My Big Cheap Melting Pot

[detox]

Today I purchased an old 5 gal propane tank from my local scrap yard ($8.50). I cut it slightly higher than halfway using cutoff wheel. Before cutting i filled it with water and flushed it out well so that tank would not explode in my face. Lead weighs 95 lbs per gallon so i figure this pot will hold atleast 2 gallons or 200 lbs of melted lead.

[DeanWinchester]

I did the same thing to a freon tank. I use it smelt zinc.

[Boolseye]

yep, that's how it's done. BTW, clean job cutting it.

[PS Paul]

Nice cut, it would appear! I would normally have it lookin' like a ragged edge with hills and dales (ha ha) once I got done with that cutoff wheel!!

[detox]

To cut that strait line i wrapped tape around tank then cut along tape edge...very simple. Air tool uses lots of air, so i had to wait then cut, wait then cut, wait then cut....it took about 15 minutes to complete. I may install a wire handle and form a pour spout on edge by pounding and bending metal. The rounded bottom of tank makes it easier to scoop out lead when level gets low.

[Von Gruff]

Now cut another ring from the top of the tank and sit the base of your "pot" into it so it has a skirt on it that will concentrate the heat on the base of the tank without it running upo the sides and dissipating in the air. You will use less gas to keep it hot that way. I did mine like that on a smaller tank and then cut grooves so the skirt notched over the bars of the gas fire and enclosed the whole of the flame. A few welds and it will stay in place.

[RoGrrr]

detox
I had a 3 QT cast iron pot I used for smelting. I also have a set of 18 inch channel locks that I gripped the side opposite from the handle so I could control it easier (?). After doing several hundred pounds of ore I decided it wasn't worth the risk of handling and my feet are worth a whole lot more so I built a new pot with a bottom pour valve. Mine holds about 200 Lbs also but I never have to handle that.
I also don't have to be over the pot while it has melt in it.

I STRONGLY suggest you install a valve on it so you don't burn yourself badly.

BTW, nice clean cut on yours

[Racenviper]

Now cut another ring from the top of the tank and sit the base of your "pot" into it so it has a skirt on it that will concentrate the heat on the base of the tank without it running upo the sides and dissipating in the air. You will use less gas to keep it hot that way. I did mine like that on a smaller tank and then cut grooves so the skirt notched over the bars of the gas fire and enclosed the whole of the flame. A few welds and it will stay in place.

Do you have a photo? We like photos. I believe I understand.

[Racenviper]

Today I purchased an old 5 gal propane tank from my local scrap yard ($8.50). I cut it slightly higher than halfway using cutoff wheel. Before cutting i filled it with water and flushed it out well so that tank would not explode in my face. Lead weighs 95 lbs per gallon so i figure this pot will hold atleast 2 gallons or 200 lbs of melted lead.

You did not remove the valve from the tank? I just removed the valve from a tank that was expired, this last weekend. 5.75 gallons of water to fill the tank to get the remaining propane out of it. Later in the day I could still smell propane at that tank. It is still sitting upside down hoping to remove the rest of the gas. Propane is lighter then water but heavier than air.

[oih]

I'd have cut less. Just enough to be able to flux the molten lead. The cut you made maximizes the surface that is exposed to air, and thus heatloss. and by the way; what sort og heat source are you using? F-18 afterburner? I've never attempted to liquify 200Ibs of lead, but in theory it takes quiet a few Joules, and usually more when trying it out live.

As for other sources of pots; scubatanks are made to hold 200-300 bars pressure, and they are pressure tested bi-annually (at lease here). When they fail, you have a thick, high quality steel pot, and you can have them for nothing at scuba stores. Don't get aluminium or composite though. Problem is to cut them, an angle grinder might not be able to handle it. Might need to borrow an acttylene torch, these tanks are also round at the botton, which make them suitable for propane. Old fire extinguishers are also sometimes made of steel, but probably a lesser gauge.

Øivind

[detox]

Now cut another ring from the top of the tank and sit the base of your "pot" into it so it has a skirt on it that will concentrate the heat on the base of the tank without it running upo the sides and dissipating in the air. You will use less gas to keep it hot that way. I did mine like that on a smaller tank and then cut grooves so the skirt notched over the bars of the gas fire and enclosed the whole of the flame. A few welds and it will stay in place.

