( 10 pours in a mold) when i add lead to the pot i start measurements usually bullets 40 till cool down have to be resized down this has been with all the calibers i have been casting including 45 and 50 cal maxi balls,the 401 mold i used today was no exception dropped 401 bullets till about bullet 52 where they went to .402 .403 cooled mold off and poof back to 401 so you have your reasons I have mine
and nope no pissing match everyone has their own ways for me mine works awesome. I have prolly cast between sinkers and bullets in the neighborhood of 90,000 pounds of lead in my life thats a lot of casting never killed a mold yet either I still have my very first plamer snagless sinker mold that was given to me as a Christmas gift in 1975 and a 2 oz pencil sinker mold I made a year later for personal use

[creature]

What are the negative effects of a mold getting too hot? As long as the lead in the cavities is solidifying and it's not leaving holes in the middle of the base of the bullet am I okay?

I'm still trying to figure out what was causing the bases of my bullets to flare out. It's almost like lead is puddling out of the mould in between the sprue plate a little.