RIMZ clips for the S&W 625-8

[Dale53]

I had previously mentioned that I had ordered a quantity of RIMZ clips for my relatively new S&W 625-8 in caliber .45 ACP. For those of you who haven't heard of RIMZ Clips maybe a short description might help. Revolvers that use the .45 ACP need "clips" to properly headspace the rimless cartridge in the revolvers. Traditionally, the original clips were called "Half Moon" clips due to their shape (they each held 3 cartridges and you need two for each cylinder full). Later, "Full Moon" clips holding the full six cartridges became popular.

Popular, that is, until you tried to remove the fired shells from them. That was quite difficult with bare hands. Soon various tools became available (in this great "supply and demand" country - you have a problem, someone will solve it for you and make a buck in the process:-D).The tool that I have used that works best for me is the California Competition Works "Demooner" tool in polycarbonate. It is reasonably priced and works well (there IS a short learning curve, but not really a problem.

Now, comes the RIMZ clips. The RIMZ clips are made of a resilient plastic that allows you to load and unload the clips with just the use of your fingers. These will be my clip of choice for all normal range use. I will still keep the steel clips for "business use" as they hold on to the cases tightly and will probably be slightly more durable for stressful situations. Personally, I see myself using the plastic RIMZ clips 98% of the time. Clever idea, properly executed. The cost is about $20.00 for 15 clips shipped.

Note: there IS a correct way to load the plastic clips. The flat side must be loaded so it is next to the cylinder (that is easily done when you place the cartridges in the clip). Of course, the steel clips do NOT have "sides" - it makes no difference how you load the steel. When you place your order, be careful as there are two different clips for .45 ACP (one for early revolvers and one for the later revolvers). The web site spells it out quite clearly. They also have RIMZ clips for other calibers.

http://www.ezmoonclip.com/

Dale53

[9.3X62AL]

Holy Sheep, you guys.

I should NEVER read any thread on S&W 45 caliber revolvers here. Every such perusal brings to mind the sale of my Model 25-2 some years ago, which ranks among the STUPIDEST dispositions I EVER made during my FFL-01 years (1981-1993). *** was I thinking??!!

One of the 625-series variants might fit right inside the gun safe. My nephew Ben's reserve unit is going to Afghanistan in Summer 2008, and I saw him and his brother at Bass Pro Shops right after it opened. Ben was looking at 45 caliber pistols for service sidearm usage, and given his mom's allegiance to the SIG-Sauer marque he was enduring sticker shock at the P-220 pricing. I offered to let him give the Glock 21 a test-drive, which he took me up on a few days back. He brought it back from the Inland F&G range that Buckshot & I infest, RAVING about how well it shot for him with the WWB FMJ's. "I LOVE THIS PISTOL, UNCLE AL!" I told him not to go out and buy one just yet, "things could develop shortly". In other words, I gotta find something his brother wants too--'cause Ben will get the Glock for Afghanistan if he wants it. Joshua was caressing a couple of stackbarrel shotguns, things not in inventory at El Rancho Dolores currently. He apparently got invited on some Midwest pheasant hunt with his girlfriend's family, and Rem 870's or his brother's Model 12 won't make the cut. I warned him about high-maintenance situations like this shotgun bit indicated--and he made an indelicate reference to "Ferraris being fun to drive". Oy, vey.......

Back to the topic. If the Glock goes overseas, one of those 625's will back-fill its slot in the gunsafe. I HATED de-mooning the rounds for the 25-2, whether they were S&W half-moons or the Ranch Products 1/3-moons. These Rimz critters look like a good idea to me. The plot thickens apace, 'cause I love them N-frames.

[Dale53]

Al;
I can recommend the 625 without reservation. I have a goodly number of handguns but this one will be with me until I leave for a better range.

I have three 4 cavity moulds for .45's and that is certainly a part of the equation. I am a near fanatic on good trigger pulls, and of course most any example of the S&W meets the grade single action. They are just plain fun to shoot because of the absolute precision of the trigger pull.

Good on you for sending your nephew off with a good pistol. Depending on his MOS, the Army may not issue him one. I spent a number of years in the National Guard (also some active duty time). I never had to "attend combat" but if I had I guarantee that I would have had a decent sidearm. I have a son who is a full Colonel in the Army and I can surely identify with you wanting to help your nephew.

Incidentally, my son is a medical officer and medical people are no longer non-combatants (the bad guys of the world do not recognize them as such but "soft targets" so the Army has changed their status). Shannon is armed with a Beretta. He is an excellent IPSC pistolman with a 1911 and has a couple[smilie=1: that are properly "tricked out".

