.429 or .430 cast lead for 44 mag

[bigchicano]

I am getting back into reloading my shells after 10 years. I have just recently purchased all the equipment I should need to get started minus primers, powder and bullets. I recently purchased 500 lrn .230 gr for my 45acp, and I'm looking for some 44 mag cast. The person I'm getting the 45's from also has 44 swc but they are .429 in dia. My manuals show loads in cast at .430 but this guy says that the .429 he has will work also. Just trying to make sure before I put those through my gun and end up with a bunch of loads that wont work for me or end up having to sit and clean my barrel for hours. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks

[felix]

The boolit diameter should offer finger friction going through the largest cylinder hole, expecially with boolits of unknown hardness, because most vendors provide hard boolits. Yes, a lesser diameter boolit will work with faster powders, provided the boolit is soft enough to expand to that desired as above. ... felix

[9.3X62AL]

Welcome aboard, B. C.

Felix gave sound advice. Depending on which 44 Magnum revolver (or rifle) you are trying to feed with castings, cylinder throats and rifle chamber throats can vary more than a little. I've seen at least one of this site's Group Buy molds spec'd to cast at .434", to enable use in some S&W revos with wide throat tolerances. Save yourself some grief and get a handle on the throat sizes of your firearms before spending deeply on slugs--or molds to create same.

My own revolvers--a Ruger Redhawk and S&W Model 624--work very well with boolits sized @ .431". I suspect that .430" would do as well--the .431" slugs took a bit of tapping to slide through the throats--but once the .431" boolits did such good work in my toys, I didn't see a need to look further.

[MT Gianni]

My redhawk works well with bullets sized to 0.430. I would take the cylinder or gun to him and test them for a fit before you buy any. If they fall through with little restriction I would not buy them even if you have to pay shipping for an out for someone else's sized to fit your gun. If you have access to a micrometer you can buy egg sinkers and lube them then push them through the cylinder throats to get a measurement. Gianni.

[bigchicano]

I should have mentioned that its a vaquero .44 mag 5 1/2 inch. .431 huh? So what would happen if I pushed the .429's through? (excessive leading is my main concern) Also, what brand of equipment do you all recommend as far as casting? I've thought about it for a few years but figured it would be messy and time consuming. I thought that about loading my own shells but found it more to be a hobby than saving a whole bunch of money, although that was one of the reasons I started reloading. I've looked into furnaces and molds, sizing and lubes and just figured I'd ask you good people here that have had experience in casting your own.

[2 dogs]

I would venture to say if you shot 429's out of a sixgun that wants 430's or 431's you would see quite a bit of nasty leading.....

[Lloyd Smale]

I probably shoot more 44s then everything else combined. I fooled alot with size in alot of 44 mag guns and for the most part now i just size to 430. 431 works a tad better is some guns but its rare and not worth the bother for the very small increase in accuracy. About the only time anymore ill size lager is for micro grove marlins. Ive sized alot of bullets to 429 to test. Believe it or not most guns will run them just fine and dont lead anymore then bullets at 430. But the accuracy seems o fall off quite a bit. Ive even shot bullets as small as 428 through a ruger with 4440 cylinders in it that was throated to 4305 with acceptable accuracy (2inch at 25 yards) and not alot of leading. After about 200 of them a cylinder full of jacketed bullets cleaned it out fine. Now before anyone says its because those soft bullets bump up its rare i cast anything with any alloy softer then wws and those 4440 loads were really low pressure loads. I was running 7.5 grains of hp38. I guess my point is that there are rules of thumb for good revolver accuarcy and funtion but sometimes things work that shouldnt and its worth giving your 429 bullets a try you might find that they work just fine.

[Sundogg1911]

I have a Taurus M44 ported 8 3/8" barrel, and a Rossi 3" .44 spl. I size them both at .429 and have had no leading problems whatsoever. best thing to do short of slugging the barrell is to try 'em. just take a bore scope with you to the range and check it often and you should find out before you end up with a quarter pound of lead in the barrell.

[Boomer Mikey]

Get the largest sizing die you can get... 0.431". If you can order your bullets at 0.432" and they will chamber, use them as cast. Most Ruger Vaquero's and Blackhawks will chamber 0.432" bullets ( I have 5), all of mine will. If they won't: size them with the 0.431" sizer. If they still won't chamber size them with a 0.430" sizer. Beartooth Bullets and many other quality cast bullet suppliers will provide 0.432" bullets.

Hard, larger than cylinder throat bullets are well centered in the chamber, will squeeze through the the cylinder throats and spring back to squeeze through the barrel thread constriction then spring back to fill the groove diameter. Soft, larger than throat bullets are are well centered in the chamber, will flow through the cylinder throats, barrel thread constriction, and with suficient pressure obturate to fill the groove diameter. When pushed with too much pressure they will shear lead in the grooves.

Undersized, hard bullets sit on the bottom of the chamber, will strike the bottom of the throat first unbalancing the bullet, will gas cut and skid down the barrel leaving lead. Soft, undersized bullets will do the same and be unbalanced to start but will obturate with enough pressure and leave a spot of lead forward of the barrel thread constriction. When pushed with too much pressure they will shear lead in the grooves.

Improved accuracy and reduced leading are the attributes of an over cylinder throat and groove size bullet because of spring back and the largest diameter bullet that will chamber springs back the most regardless of hardness. Most cast bullets will not work well in a revolver that has cylinder throats more than 0.001" smaller than barrel groove diameter but the hardest, largest diameter bullets have the best chance.

Boomer :Fire:

[leftiye]

Not to stand opposed to Lloyd, but I agree with Mikey. First off do it right, slug the bore, then measure the cylinder mouths with plug gauges or other good method. If the chamber mouths aren't .001" bigger than the groove diameter, make it so (unless they're bigger still). Then make your boolits a tight fit, or even plus .001" in the chamber mouths. This recipe has been repeated here so often it's boring. But it's where to start.

Groove sized boolits or a little undersized may shoot and even not lead, but doesn't it make you wonder if the loss of accuracy isn't signaling that there is gas cutting going on, even if it's not enough to lead?

[44man]

A smaller boolit will result in a loss of case neck tension too depending on what dies are used. That in itself can cause an accuracy loss. I have never understood the .429 boolit or bullet!

[bigchicano]

Thanks ppl. I'll be loading a few thurs or friday when my equipment comes in.:Fire: