Vintage scopes for vintage rifles

[frnkeore]

Pictured are a Lyman 438 and 422 Expert. How many of you use these scopes on the vintage 22's?

Frank

71206

[Taylor]

Sure would look good on my Mossberg.

[pietro]

.

I have a Weaver B-6 on my Winchester 69A

http://imageshack.us/a/img211/3572/dscn1052l.jpg

[avogunner]

+1 on the Weaver B6. I have one on the older of my two Marlin 39's (1952).

[NoZombies]

I use an old mossberg branded scope on my model 35 mossy. The scope is in a quick detach side mount, and I can pull it off and use the peep sights if needed. It's a pretty neat set up, but I must have looked for 3 years to find the correct scope for the gun and mount!

[Iowa Fox]

I have a 12X Unertl on a original low wall action with a 52 barrel chambered in 22 K Hornet.

[Bent Ramrod]

The 438 was Lyman's update of an original Stevens design, IIRC. It had half-decent mounts for the time, and could be set reasonably close, if you didn't insist on target-grade reproducibility. If you don't mind a little chromatic character around the edges of your vision and the fact that those small old scopes "gather darkness," it isn't too bad, especially if you like the "period" look. Better than notch and bead iron sights, anyway.

I messed with a 422 Expert for months on a Savage Model 23C, trying to get it to work. The optics of the scope were fuzzy and could be focused either on the crosshair or the outside view but not both at once. The mount is abominable; never could get it set right, so point of impact was never on, and was never the same from session to session.

I like the old stuff, but Three Thumbs Down on that one.

[frnkeore]

The 438 and the 422 are the same basic scope (mounts excluded) and adjust for focus/paralax in the same manor they both have a seperate X-hair focus. The ocular lens cells can be interchanged between the two. I can agree about the 422 mount but, once set and locked on a 22 rf, it won't move.

Besides the Stevens and Lyman, the Mossberg, Walensak and Marlins used the same design (they all have ~16mm, 5 lens systems) and while not gathering as much light as a 30mm tubed, 50mm objective, they do very good target work to as far away as 200 yards for me in 8x power (Mossberg & Carolyn) and I've boosted the Mossbergs to as high as 14X with good usable magnification at as far as 200 yards.

Frank

[uscra112]

I have three or four of those. Used one on my .25-21 Stevens for a short while, but as was mentioned above it was better at "gathering darkness" than anything else. Switched it to a Junior Targetspot. The 438s are now gathering dust.

[Baron von Trollwhack]

I have a refurbed 438 waiting for the right rifle now. The Winnie is gone.

I also have Dad"s 81 DL from 1946. I was allowed to have Kuharsky Brothers mount the scope in 1961( one of those took the rifle to school to go by the gunshop later stories too). It still hunts. Had many of the classic scopes over the years , big head Unertyls, arm long redfields, classic Weaver variables for the 722 series.

Happy the question was asked.

BvT

[frnkeore]

I have three or four of those. Used one on my .25-21 Stevens for a short while, but as was mentioned above it was better at "gathering darkness" than anything else. Switched it to a Junior Targetspot. The 438s are now gathering dust.

Phil,
Do you have a 438, 3 point turret that you'd like to sell?

Frank

[drsfmd]

I'm partial to Unertyl myself. Not only do they work well, they are perhaps the weirdest looking scopes ever made!

[gnoahhh]

I had a M1919 Savage that came with a 438 mounted on it. The scope worked ok, but as stated before, repeatable adjustments were dodgy. I cared not a whit for the rifle, so the whole rig got traded down the road.

The only reason I don't have Unertls on all my rifles is the crazy prices they fetch on the used market. The heck with gold, I wish I had filled a closet with Unertls 30 years ago!

My M1922M2 currently wears an ancient Fecker Small Game scope. I keep hoping to stumble onto another one.

Maybe somebody here can comment on a project I'm wrapping up. I have a little pre-war German single shot, break open, hammerless, double set triggers, 26" octagon barrel, weighs a tic under 5lbs., chambered in 5.6x35R (.22 Hornet, nee .22WCF). Accuracy with .221" jacketed bullets, not so hot (it has a .221" groove diameter) but shoots wonderfully with a 225438 cast bullet over 2gr. Bullseye- 1" and less at 50yds., open sights. That is the load that'll get used pretty exclusively for its intended purpose- squirrels. My question is this: I have a vintage Weaver B6 rimfire scope that is pristine and with surprisingly bright optics. After machining custom mounts to mate it to the existing holes on the top flat of the barrel, do you think that the *****-foot recoil of this load will wreck the scope in the long run? I like the idea of the long 3/4" scope on this classic little rifle, mounted as low as humanly possible. A 'modern' 1" scope wouldn't look right, IMO, and even a small Unertl would over balance it too.

[Bent Ramrod]

I would say go ahead. I have a Weaver B6 in Stith mounts on my Savage .25-35 lever action. No problems, once it was set to POA, and I have shot the gun a lot.

