450 Alaskan

[6pt-sika]

I have committed to a deal for a used Marlin 1895 in 450 Alaskan caliber .

Any insight into what I should expect in loading etc ?[smilie=1:

This is not a caliber I have ever been overly intrested in . However there was a decently priced one on one of the forums I frequent . So what the heck :drinks:

I am thinking of loading the Ranch Dog 420 in this rifle although I will most likely try the Ranch Dog 350 as well .

Incidently this rifle is micro grooved .

[lar45]

I remember reading once upon a time that there might be 2 different chamber configurations. One is a 45-348 with the 348 tapered case wall, the other has a mostly straight case that is necked down to 45 which is what most would think of. You might just want to double check before you order your loading dies.
I think the problem was with dies from CH-4D, but the guy said that loading dies from RCBS were used with no problems.

Should be lots of fun though.

[6pt-sika]

Rifle Magazine put out a special edition called "The Legacy of Leverguns" in the winter of 2000 . And it just so happens I have a copy .

Anyway inside there is an article on the Model 71 Winchester and some of the cartridges it has been rechambered to .

And they show the 450 Alaskan as a sort of slight bottle neck design . Then they have the another cartridge called the 458-348AI which is a tapperred case (looks like a 38-55 on steroids) .

I am assuming and hoping that the one I am getting has the slight bottle neck .

I've done some buisness with CH-4D in the past . I have no doubt that they will be able to get me whatever I need provided I provide them with the correct dimensions .

I have however found a gentleman with a used set of 450AK dies . If the price is right I may take a chance with his dies .

[charger 1]

I remember reading once upon a time that there might be 2 different chamber configurations. One is a 45-348 with the 348 tapered case wall, the other has a mostly straight case that is necked down to 45 which is what most would think of. You might just want to double check before you order your loading dies.
I think the problem was with dies from CH-4D, but the guy said that loading dies from RCBS were used with no problems.

Should be lots of fun though.

Yes I did say that. I'm going to tell you straight off the 450 was not designed to shoot cast. CH sent me junk with the line afterward that theres 38,000 configurations. Which kinda begs the question then how can rcbs do one die set and have it fit all 450 ak's. See the diff is in neck length. You'll have the short neck in a marlin. I did the long in a ruger #1 and at that even had to throat it out and get veral smith to make a custom mold. The 450 was meant to go jacketed and making it eat cast can be done but with blood and sweat

[6pt-sika]

Charger , how bad is this thing gonna thump me when I touch it off ?

I already have a 375 H&H MAG that I load up pretty stout and that isn't bad . Also have a 416 REM MAG that isn't bad with the 350 grain Speer loaded up . However when I shoot full house 400 grain loads in that 416 it is a bit much after 3-6 rounds .

Whoever had this 450 Alaskan done also installed a Pachmyer Declerator pad . I do not know if it has a recoil reducer in the stock , but I can always install one [smilie=1:

And I don't find ported barrels offensive , so that is another option !

[charger 1]

Charger , how bad is this thing gonna thump me when I touch it off ?

I already have a 375 H&H MAG that I load up pretty stout and that isn't bad . Also have a 416 REM MAG that isn't bad with the 350 grain Speer loaded up . However when I shoot full house 400 grain loads in that 416 it is a bit much after 3-6 rounds .

Whoever had this 450 Alaskan done also installed a Pachmyer Declerator pad . I do not know if it has a recoil reducer in the stock , but I can always install one [smilie=1:

And I don't find ported barrels offensive , so that is another option !


It aint goin to thump you bad at all. mine started life shooting some jacketed hornady 350's with h4198. at slightly under 2400 IF I remember correctly. See the thing with jacket is that you get to use a fast powder that goes through the recoil curve fast. Its when you try hot rodding the girl with cast and things like 78 grains of H4895 and a 410 grainer that you start to notice. I'm sure you already know that if a gun has a big drop in the stock it'll het harder than a straighter stock.
When does we get a picture?

Heres what Veral made via my design. It allows me to keep all the working parts ie gas check, lube in the neck. This bullet along with a 460 throating reamer from PTG has the #1 capable of an inch at 200. Not to say I'm capable each time, but it is. However all that comes up a might long for levers. I'll quote again Harold didnt have much of a knowledge of cast nor did he design his cartridges for em
http://usera.imagecave.com/chargerdive/HPIM0927.JPG

[6pt-sika]

When does we get a picture?

I'll post a picture when it gets here :-D

It will most likely be a few weeks as I have not finished paying theguy yet :roll:

It looks just like a standerd Marlin 1895 45-70 . As all they did was unscrew the barrel and rechamber . Then I believe they reblued the barrel and restamped the caliber markings of course .

