Would you buy this ariska.....

[khmer6]

It's chambered in 6.5x257 Roberts. Stock looks really nice from the picture. I haven't seen it in person yet. Only wants 100 for it

[Hamish]

Too high.

(you told him it was sold right?)

[Uncle Grinch]

That was a very popular conversion many years ago. The Arisaka's are very strong actions and if done correctly, make good sporters.

I would jump on this one....quickly.

[khmer6]

I am meeting him tomorrow. Originally wanted 140 for it. but after some reading, they weren't demanding that kind of price. the damn price of dies for this thing is going to be a killer after looking around. This will be my most challenging cast/handload project so far....

[frkelly74]

They are a good outfit if you can get a decent trigger pull. Mine was $100 when I bought it. The dealer was sure it was an ordinary 257 with a bad bore that threw keyholes. Dies come up for sale every now and then so you can load for it. I also at first made ammo using a combination of 7mm Mauser dies and 6.5 Swede dies. It is easy to get an excess headspace condition doing this though.

[Kent Fowler]

With what you are paying for the rifle, even with a 84.00 set of C-H dies, you're coming out pretty good, money wise.

[frkelly74]

My older Hornady books have jacketed data for the 257X6.5 Rob and 6.5X57 together and state that they are interchangeable data-wise, but one will not fit the other chamber, also you can use 6.5 Swede data. Start low and work up.

[TCLouis]

Double post

[TCLouis]

It is worthless and if you will send it to me I will protect the general populace from the hazard it may create.

2700 with Hornady 129s is pretty easy to reach.

The difference in the 6.5X257 and a 6.5X57 is the same as the difference in shoulder angle in the 7X57 and the 257 which is the same as the difference in the 257 Roberts and the 257 Remington as we know it.

Dies are really pricey, but you could save a bunch by sending it to someone who has the dies already!

Not mentioning any names of course.

Seriously, what is the barrel like in this one. Some of the rough ones do fine with coated, but not so hot with cast.

Just checked, the 6.5X55 seater will work with slight amount of clearance.

If ya want, I could send you a few 6.5X57 formed from 7X57 or 257 brass, I forget which. PM me a snail mail addy if you want a few

[Mr Peabody]

Starting with a set of .257 Roberts dies. Take the expander stem out. Put some very thin shim stock on the threads and screw a 6.5 expander ball on it. Sounds cheesy but works. I loaded quite a few rounds with that setup. Finally had a .25 barrel put on it.

[John Allen]

I would jump on it. Even if it takes you a year or two to find dies at that price I do not see how you can pass it up.

[khmer6]

Yeah that's what I thought even a nice wall hanger until I can get dies. I was thinking about ghetto rigging some dies. I mix and match from Roberts and mauser dies. We will see tomorrow. Might not even be chambered what the guy says. He's never shot it either because he couldn't find ammo and he doesn't reload

[JIMinPHX]

I would jump on that in a half a heart beat.

[Uncle Grinch]

Dies are a one time cost and the more you shoot the cheaper it is...... Right???

That's my logic and I'm sticking to it!

[khmer6]

True. Amen to that. What type of cast molds are available?

[swheeler]

It's chambered in 6.5x257 Roberts. Stock looks really nice from the picture. I haven't seen it in person yet. Only wants 100 for it

Yes I would!

[FLINTNFIRE]

Buy it , it is a steal at that price , even at 140 . Die sets are not that bad , and it is a good caliber , Have one a friend sold me , came with dies and all , peep sights and it is sweet , you need it , you want it , and it will be fun.

[khmer6]

This might sound like a stupid question but what caliber is it supposed to be. I took a pair of calipers and carefully checked it was coming in at 261. I know it's not an accurate measurement but I wanted to do a quick check before I slug it. What would you use to slug it? Maybe a small sinker? The mum looks a bit faded as in the picture. It must of been sitting collecting dust. The bore is full of what looks like saw dust.

[Rich/WIS]

Mum was ground, Japanese defaced them after surrender. Check to be sure rechambering was done properly, some have been reported with chambers off center or out of alignment with the bore. If done right should be a fun gun with either cast or jacketed. Per other poster 6.5X57 is close match and you can use that data.