Those Fecker Small Game scopes are indeed top-notch.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Weaver B4 on this Romanian 1969 trainer.
luckily the short eye relief coincides with the rear site.
http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/mod1969_zps771014d6.jpg (http://s640.photobucket.com/user/JonB_in_Glencoe/media/mod1969_zps771014d6.jpg.html)

[NoZombies]

Here's the Mossberg 35 with the proper scope and mount. It's the original rubber eyecup as well. As you can see, the peep is turned to the side for scope usage.

72128

[gnoahhh]

I would say go ahead. I have a Weaver B6 in Stith mounts on my Savage .25-35 lever action. No problems, once it was set to POA, and I have shot the gun a lot.

Those Fecker Small Game scopes are indeed top-notch.

Thanks. That gives me the confidence to go with my sense of aesthetics!

[frnkeore]

Here's the Mossberg 35 with the proper scope and mount. It's the original rubber eyecup as well. As you can see, the peep is turned to the side for scope usage.

72128

Very nice. Those #6 Mossbergs and #10 Wards scopes were very popular and very good scopes.

Frank

[country gent]

I occasionally shoot a small bore match at a local club with a win model 52 D that was purchsed thru the CMP/DCM years ago ( would have loved to get one of the 40X remingtons also) on this rifle I mounted an old Lyman Target spot external adjustment scope in 16X. The rifle is rough after many years of service with the AMU but will still hit 22 cal bullet holes at 50 yds with the right ammos. I get a lot of odd looks uncasing it ( do to its outward apperance) right up to when the first target comes back from the hangers. LOL. The kimber 82 Target I got from CMP/DCM is the same although it has the iron sights on it. The win lymann combo is just the ticket for me the Blocks are even lyman made not unertals.

[NoZombies]

Very nice. Those #6 Mossbergs and #10 Wards scopes were very popular and very good scopes.

Frank

I just wish the scope was a little brighter, I've considered having the scope cleaned by a pro, but I'm not sure how much it would help. I assume the rubber eyecup came with it originally for a reason...

[Baron von Trollwhack]

An old Weaver V-22 small tube variable would work well also. It has a 7/8" tube and a brighter picture. BTW rimfire central has a sale/swap section and these types of early 22 scopes often appear. BvT

[69daytona]

Here is one of my Winchester 52B with Baush and lomb scope on it, gun was made in 48 and scope in 64, Variable power 6-24 as clear as my new US Optics sn3 3.8-22 x56

[w30wcf]

Here's a pic of my 1948 Marlin 39A with a vintage Weaver K4 1946 series scope (first year for the K4) ...before they added scope adjustment caps.

http://i116.photobucket.com/albums/o25/w30wcf/Leverguns/39A19493-1.jpg

w30wcf

[Randy C]

:coffeecom

[texassako]

My only vintage .22 that also has a vintage scope, '50's BSA Int'l MkII with a Unertl:

73908

[Bent Ramrod]

Allyn Tedmon ("The Godfather of Stevens Rifles") built up a .25-20 single shot Stevens 44-1/2 out of parts back in the 1930s and used it for a prairie dog rifle. I couldn't find a 44-1/2 to chop up but I liked the look of the gun he had built with its little Weaver scope, barrel band and sling. I found a junker Stevens 414 that was a hopeless case for restoration and replicated Tedmon's rifle instead, in .22 RF. It shoots very well, and looks "period," although a different "period" than the originals.

74033

[texassako]

Bent Ramrod, is that all or the front part of a Stith mount on the Stevens? I like it.

[Bent Ramrod]

Texassako,

It is a Stith mount. I welded an extension on the rear part so I could fit it into the slot for the long-gone receiver sight. I had to make a pad for the front mount because there was no barrel slot at that point, and the dovetail adapter on the mount was missing anyway. It's a post reticle scope.

It used to be easy to find Stith mounts and parts at gun shows; not so much any more. I guess people have caught on. They were a really solid mounting that usually didn't require extra holes being drilled in the gun.

[Nickle]

I've got a Remington 513T that used to wear a Lyman Super TargetSpot from time time. Got to find a replacement for it.

[Andyd]

An Anschütz 1423 from the mid fifties with a period appropriate Hensoldt 4x32 and SEM mounts.

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z159/Andyd173/DSCF7177.jpg

All these rimfire rifles have scopes from the period and mounts, too.

http://i189.photobucket.com/albums/z159/Andyd173/Exportrifles.jpg

[RobsTV]

One of my favorite shooters is this original scoped Enfield.

74821

[Herb in Pa]

BSA International with 15x Unertl
H&R M12 with it's 24X Unertl75160

[Brad Phillips]

I use a Belgium made Browning T-bolt with a Weaver K10 scope for an across the yard rabbit whacker. Was always curious about a lack of rear sight..... Just the other day I found an unmarked peep sight that must belong to the T-bolt.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Here's my Mauser ES-340B made in 1929.

I mounted a Weaver K4 on an Anschutz one piece mount in 1978. It is still zeroed at 75 yards and has been off and on the rifle hundreds of times.

I am going for my clubs .22 Silhouette champ this year using the open sights. Will shoot again this Sat.

A month ago I shot 28/40 with the open sights.

I don't shoot it that well with the scope. But it goes right back when I'm done.


Randy