[6pt-sika]

Its when you try hot rodding the girl with cast and things like 78 grains of H4895 and a 410 grainer that you start to notice.

I plan on starting it out with the Ranch Dog 350 or 420 grain cast bullet . But I do not anticipate running them much hotter then I do my 45-70 loads .

I may also try some medium + jacketed loads in it also [smilie=1:

[NVcurmudgeon]

6 point, I shot a few rounds from a .450 Akaskan M 71 about forty years ago and remember it kicked like a blue nosed mule. There were at least two versions. The original was the .450 Fuller from Cooper Landing, Alaska. IIRC it was a simple .450/.348. Then the Ackley Improved came out and there may be other improveds. Whatever flavor you are buying, please insist on a feeding test. Sometimes it's hard to stuff wildcats into a sack!

[charger 1]

6 point, I shot a few rounds from a .450 Akaskan M 71 about forty years ago and remember it kicked like a blue nosed mule. There were at least two versions. The original was the .450 Fuller from Cooper Landing, Alaska. IIRC it was a simple .450/.348. Then the Ackley Improved came out and there may be other improveds. Whatever flavor you are buying, please insist on a feeding test. Sometimes it's hard to stuff wildcats into a sack!

I am going to hate myself for this but there is only ONE body chambering known as450 ak and to with comes a long or short neck . Thats it AMEN. AAAAALLLLL the other conversions have other names all their own. I'll say again this is why RCBS can create one die set to fit everything called a 450 AK, short or small neck. I believe it is the above mentioned which creates problems when ordering from the likes of CH. EVERY single mod of a 348 to fire a 458 projectile is being dubbed the 450 AK and causing folk(LIKE ME) a whalin pile uh heart ache..........ONE 450 AK body long and short neck. Thats it, thats all . Dont add what aint there:killingpc

[6pt-sika]

6 point, I shot a few rounds from a .450 Akaskan M 71 about forty years ago and remember it kicked like a blue nosed mule !

Hmmm , I take it this thing might be just a slight bit large for SQUIRRELS :bigsmyl2:

Truthfully , when I saw it on leverguns I thought it looked pretty nice . And I have wanted a 50AK for awhile now .

But I figured I couldn't turn this down !

As I have little more then what I would pay for a "good Used" Marlin 1895 in 45-70 .

Granted if I ever want or need to get rid of this thing it will probably be hard to move . But that never really bothered me about any of the others I have :-D

[lar45]

As I have little more then what I would pay for a "good Used" Marlin 1895 in 45-70 .

Granted if I ever want or need to get rid of this thing it will probably be hard to move . But that never really bothered me about any of the others I have :-D

Sounds like a great deal and I doubt you would have problems selling it if you wanted. There are many of us out there that are smitten with the Magnum Bug.

If the chamber is not what you expected, you could always get a new 45-70 barrel from Nuemrich for $44 and have it rechambered and installed. If you looked around, you might luck into one from a guide gun that was ported already.

[6pt-sika]

If the chamber is not what you expected, you could always get a new 45-70 barrel from Nuemrich for $44 and have it rechambered and installed. If you looked around, you might luck into one from a guide gun that was ported already.

Hmmmm , I wonder if I could have it converted into a change barrel rifle . Have a 450 Alaskan barrel and a 50 Alaskan barrel [smilie=1:

[frank505]

I have a 450 built on a 71 reciever. It has killed several elk but no bears yet. It is an interesting cartridge with a 405 grain at 2100. Yes it does kick but it nots too bad, my rifle has a restock and is long enough for me. I use Elmer Keiths load of 63 grains of 3031, which is about all I can get in the case. I tried the 300 gr Nosler Partition on elk, was not impressed and neither were the elk. I just shoot the 405 bullet now, maybe will try thr 500 grain FCBS mold one day if I can find one. DO NOT use any round nose cast, ask Kent Lomont about magazine detonation or look at his left hand. He was shooting a 500 grain HARD cast round nose with 60 grains of 3031when it went. His Dad chewed on me about lever guns until he passed. Flat point is the only way to go.

[frank505]

I just chrono'ed 63 of 3031 witha 405 gas check MM, it does 2042 and 63 grains of Data 74 does 2055. No more room for 3031 but some for 74. After the 5th or 6th and maybe some toothy bears on the Beartooths I will add some more 74. Not really sure if more velocity will do anything good. Shooting at a golf ball at one hundred yards yestreday, I didn't hit but moved it twice in three shots.

