Loading the 41 special

[Matt_G]

Spent some time this weekend with this cartridge.
I had read an article by John Taffin a while back on this “wildcat” and it intrigued me.
I’ve always been drawn to the special side of the equation rather than the magnum side.
For instance, in my 44’s I rarely shoot magnum loads anymore. 98% of what I shoot are 44 special loads in 44 special brass.

When I first got my S&W Model 57-1, the first thing I did was load up some H&G 258 copies cast from one of Miha Prevac’s outstanding moulds.
I very quickly ran into several issues.
First, using 41 magnum brass, I found that if the boolit was seated so the crimp groove could be used, the cylinder in that revolver was only about .015 inches longer than the cartridge OAL. That’s cutting it a bit close.
Second, the loads I had loaded were a bit on the hot side.
Third, after just a few rounds, I found that my crimp wasn’t up to the task and a boolit jumped the crimp, tying the gun up. (Mainly due to the hot loads…)

While the gun was at the gunsmith’s I pulled all the ammo I had loaded. Powder charges were verified on a scale and triple checked against Lyman’s third edition cast handbook. Hmmm, sure enough, I had loaded what that book called starting loads. (Close enough)
220 grain cast bullet
15.7 grains of 2400 was the starting load.
20.1 grains of 2400 is max per the third edition.
I had loaded 16.0 grains.

Then I realized, I hadn’t checked a later manual.
So I checked the fourth edition of the Lyman cast manual and surprise, surprise, 16.2 grains was the MAX load for 2400 under a 220 grain cast boolit.
That’s embrassin’ is what that is…
Lesson learned.

Anyways, those things combined, especially that “short” cylinder is what got me heading down the 41 special road.
I had some brand new 41 mag brass from Starline. I took 50 of ‘em and trimmed them down to 1.150 inches. Same trim to length as the 44 special.
Using John Taffin’s article as a guide for loads, I loaded up the following:
Mihec’s H&G 258 clone. (225 grains lubed and ready to load)
Federal 150 primers
10 rounds with 6.5 grains of Unique.
10 rounds with 7.0 grains of Unique.
10 rounds with 9.0 grains of Blue Dot.
10 rounds with 9.5 grains of Blue Dot.
10 rounds with 10.0 grains of Blue Dot.
The most accurate seemed to be the 10.0 grain Blue Dot load. However, I am going to test that 9.0 grain load some more as that was really pleasant to shoot.
I could shoot that load all day long me thinks.

I’m looking forward to spending a lot more time with this cartridge. I’m thinking it is going give the 44 special a good run for its money.

[GLynn41]

hi matt-- I have a .41 Tracker--and more problem than you -- I like Keith boolits- I have the Lyman 410459--225 gr .420 nose and a Saeco .411 235 .410 nose to crimp- I trim my .41 brass- to about 1.220-and it is almost even with the cylinder- my Loads are hotter than your .41 special-- 14.-14.5 gr of 2400- or AA#9
they are nice and the brass last and lasts-- i bevel the case mouth and then seat -- and then crimp after several hundred + -- which means I do not know-- but I have had no problems -- I hunt with scoped handguns and wanted a light side arm-- and it is all that- i would try another powder but all I have is H110, AA#9 and 2400-- there is none around me-- but this is fine--- i have a MP mold but mine is a LFNgc- so I did not get inot the #258 group buy//// have fun

[Reloader06]

Matt,

Rocky Raab also has some data for the 41 Special. This is an experiment I am anxious to delve into. Keep the reports coming.

Matt(Yup)

[ddixie884]

I really like 7 to 7.5 Power Pistol under machine cast 215gr swcbb in Starline .41spl brass with a federal standard LPP.........

[Tatume]

First, using 41 magnum brass, I found that if the boolit was seated so the crimp groove could be used, the cylinder in that revolver was only about .015 inches longer than the cartridge OAL. That’s cutting it a bit close.