Dale53

[JSH]

A demooner or unmooner is sooooooooooooo easy to make and a lot cheaper than store bought. Take an empty 45ACP case and go down to the local hardware store. Find a piece of PVC that the empty will fit in, 1/2" I think. Take the PVC and poke the empty or the loaded round on the moon clip. Take a sharpie and mark out what needs to be removed. A jewelers saw or fine bladed hack saw works fine. A bit of sand paper or a rasp to knock off the burrs and you are done. I made mine long enough to hold 24 empties. I used a glue on cap on the end, but decided to not glue it. One case does hang up every once in a while, but no big deal.

Those boys going over seas, just wondering what type of issue ammo the have available to them? I thought the US forces went to the 9mm?
Jeff

[Dale53]

JSH;
Could you possibly show us a picture? I can't quite figure out what your tool looks like (the demooner tool:roll: ).

Dale53

[JSH]

Dale, will do. Need to break out the camera any way. I have not played with it for a while. I will send pics to Ken as my ability to get them here is lacking.
Jeff

[9.3X62AL]

Per my nephew, good old RN hardball isn't real tough to get ahold of in-country. Like every other war theater since Sumeria---needed weapons and supplies find their way to the troops. LOTS of P-220's, Glock 21's, 1911A1 variants, and other personally-owned 45's were on scene in West Ramadi where Ben was in 2005-2006. It seems to be a unit-by-unit thing whether personal sidearms are let in, and often the personally-owned pistols aren't allowed out. So the 45's often stay behind for use by troops remaining or replacing those heading back to The World. I have zero problem seeing a pistol I gave to my nephew staying in-country to continue protecting our sons and daughters. Proud to donate, actually.

[JSH]

Dale got the pics sent to Ken. I hope they are good enough you and others can understand how they work.
Jeff

[imashooter2]

I rather like the 625 myself.

<---------------------------



Moon clip stripper:

http://www.brownells.com/Images/Products/352197100.jpg

Note the end cut on the tube. A broken golf club shaft works great for homemade.

[45nut]

Pics from JSH.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/jsh8.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/jsh7.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/jsh6.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/jsh5.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/jsh4.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/jsh3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/jsh2.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/jsh1.jpg

[Dale53]

JSH and 45nut;
Those pictures tell the tale completely, Thanks for sharing with us. I doubt that I'll be replacing my CCW de-mooner with this but I may just make one up to see how it works. Looking at the pictures, I see that it should work just fine. Good job!

I do love home made tools and equipment that work.

By the way, I see that you have a Jerry Miculek revolver yourself. That "tool" is not home made but it is sure one cool tool!:drinks: :drinks:

Dale53

[JMax]

I would use an old golf club of steel tubing as PVC will wear at the wrong time. Both Brownell and TK have de-mooners if one doesn't want to make one. As a side note I find that the new 625's are more accurate than the very lovely 1950 and 1955 targets of old.

[45nut]

An update to the "re-mooning" situation here. Rugerman showed me a ebay auction a while back with a simple jig, he made a copy and then I made my own.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/100_1060.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/45nut/100_1062.jpg

I have the plier type de-mooner so I am set there but always fought refilling the clips and especially the last 2 rounds, well this jig pops them in with near zero effort.

Happy camper now.

[rugerman1]

I saw this pic in an auction:
http://san1.atlanta.gbhinc.com/GB/086203000/86203356/pix637641875.jpg
After I got my 625,I decided I needed a similar device.So 5:00 AM Sunday morning,I went down to the wood shop and picked up some scrap I'd been tripping on and cobbled this together
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q299/sawrm1/Nov182007.jpg

lastmanout gave me this "de-mooner",kewl huh?
http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q299/sawrm1/Nov182007003.jpg

[EDK]

Those Rimz full moons sure look nice, but not $20 for 15 nice!

A handfull of full moons will last sometime past forever unless you lose them. Look up Ranch Products out of Malinta OH--I don't recall the web address, but they do have one and a telephone number. Buy 100 and try to refrain from cursing people who put a rather exorbitant mark-up on them.

I had a 25-2 cut to 4 inches and gave it to my younger brother. Currently there's a 3 and 5 inch Model of 1989 (625-2) in the safe. After I get them out and shoot a few rounds, I wonder why I leave something that good languishing in the safe.


