Newbie who wants to learn how to Swage here

[warthog]

How does a guy without a shop who can't weld get into swaging?

I have a hydraulic press that I have used to build many AKs and I've made some rockets and other fireworks with it just fine so I know it smashes things well. I just don't know where to start. I've cast bullets for a long time but I am well aware this is different. I have no idea what to do or where to start. No doubt Google will help me but I thought I could cut down on time searching and go right tot he experts and ask them. So, if you could help a noob out with places to start, maybe an idea of what this will wind up costing me, I can at least start saving my duckets if nothing else.

Calibers I would be wanting to try this for are .44, .45, .327 Fed Mag (thinking to make jacketed bullets for this one most) then for long range precision shooting I thought this would add a new dimension and perhaps a new touch of whatever to my endeavors to put bullets through the same hole at 1000 yards (still need a lot of work BTW) for .223 & .308 which are the two calibers I own rifles for this sort of thing for now.

Thanks for any ideas or help you give me.

PS: I know I'm new and all but could someone refer me to where or who it is that hands out those life membership badges under your name? I have been what my signature says for quite some time now. I am new here, not new to fighting for my Second Amendment Rights.

[DukeInFlorida]

1) You don't have to do any machining or welding to get into swaging. Very few of us have that equipment and abilities.
2) You get what you need by having deep pockets, and purchasing equipment and dies from those who do have the machining abilities, and have the experience to make the tools correctly.
3) Swaging is NOT CHEAP. For everything you need to do those calibers (presuming that you will buy everything you need), plan on spending about $2,000 total. THat includes some casting equipment to make cores, etc.
4) The hydraulic press that you have is of NO USE in swaging. Maybe for extruding rifle core wire, but not for any of the forming process.
5) While I appreciate your direct approach (which is apparently, "Why read everything, I'll just ask"), you're cheating YOURSELF by not reading. If I were you, and really interested in swaging and saving money, and becoming as much of an expert as you could................ Go back to the very first post in this Swaging area, and start reading. There's a few weeks of readying there. Your eyes will spin. BUT............ you will see the process from every angle. It will answer questions that you don't currently even know are questions. If will save a LOT of us un-necessary typing time, since virtually everything that you are asking for.... have been answered at least a dozen times previously.
6) Edit your profile, and you MIGHT see a link for the various badges we get to wear. However, that requires a paid membership here at castboolits. I would refer you to:
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/cmps_index.php?page=donations

[Case Stuffer]

His hydry/ press could perhaps be useful. I have not seen it are read a description of it but many,Star Lub,Sizers are hydro. powered as are some progressive pressesm,some commerocial metal jackets bullets such as FMJ,JHP,Spotzer BT, SWC, in sizes from .22 to .50Cal .

I designed and built many hydraulic and pumatic powdered jigs,fixtures machines as well as one driven by sprockets and chains sprockets or belts and pulleys.

[JRLesan]

When I got interested in swaging back in the early '90's, I found Dave Corbin's books to be a wealth of information. Most of his info is now available on his website and a lot of time can be saved by going directly there and reading and absorbing information. Expensive is a relative term and I would guess you could get started for a grand or so in one caliber with quality equipment if you first study the process and purchase wisely.

[Randy C]

You can also go to YouTube and type in bullet swaging. There are commercial presses you can buy or some use there RCBS or LEE reloading press. The old RCBS presses are stronger they say on here. The bullet swaging industry is as hard to buy from as trying to buy primers everybody is back logged. I ordered a press and dies from RCE Richard Corbin but he is like everybody else they can’t keep up and he is a one man shop I have been told. I was told he has been spending a lot of time at the hospital with family that is in there.

[IllinoisCoyoteHunter]

I am a newbie too and have been surfing the swaging forum for the past couple weeks. I use the search function on the top right of the page to try to find answers that may have already been asked. Good luck and welcome to the forum!

[warthog]

Well, deep pockets I lack. But I am a patient man who is willing to do things one step at a time. What I meant about not doing the searches was that I might be able to cut to the chase, not that I don't want to read up on the topic. In fact I love to read and especially love to read up on something I want to learn. I will Google some info and I have been reading here for some time now, notice the join date verses how few posts. I don't feel like I have much to add yet so I am reading as much as I can here first since this is the first place I found group of serious swagers.

Thanks for the information and if anyone else wants to throw me any more, I am ready to learn.

Thanks, looks like I found the badges too. :)

[warthog]

Wait a minute, I can use my Lee Classic Cast Press to swage? Maybe I am at least part way started on the equipment then. :grin:

ONWARD AND UPWARD! Maybe I can find some e-books to add to the ole Kindle on this too. Time to search there and also on any place with PDF's that I tend load on to the KF for reading. Bad eyes from too much reading in poor light all my life so the Kindle has made it a lot nicer to read for me and me a lot happier because I love to read.

Back to my research and thanks again! :coffeecom

[runfiverun]

it takes a while to digest everything here, and to learn to navigate the sight efficiently.
http://www.google.com/cse/home?cx=001951264366462437169:ggn3vg-bjum
this will help you search around here better.
like duke mentioned cost is ,,,,,well, it ain't cheap.
for the thousand yard shooting stuff, you would be looking at a grand for just a point form die.

[Lizard333]

If you go to RCE's swaging site, he has a wealth of information there as well. Yes you can use your lee press, will you probably end up modifying it, yes. Will a dedicated swaging work better, YES. IMO, keep reloading with a reloading press and save up and get a swaging press for swaging. Buy once, and you'll be glad you did. Take your time and read, read some more, and then when you think your done and know what your doing, read some more. It took me 6 months before I dropped the coin on my RCE press and first set of dies. 1400$ later I made my first 224 bullet. That first bullet was 1400$. The rest were practically free.

