Why make pistol jacketed bullets when you can cast?

[Utah Shooter]

Just curious what the common consensus is? Sure it is something different but is it really worth the extra steps?

I just got into casting for 9mm and am finding it way easier than swagging for my .224 cal. I can understand get MOA at 500 yards but what are you really getting with pistol?

[lup]

Jacketedl buys you slightly higher velocity in some cases and in the case of autos, improved feeding for some finicky guns.

[30yrcaster]

Since you mention 9mm, in my experience 9mm lead bullets have always leaded the barrel. You can load down the 45 and still get the action to cycle but doing the same with the 9mm you can't. Only now after many years I found the barrels to be oversize in several I've checked. The bullet molds I have from the early 80's only produced a bullet .356 and the bore slugged .358. Every reloading book says to use .356 bullets. The new molds I have produce slugs .359-360. Also used a .358 size die. Next problem was the expander die, it too was undersize once you got larger bullets that fit properly the shell would swage it back down. I got a Lee 38 S&W expander that was larger than the 9mm expander and it worked like a charm. First time in all these years I was able to shoot lead bullets without leading. Until then if I wanted to shoot 9mm, I used jacketed bullets.

As for 38 & 45, I never had leading but when slugging the barrels, found they weren't oversize like the 9mm's seem to be. Never thought to slug the barrels until I read a post here from someone else with the same problem. It is interesting the older molds made bullets to spec and now they're considerably oversized so you can size them to whatever you want.

Just my experiences on it.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

I started swaging 40s and 44s before I started casting.

Now I cast about 500 boolits to every one bullet I swage.

expensive dies seem to be a shame don't it ?

I cast several 22 cal. and can get 2 MOA @ 100yd without too much difficulty, If I do my job.
Jon

[BT Sniper]

If we had plentlyful supply of commercial jackets the process may go pretty quick for jacketed bullets in 9mm. Casting is certainly faster.

The fastest production I think that is obtainable is making 40 cal bullets from 9mm brass as far as jacketed bullets go. Me? I just like the look of the jacketed bullet. I did attempt to load some cast boolits in a 40S&W, alox TL but I guess I didnt' bell the mouth of teh case enough as it shaved a lot of lead, wouldn't that have an effect on a case that headspaces off the mouth of the case? Then I gave them to a friend to shoot and for some reason he got a lot of duds????? I have just loaded JHPs since simply because I can since then.

Good shooting to all, cast or jacketed

BT

[NSP64]

I cast for all my guns(.308 win, 9mm, .40, .38) except my AR's. I swage them.
No leading in any of them.
Water drop, size .002 over bore and good to go.

[MOcaster]

I swage 40 cal form 9mm brass because I can. I mean, really, how many people do you know that shoots 9mm brass as bullets out of a 40 S&W? It makes me feel special. And I know jacketed billets won't lead my barrel.

[I'll Make Mine]

With the right alloy and correct fit of the bullet, you can shoot any of the "traditional" handgun rounds (all the ACP family, 9x19, .38 Super, .40 S&W, and a few others in semi, and virtually all revolver rounds) up to full power without a trace of leading, not even a gas check is needed. Where jacketed bullets gain some ground, as noted above, is in feeding in semi-autos; there are a bunch of factory pistols that need significant work to reliably feed cast bullets. Jacketed can also have an advantage if expansion is favored over penetration in low velocity rounds; with soft cores and thin jackets, you can make a bullet that will expand reliably at .380 or .32 ACP velocities (there are still some who believe, for one reason or another, that it's better to have the bullet stop in six or eight inches and/or fragment than to penetrate right through), but it's hard to get a cast bullet soft enough to expand this way to feed in a semi-auto.

[Case Stuffer]

Making ones' own jacketed bullets is just cool and another part of the hobby / satisfaction , part of the business , cost savings and for many they have never figured out how to use cast boolits without leading.

A good info source on leading:

http://www.lasc.us/Fryxell_Book_Chapter_7_Leading.htm

[Bwana]

It is always good to have options. I shoot cast bullets in all of my guns. I can shoot my Hybrids in all of my guns. It has been quite a while since I have shot anything but cast in any of my guns except for the 44 mags. For defense a larger crush cavity is better (as long as it is deep enough). This is easily obtained with soft cored jacketed bullets. Harder to do with cast and maintain 100% feeding and 100% performance in the target. Besides that, it adds spice to life.

[perotter]

I bought a 9mm swage setup and have made a few bullets, but only just fun and future need. I got the setup at a very reasonable price(IMO) a few years back before the current revival of swaging.

Otherwise I cast my pistol caliber bullets, because it is faster, cheaper and serves my needs.

[newcastter]

I cast for 9mm 40cal 38spl/357 and 7.62x54r/7.62x39 and only have ever had leading in the 9mm and I believe that is due to the previous mentioned over size barrell, I need to slug my barrel and find out. I seem to find better performance in pan lubed boolits to tumble lubed.
I swage .224 because...well thats self explanitory but I am into BT for a set of 40cal swage dies because that was something else I wanted to add to my hobby, also really like the look and the availabilty to shoot jacketed bullets if I want to on the cheap. I also was thinking about carrying them but I want to look into the legality of that first if I actually have to use them.

[Forrest r]

Because I like to listen, observe, study & learn from the best.

Because I'm lazy & like to clean my bbl's with jacketed bullets after shooting a couple hundred cast boolits.

Because I can make/create different nose profiles, hp's, bullet weights by simply making another nose die or simply adjusting the swage body rather than cutting a new mold.

I love casting my own boolits, have for 30yrs & have/use what I believe to be some of the best molds on the market right now (7 different Mihec molds & waiting on #8). Bullet swaging goes hand in hand with bullet casting. The better you are at casting the better your swaged bullets can be.