:redneck: :castmine:

[Dale53]

I am a BIG fan of the RIMZ clips. Let's see how much they cost long term. Just for the sake of discussion, figure each clip will last 200 cycles (there is very little stress when used and they may last much longer). At any rate, if we load five cartridges in each cycle, then we are talking about 1000 rounds through each clip. That cost is "ONE TENTH" of a cent per shot. When you consider that ease of use and just plain pleasure without all of the hassle using re and de mooner tools, etc. it is a no brainer for me. I LOVE the RIMZ clips.

Just for the record, I have many of the full moon steel clips and a de-mooner (CCA pliers type tool which works very well). I just MUCH prefer using the RIMZ clips for target use. I think that I will make up a re-mooner tool that is illustrated here, tho' as that is just very clever.:drinks:

Dale53

[EDK]

If you prefer the RIMZ, it is fine by me.

I bought 20 or 30 full moons from Ranch Products when I got the 625-2s in 1989 or 90. They're still doing fine, but I decided I ought to get some more....especially after seeing the prices at various big time merchants! Contacting them last year got me 100 at a very low price.

Now I need to find my little brass de-mooner...and copy one of the re-mooners!

We may not agree on the RIMZ, but there's no difference of opinion on 45 ACP Smith & Wesson revolvers in any of their variations. The 5 inch is excellent and the 3 inch has its own mystique. I'd love to find a 6.5 model 25, but I'd have to shoot it and some collector would have kittens!

Enjoy a fine firearm and caliber :Fire:

[Shepherd2]

I made a de-mooner years ago using a piece of 1/2" electrical conduit and fitted a wooden handle to it. That re-mooner looks like something I really need. Now I've got a project for the next rainy day.

[Dale53]

EDK;
We have no quarrel here (heck, I even prefer brunettes to blonds[smilie=1:). The important thing is we have and use the wonderful S&W .45 ACP revolvers!

I am continually surprised at how "user friendly" my 625-8 (JM Special) is. I have shot more good scores with this than all but a couple of my other revolvers. It is SO satisfying to watch those BIG holes appear in the "X" ring (sometimes[smilie=1:).

Dale53

P.S. I really like that aluminum re-mooner shown above. I may try to talk one of my machinist friends into making one for me. On the other hand, how about one made of exotic wood (say, Ebony) for a real conversation piece. Another good material would be black delrin. It would certainly be sturdy enough, the black would not show "dirt" and if finished nicely, would look rather elegant. Hm-m-m-m, I may have enough delrin to get the job done. rdm

[MakeMineA10mm]

I wonder what kind of moon clips Jerry Miculek uses? I was watching a video of him shooting the other day, and he was describing loading techniques. In the video, there were two-three close-ups of his full moon clips, and they are easy for him to load and unload with just his fingers.

The main things I noticed about them were:

1. They were metal.
2. They were full-moon.
3. They had a long, straight, thin slot cut down each arm of the clip, about 3/4's of the way from the outside edge towards the center of the clip.

It's this slot that I believe makes his moon clips easy to load and unload without tools.

Wonder where he got them?

[Pepe Ray]

Those clips (that Jerry uses) are more sensitive to bending and thus misfires.
I've been using the Ranch Prods for years. A copper tubeing extractor and fingers for loading. I've got enough junk to carry around to the range w/o adding a loading block tool.
Pepe Ray

[Dale53]

Some of the different caliber moon clips have slots. Maybe he was shooting something besides the .45 ACP. Or maybe, he just looked at the other caliber clips with slots and said, "Eureka! and cut his own slots". That would sure be worth doing. You might be able to do it with a bandsaw (depending upon how hard the clips are). It would be hard on the blade unless you had a metal cutting blade, then it would probably be a piece of cake.

There is NO doubt that for a competition or combat reload, you would wan to use the steel clips. THAT is a no brainer, even tho' I use the RIMZ clips for general range use...

FWIW
Dale

[lathesmith]

Thanks for the post here Dale, this looks like a great product.I see some have complained about the price of the Rimz; I guess I am looking in the wrong place, but the Rimz aren't much more expensive than steel clips I have found for sale online.
Like others here, I intend to keep the steel clips I have, but these look like great "range"clips as they should be much more finger-friendly without tools.
lathesmith

[richbug]

I fail to see what all the fuss is about loading and unloading moon clips. I shoot several thousand rounds a year out of my 610 and don't own any special tools for it. I load a bunch before a match and sort out the mess when I get home, or when I feel like it.

Brownells house brand clips are excellent. With the C+R discount they are like 60 cents each.

The ones with the split in them are the factory S&W 10mm-40S&W clips. S&W is a little proud of them for my taste, to the tune of $4 each.

[Dale53]

lathesmith;
Glad to "be of service". You'll like the RIMZ clips.

