Shooting steel; the target's limits?

[dilly]

Hello, I just purchased a cheapy steel target and wanted to know if you guys can give me some advice on its limits. I could find out its limits easily enough but with steel targets trial and error can be expensive.

It says it can handle 9mm to 30-06, which I think is a pretty tough little target for this price range. Obviously they say don't use FMJ and skinny fast rounds like 243. Couple questions remain though.

The 30 yard minimum for pistols they recommend, is that for ricochet safety or for the sake of the steel? I mean could I use a light 38 spec at 15 or how does that work?

Where does my 45-70 lie on this spectrum? I shoot 405 gr cast bullets at trapdoor pressures. I would think it would be much easier on steel that 30-06 but I thought I'd double check.

I have similar concerns about my 44 magnum.

If I noticed significant denting from a 44 or a 45-70 or something would I be better to change to a heavier bullet, lighter bullet, less powder or what? I'd prefer not to get too skimpy on the loads because I kind of like a gun to let me know when I fired it.

I am also curious about bullet design. I understand that cast does less damage than FMJ, but how should I expect soft points to treat the target? Hollow points? Plated bullets? Polymer tipped?


It's a Do-All Outdoors Double Blast, if anyone is familiar with the product and has a personal experience they would like to add.

Thanks for your input guys.

[45-70 Chevroner]

In the cowboy shoots they use hard steel. The regulations state that the targets should not be any closer that 21 feet. Of course that is for cast lead boolits. I would worry about j-words, so I would stick with the 30 yards for j-words. If the steel you are using will handle 30-06 I would say that it is hardened steel. A 30-06 will shoot right through a 1/2" of cold rolled steel.

[captain-03]

Most steel advertised for centerfire rifle state they are tested at 100yrds ........

[dilly]

100 yards rifle, 30 yards handgun is what the paperwork says.

[Stephen Cohen]

At 50yrds my 243 and 85gr Sierra will punch right though 1/4inch mild steel, I would stick to cast and when target becomes hollow turn it around.

[milkman]

With Jacketed, velocity is not your friend. My experience with 1/2" hardened steel hanging targets is 30-06 will crater the steel at 100 yds and at 50 yds a 7 mag left a 3/8" hole completely through, with visible rifling marks on the inside of the hole. ALSO---- I had a 22-250 round come back by my ear because of a tilted swinging target. If the target is not flat and hanging vertically straight or tilted away from the shooter DON"T USE IT
Milkman

[BruceB]

My steel IPSC silhouette target is cut from 3/8" AR500 plate.

At 100 yards, full power .308 150-grain softpoints and full-power .223 55 V-max loads have no effect on the steel, except to remove the paint. No cratering, no dents, nothing. Even so, I prefer to reserve this target for lead-bullet loads from rifle, handgun and shotgun.

[shootinfox2]

The key to that is the AR500 rating lof the steel.

[canyon-ghost]

AR is tough steel but, you'll want to place it as far back as you can. I build and shoot targets of your average #3 mild steel. At 40 yards, a 22 long rifle won't hurt it as much as a 17hmr. Fast rounds like the 17 will hammer it hard enough to crack! Even 1/4" at 100 yards will be pierced by high velocity rifle rounds.

Shooting lead at steel is good only as long as the steel is above 1/4" thickness. 9mm isn't bad on them at 50 yards. The 45-70 will be great at 100, loaded with lead. Anything shot with jacketed or soft points is going to leave indentations and eventually crack the target or, out-and-out pierce it. Just check your damage after the first shot on different ammo types.

Good Luck,
Ron

[Tyler Anderson]

Speed kills steel. Its not the jacket, If you think about it, the copper jacket is still way softer than the steel you are shooting. When I was younger, my friend and I shot steel with everything we could get our hands on, from 22 to 50 bmg. The one thing we found is that nothing will destroy a steel target like speed. A big bullet from a 45/70 going slow...makes a big smear on steel. A 40 gr from a 223, either goes through or leave a deep pock mark. Jacketed bullets from a 300 whisper at subsonic velocity, they just leave a lead mark. The cartridges that were the hardest on steel had heavy bullets and high velocity. (338 lapua, 375 H&H...etc). The 50 was a different story as it typically has steel cores, which certainly do more damage to steel.

One thing that we did not notice much difference with is the type of bullet. a 55 fmj did about the same amount of damage as a 55gr soft point. There may have been some difference, but not enough for us to notice without measuring.

The reason that most ranges don't allow you to shoot jacked bullets at their steel targets is that they are typically going faster, and thus do more damage. I will agree that jacketed bullets will create more splash back than lead bullets, so I would not feel as comfortable with them at close range on steel.

When we used to shoot handgun at 3/8 mild steel, if you shot them with a 9mm with round nose bullets, it would just leave a tiny dent. If you shot them with flat point bullets, it would leave a much larger dent. The dents weren't huge, but you could see a difference.