The best of both worlds:
The lead core started out life as a Mihec 359640 hp/penta point. I fairly picky about my cast boolits & reject them for simple things like small blemishes/dings/etc. They can be used for cores for the 45acp & 44spl/mag.
Simply use range pickups (free) 40s&w cases & cut them down to 1/2" to be used as 1/2 jackets for bullets.

The 359640 cast bullets hold their hp as they get swaged into jacketed bullets.
Some 225gr 44spl/mag bullets.

67304

I make the 1/2 jackets .550" for the 45acp's & use the Mihec 359640 cores to end up with 230gr hp's for the 45acp/1911.

67305

I'm new to swaging & am still learning but it's very satisfying to be able to cast some beautiful bullets & be able to incorporate them into a jacketed bullet if I so desire.

[runfiverun]

I actually use my pistol swage sets to modify my cast boolits more than for actually swaging jaxketed.
I just done a run of 300 gr half jaxketed boolits in my bt 44 swage die set, I have also used it to 'bump' some 200gr .428 [44-40] boolits to 430.
and have used mine to add hollow points to other 44 bullets.

I recently finished another small run of 145gr swc's for my 38 in a different tool,this gives me a perfect square base and full diameter drive band areas.
I also bump size my 223 cast boolits in another die to more closely match the throat of my 22-250.

[Reload3006]

i got into swaging in the first place for my sons Ruger Deerfield carbine 44.mag Ruger warns you NOT to shoot Lead bullets in that gun. So when I couldnt buy any for a time I got into swaging to feed that gun and it blew up from there. For most of my firearms I could indeed just cast. But for that one when the MFR warns you not to do something I listen. after that I like to swage my bullets I make better than I can buy IMO and less money. Not that much less but indeed less. It also gives me more man cave time.

[fredj338]

IMO, not much a good lead bullet in any handgun caliber can't do vs a jaketed. The only upside to jacketed is less smoke. Even with expanding bullets, you can make a LHP work to quite high vel, expand & not lead. The swaging for me is a rifle thing, particularly higher vel, gas system rifles, where lead bullets can be tricky.

[38superdave]

http://i660.photobucket.com/albums/uu324/daclark1911/SU1BRzA1NzguanBn.jpg

It's a performance issue for me. This gun operates off a 7lb recoil spring, lightened slide, lightened hammer and a 14lb main spring. I'm moly coating jacketed bullets because this gun is just that sensitive to grit. Leading would be a big issue for this gun. Hornady flat dropped me in the grease for competition bullets this year, once I settle on a die maker, jacket supplier and begin swaging my Hornady problem is over.

[kcinnick]

http://i1071.photobucket.com/albums/u514/ferraraleather/Ferrarabullets1.jpg (http://s1071.photobucket.com/user/ferraraleather/media/Ferrarabullets1.jpg.html)

What Leading?

Anyway, I am looking at a Swaging set up, but it is a little different than what is used on the forum. I don't need lube groves, so I can use the same swaging presses developed for plated bullets for my bullets. Swaging pretty much eliminates rejects.

[onomrbil]

Let me know when you successfully get a cast 55gr 224 bullet to go 3800 fps, stay together and hit a chuck at 400 yds. Better yet, a 45 gr cast 224 at 4000+ fps in your 220 Swift. I will switch immediately, sell my swages and buy into lead futures.

Fact is, that's not gonna happen. The current crop of high velocity arms and ammo are completely dependent on jacketed bullets. If lead bullets were the answer the BR guys would going nuts. I see no sign of that aside from the Schuetzen guys, where lead bullets are the law. Cast bullet accuracy enthusiasts should have a look at the Schuetzen regime: you'll be amazed.

In the meantime my swaging stuff isn't going anywhere. My bullets are, though . . . .

[Utah Shooter]

Let me know when you successfully get a cast 55gr 224 bullet to go 3800 fps, stay together and hit a chuck at 400 yds. Better yet, a 45 gr cast 224 at 4000+ fps in your 220 Swift. I will switch immediately, sell my swages and buy into lead futures.

Fact is, that's not gonna happen. The current crop of high velocity arms and ammo are completely dependent on jacketed bullets. If lead bullets were the answer the BR guys would going nuts. I see no sign of that aside from the Schuetzen guys, where lead bullets are the law. Cast bullet accuracy enthusiasts should have a look at the Schuetzen regime: you'll be amazed.

In the meantime my swaging stuff isn't going anywhere. My bullets are, though . . . .

I asked about pistol but I do appreciate your enthusiasm!

We have no need to be lectured about bullet making .224 projectiles vs casting! I as well as most here already do that.

[runfiverun]

I went back the other way from swaging to casting most all my 22 stuff.
there is a velocity barrier there to be overcome.
27-2800 is easy nuff with good to excellent accuracy, even 2-k with green globs of lube coating ain't gonna cut it, unless 3-4-11" 100 yd groups are okay.
the gold stuff ain't gonna do it either.

[scarry scarney]

Why swag when I can cast? Good question. Casting supplies most of my boolits. I do have some pistols that do not want cast. Yes, for these I could purchase my own J-boolits. But learning to swag is just another wonderful experiance of the making my own.

[sargenv]

Um, the look on ppl's faces who have never seen a swaged jacketed bullet from 9mm brass is priceless.. they are so confused... :)

[rbt50]

I would rather shoot a jacket bullet over a lead bullet any day.

[rbuck351]

I want to see this 4000 fps 220 Swift pistol.

[IllinoisCoyoteHunter]

Yeah, me too. Plus hitting a chuck at 400 yards with it??? Impressive. Probably done off-hand too. ;)

[Utah Shooter]

Not sure if anyone ever claimed that was a reality. I took his post to be smart assed (?). Lets stick to the topic though.