[charger 1]

I just chrono'ed 63 of 3031 witha 405 gas check MM, it does 2042 and 63 grains of Data 74 does 2055. No more room for 3031 but some for 74. After the 5th or 6th and maybe some toothy bears on the Beartooths I will add some more 74. Not really sure if more velocity will do anything good. Shooting at a golf ball at one hundred yards yestreday, I didn't hit but moved it twice in three shots.

Get yourself 71 grains of H4895 in there. That'll light her up to about 2300. Yeehaa and the bed broke type uh fun

[frank505]

All I have is IMR 4895, like a twenty pound keg, what is the difference?

[charger 1]

All I have is IMR 4895, like a twenty pound keg, what is the difference?


Between 71 grains and a 20 pound keg? I'd have to get out my calculater but off hand I'd say 19 pounds 6,929 grains difference.

Can you's all just imagine after readin that response. Just think, two bass akwards on deck. Theres tonights nightmare for ya's

[6pt-sika]

Here's a picture of the two bullets that will first be tried in the 450 Alaskan [smilie=1:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/DSCN0207.jpg


They have both performed very well in my Marlin 1895CB [smilie=1:

So I am hoping they will do well in a 1978 vintage "New Model Marlin 1895" and this 450 Alaskan .

[6pt-sika]

If I find the 450 Alaskan doesn't like cast , I suppose between the 300 grain Nosler Partition , Sierra HP , Hornady HP and Barnes "Original" I will find one suitable for hunting purposes :drinks:

After all I'm not really gonna be using this one for what the cartridge is intended [smilie=1:

[charger 1]

Here's a picture of the two bullets that will first be tried in the 450 Alaskan [smilie=1:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/DSCN0207.jpg


They have both performed very well in my Marlin 1895CB [smilie=1:

So I am hoping they will do well in a 1978 vintage "New Model Marlin 1895" and this 450 Alaskan .


Your CB cartridge doesnt have a neck though does it?

[frank505]

I tried the 300 Nosler at 2593 fps with VV 130 powder some years ago. The elk were not very impressed when hit, so I have gone back to cast and more weight. The saeco 017 has killed 13 elk and over 30 deer with two things constant, 2 to 3 inch wound channels and no bullets recovered. It is a very accurate bullet also. I am leaning toward a 375 grain or 405 grain bullet because of the big bears here. The Handloader article by John Kronfeld on the 450 AK stated he trimmed to 2.145(?) but gave no reason for such a short length. I do not trim mine so maybe I have the longer neck chamber. My case length is 2.156 after fireforming and many shots, no stretching unless I load some high pressure stuff. Th ecase necks iron out very nicely after firing so I very much doubt I am running into the end of the chamber.

[charger 1]

If I find the 450 Alaskan doesn't like cast , I suppose between the 300 grain Nosler Partition , Sierra HP , Hornady HP and Barnes "Original" I will find one suitable for hunting purposes :drinks:

After all I'm not really gonna be using this one for what the cartridge is intended [smilie=1:


If you dont go cast mine likes hornady 350 RN's and H4198

[6pt-sika]

If the chamber is not what you expected, you could always get a new 45-70 barrel from Nuemrich for $44 and have it rechambered and installed. If you looked around, you might luck into one from a guide gun that was ported already.


It just so happens I have a un ported NIB 1895G that I am planning on having rebarreled into 50 Alaskan .

I could always have this barrel rechambered and fitted onto my original 450 Alaskan . Should I have trouble getting dies .

[Bullshop]

6pt-sika
If you are having trouble finding dies for the 50 AK you may be able to get by with a set of Lyman 50/70 dies. They are very reasonably priced at about $30.00. I have been using them for quite some time and have used them with sevaral differant rifles so chambered. I use reformed 348 Win brass which is thinner at the mouth than the Star line brass so dont know how they would work with Starline. I was blessed with a gift long ago of a set of RCBS dies in 50/110 and they work also. However the 50/110 dies are a bit too long at 2.4" to apply any crimp to the 50 Ak case at 2.2". The Lyman 50/70 dies being at 1.75" will crimp the AK case nicely if backed off the shell holder a bit.
BIC/BS

[45 2.1]

It just so happens I have a un ported NIB 1895G that I am planning on having rebarreled into 50 Alaskan .

I could always have this barrel rechambered and fitted onto my original 450 Alaskan . Should I have trouble getting dies .

There is a 50 Alaskan on a Marlin sitting in a gunshop in Woodruff, WI. right now if your interested. The name of the place is the Hunters Headquarters.

[rockrat]

6pt-sika

There is a guy here locally that converts 1895 Marlins to 50AK for about $300. He has them rebored and then chambers the gun and lightly reworks the port. If you are interested, email me and I will see if I can find his address and phone number.

