.357 maximum rifle project?

[3006guns]

I have a fair quantity of .357 Maximum brass, all new left to me by a friend that passed away some years ago. He used it in a Contender that I shot once....just once. My impression was that it would make one heck of a nice little rifle round and I'm still playing with the idea of a handy carbine chambered for it. The question is: which action could I use? I have several surplus Yugo Mauser actions, but they might require too many modifications for feeding, etc. A single shot? Rechamber a lever action? Just looking for suggestions.....[smilie=1:

[Old Ironsights]

How about a Win 94? Unlike the 92 the action is long enough to handle it...

[3006guns]

That was one option I thought of, but using the little carbine made by Rossi in 357 magnum reamed forward. I think that was a copy of the 92 though and I wasn't aware of the difference in action length. Any single shot ideas?

[lathesmith]

I've always thought a lever-gun in 357 max would be a great idea. I often wonder why it wasn't done more... As to single shots, there are a few choices: T/C s, of course, and the NEF tip-ups; I've seen a few Rugers; and even a repo rolling-block. I have had good success hunting Missouri white tail deer over the years with this cartridge, even though some arm-chair "experts" say it is "too light". Then, I can use 38 wadcutters in it , and go squirrel hunting. Talk about versitility!
A bolt-gun in 357 max? Now there would be a novel and unique creation! Keep us posted...

[45nut]

Actually I believe the 92 is stronger than the 94's and that is why Rossi chose the 92 for the 454 Casull's they are making. The 92 is a scaled down 1886 and the '86 is strong indeed.

For my own Max carbine I have a rolling block.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/rifles/100_0754.jpg

[Scrounger]

Cartridge length limitations inhibit putting a .357 Max in a Marlin 1894, but it could be done in the 336 action or the Winchester 1894. Trouble is, with those actions the temptation is to put a badder .35 caliber in it, like .35 Remington or .35/444. I like the 1894 Marlin myself and I lean toward rechambering a .357 Mag to .357/44 Baines and Davis. Cartridge length is compatible with the action and performance is as good as or better than the .357 Max. I keep trying to pick up another .357 Marlin or Rossi to do this thing.

[Old Ironsights]

Neat thing about the Win 1894 is that it was made in .357 for a while, so finding one wouldn't be too hard.

http://www.gunblast.com/Winchester-Ranger357.htm

Find one and all you'd have to do is open it up to take the Max. Probably wouldn't even need to re time it (much).

Here's one on Gunbroker

http://gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=79630513

Heckofa lot easier than a re-barrel and making sure your extractor was correct.

[lathesmith]

I've looked at the 357 B&D, but finding dies is usually the rub. Reasonably priced dies, I mean...I would also think the max would be a bit more cast bullet friendly. But, that is just a guess on my part, and this may or may not be important to some(it is to me). That 1894 looks to be a relatively easy conversion, and practical too.
Lathesmith

[Scrounger]

The .357 Winchester sounds like a real good way to go. All you got to do is run the .357 Max reamer in... I wonder if it could be done by hand? Someone here, Jeff223 I think, has a reamer. I guess I'm in the market for a Winchester Ranger 1894 in .357 mag but I ain't going to pay no scalper's price.

[Boomer Mikey]

The .357 Winchester sounds like a real good way to go. All you got to do is run the .357 Max reamer in... I wonder if it could be done by hand? Someone here, Jeff223 I think, has a reamer. I guess I'm in the market for a Winchester Ranger 1894 in .357 mag but I ain't going to pay no scalper's price.

The M92 Puma action is too short.

The Marlin 1894 action is too short.

The Winchester 94 and Marlin 336 actions are long enough but you'll need to rework the cartridge guides to feed Maxi brass and Winchester rifles are overpriced lately.

The H&R/New England Arms Handi-Rifle in 357 Magnum is easily re-chambered to 357 Maximum and inexpensive.

