SR1911 last round feed failure

[prs]

Out of 100 rounds at 7 per magazine I had three instances where the last round out of the magazine failed to feed, the live round trapped vertically in the action. I am a bit new to 1911s, but have seen this mentioned before. Are my mag springs getting weak, or my load too wimpy, or.....?

WW LP, Starline, 5gr Unique, Lee 452-230-TC, OAL set using barrel as gauge for max length with good "plunk" test.

Have shot several thousands of these over the past several months, but today was first such incident of this.

prs

[CJR]

prs,

Last round problems, like your "stovepipe" failure, tend to be caused by a weak mag spring. What happens is the spring becomes weak and the recoil causes the follower to depress slightly and release the last round before the slide can feed the round forward. When the slide does contact the round, it is already standing-up. Get some heavier springs. Likewise, truncated cone bullets need to have shorter OAL to feed properly.

Best regards,

CJR

[prs]

Thanks, CJR. If I seat that particular boolit much deeper, my taper crimp will be close to or even on the truncate area, but I will investigate.

I have had an occasional "stove pipe" with this pistol, very seldom, but always before with an empty case not fully ejecting. I simply wipe that away with a swipe of my free hand. Those cases are often found to be mashed severely enough to be creased beyond usable state.

That brings up a variable I failed to recognize at first, I shoot single handed with either hand. I hope I am not losing strength to the point of "limp wristing"! I don't EVEN like the sound of that. I will shoot another 100 today paying attention to grip strength.

But why was it just the last rnd of a mag?

prs

[Silver Jack Hammer]

To see if you are limp wristing, intentionally limp wrist and see if you can duplicate the same type of malfunction.

I had malfunctions with the last round in my 1911 after years of reliability; a call to Wilson Combat confirmed weak mag springs. They sent me new mag spring and a new recoil spring. Problem solved. I have 3 Colt 1911 and use Wilson Combat mags. However I was not getting a stovepipe malfunction. But your malfunction is with a loaded cartridge on the last round of the mag so I'd change the springs first. Spring changes are standard maintenance and cheap. I heard an instructor for Glock and 1911 lover said one of John Browning’s grandsons told him: Grandpa always said to change the springs.

Our local 1911 guru says to throw away the factory springs early. He also says to toss the factory mags. I’ve heard him recommend Wilson Combat 7 round mags, he says never use 8 round mags. Lately he has recommended Metalform mags.

Try Wolff or Wilson Combat springs. Wolff used to be the only way to go but their quality lately has gone the way of everything else.

[Dan Cash]

A number of things contribute to your last round event; alloy frame allowing greater movement under recoil, modern short lipped magazines, and weak springs. U.S. issue magazines with longer lips will eliminate the problem but they do not come in 8 round versions and are not a "cool" stainless.

[CJR]

prs,

Re: "empty case not ejecting". When you field strip this piece, where are the impact marks on the barrel? Are the marks on the back-side of the under barrel lugs (i.e. vertical impact surface)? Or, are they on the underside of the chamber where the barrel hits the horizontal trough (i.e. where lugs fit into the frame)? It makes a difference what impact area is being hit.

Best regards,

CJR

[gray wolf]

Out of 100 rounds at 7 per magazine I had three instances where the last round out of the magazine failed to feed,
If it's not fixed with springs or new mags ( I disagree with this anyway )
Check your extractor tension, The last round is not supported as well as when there are rounds pushing up. The extractor grabs the last round and it can fall a little bit messing up how it presents to the feed ramp, or it can even loose it's purchase on the round Checking the extractor is easy and painless, so is the fix.
I use 6 or 7 old give me mags, 2 original springer mags, and a couple that I have no idea what they are, also they have different followers, spring have never been replaced, 6 years and thousands + of rounds. they work every time, with HP.s flat points, SWC and round nose.
Flying ash trays and 230 grain gold dots. People need to know the extractor does more than grab a case from the chamber. I know, many folks do, but some don't.

[35remington]

Replacing a standard 7 round magazine.....that is, similar to the original style, seven shot flush fit with a Wilson seven shot won't gain you anything in spring strength. Wilson springs, even Wilson seven shot springs, have nothing in spring strength over what you could be using. They are, in fact, of lower poundage.

Replace the factory 7 round magazine spring with a Wolff +10% seven round magazine spring. If that's what you have.

Which magazine type, exactly, is this magazine? Seven shot or eight shot? Smooth follower or dimpled? Tapered magazine lips or straight? These things matter. The correct answer depends upon your response, so we need more information.

