6.5x55mm cruise missile for deer?

[horsesoldier]

Is this a suitable boolit for deer? Small diameter but with the proper alloy and enough velocity could it work for whitetail within 200 yards? I think they shoot moose with this caliber and boolit Sweden

[jhalcott]

I tried this bullet in my .260 with poor results. The bullet from the mold were too large and sizing them to fit wiped out the lube grooves!! IF it shoots in your barrel it should be a FINE bullet. It is a DEEP penetrator though. It should go thru any deer hit with it. I am assuming you are talking about the 160 grain gaschecked RN model. The only thing I'd do to make it better (in MY opinion) is put a flat nose or HP on it.

[Bullshop]

This boolit design (170gn fngc) caused a long running never ending hot debate and ended in some folks leaving CB.
Anyway forgetting all that the general concesus was that in milsurp barrels its upper velocity limit was 1700 fps or there about.
I seem to remember several reports of it taking game cleanly within that velocity limit.
If you go back and start reading everything about 6.5mm cal since the introduction of this originaly group buy mold it will take a year of reading to catch up to all the fine details of what I just said.
Some real good spun off of it but much bad and hard feeling were gererated by it as well. After that the boolit design just seemed to have died maybe being too much of a good thing by way of length for caliber.

[quilbilly]

I have a friend who travels annually to the Sweden, Norway, and Finland. That caliber with a cruise missile is far and away one of their favorites for their moose (called elk there). It is an astounding number but tens of thousands of moose (if not 100,000+) are killed in those countries with that caliber every year. Of course, training to be the shooter in those countries is stringent and it would be tough for any of us to pass the test. Because of those shooter qualifications, a single shooter is allowed to fill many tags.

[Doc Highwall]

horsesoldier, what are you going to shoot these out of?

[horsesoldier]

Tikka T3 hunter with a 22 inch barrel.I have shot a few groups with this boolit and I am very impressed.This target was at 50 yards, five shot group.http://i1130.photobucket.com/albums/m538/Andrew338win/013.jpg

[Bullshop]

I may hate myself for saying this but I dont think that is a group. I think it is a single boolit tipping as it passed through the paper. Please dont get angry with me for saying that but from the appearance of the hole and color around the hole and knowing what I know about this boolit I think that is what I am seeing.
You could easily proove me wrong by shooting a couple more groups.
Really sorry but I have to call it like I see it.

[David2011]

Watching with great interest.

David

[horsesoldier]

Its ok, I understand.But I dont have to prove anything, the group size is irrelevant to my question.Thank you for your input Bullshop.

[Bullshop]

One of the problems associated with this design and also with the relatively fast twist milsurp barrels and the reason for the 1700 fps velocity limit is that above that the boolits seemed to be bending from the torque remaining on the base end of the boolit while still in the barrel and after the front end had already exited.
At some point in pressure/velocity you could hear the boolits whizz off in random directions supposedly from the bending taking place at the muzzle. I have recovered many of these bent in perfect horse shoe shape.
It is a very interesting design and I like it and it will do good work within its velocity limit on game or otherwise.
I have a custom 6.5x57 on a single shot FN Mauser with a 1/10" twist barrel and it seems a bit more forgiving than milsurp barrels but still I dont see a huge gain in atainable velocity with this boolit.
For hunting it may be a good candidate for soft nose casting. It will penitrate well even with a good frontal mushroom.

[sundog]

jhalcott, there were a batch of moulds that were improperly cut. Is yours one of them? I have two that are as you describe, and two more that are correct diameter.

I do not see why this would not be a good boolit for deer; alloy, velocity, and shoot placement. Heck, done right, you can harvest a deer with a .22 rim fire.

[Awsar]

yes ive heard good things about the 6.5x55 and if yours shoots that well you should have no problem taking down deer.

[JeffinNZ]

Does OK on wallabies:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v505/JeffinNZ/Roo%20trip%2010/IMG_0003.jpg

The challenge you may face is finding an alloy that is soft enough to expand but hard enough for the twist/velocity. I find that to get my Carcano to shoot I have to use alloy no less than 18 BHN.