[BBQJOE]

I have a bunch of steel targets, and they are always the most fun to shoot to me.
They are all rated "Magnum". I generally shoot them with .38, 9mm, and .44. and they've never shown any wear except for the paint. That is, until I loaned them to a friend, who shot them full of holes with a high powered rifle.[smilie=b:

[Love Life]

Who did you buy the target from? Is it AR500 or is it el cheapo steel?

I've bent over el-cheapo steel targets with a 9mm shooting 115 LRN.
I've punched through el cheapo steel targets at 400 yards using the 308 and 175 gr SMK bullets.

Ar500 is the way to go.

The target with holes is just cold rolled. The target with no holes is AR500. Both were shot at 400 yds with the exact same bullet, powder charge, brass, and from the same rifle.

If the manufacture gives you a performance envelope, then I would do what it says...

[plainsman456]

I had a target cut from some scrap 1 inch steel plate,it came out of the oil field.

We usually shot it with 22s and all that happened were lead smears and dust.

I had been playing with some 80 grain cast in my 25x39 so i shot it at 50 yards.

It cratered the plate about 1/4 deep.

I had a few more from loading tests to shoot up so it was moved to 100.
It still got cratered.
Like i said don't know what type it is but them cast sure do leave a mark.

[Stonecrusher]

At our gun club they have 17yd minimum for shooting the plate racks. Even at that, once in a blue moon a thin washer of lead will make back to the shooters general area. By then it isn't going fast enough to do much damage, as long as you are wearing glasses.

[BruceB]

The key to that is the AR500 rating lof the steel.

Well, of course!

When my fabricator friend started-in to build this target, I specified the AR500 precisely because of its known qualities. The target cost me over $150, whereas a mild-steel equivalent was closer to $50.

I went with the AR500 in hopes I'd have, with care, a lifetime of shooting ahead of me with a DURABLE target."Pay once, cry once", right? So far, so good. From now on, jacketed rounds will only be used on this target at longer ranges, such as 300-plus yards. CAST rifle loads are non-harmful even at 50 yards, but due care should preserve the target for many years.

The IPSC-silhouette pattern offers a very realistic size for practicing game or SHTF purposes.

Hanging steel targets so that they are free to swing will greatly reduce target damage, giving much longer life-spans.

[BBQJOE]

At our gun club they have 17yd minimum for shooting the plate racks. Even at that, once in a blue moon a thin washer of lead will make back to the shooters general area. By then it isn't going fast enough to do much damage, as long as you are wearing glasses.
There are no if's when shooting steel, you will eventually get hit or sprayed with lead at some time. Unless you're at 100 yds or something.

[Love Life]

Well, of course!

When my fabricator friend started-in to build this target, I specified the AR500 precisely because of its known qualities. The target cost me over $150, whereas a mild-steel equivalent was closer to $50.

I went with the AR500 in hopes I'd have, with care, a lifetime of shooting ahead of me with a DURABLE target."Pay once, cry once", right? So far, so good. From now on, jacketed rounds will only be used on this target at longer ranges, such as 300-plus yards. CAST rifle loads are non-harmful even at 50 yards, but due care should preserve the target for many years.

The IPSC-silhouette pattern offers a very realistic size for practicing game or SHTF purposes.

Hanging steel targets so that they are free to swing will greatly reduce target damage, giving much longer life-spans.

Exactly. Buy once, cry once. Old Mr. Muj was not cheap, but we have launched a large number of 30 cal procjectiles from 308, 30-06, and 300WM/300 WSM and he is still going strong. It is great for pistol as well. I went with the full size echo target. Be careful though as these targets can get heavy. Mr. Muj is 60 lbs.

[FN in MT]

I've got some 3/8" ARM-500 targets that we have been shooting at for about 20 plus years.

The full sized IPSC sillhouette has taken so many pistol rds that it started to "dish" a bit, so I recently reversed it.
Couldn't even imagine the thousands of .357 sig, 9mm, .45 acp, 10mm from MP-5's, and countless lead slugs from .22 lr to .45 Colt at +P velocities.

Rifle is a bit different. I agree that both velocity as well as bullet construction does make the difference. I have had noticeable dents at 200 yds from a buddies .30-.378 shooting light Barnes copper slugs. That same plate has been hit hundreds of times with .223 GI, .308, and both AK rds. All they do are take off the layers of paint.

Had the same aforementioned .30-.378 guy REPLACE my 50 yd pistol plates as he shot holes in them one day after being specifically told NOT to with that silly Weatherby. 200 yds is one thing. 50 yds there's still too much velocity.

My five year old ARM-500 dueling tree has never seen rifle, it's relatively new looking after a recent repaint. Velocity is the killer.