Dale

[imashooter2]

Thanks for the post here Dale, this looks like a great product.I see some have complained about the price of the Rimz; I guess I am looking in the wrong place, but the Rimz aren't much more expensive than steel clips I have found for sale online.
Like others here, I intend to keep the steel clips I have, but these look like great "range"clips as they should be much more finger-friendly without tools.
lathesmith

You're looking in the wrong place. Ranch steel moons are $35 a hundred delivered. You can get them either on eBay or direct from Ranch Products. RIMZ are $1.20 each plus delivery.

[EDK]

Imashooter2 is my brother!

Those Rimz are nice, but not that nice. I look for my nitro when I see what full moon clips cost most places. And the steel ones will last forever.

Hey, Dale My preference in women is "friendly--personable--gainfully employed" good looks optional--not a requirement....a genuine smile raises ratings immensely!


:castmine: :redneck:

[lathesmith]

Thanks for the useful information guys. When in doubt....just ask! 100 moon clips would probably last me several lifetimes.
lathesmith

[Dale53]

I guess I don't really understand what "price" you are talking about. You shoot a $1000 revolver and worry about $.001 (tenth of a cent per shot) cost of Rimz clips that require NO tools to load and unload so easily? Tools that can cost upwards of $100.00 ( CCA aluminum de-mooner and re-mooner).

I guess you just look at things differently than I do.[smilie=1:

What ever spins your propellor.:???:

Dale53

[lathesmith]

As far as I'm concerned, I have a place in my shooting gear for both RIMZ and conventional clips. I am not the type that burns hundreds of rounds at a session thru my guns; a session of a hundred or two at most and I am done. So, 15 or 20 of either type of clip will suffice for me. I am glad to get the info on the standard clips though, I was thinking of ordering a few from Midway( and a few was all I would have gotten @ a buck apiece).
lathesmith

[Dale53]

>>>As far as I'm concerned, I have a place in my shooting gear for both RIMZ and conventional clips. <<<

My thoughts exactly. I use the RIMZ clips for every day use and will use my steel full moon clips for "serious" use. I have the tools for the steel clips but will continue to use the Rimz for fun. That way, I have "The best of both worlds"...

I am still going to make a set of "home made" tools to re and de moon my steel clips as I am afraid I am a bit of a "sucker" for good, well designed, home made tools and fixtures. I sure wish I had metal working equipment as I am really enamored of the aluminum fixture to reload clips. I guess I'll have to settle for the wooden type (however, maybe I can make that nicely of some well figured wood of some type). Hmmm, sounds down right doable...

EDK:
>>>Hey, Dale My preference in women is "friendly--personable--gainfully employed" good looks optional--not a requirement....a genuine smile raises ratings immensely!<<<

I married a woman like that. We will be celebrating our 50th Wedding anniversary next June. So, we are in agreement there, also:-D.

Merry Christmas, to ALL!!

Dale53

[lathesmith]

Dale, here is a tool I whipped up on the lathe out of a 7/8 chunk of cold-rolled. I hollow-bored the handle, knurled the outside, and then plugged the end with a 5/8 - 11 plug. The thin shaft was turned to .640" and then inside-bored to 15/32". See what happens when a guy with metal-working tools gets bored in the winter? It really works slick, and I like it!
lathesmith

[Dale53]

I'm impressed! I was trained as a machinist but haven't worked at it for many, many years. I have a few power tools but no lathe. I have relied on friends for special tools (and compensated them one way or another).

Your de-mooner is something to be proud of. I'm looking for a discarded golf club shaft to make one of my own even tho' I have a very nice de-mooner. What I really need is to get busy and make a re-mooner like is pictured here in a couple of different iterations.

Dale53

[lathesmith]

Yes, one of those "re-mooners" is going to be on the winter project list. I'll probably go for a metal one--I'm kind of a metal-head when it comes to making tools--over a wood one. I know a wooden one will work just fine, but...I actually ENJOY cutting those metal chips. It's a mysterious illness, I guess...if you have been bitten by the metal bug, you'll understand.

Alas, I have another confession to make; my revolver is not a 25-2 or 625 at all but a 25-5 on which I installed a 5" 625 full-lug barrel, along with a 625-2 cylinder. This gun originally had .458+ 45 Colt throats, and shot pie-plate sized groups at 25 yds. Worthless junk; pretty, but just a wall-hanger. I haven't wrung it out thoroughly yet, but I can tell it now shoots better than I can hold! It's a blast! Now, I know there are some guys out there with their pure-bred 'Smiths that will look down their noses at my bastard handgun, but I LOVE it! This is one of those that I will own 'till I depart for that great hunting ground in the sky...bastard-haters notwithstanding.
lathesmith

[Dale53]

Lathesmith;
I would choose to have mine a copy of the aluminum one in this thread if I had my druthers, but since I don't, it'll have to be wood.