[45 2.1]

horsesoldier-
I'm the designer of the cruise missle. It has been a real adventure, with all the harassment I get, to help people to get it to shoot. A sticky involving all that is down in the Military Rifles forum titled "Milk Jug 300 Yard 6.5 Swede". Somewhere in there I posted directions on how to get this boolit to shoot at higher velocities. Read at your own risk because these folks don't believe it. A few other people have done the same as I have, but very few.

[horsesoldier]

Thanks for all of the input guys.I didn't mean to open a can of worms with my question. The ones I am using a sized to .266.I believe my load data was 28.0 grains of IMR 4895( Its been awhile since I have played with it).First cast boolit I have shot outside of black powder.I am brand new to casting so I do not have a lubersizer yet.My friend sent me the boolits to try.

45 2.1, I read a little of the thread, I plan on reading it fully tonight.Amazing results!

[Bullshop]

The buffered load technique was one of the tenticles that grew out of the monster.
I never tried it simply because I got tired of trying to filter through the arguing to find useful information and gave up following as I think others did as well.
There were a few dedicated sluggers though.

[sisterjim]

Jeff; they look like the Bennetts wobbley we get in Tassie I shot a few this morning with my PB 115gr HP in 30-30. It sounds like overkill but is very efficient out to 100yards. I have posted some pics of the boolit and mold on the design and maintainance page in the last couple of days; search "Erik Ohlen".


64993


I am digressing but my point is does anybody have experience of a scaled down version of my HP boolit in 6.5mm. I inherited a Merkel 6.5x57R/12 combo it is battered but functional. The twist is 1:8 "ish" and throat not as long as milsurps. The smallest commercial mold I have seen is 140gr. Lyman Loverin. I am hoping to get something around 100 grain flat point spitzer, LBT praps. Other possibility is get Lyman milled down; GC'ing could be a problem however. I noted the 18 bnh plus, is this because the sharp twist throws the boolit out of whack? If the boolit is shorter it might be less prone to bending. Ultimately like to get it up to 2200f.p.s. GC'ed of course. I'd like to take the same game out to 200 yards. I appreciate your input Jeff and others. Apologies for curving the thread Horsesoldier but it seems you already have the attn. of the 6.5mm afficianados.

[horsesoldier]

Its quite alright. Any other moulds I should take a look at for the swede for deer hunting?

[Bullshop]

There were two other group buys after this one for 6.5 cal in the 140gn range and they worked out very well.
I have both and could produce some samples. You could test those then maybe have a better idea of what you want if you go custom.
One of them is a loverin design that I nose size about half its length to .259" to ride the lands and it is ever so accurate from my 6.5x57

[Bullshop]

I got an email because of this thread from my friend Joe. He seemed to think I was taking sides on this seemingly rebirth of an old issue.
Let me make myself clear I am just passing on some of what I read here and too ignorent to have a definate opinion on what if any limits there are with the original design of what was called the 6.5 cruis missel.
If there is anything at all that I have learned about shooting boolits it would be to never say never.

[waksupi]

Joe outlived his chances and rights to put in his opinion on this board. He is gone, will stay gone, and will not be allowed to state his opinion by proxy here.

[swheeler]

Ric I think that is a wise decision considering his track record.

[jhalcott]

I got MY "cruise missile" in a trade. A 6.5 RN GC 160 grain, it dropped from the mold nearly .268 or .269" in a linotype alloy. It DID drop a bit smaller in a softer alloy, though. Neither of my barrels would handle it, and if sized small enough to fit, the grease grooves were destroyed. I traded it and all the bullets cast from it to a cousin that dotes on Swedes! I do not know the number or real name of that monster.

[swheeler]

I got MY "cruise missile" in a trade. A 6.5 RN GC 160 grain, it dropped from the mold nearly .268 or .269" in a linotype alloy. It DID drop a bit smaller in a softer alloy, though. Neither of my barrels would handle it, and if sized small enough to fit, the grease grooves were destroyed. I traded it and all the bullets cast from it to a cousin that dotes on Swedes! I do not know the number or real name of that monster.

