Curtis and Harvey No 2 gun powder.

[melter68]

Hi Guys,

I got given this tin of Curtis and Harvey No 2 gun powder, does anyone know, which
someone will, what type of powder is it, is it black powder, shotgun powder or can it be used to load rifle/cowboy action brass.
Looked on net and cannot find much at all, made by ICI, looking at the age of tin etc
i would say about 1960 or 1970's

Here is the only load data for C/H powder i can find, but is this the same powder.

Take a look http://www.reloadammo.com/relblac2.htm.

Its best to be safe, so do i use it, dispose of it, what you guys think.

Thanking you for your help

[montana_charlie]

It is 'canister gunpowder' ... says so on the can.

'Cannister' means it is packed in small containers, such as yours, rather than in kegs and such.
'Gunpowder' means it is made from saltpetre, charcoal, and sulpher, and is black in color.

It is very different than 'smokless powder'.

The number 2 should equate to the modern 2F or FF granulation.

CM

[KCSO]

Probably the BEST black powder ever made when fresh. Least fouling and best shootability in ctg guns. This was Ned Roberts favorite powder and he reported that he fired 130 consecutive shots with the last shots grouping as well as the first. But that is OLD stuff now and who knws how it will shoot, maybe good maybe not. I would think it would be worth more as a collectors item than as shooting powder. Somewhat like the cans of Dupont Bulk i am working with now.

[melter68]

Well if i could use the powder someone can gladly have the can.
Just trying to work out what calibres if can be used for.
I have ,223,243,308 and 357 and 44 cowboy and 410 shotgun.
I have no black powder guns, but my friend has a cannon.
cheers chris

[dromia]

Very good powder, moist burning too especially if it was the Scottish made stuff. During the 20th century C&H brand was part of the ICI/Nobel conglomorate with BP being made in Scotland 'till the nid 70s when the mill was closed, the C&H brand continued into the 80's with powder coming from Germany. I have a couple of stone of assorted C&H powders left, currently using some for a Westley Richards, Deeley Edge falling block rifle in No 2 musket. When I was lad it was the only BP you could get.

Use the powder and savour they joy of using the real thing secure in the knowledge that when its gone its gone and we are never going to see its like again. These "proper" black powders used in the guns they were made for really helps with connection to the past that fine old firearms gives us.

[John Boy]

I got given this tin of Curtis and Harvey No 2 gun powder, does anyone know, which
someone will, what type of powder is it, is it black powder, shotgun powder or can it be used to load rifle/cowboy action brass.
Looked on net and cannot find much at all, made by ICI, looking at the age of tin etc
i would say about 1960 or 1970's
Your can of No 2 Curtis's & Harvey's is original gunpowder (BP) and was made in Ardeer, Scotland prior to 1970 under the new ownership of ICI prior to when they stopped labeling the C&H powder as C&H. ICI purchased C&H in 1967 but continued to use C&H production processes and inventory until they stopped making BP at the Ardeer production facility
C&H powder came in 8 granulation sizes with No. 2 being the smallest - possibly 40 - 50 mesh thus being a priming powder for flint locks
In size of the grains, from smallest to largest: No.2 - 3 - 4 -5 -6 -8 - Col Hawker's Duck Powder and Capt Latour's Punt Powder

If I owned your can, I would put it on a shelf and save it because it is collectible and was some of the best made black powder that was made. Shooting it for anything would be a moral sin being you would have an empty can of history

C&H did sell their powder in the US market:
* 1955 to Austin Powder Co until they blew up their plant and went out of business in 1957
* Early 1970's to Hodgdon who put their own label on the cans ... Of course, but Hodgdon has never made 1 pound of powder themselves - always by someone else or surplus US powder
* Up until 1973, through ICI's subsidiary in Canada into the US with the cans marked Meteor (no paper label)

[melter68]

I knew if i asked here someone would know, i like history and now have it in tin form.
Cheers for the replies guys

[Mike Brooks]

I had a can of that. haven't found it yet since I moved 2 years ago.

[dromia]

If I owned your can, I would put it on a shelf and save it because it is collectible and was some of the best made black powder that was made. Shooting it for anything would be a moral sin being you would have an empty can of history




Please explain further.

[swheeler]

I've shot some of it, sold under the Hodgdon name, good powder.

[melter68]

I had a can of that. haven't found it yet since I moved 2 years ago.

Quick find that tin, dont loose history

[UBER7MM]

I like the tin. Everything is black plasitc jars these days.....

Enjoy

[dromia]

It is illegal here in the UK to sell the powder in the tins now.

A month ago I came across an unopened box of 25lb, in 1lb tins, of Nobel Rifle No1 powder. I had to decant the powder into the current plastic containers to sell it, I now have an ICI/Nobel crate with 25 empty powder tins in it, waxed paper and all.

[RMulhern]

My oh My!

The ignorance of history!!

[Bent Ramrod]

Dromia,

Perhaps you could flog the crate on E-Bay as "A boxfull of empty cans of history.":mrgreen:

I am no stranger to the basic irrationality of the collecting instinct, but I would be interested in seeing how the stuff shoots, if it was mine. I am rather fond of working up loads with obsolete powders just to see if they really are as great as the old writers said they were. (FYI, most of my experiments along this line have convinced me that these are The Good Old Days, at least for smokeless powders.)

I would probably also pop the cork on a bottle of 1847 Chateau Lafitte Rothschild and swill it down (in good company, of course) just to see what all the fuss was about.

[John Boy]

Please explain further.
Mate, I don't follow the question. What more is to there to explain having a can of C&H with powder in it? The empty can alone is collectible and the powder doesn't exist any more. It is history.
About 3 years ago, I came upon a deal of new unopened cans (many) of old DuPont and Meteor powder in FFg and FFFg. On SoldUSA auction one empty can of Meteor went for $35. Plus the powder is C&H which I proved comparing it to a sample of the 1955 Austin C&H packaged powder (FFg) for density - sieve ratio - velocity over a chronograph - fouling control and foul testing for percent of potassium bicarbonate residue and microscopic view of the size of the unburned charcoal

[John Boy]

Here are the details of comparative test results between the Austin C&H powder and Meteor

http://www.assra.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1309551107/17#17
http://www.assra.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl?num=1312504876/2

[dromia]

Mate, I don't follow the question. What more is to there to explain having a can of C&H with powder in it? The empty can alone is collectible and the powder doesn't exist any more. It is history.
About 3 years ago, I came upon a deal of new unopened cans (many) of old DuPont and Meteor powder in FFg and FFFg. On SoldUSA auction one empty can of Meteor went for $35. Plus the powder is C&H which I proved comparing it to a sample of the 1955 Austin C&H packaged powder (FFg) for density - sieve ratio - velocity over a chronograph - fouling control and foul testing for percent of potassium bicarbonate residue and microscopic view of the size of the unburned charcoal


"Moral sin"?

[melter68]

Shooting and reloading are fun, but to make a fast buck on E bay, thats a sin

[cajun shooter]

I guess if you see a 2 it does not mean that it is 2F. Some become confused by this. Good posting John Boy. As soon as I read the OP I knew that you could set it straight as you had told me you had some of that powder. Later David