You will need a "custom" reamer for the 357 Maximum if you don't want the lousy SAMMI chamber with it's 0.400" cone throat. The extra cost of a custom reamer negates the savings on brass and 357 Maximum is a finicky cartridge that works best at full power.

35 Remington & 38-55 are far superior, more flexible choices that can easily be loaded down to 357 Maxi levels in standard 30-30 actions.

I favor the 38-55 but that's why they call me Boomer.

Boomer :Fire:

[Beerd]

45nut,

that .357Max Rolly Block is COOL! :-D
..

[Scrounger]

It's all daydreaming anyway, Mikey. The logical part of my mind says why knock yourself out to get a .357 Max to shoot 200 grain bullets at 1800 fps or 1900 fps, When you already have TWO .44s that will shoot 210gr bullets at 2000 fps? If that ain't enough, there's the .30-06, 220gr at 2400, or the .45-70, 400gr at 1800 or thereabouts. We're just a bunch of overgrown kids.

[nitroproof]

My .357 Max carbine is built on a BSA Martini Cadet action.

Craig

[lathesmith]

Yep, Mikey and Scrounger reminded me why I chose a 375 Winchester barrel for my T/C Contender carbine instead of the max. The 375 is a very flexible round, I have a favorite 2.8gr Bullseye/250gr bullet load that sounds like a pellet gun and is very accurate. Its 600fps is hell on those pests that need dispatching quietly and humanely! It sounds like a pneumatic pellet gun or quieter. From there, I have a 9gr Red Dot load with the same bullet that approaches 44 mag handgun ballistics, with the noise of a high speed 22lr. From there, a 200 gr pill can be pushed to 2400fps or slightly faster, and will dispatch any game we can hunt around here.
The max, on the other hand, is also flexible, but is mostly a custom proposition. It may or may not let you shoot 38's with decent accuracy, and can be difficult to load down and maintain accuracy. The appeal of using 358 bullets is strong, and this can simplify some things. Like Scrounger said, we all have plenty of toys, and there are plenty of choices.
I'm with Beerd, that RB is a really neat gun, I've always been partial to those things.

[3006guns]

Sorry I didn't get back to everyone right away....had to visit my gunsmith buddy and do a little "rust trading". Also hashed over more wierd projects! A single shot pistol in .577 Snider? Hmmmm....YOU shoot it first!

Some good ideas here! I checked into the Handi Rifle and rolling block ideas and so far the small rolling block action looks very good. I'm wondering if playing around with black powder loads might be a way to mimic the old Ballard Extra Long rounds used in target work so many years ago. After all, the idea is to have some fun and not knock a moose on its butt!

As for my little rechambered (32-20) Cadet...it made it all these years in nice shape, so it stays untouched! Of course if there might be a supply of little Martini actions laying around.....Thanks everyone!:mrgreen:

[44man]

Talking about the .357 max, I have a set of Redding steel dies for it and also for the .375 super mag. Anyone interested, make offer.

[Junior1942]

For my own Max carbine I have a rolling block.Nut, that's the coolest lookin' rifle I've seen in a long time.

[45nut]

Thanks to all that like that, the action is from a 1871 NY Militia rifle that was bought as an afterthought from a scope buy on ebay way back when. An innocent question if he had any other goods for sale paid off. The barrel that was included was rough to say the least so it was dropped off with a favorite 'smith and carte blanche was given. He had that barrel chunk leftover from another project and had a max reamer on hand. I sent out a Lyman #17 front and a tang sight and he set it all up. I will say it has a lot of heft to it, some of those HB Sharps Shooters know of the front heavy feel. I am quite happy with it. The odd thing with the NY Action is the need to re-cock after closing the block, a built in safety of sorts.

[lar45]

Also hashed over more wierd projects! A single shot pistol in .577 Snider? Hmmmm....YOU shoot it first!