The CM has a meplat and is FNosed

[Bullshop]

Joe outlived his chances and rights to put in his opinion on this board. He is gone, will stay gone, and will not be allowed to state his opinion by proxy here.

No argument there. Joe was a welth of information but because of a character wrincle he well wore out all his chances.

[horsesoldier]

Have you guys tried alox as a lube? If you did how did it work?

[PS Paul]

http://www.castpics.net/subsite2/GeneralReference/Hunting%20with%20the%20Cast%20Bullet.pdf Waksupi wrote a very interesting and informative article on hunting with cast. The link above takes you to it in Castpics and you should really take a look!! He touches on the 6.5 in the article.

You'll find it somewhat useful, but he does not go into the soup can (or worms) subject.........

[horsesoldier]

Waksupi, excellant article on castboolits, I really enjoyed it!

[Larry Gibson]

Its quite alright. Any other moulds I should take a look at for the swede for deer hunting?

There are several; the older Lyman 266455 and the several varients of the "Kurtz" GB designs should all be good. I had a seperate thread wherein I attempted to follow the buffered load technique directions; I did succeed with very good (1 1/2 - 2 moa at 100 yards with 10 shot groups) accuracy at 2000 - 2100 fps. Cast of COWWs +2% tin with 50% lead then added and WQ'd they should do well on deer (always with proper bullet placement) to 150 yards, perhaps 200. I would HP them to 3/16" deep with the Forster 1/16" HP tool to ensure expansion at the longer ranges. Penetration will be all that is needed and probably then some.

I also am working with the grossly over sized CM. I am sizing the nose down to .258 and sizing the driving bands to .268 so with the GC at the base of the case neck the driving bands enter the throat and the nose into the bore. Otherwise, w/o the sizing the bullet gets shoved down into the case on chambering (and no a heavy crimp doesn't prevent it). Haven't really gotten much testing doen after the mentioned sizing to give any results but will do when I have something. Results before sizing really aren't worth mentioning. I've no experience with the CM that casts to proper specs for the 6.5 Swede throat and bore.

Larry Gibson

[jonp]

This is my favorite caliber for hunting. The 6.5x55 Swedish Mauser has mild recoil coupled with enough power for everything up to whitetail and superb accuracy to boot. I found a sporterized Carl Gustaf made in 1917 I think and bought it on a whim as the price was very low. Nice Monte Carlo Stock and an action smooth enough to die for. This boolit placed in a necked down 30-06 (6.5-06) is very accurate out to 1,000yrds and was the rage in long distance matches a few years ago due to the bullets length which results in an unusually high BC.
Although I know that it is used in Scandinavia to shoot thousands of Moose a year I have not used it for that as I have several larger caliber rifles I think are better suited for Moose but you can not argue with the successful use on game of that size in Europe. I just don't feel comfortable using this round on an animal that will top 750lbs in the NorthEast where I am from but that is just me.
The extra long bullet causes it to be perform way out of what should be expected of something in this velocity and caliber range.
I think that it would be one of the best rounds to place in the hands of the beginning hunter or those that are recoil sensitive.

[Doc Highwall]

I bought a Browning 1885 Lowwall that is chambered in 260 Remington looking at it as a modern 6.5x55.

[jonp]

http://www.castpics.net/subsite2/GeneralReference/Hunting%20with%20the%20Cast%20Bullet.pdf Waksupi wrote a very interesting and informative article on hunting with cast. The link above takes you to it in Castpics and you should really take a look!! He touches on the 6.5 in the article.

You'll find it somewhat useful, but he does not go into the soup can (or worms) subject.........
Great article. Thanks

[Hamish]

I can't help but wonder if the use of an enriched copper alloy would help stave off some of "pretzel" factor.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?172475-High-Copper-Alloys-Lets-discuss-this-further

I am hopeful that at some point the mere mention of the caliber will no longer bring hard feelings to the surface,,,,,,,