[charger 1]

wild west guns sells lee 50 ak with the factory crimp included for $75

[6pt-sika]

6pt-sika
If you are having trouble finding dies for the 50 AK you may be able to get by with a set of Lyman 50/70 dies.

Hornady supposedly makes 50AK dies for about $50 a set !

That is what I have been planning on using .

I "had" planned on getting CH4D dies for the 450 AK , but based on what you guys are saying , I suppose I will splurge and get the RCBS set . Thought I had a set of used RCBS lined up , but the guy never emailed me back :(

[6pt-sika]

There is a 50 Alaskan on a Marlin sitting in a gunshop in Woodruff, WI. right now if your interested. The name of the place is the Hunters Headquarters.


Thanks :-D

I think I will see if I can locate there phone number and then see if they can email me some pics [smilie=1:

[6pt-sika]

6pt-sika

There is a guy here locally that converts 1895 Marlins to 50AK for about $300. He has them rebored and then chambers the gun and lightly reworks the port. If you are interested, email me and I will see if I can find his address and phone number.


Thanks for the offer ! I wanna first see what the gun shop in WI has to offer . Then I can go from there !

[6pt-sika]

wild west guns sells lee 50 ak with the factory crimp included for $75

Thanks for the info Charger !

I don't really like Lee reloading dies , but if push comes to shove that doesn't sound like to bad of a deal [smilie=1:

[6pt-sika]

There is a 50 Alaskan on a Marlin sitting in a gunshop in Woodruff, WI. right now if your interested. The name of the place is the Hunters Headquarters.

45 2.1 , I contacted the Hunters Headquarters today . The owner sounds like a pretty nice guy ! Anyway he says McGowan built or rebarreled the rifle and the gun has only been test fired .

It's also a consignment gun , He is going to e me some pics in the next couple days . So we shall see how it goes [smilie=1:

Thanks again for the heads up !

[45 2.1]

45 2.1 , I contacted the Hunters Headquarters today . The owner sounds like a pretty nice guy ! Anyway he says McGowan built or rebarreled the rifle and the gun has only been test fired .

It's also a consignment gun , He is going to e me some pics in the next couple days . So we shall see how it goes [smilie=1:

Thanks again for the heads up !

I never picked it up, but in the rack about 1-1/2 foot away it was a very good looker, pricey also. Good Luck.....

[6pt-sika]

I never picked it up, but in the rack about 1-1/2 foot away it was a very good looker, pricey also. Good Luck.....

Thanks !

Now you know if I purchase this thing I'll need three or four good gas check moulds . [smilie=1:

[6pt-sika]

Well the Marlin 1895 , 450 Alaskan is in my hands now !

Took me a bit to pay the gentleman off that I got it from .

And then FEDEX took 11 days to get from eastern NC to central VA . They took the scenic route thru VA to MD and then to PHOENIX and back to MD then to central VA !!!!!!

But I have finally laid my hands on it and the Marlin 336-44 that ended up coming with !

Whoever did the rechambering etc seems to have done a decent job , although the proof will be on the paper when I shoot some targets [smilie=1:

Will try and get some pics up in the next couple weeks !

[6pt-sika]

A couple pictures of my Marlin 1895 that has been rechambered to 450 Alaskan [smilie=1:

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/DSCN0343.jpg

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/DSCN0340.jpg

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f316/6pt-sika/DSCN0349.jpg

[charger 1]

I'm guessing that by the way that looks like a different barrel that the builder also rethreaded the receiver? One does not,NOT want a 1895 marlin thats merely had a chamber reamer stuck into a 45/70 pipe. If the receiver hasnt had a thread reduction/convertion from square to V they got a nasty of blowin barrels off. Maybe ask the former owner where it was done then find out how that shop does em...99% of em know to redo the receiver but I'd hate to see ya sittin on one from a fool

[6pt-sika]

It's a factory barrel that was rechambered !

[6pt-sika]

If the receiver hasnt had a thread reduction/convertion from square to V they got a nasty of blowin barrels off.

You have it backwards ! All the 1895's are V threaded except the 450 Marlin which is square threaded . The square threads are also what they went to on the new 308 Marlin Express !
The square or full threads are supposed to handle more pressure then the V threads !

[charger 1]

You have it backwards ! All the 1895's are V threaded except the 450 Marlin which is square threaded . The square threads are also what they went to on the new 308 Marlin Express !
The square or full threads are supposed to handle more pressure then the V threads !

SO you have a stock 45/70 with a 450 chamber?

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