A .577 Snider single shot pistol would be cool and I'd be glad to test fire it(More Powder, Bigger Bullets)
BUT anything over 1/2" bore in a pistol is classified as a destructive device. Unless you can find an Antique. You could always do 50-70, not quite the same, but still pleanty big.
(dang ATF rules getting in the way of some honest fun :( )

I have a pair of .577 double pistols, they are pinfire though. They will chamber 28 ga brass cut down.

[3006guns]

Actually the same buddy came up with a genuine Khyber pass handmade Martini action piston chambered for .303 British! We looked it over carefully and decided the workmanship was really pretty damn good given the "manufacturing conditions". Guess who got to touch off the first round?[smilie=1: Yup...still have the stinging sensation in my right hand on a rainy day. Actually it was very manageable and a ball to shoot.

[3006guns]

Oops...that should have read Martini action PISTOL.

[45nut]

Any chance of a pic?

[3006guns]

Nope.......long gone in a trade. Too bad, it was a real curiosity and definately intimidating!:(

[Boomer Mikey]

I checked the H&R website; if you own an H&R Handi-Rifle you can order an accessory 357 Magnum barrel for $87. Poke that with a 357 Maximum reamer and enjoy... If you don't like it, send it to me.

Boomer :Fire:

[JRR]

You would think that the Win. 94, 357 mag would be a good conversion. The problem is that the Win. in this caliber is loaded with poor engineering, especially in the link and cartrige stop.

The stop is borderline in preventing the cartrige from slipping past and underneath the lifter. Every 94 in 357 I have used or examined has had this problem. The only possible cure is to weld up the stop and recontour it with a file approx. plus .030-.040". The extra recoil of the "max" would most likely make this worse. If you don't get it perfect, the loading gate will not depress or the stop will bind in the slot that it rides in slowing and adding friction to the action.

I have not had this issue with 44 or 45 due to more engagment of the cartridge rim with the stop. Larger diameter rims. I think the 44/357 conversion would be ideal to shoot .358" bullets. Perhaps get a 44 mag 94 and put a .357 barrel on it and rechamber.

[Blammer]

357 max would have been neat to do in my Win 94 in 357 mag but since it was too long, a friend introduced me to 360 Dan Wesson. That is the ticket! It's midway between the 357 mag and 357 max brass.

[Blammer]

I've often contemplated getting the 357 mag barrel from H&R and having it punched out to 357 max.

$87 for barrel plus shipping there to H&R.

then $20 shipping of barrel to have it punched out, and punching price is $125...

a little steep right now....

[Old Ironsights]

Ok, now I am completely confused.

Let's see if I'm getting this right:

The Win 94 is made for long cartridges (like the .38-55).

It had to be re-engineered a bit to take the .357 because it is so short, but the .357 is still SOO short there can still be issues with it not engaging the stop fast enough to prevent under-carrier jams.

BUT, the longer .357 max still has the same "short cartridge problem" that the even shorter .357mag has... (why? shouldn't the greater length make it work BETTER?)

BUT the .360 Wesson is midway between the Mag and the Max but it works anyway?

:confused: :confused: :confused:

[JRR]

Old Ironsights,
It's not the length that is the problem. It is the diameter of the rim that causes the cartridge to slip over the stop.

[Old Ironsights]

Ah. Ok. My bad. Thanks for the correction.

[jhrosier]

H&R made the Model 058 break action in .357 Maxi, back in the 80s.
I have one that I bought way back then to shoot with black powder.
I worked well enough, but has not captured my imagination and so hasn't been shot in many years.
If I get a 200 gr mould for my .358 Win. I will probably try the bullet in the Maxi also.

[leftiye]

Rosier,
.357 max. works muy bueno with all .357 boolit weights, and cast or condor bullits and white powder. Not a big capacity ctg., but it performs beyond expectations. Black powder????

[jhrosier]

Rosier,
.. Black powder????
Yep, it is similar in size to some of the old Maynard cartridges and you can get enough fffg in there to make it interesting. It is also possible to make a breech seater for the bullets and then the case capacity would be nearly equal to the 38-55. That was the original plan, but as I mentioned, I llost interest in the project for a while.
I'm getting back into casting after a long break so I've started thinking about this one again.:)

Jack

[home in oz]

Does anyone have some 357 cast bullet loads for deer from a 14" Contender barrel?