VERYGOOD idea. I do have a small mig welder. I could just tack ring into place. On second thought i would not have to tack weld it on. I could just set ring on top of burner then rest pot on top of it. I could cut ring a little short for just a little ventilation and to direct heat up and all around pot's round bottom.

I did not remove valve before cutting because darn thing is on there tight. This tank came with a 1/2" hole drilled on top (you can see black hole in picture).

[detox]

Here is a good deal on electric cut off tool. Coupon Expires May 31 2013
http://widgets.harborfreight.com/wswidgets/common/displayCoupon.do?week=2213&campaign=b&page=coupon25.html&single=true&cust=61070717974&keycode=1002

[Von Gruff]

Do you have a photo? We like photos. I believe I understand.

As I said it is a smaller pot at just 6 in dia but you get the idea.

http://i667.photobucket.com/albums/vv39/VonGruff/Cast%20bullets/008_zps3856de58.jpg (http://s667.photobucket.com/user/VonGruff/media/Cast%20bullets/008_zps3856de58.jpg.html)

http://i667.photobucket.com/albums/vv39/VonGruff/Cast%20bullets/009_zps96a491a0.jpg (http://s667.photobucket.com/user/VonGruff/media/Cast%20bullets/009_zps96a491a0.jpg.html)

[Gibbs44]

Those notches look like they lock it on top of the burner, helping to prevent tipping in the event of an accidental bump.

[Von Gruff]

They do that too, but the primary reason was to get theskirt down to the flame base and direct ALL of the heat to the base of the pot.

[shadowcaster]

After doing several hundred pounds of ore I decided it wasn't worth the risk of handling and my feet are worth a whole lot more so I built a new pot with a bottom pour valve. Mine holds about 200 Lbs also but I never have to handle that.
I also don't have to be over the pot while it has melt in it.

I STRONGLY suggest you install a valve on it so you don't burn yourself badly.

I too feel that making a pour of more than a few pounds (including the weight of the pot) to be dangerous and not worth the risk. It will be worth the extra effort to built a spout/valve or let the remaining alloy cool and then just lift it out. The bottom pour smelter I built is a 400 pounder and I can ladle from the top if I choose to, or drain it down to almost nothing.

Shad

[leeggen]

Lot of static pres. on 200 LB. of lead, be careful when you put the valve on it. Open slowly first time and until you get used to it.
CD

[detox]

This propane pot will hold slightly over 200 lbs of lead, but the most i will probably ever smelt is 150 lbs. The high sides will allow me to stir and flux vigorously using sawdust without spilling lead over sides. I am now working on making my burner more efficient thus saving fuel. I will use Two Visegrip plyers to lift pot and pour melt when level gets too low to dip.

I wonder if covering the pot with lid between pours reduces dross (oxidized tin) build up

[shadowcaster]

As I value my unburnt legs and feet... At approx 700 degrees I wish you the best of luck with your "Two Vise grip pliers" pot lifter!

Shad

[detox]

As I value my unburnt legs and feet... At approx 700 degrees I wish you the best of luck with your "Two Vise grip pliers" pot lifter!

Shad

The remaining 10-12 lbs of melted lead will be easy to lift. I will turn off the fire then grip top edge of pot with one set of Visegrips and then tilt pot and grab the bottom edge then pour.

[country gent]

This is as a "side bar" on using vise grips to lift things. At one shop I worked it was common practice to use vise grips to Carry sheet meatl sheets and lift them to the shears, Brakes and rolls. Worked for years. Only took once of a set releasing at the wrong moment ( almost up to the brakes table) and coming down on a foot to show the error of this. Stitches and week or so off work for the guy. Slid down his shin and onto his foot. A solid handle built onto the pot would be much safer. Oh the week after this guy came back to work there was a cam operated sheet lift in house.

[sirgknight]

I've used this pot for about five years. It started out as a propane tank but with modifications. First I made a pour spout for it. Then I welded three feet on it and cut a slot in the bottom of the feet so that they will sit snugly on the burner grate. Topped it off with two welded handles to make it easy to pick up. Works like a champ. I think steel is the only way to go when working with molten lead.

