CASTPICS load data query 30-30

[sisterjim]

I'd like to hear some opinion or actual results on the use of 4198 with light boolit in 30-30. The CASTPICS data looks reasonable although one or two loads stand out as high pressure. Load #1126 is for 131gr. 311410 max is up to 27grs 4198 @ 2260fps. I want to try and push the 311465 Loverin to similar velocities. I would expect this to shoot to the same point of aim as my PB HP small game load at 75 yards. Ben tried it last year to about 1700 but didn't find any other data. Am I missing something Larry?

[sisterjim]

I just found this same data in Lyman manual no 44 (1967) Castpics. Is the 4198 still same recipe/potency as 40 odd years ago?

[MT Gianni]

Larry, you might be missing the bearing surfaces. The Louverin has a lot of surface and the 410 a medium taper. Less bearing surface means less friction so less pressure to push out the bbl. That may not be a good thing with bullet slump but you cannot interchange between similar weights without considering profiles.

[sisterjim]

Thanks Gianni I will factor that into my reckoning in future. I posted my findings over on hamour's "30-30 hunting alloy" thread. 24 grs of 4198 gave me a terrific result but too much pressure. Going to switch to slower powder I have H4895 equivalent will build up from 25-28 grs.

[Doc Highwall]

You can start with bullet weight but if you have twice the bearing surface you will have twice the friction.

Take a look at a 38 wad cutter and then look at a round nose bullet and compare the bearing surface. Most people just think about the bullet weight.

[rintinglen]

311-465 is my favorite of the Louverin boolits.
I have worked extensively with it using Herco, Unique, 2400,IMR 4227, IMR 30-31, WW-748 and experimented with a couple more. Unfortunately, 4198 never made the list. I used it in a Remington 722 .222 Rem back in the 70's, but have never used it since. Were I to give it a try, I'd start at 18.0 grains, and work up to 25.0 grains. You would likely find your desired velocity somewhere around the 22-23.5 grain mark at a guess, but Professor Gun and his assistant Chrony would tell you that more precisely than my SWAG.

My personal favorite loads for this boolit include 8.0 Herco, or 8.5 Unique, 35 grains WW-748, and my most preferred 17.5 grains of 2400.

[madsenshooter]

Yea, bearing surface makes a biiig difference in both pressure and velocity attained. An example that comes to mind is the Eagan MX3-30AR out of a .310" groove diameter Krag vs the same boolit out of .305" groove diameter K31. With the Krag, I could use Blue Dot to get to 2000fps with extreme accuracy, out of the K31 I couldn't get to 2000fps with BD without exceeding the pressure limit of the alloy. When using NOE's 311365, which has a .305 nose diameter, in my Krag, I couldn't get to the velocity I wanted using 4198 without exceeding the pressure limit of the alloy, but similar weight, bore riding boolits that engraved less gave me the velocity I was after. Slower powders got me what I wanted with the 311365. I guess the bottom line is that data you find anywhere isn't necessarily engraved in stone. Lots of other variables to consider.

[fa38]

Not 4198 but Weidners says to use 4198 data for SPP 210
16.1 grs. SPP 210, RCBS 180 SP. Win LR Mag primer

I have had better luck with 2400
13.5 Grs. 2400. RCBS 180 SP or RCBS 168 Sil, Fed 215 Mag primer

Plain base load
7.4 grs. Herco, RCBS 170 plain base, Win Lr or CCI Mag primer

Not fixated on mag primers.
Just have a lot of them that I purchased at $18.00 per thou. and they work very well.
Rifle is a Ruger No.1 MATCO barrel.

[sisterjim]

Thank you all for your input. I'll range test my batch with the slower powder 2206H over the weekend.