[Captain Midnight]

Can the cylinder for a Smith 27 be rebored to 359 Max? Or is it too short?

[725]

H&R .357 mag recut for the .357 Max. (if you can find one)

[longbow]

I keep thinking that a .357 Max rimless (blown out .223 brass) in a bolt action would be rather nice. Should be pretty easy to convert a .223 bolt action by rebarreling and maybe some work on the magazine. However, that is one I likely will never get to.

[Moleman-]

I've done several 357Max rimless in ar15's. You need a reamer that cuts a shoulder for the case mouth so it will have something to headspace one, the barrel extension needs opened up for the wider bullets and the two bullet guides in the front of the mag need removed so the rounds can double stack. Sometimes the feed lips need trimmed so they let go of the case sooner. A 223 rifle should be pretty easy next to that, but I'd rather convert my 336 since it only gets used when I go out of state any more.

[Ballistics in Scotland]

Cartridge length limitations inhibit putting a .357 Max in a Marlin 1894, but it could be done in the 336 action or the Winchester 1894. Trouble is, with those actions the temptation is to put a badder .35 caliber in it, like .35 Remington or .35/444. I like the 1894 Marlin myself and I lean toward rechambering a .357 Mag to .357/44 Baines and Davis. Cartridge length is compatible with the action and performance is as good as or better than the .357 Max. I keep trying to pick up another .357 Marlin or Rossi to do this thing.

The reason the modern shooter can have a new square-bolt centrefire Marlin, very like the original LL Hepburn 1894, is that they tried and failed to make the .44 Magnum work reliably in the 336. You might find the same with the Maximum in the 336, when you have got a lot of time, trouble and money in it, and I wouldn't entirely dismiss the possibility with the 94 Winchester. It is a cartridge length that hasn't been much tried with either, and at the best it would require quite a bit of work on the carrier and ejector. Neither of the short-action rifles, Winchester 92 and Marlin 94, would accommodate the Maximum's length.

To me it begs for a single-shot action. One of the modern break-open actions would be a simple and inexpensive conversion job, if indeed a Maximum version doesn't exist already. I'm sure you could do something with (Am I allowed to say this?) one of the more interesting single-shot actions? The Cadet Martini is excellent but expensive nowadays, but the BSA target rimfires which preceded the Martini-International are an easy centrefire conversion job.

A full-size Mauser seems like a clumsy great thing for a cartridge like this. Perhaps you could do something with one of the Howa or Zastava miniature Mausers.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?318218-Howa-mini-Mauser

[Ballistics in Scotland]

I've often contemplated getting the 357 mag barrel from H&R and having it punched out to 357 max.

$87 for barrel plus shipping there to H&R.

then $20 shipping of barrel to have it punched out, and punching price is $125...

a little steep right now....

$85 for a solid pilot chambering reamer from Clymer, one of the easiest of gunsmithing jobs with a rimmed straight case, and you would be ready if you or a friend wants it done again. You have to specify that you want the pilot diameter for a barrel and not a revolver cylinder.

http://www.clymertool.com/price/CLYMER%20PRICE%20LIST.pdf

[jmorris]

I have already machined the lug, bought the bolt and ejector and blank, I just need to turn the barrel, weld, chamber and machine for the ejector and I'll have a 357 max contender carbine.

[SSGOldfart]

I'm working on a TC Encore in 357 Maximum,seeing how I already use it in a Ruger New Model Black Hawk and a T C Contender. Wish I had a little more brass on hand, Star is coming out with new brass soon, the maximum is going to rebound in the near future. I'm hoping my new barrel is ready soon.

[ratboy]

Can the cylinder for a Smith 27 be rebored to 359 Max? Or is it too short?

much too short. can hardly get a heavy magnum load in it.