If something confuses you, please ask. We are not all grumpy like Duke, but he is a wealth of information, and very helpful. Don't be afraid to ask!

Welcome aboard!

[warthog]

Thanks for the help, I am sure some google work will get me to the site's mentioned.

I asked about the press as a way of maybe starting until I get to a point where the money breeds and has enough babies to afford my next step and so on until I get to a point where I am ready to take out a second mortgage and get serious. I started reloading with one, single stage press then moved on until I had a number of dedicated use presses so I didn't need tear things down to do this or that only to put it all back together to finish. I did the same and am still doing this with casting. While I have been at that for a while I am not anywhere as serious as what I am reading here so more reading etc there too. Swaging is something I've thought about doing for more than 35ish years now, since I was starting first learned you were allowed to make your own ammo etc which before then I assumed was not legal since it seemed to me to be full of "danger". We all grow up and as I did I became a firearm nut case and wanted to make my own everything, can you make cases at home too or is that ridiculous and not worth the money and trouble? I know enough chemistry to make a workable primer. safe enough to load even, out of the spent ones but then I don't as that does strike me as ridiculous... for now at least.

sorry, guess I got carried away... more to read and more to look for to read as well. :coffeecom

[runfiverun]

that link I gave is a custom one set up for THIS sight.

[Utah Shooter]

I cannot wait to see the photo you post of your smile after you make your first projectile that you have shot. PRICELESS!


Looks like the guys here are heading you in the right direction.

[SquirrelHollow]

Don't let these guys convince you that the ONLY way to swage is with expensive equipment. It is the BEST way, but there are alternatives that can be explored, if you are not after absolute precision with the end product. (Our you just want to try your hand at the basic process.)

I, for example, swage .44 caliber bullets for several .44 Mags and a .444 Marlin... with a Rock Chucker press, a 7x57mm sizing die, and a Lee bottom punch (from a bullet sizer). I use cast lead cores and .40 S&W cases.
You can read more and see a few photos here: My .44 bullets from .40 S&W (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?144113-My-44s-from-40-S-amp-W)
So far, they've been just as good to me as commercial bullets (Remington, Sierra, and Hornady), but I'm only paying about 3.5 cents apiece for them.

My equipment cost was $5 for the Bair Cub die set, $18 for the Lee bullet sizer (also used to size the swaged bullets), $18 apiece for the two molds I use for cores, and $9 for the N-size drill rod I use to eject the bullets, for a grand total of .... $68. ;-) If you eliminate one of those core molds (I rarely use the 175 gr), and the drill rod (it was left over from another project)... the total start-up cost comes out to $41.

Everything else I use in the process is a tool or consumable I use for general reloading tasks (and already had), or was just something I keep on hand in my garage (like the turkey fryer, propane, and flux).

Last October, I took an Elk with 2 of those bullets, and they performed beautifully. (One was fatal. The second was insurance.)
You can read more here: .40 S&W .444 Reloads - Page 4 (http://www.marlinowners.com/forum/reloading/85261-frankenmausers-40-s-w-444-reloads-4.html) (You may have to be a member to view the images. I'm not sure.)

A bullet swaged with a $1,200 die set, on a $400+ press will probably always be more consistent than my bullets. But, they're good enough for me, and just as consistent as the commercial bullets I've tested. (Much tougher than the Sierra and Remington offerings, and roughly on-par with the Hornady 265 gr Interlock FP.)


Of course, there are options for applying the same "Redneck" concept to .45 caliber, as well.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=41068&stc=1&d=1329624932

[BT Sniper]

I cannot wait to see the photo you post of your smile after you make your first projectile that you have shot. PRICELESS!


Looks like the guys here are heading you in the right direction.


I haven't read threw the entire thread yet but this comment couldn't be more true! Or maybe the smile on your face with the first perfect bulelt you make out of the press.

You can't go wrong no matter which route you take. Being able to make your own will always be better then the latest allternitive everyone else is dealing with in trying to find ammo or bullets.

Good shooting and swage on!

BT

[warthog]

I have some of the stuff you list in your thread already SquirrelHollow. So maybe this is closer than I think it is already, at least some of the handgun swaging.

Once I get the hang of things, have more time to save and etc, I am always looking to upgrade until I reach tat point were it just feels right for me & my purposes. Any sort of precision swage boolit for long range hooting is just that, long range... a goal to reach eventually until I set a higher one. So when I am ready to go, I plan on taking this one thing at a time.

Is there say, a relative "easiness scale" here? Like are say .45 cal boolits esaier starter than maybe a .38/357 or a .32 cal?

You can be sure I will capture that face for you when the fist usable projectile occurs, maybe throw in a few OMGWTH pix as I move in that direction too for your amusement.

[SquirrelHollow]

Is there say, a relative "easiness scale" here? Like are say .45 cal boolits esaier starter than maybe a .38/357 or a .32 cal?


It's about as easy as it gets with BT Sniper's .45 cal (or .44 cal) "One Step" die and .40 S&W cases.
A 'redneck' setup for .45 cal handgun bullets should be possible with just about any sizing die from the .308 Winchester family (.243 Win, 7mm-08, 6.5-08, .308 Win, etc.).

I haven't yet found a good 'redneck' setup for .35 or .32 cal. (And I could really use a .32 cal setup - I have several .32 rifles and revolvers to feed.)