[D Crockett]

I have had aluminum pot fail on me and I have had cast iron pot fail on me. and this was before computer were so handy. then I learned about propane tanks. never had one of them fail on me yet. I use a piece of angle for the spout on mine and it works great. the best handles I have found to get the last little bit of lead out of the pot are c clamps. they do not get as hot as wielded on handles do. Sirgknight has it right about steel being the best to use when melting lead. D Crockett

[alfloyd]

I built mine out of a old propane (LP) tank. I cut it just above the welded seam like detox did.
I then cut a second tank in half and made a skirt to go around the outside of the tank. This skirt curves in at the top of the tank and has holes in it there. This makes the heat go up the sides of the inner tank all the way to the top. Saves gas.
The skirt is flush with the ring on the bottom of the pot so it sits solid on the turkey fryer burner.
I had to cut and splice a section into the skirt to make it large enough to fit the outside of the inner tank. That is why I cut the second tank in half, so it would be make larger to fit the outside of the pot.

Lafaun

[mold maker]

Unless your changing alloy, why empty the pot? Just let it cool and then drop the slug out. (or leave it in place) You can mark it, and keep it with your like ingots. Putting it back in the pot before starting another melt speeds things up.
This totally eliminates the dangers of handling a pot with molten lead.
The weight of lead will overbalance a dutch oven with the wire handle, and dump it out of control. Been there, done that.

[nicholst55]

I wonder if covering the pot with lid between pours reduces dross (oxidized tin) build up

I dunno about that, but it definitely traps heat and makes the lead melt faster.

[bhop]

This skirt curves in at the top of the tank and has holes in it there. This makes the heat go up the sides of the inner tank all the way to the top.
The skirt is flush with the ring on the bottom of the pot so it sits solid on the turkey fryer burner.
I had to cut and splice a section into the skirt to make it large enough to fit the outside of the inner tank.

Lafaun
Could you possibly post a pic of this please?

[detox]

This should direct heat better. I cut a ring from other half of tank to go around bottom edge of pot. I also raised the burner closer to bottom of pot.

[detox]

I just smelted 250 lbs of lead. It took 1 hour for pot to reach 675 degrees. Flame was set high, but not wide open (10 psi regulator). I did not use lid to trap heat.

[shadowcaster]

A pot of gold! :) Just a thought though. Have you tested out your burner for it's weight capacity? The legs, at least it's how it looks like in the pic, look like they won't take a lot of weight.

Shad

[detox]

A pot of gold! :) Just a thought though. Have you tested out your burner for it's weight capacity? The legs, at least it's how it looks like in the pic, look like they won't take a lot of weight.

Shad

Before smelting, i set all lead in pot then tried to shake cooker. The Bayou Classic cooker seemed sturdy enough to proceed with smelt. After being fluxed, I dipped some alloy into two smaller #8 cast iron pots to be smelted again and poured into ingots later. Next i will fabricate larger ingot mould.

Alloy is close to Lyman #2 with a BHN of 12-14

[Randy C]

:coffeecom

[wrench]

Here's a pic of my propane tank pot. I made a wire bale handle for it, and heated up a spot, then bashed it with a pry bar and a hammer to make a spout.
I usually only melt 50-75 lbs at a time, and use a big ladle from rayinnh to get it out and fill the ingot molds.
Lots of room to flux and stir.

[detox]

I like the handle and spout. Where can i find stiff wire like that?

[Randy C]

I would use one that come from a paint Bucket, and I would use It only when the pot is almost empty.

[wrench]

I would think a hardware store would have 1/4" steel rod, mine was just something I had laying around. Wood handle is a chunk cut from a broom handle. I only use the handle for lifting the pot when it's nearly empty, and I want to pour the last little bit out. I welded that piece of corner bracket on the back to support the handle so it doesn't burn up, also it's a convenient place to grab with a vise grip to help tilt the pot to pour.

[troutman]

going to make mine similar out of 2 propane tanks bought for 5.00 at scrap yard while looking for lead and cast iron pot. Tanks already cut above half way with a torch so clean up necessary. They had about a half dozen but I restraind myself. The skirt on the bottom is a dandy idea. I plan on making wire loop handles although I wont be picking up with more than 20 lbs if even that. Only in odd situations. Had no idea lead weighed 100 lbs per gallon!