You certainly won't find me putting you down with your 25-5. I HATE guns that won't perform. I am a "Pretty is as pretty does" kind of guy with both people and guns. Frankly, if you took a "non-performer" and made a "performer" out of it, you would only get kudos from me!!:drinks:

Dale53

[lathesmith]

Yes, I thought about using aluminum, but I thought the steel would hold up better. I have plenty of both aluminum and steel to make such widgets.
This gun was definitely NOT much of a shooter before. I even tried some 300 grainers for the 45/70. Amazingly these would chamber! But the 6"barrel was .451 and accuracy was still not very good.
I decided on that 5 incher because it just "feels" right to me. It measures right at .451 or so, and the throats of the 45 acp cylinder are about .452. This was a good match, and in my testing so far it has performed very well. At first, I had some misfire problems, and I thought something might be amiss with the headspace. But, the headspace was okay; turns out that I had a screw loose(I've been told this before!) but this was the mainspring screw. Also, I had a "sticky" problem with the mainspring to hammer link, which a little lube cured. I guess this thing had sat around unused for so long the old lube had just gummed up. Anyway, once this was fixed I had a real shooter. I am having a real blast with these recently accquired metal-working tools! I have wanted to fix this old revolver for years, and now I finally have. There's nothing like the nice smooth action of a properly working N frame.
lathesmith

[viet68]

I just got my JMP for Christmas. The one gun that slipped thru my hands back in 1982. I always regretted not purchasing one these last few years, but strayed over to the Dark Side of Glock and 9MM. I'm back now. Would you mind sharing some of your most accurate loads? I've only shot 230 FMJ behind a standard reload of WW231.
One other thing; I'm having a really hard time finding a good non kydex holster; any suggestions would be appreciated.

[Dale53]

I have found that my 625-8 is not terribly ammo sensitive. It shoots most any standard .45 ACP load well. In fact, it shoots them EXTREMELY well.

My preference is for a 185-200 SWC (I have both the Saeco #68 and the H&G #130) ahead of 3.5-4.0 grs of Bullseye or equivalent. Win 231 shoots very well as does Red Dot. In the heavier loads, Unique shoots quite well, also.

I use NOTHING but cast bullets (MY cast bullets) and size at .452". I am now lubing with Lars' White Label Red Carnauba but NRA 50/50 Alox/Beeswax will work well, also.

Good luck and Good Shooting!:drinks:
Dale53

[imashooter2]

4.2 grains of Bullseye under a Lee 452-228-1R in a Winchester case with a Federal 150 works well for me. It's what I use for USPSA.

[MakeMineA10mm]

Alas, I have another confession to make; my revolver is not a 25-2 or 625 at all but a 25-5 on which I installed a 5" 625 full-lug barrel, along with a 625-2 cylinder. This gun originally had .458+ 45 Colt throats, and shot pie-plate sized groups at 25 yds. Worthless junk; pretty, but just a wall-hanger. I haven't wrung it out thoroughly yet, but I can tell it now shoots better than I can hold! It's a blast! Now, I know there are some guys out there with their pure-bred 'Smiths that will look down their noses at my bastard handgun, but I LOVE it! This is one of those that I will own 'till I depart for that great hunting ground in the sky...bastard-haters notwithstanding.
lathesmith

lathesmith - I'm a S&W afficionado, but I would never look down my nose at your pistol. Form FOLLOWS function, and .458"+ throats is not purty, no matter what the bluing, etc. looked like! If your pistol shoots well now, and makes you happy, that is 99.9% of "quality." Look at it this way - if you want to get that last .1%, you could send it off for some kind of guncoating that will hide it's mix-match make-up. Just remember, it won't shoot any better! :mrgreen:

[lathesmith]

MMA10MM, you pretty much summed up my thoughts on the matter in your post. The mixed finishes really doesn't bother me at all. It reminds me that this gun was not a shooter until I fixed it. Arrogant? Perhaps, but I tend to think of it more as a job well-done rather than arrogance. I just knew I had the ability to fix S&W's design mistake, and now I have the proof! Of course, acquiring the right tools for the job in the last few years is what finally made it possible.
Dale's post above so far mirrors my experience also. This gun now is not picky at all concerning loads, it shoots most everything I have fed it reasonably well. 45 ACP and the Smith N frame are just made for each other!
lathesmith