Just for grins, also up your load 0.5 grain and see if the slide is short stroking and not allowing the round to fully rise before it goes forward. This mimics a weak spring spring, but the real cause is insufficient slide travel. The round stands straight up because the breechface hits it in the extractor groove rather than the rim, causing what is called a live round stovepipe. Yes, the magazine spring being weak causes this too, but so does this.

Whether the slide reaches full travel or not depends upon load strength and recoil spring weight.

[35remington]

It happens on the last round because spring tension in the magazine is least then. Be sure to look into the other things as well; if you really want to know the cause change only one thing at a time and test.

The prescription for reliability for a 1911 using flush fit magazines is seven shot capacity, a full rear skirt or skirted front follower, good magazine spring strength, a small radius firing pin stop and not overspringing the gun's recoil spring because you heard it was a "good idea." Heavier recoil spring strength is a downside to 1911 reliability and there are better ways to get there from here than that. Which is why the small radius stop is the better solution.

Since the slide really doesn't hit the frame all that hard with 230 grain standard or even heavy loads (yes, folks, the slide hits the frame at only 17 to 20 mph depending upon the load) overspringing the slide return with a heavy spring is not a good thing, and increases the tendency of the slide to outrun the magazine.

John Browning's OEM magazine design feeds the gun the way it was designed to be fed. Most other designs, including nearly all the "brand name" ones, do not. This is generally overlooked for some odd reason by most 1911 users.

[Frank46]

I had this problem with one of my 1911's. The magazines were unmarked 7 rounders. First thought that the springs were the problem. So took a couple out of my chip McCormik mags to see if that did any good. Nope. What you have to think about is that when the last round is fired two things happen. Case leaves the mag and the
lip of the follower hits the slide stop, locking the slide back. Went through the unmarked mags and any that did not lock the slide back had the little tap adjusted upward a slight amount. That solved the problem on most of the mags. Got an ed brown oversized firing pin stop and all was well. I checked out the underside of the old slide stop and it was badly chewed up from the follower hitting it. Cured the last round problem I normally run an 18#spring as mostly shoot the 230 grain hard cast round nosed bullets. Frank

[prs]

WOW! Thanks folks! That gives me a lot to consider. I will go one step at a time. The same thing occurred twice in that second 100 round batch, both strong handed, both last round with live round stuck in action in vertical orientation. Both from fairly new Chip McCormick 7 round mags. My first step, check the gun for signs where the rounds may have been slamming the chamber entrance or slide.

Will report soon.

prs

[prs]

The gun seems to show no sign of the problem. Stripped it down, all is well. The magazines that I noted during the failures were not Chip McCormick, they are MecGar 7 rounders. I will try some of the other ideas when I can. Weather turning nasty again for short time.

prs

[ColColt]

Interested if a fix was ever accomplished? There are better mags than MecGar's...Tripp or Checkmate would be the choice in 7 round capacity with either hybrid or USGI lips.

[Clay M]

WOW! Thanks folks! That gives me a lot to consider. I will go one step at a time. The same thing occurred twice in that second 100 round batch, both strong handed, both last round with live round stuck in action in vertical orientation. Both from fairly new Chip McCormick 7 round mags. My first step, check the gun for signs where the rounds may have been slamming the chamber entrance or slide.

Will report soon.

prs

I had failures to feed the last round in my Kimber Ultra Carry.I found it to be the MecGar mags.I replaced them with Kimber mags,and the problem went away.On examination the MecGar uses a different follower.

[Abenaki]

Sounds like mag springs to me.

Can you try different mags?

Also......when was the last time you cleaned your mags?

Take care
Abenaki

[imsoooted]

i'm glad I saw this thread. I recently bought 2 kimber tac pro 8 rounders for my kimber eclipse. the old mags were still working fine, but I startedshooting action pistol at my club and wanted bumper pads on the mags for drop protection. took them to the range and guess what?
last round ftf every time. not stove piped, but the fired round is still in the extractor while the last round gets picked up from the mag. run an old mag, perfect. same recipe as always with a 200g mihec swc over 4.9g of 231 OAL 1.250

[35remington]

Many 8 round flush fit magazines have two problems:

Subpar spring strength in some instance.

Crappy Devel type (short rear skirt) followers.

Beware. If JMB thought 8 rounds in flush fit was a good idea, he would have done it. Now you know why he did not. It wasn't a good idea.