Hi Matt,

I disagree that 15 thousandths is insufficient clearance at the front of the cylinder. That's exactly what I use in my Freedom Arms M97. My load is a 240 gr LBT WFN GC bullet at 1150 fps. I've had no trouble whatsoever with bullet migration tying up the gun. Fifteen thousandths is plenty if a firm crimp is applied.

Take care, Tom

[Matt_G]

I forgot to mention one modification I had to make in order to make this work.
I bought another set of Redding 41 mag dies and another 41 mag profile crimp die to use for special loads.
The FL sizer, expander, and seat die all work fine with the shortened cases.
However, I couldn't crimp the cases using either the profile crimp die or the seater die.
Even with the dies hitting the shell holder, the brass was to short to hit the crimp shoulder inside the dies.
I cut about a tenth of an inch off the profile crimp die and it now works just fine.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Matt: I think Starline is now making .41 Special brass. Try Track of the Wolf as a source. http://www.trackofthewolf.com They are the cheapest place to buy Starline brass I have found. It might be a special order type of thing.

Randy

[Matt_G]

Randy,
I did e-mail them (Starline) about that over a year ago.
This is the answer that I received:

Matt,

We did produce .41 Special brass a few years ago for an individual to resell. We will probably produce it again eventually but I have no idea when that might be.
With all the craziness going on right now, I'm sure that something like this is even lower on their radar than normal.

[336A]

Hi Matt,

I disagree that 15 thousandths is insufficient clearance at the front of the cylinder. That's exactly what I use in my Freedom Arms M97. My load is a 240 gr LBT WFN GC bullet at 1150 fps. I've had no trouble whatsoever with bullet migration tying up the gun. Fifteen thousandths is plenty if a firm crimp is applied.

Take care, Tom

I have to agree with Tatume, I've not had one problem when using the H&G #258 but I use a healthy crimp. I've gone all the way up to 19.0gr of 2400 without a single issue other than a sore hand. I also disagree with the load data that is shown in the Lyman #4 cast bullet manual as that data set is for the SAECO 220gr bullet. The SAECO bullet has more of the bullet shank in the cartridge case than the Keith design does, so of course it's going to use less powder than the Keith.

[Matt_G]

I never said 15 thou wasn't enough...I said it was cutting it a bit close...as in a little closer than I would like to see it.
As for the 2400 load, in my Model 57 it was too hot, period.
Primers were flatter than heck and it wasn't pleasant to shoot at all.
I shot that load at NCBS last year and the very first round I touched off, several people stopped and looked my way.
A couple said "Matt, that sounded pretty hot."
Just sayin'.

[Tatume]

I never said 15 thou wasn't enough...I said it was cutting it a bit close...as in a little closer than I would like to see it.


Anyways, those things combined, especially that “short” cylinder is what got me heading down the 41 special road. I had some brand new 41 mag brass from Starline. I took 50 of ‘em and trimmed them down to 1.150 inches. Same trim to length as the 44 special.

Hmmm.

[Matt_G]

My first response here was a bit curt. Sorry 'bout that.

Tatume, what I mean is, I wasn't comfortable with how close they were to the end of the cylinder in my gun.
In other words, it was insufficient for me personally.
I didn't mean it to come across as if I was standing on top of the mountain, preaching to the unwashed masses, that 15 thou is insufficient for everyone.
Better?

[Tatume]

Hi Matt,

Thank you for your courteous reply. It is appreciated.

Sincerely, Tom

[fcvan]

I don't recall which mold number SAECO mold dad bought in the 70s, but its a 230 Keith SWC. When properly crimped it is flush with the cylinder face. Dad had problems one time with the boolits jumping the crimp and it tied up his S&W M57.

I bought the SAECO 415 which is the gas check 220 TC boolit as I thought it would feed well in my M57 and my Marlin 1894. I was not disappointed. A couple years ago, my brother loaded up some of dads boolits in my brass. They absolutely would not feed in the carbine. Fortunately, my brother brought his Thompson Contender with the .41 barrel so we were able to 'pull' the boolits with style.