[frkelly74]

Mine slugs at about .267. I used a 7mm cast boolit driven through the bore.

[Dutchman]

Mum was ground,

Based on the pictured rifle it does not appear to be a commonly seen ground mum but one that was defaced by a bayonet blade being hammered across the mum.

Dutch

[khmer6]

Thanks for all the input guys. I have a lot of random lots of rifle brass. So bolt face seems to be of the 06 family. 35 Remington drops in and drops out but definitely won't be chamber 6. 5x55 is too long. Can I cut brass from any calibers?

[turtlezx]

i bought 1 at auction 6.5 mm $100
thought the barrel looked un military ??
took the barrel and action out of the wood
AND hart barrel 243 nice !! and a bishop custom stock
turtle

[Reg]

Not all that bad of a looking old rifle . Nothing wrong with the caliber if it was redone correctly and you cannot beat the price.
Those Jap actions have a great reputation for strength. About only real valid complaint is the safety but those who have them and use them say it is something you can easily get used to. If you do not like the caliber it is a simple matter to rebarrel. 243, 308 are a couple of good choices.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Thanks for all the input guys. I have a lot of random lots of rifle brass. So bolt face seems to be of the 06 family. 35 Remington drops in and drops out but definitely won't be chamber 6. 5x55 is too long. Can I cut brass from any calibers?
I sent you a PM about a resizer die

Nice rifle

If you use a longer case like 30-06, it can be a hassle getting the neck's turned to the correct thickness.

I'd just use 257 robts brass and size up or 7x57 and size down.

[EDG]

A RCBS .257 Roberts trim die has almost exacty the right neck ID for a 6.5 sizer because the tirm dies are larger than a FL sizer die. It should be about .286. You can call RCBS and they will tell you what their dies are made at. Use a 6.5X55 seater to seat the bullets. No expensive dies required but you have to knock out the primers by hand or with another die.

[khmer6]

Primers are no issue. I use a universal decapper for that. This place is such a wealth of information. I've tried to look at things but I there wasn't much hits on the search items. After easter I will Prolly find some time to slug it

[bruce drake]

I'm following your thread. Interested in how it goes.

Bruce

[khmer6]

Lol I do the same too whenever someone posts about a "new" mauser. I'm sure it'll be a while until I can secure the mold and equipment for it. Especially during this craziness. But I gotta at least slug it :) one thing I noticed was the front sift is loose. Not the blade, and but the ring it's mounted on swivels :(

[bruce drake]

a temporary quick fix for that is red loctite squirted underneath the front sight ring and heated with a hair dryer on high. a permanent fix would be to silver solder it into place

[TCLouis]

Interesting the way the Mum was "decommissioned".

[richhodg66]

Odd, one very similar to this turned up in a local shop for $159 asking price, but it will sit there a while and I'm pretty sure it could be had for less.

Not a nice enough rifle for me to go to the trouble of specialty dies, forming brass, etc. But for the right guy...

[3006guns]

Interesting thread. The 6.5 x 257 was a common conversion after WWII to get the captured type 38 rifles back in action since original Jap ammo was non existant. I don't remember what the parent case was but the trick in picking a rifle for the conversion was to take a .25 caliber bullet with you and try to stick in the muzzle. If it didn't pass beyond the ogive it was judged tight enough for the conversion. Still not a bad way to do it these days.

I've been using .35 Remington cases for my 6.5 Jap by simply running them through a normal 6.5 Jap die. This results in a slightly shorter case but presents no problems at all. Now, good quality 6.5 Jap cases are available from Graf and Sons (normally, there's a shortage now) and could be run through the 6.5 x .257 dies with the good results.

[TheGrimReaper]

100.00!!! Why oh why can I never find a deal????

[Patricklaw]

I HAVE one so similar to that. I have a very good friend that had been trying to get me into Arisakas since he has two, in 6.5x257 AI. He called me from Cabella's to say that he'd found it for $120. I said, "go for it!" When I got it, it said 6.5x257 Improved. I cast the chamber to find that the steep Ackley shoulders I'd expected were not there. I expanded 50 257 cases to 6.5 and fire formed. I use a Hornady neck sizer die after firing. I don't know where I'd find a die to fit it and really don't want to spend the money. My plan is to shoot this brass, neck sizing only, until it's hard to chamber. Then I'll anneal and squeeze it back to something that will fit well, 257 if nothing else, and begin the process again.

