Accuracy out of the 9mm to 40 bullets

[Lizard333]

I'm finding that getting great accuracy out of the bullets is proving harder than I thought. I know it can be done, as BT is shooting them at rifle ranges, but out of several different pistols, and a number of different loads, I'm getting poor accuracy.

Here's what I've done.

First, I weighed all of my 9mm cases and sorted them by weight into two grain groups, keeping the weights as consistent as possible.

Next, I expanded the neck to except a 126 gn pure lead core.

I then core bonded and annealed in the next step.

Notching was next. Followed by the HP and point form.

Now, the rounds all look great. They weigh in at 190 gns. I'm loading these with 200 gn load data. Mild to mid loads.

What's up?

[MOcaster]

You are using 200 grain load data? I am surprised pressures are still okay. 2.8 to 3.1 grains of Titegroup was the only load I could get to work with the 190 grain bullets. I haven't accuracy tested yet but just working up loads to safe pressures and will cycle my gun, I found I could get pretty nice groups at 10 yards. I was just shooting freehand at different spots on the paper and I can tell where I was aiming based on the groups. They weren't anything outstanding but for my not tying too hard, they were pretty good. And I'm not the greatest shot, either.

[BT Sniper]

I'm not sold on accuracy from core bonded bullets yet. I believe I have had some bulelts with trapped air pockets when core bonding, you wouldn't think air pockets would be possible after melting the lead but......

Try some without bonding see if there is any difference.

Some where there is a thread here with data and range results for these 40 cal bullets. I know in my testing with these 40 cals they needed a little speed to stabilize. May have just been my barrel or twist? FPS less then 800 and they showed signs of heyholes, at 950 they did well. My standard load was 5.0 grains of W-321 at about 1,000 FPS IIRC.

I'm sure a little more load development will improve your results, hopfully. What sort of accuracy are you normally able to obtain with facorty bullets from these guns? with the custom bullets? and what accuracy would you be pleased with?

Brian

[sargenv]

Am wondering if you are using the right kind of powder.. I did most of my testing with slower powders.. Autocomp was one of them.. I would think you would want something a tad slower.. something that would not hit peak pressure quite so fast.. I can seat mine long since they are fired out of either a 610 or a 1911 pattern gun.. 1.250" seems about right..

[GRUMPA]

I'm getting a bit curious about the answer to this myself. Times like this make me wish I had a 40cal myself so I can try this and that to find out what works and what doesn't.

[beex215]

my results were not stellar either. i do believe the charge was the culprit as it seems low. i still have some loads to test and a few different powders to try. will update when its all said and done.

[Lizard333]

I've found that the higher velocities were producing worse results. With cast boolits out of my Beretta 96, I'm getting a 2 inch group at 10 yards. With these bullets, I'm getting about an 8 inch group. Most of the shots are at 6 inches, but the flyers put it out to 8.

When doing my core bonding, after the lead is up to temp, I tap the side of my pot to ensure any bubbles, not that I've seen any, would "float" to the top.

I may take some of my bullets to a friend, and get them tested for concentricity.

I don't know if the core bonding is the issue, as the 40 to 45's I've done are more accurate. 2-3 inch groups at 10 yards.

[IllinoisCoyoteHunter]

Is this the one step die?

[Lizard333]

Yes. One die, multiple steps.

[Bwana]

First off I get very good accuracy with my Hybrid bullets. But that's not the subject here. A couple of your statements may point to your problem. You say, "I then core bonded and annealed in the next step." And you say, "When doing my core bonding, after the lead is up to temp, I tap the side of my pot to ensure any bubbles, not that I've seen any, would "float" to the top."

If you are using the temp from your pot to anneal your brass, it isn't going to work. There is a guy who melts and bonds at the same time; but, he does this in a kiln. He can get it hot enough for long enough to anneal his brass. Without annealing the brass properly it is hard, if not impossible to get the base to expand correctly. Without this you will not get the kind of accuracy you want.

With my bullets the brass is annealed, formed, then filled with molten lead. Also the cases are sized down not swaged up. Over thirty years and it has worked well for me.

[Lizard333]

If the pot temp gets up to 800 degrees, I have a thermometer, how does this not anneal the brass? Why do two steps when it can be done in one step?

[Bwana]

If the pot temp gets up to 800 degrees, I have a thermometer, how does this not anneal the brass? Why do two steps when it can be done in one step?

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?103824-Annealing-Jackets&highlight=annealing+kiln

[Lizard333]

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?103824-Annealing-Jackets&highlight=annealing+kiln

I'm familiar with the thread. Where is 800 degrees not enough? The thread states brass is annealed at 650 for a longer length of time. 800 degrees and the brass annealed faster.

I use the same process with the 40-45 dies and I got very good results with my 1911 and Colt 45. Using the same process I get great results doing a 40-44. I shoot these out of my Winchester 94. Accuracy is six inches at 100 yards.

[Bwana]

I'm familiar with the thread. Where is 800 degrees not enough? The thread states brass is annealed at 650 for a longer length of time. 800 degrees and the brass annealed faster.

I use the same process with the 40-45 dies and I got very good results with my 1911 and Colt 45. Using the same process I get great results doing a 40-44. I shoot these out of my Winchester 94. Accuracy is six inches at 100 yards.

That is 650C which is 1202F. Your thermometer is in fahrenheit.