[detox]

Smelting lead during hotter Spring,Summer, Fall months can be brutally hot. Especially when casting ingots from a large tank filled with 250 lbs of hot 675 degree lead. So i filled my smaller cast iron pots to be casted into ingots at a later date when it is cooler outside. I also filled my 20 lb Lee electric ladle pot with this alloy.

[JIMinPHX]

Here's a pic of my propane tank pot. I made a wire bale handle for it, and heated up a spot, then bashed it with a pry bar and a hammer to make a spout.
I usually only melt 50-75 lbs at a time, and use a big ladle from rayinnh to get it out and fill the ingot molds.
Lots of room to flux and stir.

Geeze, I was going to build a propane tank pot with a bottom pour valve, but after seeing this version, I may change my mind.

[shadowcaster]

Geeze, I was going to build a propane tank pot with a bottom pour valve, but after seeing this version, I may change my mind.

A well designed bottom pour smelter is really hard to beat!

Shad

[JIMinPHX]

Yea, but that thing looks so easy to make, & it would probably work pretty darn well too.

Trying to build a non-drip-o-matic valve for one of those is probably a full scale project.

[shadowcaster]

Yea, but that thing looks so easy to make, & it would probably work pretty darn well too.

Trying to build a non-drip-o-matic valve for one of those is probably a full scale project.

My design is super simple to build and not a single drip.

Shad

[Idz]

I notice most smelters are pot-on-fire arrangements. When I'm melting down range scrap it smokes like crazy so I enclosed my propane tank pot in a furnace box made out of 18" patio pavers, used the cut off tank section as a pot lid, and cover the furnace top with a piece of sheet metal. My burner is a Harbor Freight weed torch that can put out 500,000 btu/hr but I throttle it down to about 36,000. By keeping everything enclosed the noxious smoke in the pot becomes a reducing atmosphere to 'flux' the metal and doesn't annoy the neighbors. After cooking 100 lbs of scrap for about 45 minutes I can open things up and most of the smoke has been reduced to carbon. I calculated a melting efficiency of about 15%. I think I can do better with a true insulated furnace box but am not that ambitious. Does anybody have guesses/measurements of efficiencies of the open pot-on-burner smelters?

[RoGrrr]

Some of you fellas have built some nice looking equipment and I'm sure you are taking good pride in it. Starting out, I used a 3 quart cast iron pan to smelt several hundred pounds of range scrap into ingots. I puckered up EVERY time I lifted it from the turkey burner to pour into my moulds.
I finally decided it was not worth the risk of pouring/dumping/leaking 30 or so pounds out and splashing it all over the place and cooking my feet to the point that I might never be able to walk again. I looked at many of the bottom pour pots here and bit the boolit and designed and built a hefty bottom pour pot that I never have to lift. Consequently, I have no worries about burning my feets.
I strongly recommend everybody either limit your melt to 10 or 15 Lbs so you can easily handle it or build a bottom valve pot.
Also if you are going to lift and pour, either stand on a metal grating such as a heavy duty drain grate or have a layer of COARSE (#4) gravel/crushed limestone so if the pot fails, the molten lead will flow down between the gravel and be UNDER your feet. I learned this tip from some metal smelters (no, not lead, but aluminum/brass) who have numerous stories about people who were seriously injured when their smelt escaped.

[shadowcaster]

Some of you fellas have built some nice looking equipment and I'm sure you are taking good pride in it. Starting out, I used a 3 quart cast iron pan to smelt several hundred pounds of range scrap into ingots. I puckered up EVERY time I lifted it from the turkey burner to pour into my moulds.
I finally decided it was not worth the risk of pouring/dumping/leaking 30 or so pounds out and splashing it all over the place and cooking my feet to the point that I might never be able to walk again. I looked at many of the bottom pour pots here and bit the boolit and designed and built a hefty bottom pour pot that I never have to lift. Consequently, I have no worries about burning my feets.
I strongly recommend everybody either limit your melt to 10 or 15 Lbs so you can easily handle it or build a bottom valve pot.
Also if you are going to lift and pour, either stand on a metal grating such as a heavy duty drain grate or have a layer of COARSE (#4) gravel/crushed limestone so if the pot fails, the molten lead will flow down between the gravel and be UNDER your feet. I learned this tip from some metal smelters (no, not lead, but aluminum/brass) who have numerous stories about people who were seriously injured when their smelt escaped.

That's how I started out too, and won't go back to the ladle method if I can help it.

++1... Very well put on the dangers of smelting and the safety precautions one can take!

Shad

[detox]

I would use one that come from a paint Bucket, and I would use It only when the pot is almost empty.

Good idea. I removed wire handle from my 5 gal paint bucket. I will attach it to pot when it is allmost empty to pour remaining 7 lbs. I have poured from this pot a couple of times using visegrip pliers and i have decided that spout is not needed.

The diameter of this pot is 12 inches, same diameter of 5 gal paint bucket. This wire handle fits perfect.

[Racenviper]

I finished mine today a used it. Smelt down 113 lbs of range lead. Using a propane tank works so much better then a dutch oven. With the curve bottom one can almost empty it while it sits on the burner. I made my cut below the weld a was glad I did as there was a nasty lip at the weld seam. Overall I happy with the way it turned out.

[RoGrrr]

I finished mine today a used it. Smelt down 113 lbs of range lead. Using a propane tank works so much better then a dutch oven. With the curve bottom one can almost empty it while it sits on the burner. I made my cut below the weld a was glad I did as there was a nasty lip at the weld seam. Overall I happy with the way it turned out.

RV
While I'm entirely happy with my furnace, I'm wondering what kind of handle you have on your vessel. I hadn't thought of doing what you describe here and if I ever replace my exotic furnace I will give serious thought to what you have done. While I do like the ability to pour the pot empty I think it is advantageous to leave some remnant to facilitate melting the next batch of ore.
The huge ladles in smelting plants where they smelt TONS of steel and other metals gave me the idea to gimbal the (propane tank) vessel for ease of handling.
Originally, I was going to install one of those hose hangers like you see in the self-serve car washes, in which the hose/wand is suspended from the ceiling so you can swivel it and walk all around your car and spray (I found one at a scrap yard and it was just too good a deal to pass up so I bought it). Then I saw shadowcaster's setup and changed my design so I don't have to lift or swing anything to pour. I'm thinking about selling mine and building an updated version tho. Mine is 7" by 9" and 7 inches deep. Shad's is no more than 5" deep which is good for scooping out jackets and dross.
If you want to see what I have, go to imgur, as shown in my sig.line. Also there is a lengthy thread on gathering/cleaning and sorting at:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?174512-Range-diving-186lbs&highlight=186lbs
I believe up to 77 posts.

[Racenviper]

I don't have a handle yet, was going to put one on just as 'detox' has in the post previous to mine. I just have a handle from a bucket that would work, as a modified a bucket for a Frankford arsnel brass separator I use for my stainless steel pins.

[RoGrrr]

I don't have a handle yet, was going to put one on just as 'detox' has in the post previous to mine. I just have a handle from a bucket that would work, as a modified a bucket for a Frankford arsnel brass separator I use for my stainless steel pins.

Considering how heavy my 3 quart cast iron pan was when filled only halfway, if I were using a propane bottle, I'd want not only the bail as a handle, I'd also drill 2 holes thru the rim 90 degrees off from your bail and stick a rod (1/2 inch all-thread) thru both holes with it sticking out about a foot (it would be just below his index finger) as a lever/handle for you to hold onto and control your pour.

[Lance Boyle]

I have a cut down propane cylinder. I wanted to add a bail handle and a re-rod loop handle opposite of the spout. When I figured out the weight of what I would have in there I just skipped the handles altogether to eliminate the want to move a hot pot. I will probably add two re-rod handles only for handling cold. I have a large plumbers ladle about the size of a half softball I use to fill the ingot molds.

I have retained the top half of the cut down propane cylinder and have rough plans to make a bottom pour from that. It's already got the hole in the bottom, just make a rod and grind a point on it and grind to fit to the hole. Plumb a pour tube to an ingot mold shelf. I'd have to revisit the other designs on here to not oversize the pour pipe, that's a lot of head pressure on the pour to make a molten squirt gun/ splasher.

[RoGrrr]

Use the upper half of the propane bottle and put a valve on it. Use it as a bottom pour furnace. Use the handle ring as the support and center the burner under there.
Granted, I talked about handles on the pot but do it the easy way.
These things are just too heavy to manhandle especially when they are hot. Don't ask for more trouble than necessary. I like my bottom pour smelter.