Good luck with your copy. It looks like a great use of $100.
-rlp-

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

My plan is to shoot this brass, neck sizing only, until it's hard to chamber. Then I'll anneal and squeeze it back to something that will fit well, 257 if nothing else, and begin the process again.


Helpful hint...
OR when the case doesn't fit well anymore, you can Size the body with a 7x57 FL size die (without the expander)...and continue using the Neck sizer afterward.
Jon

PS, FYI the 7x57 is the parent case for the 257 roberts.

[Patricklaw]

Helpful hint....
So much experience here! Thanks.
And ABSOLUTELY if you have $100, buy the rifle.

[flounderman]

You should be able to fire form 257 roberts brass and load with 260 dies. when you neck size, you should never size all the way to the shoulder anyway so the head space wouldn't be a problem. neck size about 3/4s of the neck and leave the remainder unsized. You will find the bore is about 267.

[Tazman1602]

For a hundred bucks I would have RUN to the bank, not walked, RUN.

Art

[bruce drake]

For others on this thread to answer which might benefit khmer6...

Can 6.5x57 dies be used to reload this 6.5x257 chambered rifle?

Bruce

[ubetcha]

There is suppose to be a guy in Fond-du-Lac Wisconsin that makes a replacement trigger for the Arisaka. I think his last name is Huber.Go to surplusrifle.com and look under Arisaka type 99 in the left hand column. On the next page in the right hand column,there is an article by a guy named R.Ted Joe about installing the trigger and reloading and shooting the type99.Might find some info there and a history of the Arisaka Type 99

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

For others on this thread to answer which might benefit khmer6...

Can 6.5x57 dies be used to reload this 6.5x257 chambered rifle?

Bruce

edited: regarding my original post below...take this info with a grain of salt, it seems CH4D is assuming these two cailbers are "close enough" to be interchangeable...I now wonder if that is correct or NOT ?

I always wondered that?
I did a little search...and according to CH4D, the answer is YES !
as listed on page 48 of their caliber list, 6.5-257 Roberts is AKA 6.5x57
http://www.ch4d.com/catalog/dies/caliber-list?page=48
when you click on 6.5-257 Roberts, it lists 5 notes, the first note says, "6.5x57 dies can also be used for this caliber. The dies you receive may be marked with either designation."
There we go !,
Jon

[bruce drake]

Khmer6,

Consider yourself a very lucky guy. PM me with your mailing address and I will mail you an older 6.5x57 RCBS die set that has been on my shelf for a while now. That should save you some Moola in this economy in getting this rifle shooting again.

Don't thank me, thank KyWoodwrkr who sent me a .38 Super barrel for one of my 1911s free gratis last week. I'm just carrying the good action forward to someone else. If you want to do something in return, send another shooter on the forum something nice out of the blue to help them out.

Bruce

[khmer6]

I don't have any large rifle primers at the moment. I only bought 5k with my last order. I have cases of srp and lpp. As long as the firing pin can ignite the shorter primer of the large pistol wouldn't be ok? Also would the universal 10gr of unique work in this case?

[bruce drake]

Your 10gr of Unique would work in this case size. You could use Large Pistol Primers if the load is mild enough that the firing pin doesn't pierce the primer when its fired as the LPP primer cup is thinner than the LRP.

[frkelly74]

Caution, I do not want to offend Jon but I believe that The shoulder angle is slightly different between the 7mm/257 Roberts cases and the 6.5X57. I read it somewhere a long time ago and a person undertaking this should really be sure. Load data is interchangable but I would hate for someone to get into trouble with excess head space.

I found this Quote from The Firing Line, It seems to be what I remembered.

6.5X257 Roberts IS NOT the same as 6.5X57. The Roberts case has a 20*45' shoulder and a 1.912" datum measuremebt, as does the 6.5X257 Roberts, whereas the 6.5X57 has a 18*55' shoulder and a 1.941" datum measurement. They are not the same round!!

6.5X257 Roberts is a wildcat round designed in the 1950s, and 6.5X57 Mauser is one of the oldest rounds chambered by anyone (having been designed in 1895). Both are based on a necked down 7X57 case, but they are not identical!



I would think neck sizing would be good though same as with the 6.5 swede dies.
__________________

[blixen]

Sweet rifle. A friend's father in central PA. shot many a deer with that caliber.
I have a soft spot for well-done sporters, even though no one thinks they are worth anything. I've got a spanish 7x57 and Argentine mauser that were well done.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Caution, I do not want to offend Jon but I believe that The shoulder angle is slightly different between the 7mm/257 Roberts cases and the 6.5X57. I read it somewhere a long time ago and a person undertaking this should really be sure. Load data is interchangable but I would hate for someone to get into trouble with excess head space.

I found this Quote from The Firing Line, It seems to be what I remembered.

6.5X257 Roberts IS NOT the same as 6.5X57. The Roberts case has a 20*45' shoulder and a 1.912" datum measuremebt, as does the 6.5X257 Roberts, whereas the 6.5X57 has a 18*55' shoulder and a 1.941" datum measurement. They are not the same round!!

6.5X257 Roberts is a wildcat round designed in the 1950s, and 6.5X57 Mauser is one of the oldest rounds chambered by anyone (having been designed in 1895). Both are based on a necked down 7X57 case, but they are not identical!
I would think neck sizing would be good though same as with the 6.5 swede dies.
Fr,
No need to worry about offending me when correcting anything I post, especially if it's from another source like this.
I am no expert on cartridge dimensions, BUT I am surprised the CH4D would be so incorrect...obviously there is two names for a reason...and CH4D must think they are "close enough" to be interchangeable. I sure won't make that claim, and I would recommend anyone procede with caution if anyone is taking CH4D's indirect advice.
Jon

[bruce drake]

Ok, I'm going to hold off on mailing Khmer6 those 6.5x57 dies as I am not going to be responsible for him blowing up that rifle and possibly hurting himself as well.

Instead, I'm going to mail him a hundred or so Lyman 266469s which are 140gr round-nose Loverin-style bullets for that 6.5mm rifle.

Bruce

[khmer6]

Caution, I do not want to offend Jon but I believe that The shoulder angle is slightly different between the 7mm/257 Roberts cases and the 6.5X57. I read it somewhere a long time ago and a person undertaking this should really be sure. Load data is interchangable but I would hate for someone to get into trouble with excess head space.

I found this Quote from The Firing Line, It seems to be what I remembered.

6.5X257 Roberts IS NOT the same as 6.5X57. The Roberts case has a 20*45' shoulder and a 1.912" datum measuremebt, as does the 6.5X257 Roberts, whereas the 6.5X57 has a 18*55' shoulder and a 1.941" datum measurement. They are not the same round!!

6.5X257 Roberts is a wildcat round designed in the 1950s, and 6.5X57 Mauser is one of the oldest rounds chambered by anyone (having been designed in 1895). Both are based on a necked down 7X57 case, but they are not identical!



I would think neck sizing would be good though same as with the 6.5 swede dies.
__________________
I read that somewhere as well. They also had pictures of the diagrams showing the shoulders. It appears some people have gotten away with not completely screwing down the sizer die so it doesn't push the shoulders so low and checking by chambering an empty round to check headspace. I am going to stop by my local sportsmanwarehouse and see if they have any 257 roberts casing I can size up. Funny thing is quite a few months ago I was looking around the reloading supplies there and a father and son was looking for brass for his BOB. I stood there and thought to myself *** is a roberts cartridge. Funny how I ended up with one. I owe all of you a range report! Thanks for the support and information. I am sure it'll be useful for someone in the future who might acquire one of these specimens.

[khmer6]

Got the package I bought from Jon. Thanx for the nice selection of boolits. It will definitely help in optimizing this rifle. Cases fit the chamber fine. I loaded a blank case with a lrg pistol primer wolf. Looks like it'll work, I'll keep my loads light until I can buy some more lrg rifle. Even at 269 boolit the barrel seems very tight. I'll have to slug it this weekend. What oal are you using? 3"?

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

Got the package I bought from Jon. Thanx for the nice selection of boolits. It will definitely help in optimizing this rifle. Cases fit the chamber fine. I loaded a blank case with a lrg pistol primer wolf. Looks like it'll work, I'll keep my loads light until I can buy some more lrg rifle. Even at 269 boolit the barrel seems very tight. I'll have to slug it this weekend. What oal are you using? 3"?

Of course you should seat the boolit to match your rifle...I seat a boolit to just touch the lands (as long as that fits in the Mag well).

So, for reference only, I seat the Beagled Lyman 266469 so COL=3.020 And the NOE 269145FN COL=3.060

I'll be curious what you bore slugs at ?
Good Luck,
Jon

[bruce drake]

Khmer6,

The dies are in the mail and should be delivered on Monday according to USPS guy. They should work if you neck size only. I'll get the 266469 bullets out in the next few weeks as well once I'm back from a mission trip in Indiana and cast up a hundred or so.

Bruce

[khmer6]

Thanks bruce. I slugged her and she comes at 259/268. How does that compared to the "norm"
I'm glad it didn't slug larger as I've read elsewhere of 270plus

[bruce drake]

About normal :) Most T38s were built before the War with the US kicked up so their quality control was tight. I'll size the bullets to .268 when I put the checks on them so you'll have a good fit.

Those .270s were the batch that was imported in from China in the 80s. Those rifles were rode hard by the Chinese before being put up for surplus. I saw one that measured .274! But it was pure evil using Lee's 130gr 7mm mold.

Rechambering to 6.5/257 probably gave your barrel a fresh barrel throat as well so you should be pretty good with the Metford rifling. Keep an eye on the muzzle end of the barrel as well. Sometimes over-zealous recruits would wallow out the muzzle with the cleaning rods so badly a counter-bore is need to get it back to normal. If your barrel slug got easier as it got closer to the muzzle or the chamber area, thats an indicater of wear as well.

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

My rifle slugged at .2685
that's why I honed out a push through sizer to .269
then when I got the NOE mold, I ordered a .270 die for my lyman lubesizer.

it's been a while since I posted photos of my rifle.
http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/100_1510.jpg

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/100_1513.jpg

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/100_1515.jpg

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/100_1514.jpg

http://i640.photobucket.com/albums/uu127/JonB_in_Glencoe/100_1516.jpg

[khmer6]

That full length stock is nice. What front and rear sight is that?

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

The unmarked front ramp site is the type that has a ring around the barrel. The adjustable Rear Peep is also unmarked. I bought this at a gun show as you see it, 3 years ago. It has an awesome aftermarket trigger.
Jon

[khmer6]

Sorry it's taking a while. My only available shooting day has been preoccupied with family matters as of late. I've been looking for load data can't seem to find much. A lot of it references using 6.5x57 data or Mauser data. Is there any calibers I can cross reference? Powders I have on hand at the moment.
Unique
Titegroupe
Blue dot
Wc844 (h335)
Wc860
I think there's a couple more but that's off the top of my head.

[madsenshooter]

I used 6.5x57 dies to size down 7x57 brass for the two 6.5x257 rifles I have. It was PRVI brass that had the neck and shoulder annealed. The final closing of the bolt will size the shoulder back to proper dimension. Biggest problem I've encountered is finding a mold that casts big enough as one of them slugs .271. I did get a 150gr mold from Swede that casts large enough though. Wasn't a group buy, just one he ran a few of. Haven't got around to any loading or shooting yet.

[khmer6]

Well I made a few rounds with various powders. Will be going out this Sunday hopefully. I figure I would do some close up shots to make sure it's not keyholing or anything weird. And move her out for iron sights.

[khmer6]

At the range right now. A full case of Wc860 about 53gr is pretty snappy. Thought it would be lighter. I tried 14 and 14.5gr of unique. Very light shooting. Will have to move her out further and see how well. Was only testing at 10 yards and trying to save my face from shrap metal

[helice]

Wow. What a break for a guy with your ability.
If one like that came to me I'd be in danger of spraining a collar bone whipping my hand back for my wallet.
Congratulations on a good find. Looks great.
I gave an arisaka barreled action to a friend who put it back to military configuration. Clean Mumm and everything. Extremely stong actions.