Need help with Lead Shot Dripper

[ryan777s]

I am currently working on a lead shot dripped as my high-school shop project. If anybody can help me troubleshoot it would be greatly appreciated. I Have been testing it, and whenever the lead drips roll off into the coolant (soapy water) they pop and end up looking like corn flakes. I have tried changing a few things but none seem to help. If anyone has experience with this, I would appreciate the help.

[runfiverun]

it's the water.
you need to go to either full soap or atf or antifreeze.
move the coolant up to within 1/4" of your ramp.

[ryan777s]

Alright ill try that, thanks, I really appreciate the help

[victor3ranger]

How does this actually work, I would be interested in seeing how this is done.

[ryan777s]

[QUOT
E=victor3ranger;2102451]How does this actually work, I would be interested in seeing how this is done.[/QUOTE]

Look up "lead shot dripper" on YouTube, there's a few guys who have made some pretty cool ones. I will post a picture or two of it when I get on the computer because my phone wont let me do it.

[runfiverun]

lead get's hot, and drips from nozzles.
[different sized nozzles give different drip sizes]
it rolls down a ramp.
it falls into liquid.

[Solus]

I thought they turned into corn flakes because the lead was too hot. I have the same problem with mine. I was using antifreeze and it still did it. It started off fine but after a minute or too they got bigger and then corn puffs lol I would like to see your results when you figure it out

[earthling121757]

Ryan, check out the "Casting for Shotguns" forum. Lots of threads there on shot makers.

[ryan777s]

Alright, will do

[ryan777s]

Here's a picture of what I've got so far, still needs some work and some figuring done, but hopefully everything works in the end.
63589

[Agent1187]

Here's an older picture of my shotmaker in action. The coolant tank is a bit too low, and the extra drop was giving me some ugly (though still serviceable) shot. The puffballs are a coolant issue. I personally run straight SUN liquid detergent, but alot of people also use undiluted antifreeze and lightweight oils. I still get puffballs, but it's down to maybe a handfull for a hundred pounds.
Looks like you have a great start on your shotmaker. If you have the time and materials, I'd recommend working up a removable coolant tank or mounts for one. I've found that getting the coolant tank parallel to, and within the proper distance of the lip is 90% of my setup time.
63593

[ryan777s]

OK, so I tried it with some heavy duty machining coolant and it no longer pops into cornflakes, now the only problem i have is that the shot has little tails on it. Is this a problem with heat, bib, falling distance, or some other issue? They also like to build up on the bib more often than not, causing it to just pool up, is this because the hot lead is hitting a bib that isn't hot enough and then just sticking to it? Thank you everyone for your time, and for helping me with this project, it means a lot.

[runfiverun]

i used some soap stone on my ramp to help the shot roll down and form a ball.
the short drop really helps capture the ball and cool it.
ww's and shot both have arsenic content because it is a surface tensioner and helps the shot go round.
shot has about double what ww's have.

also try to monitor your alloy temp so you can duplicate everything.
something between 625 and 675 should be close.

[ryan777s]

ok, i will try that when i get a chance. there is no consistency in my runs at the moment because we have just been melting the lead in a non-ferrous furnace and keeping it hot with an oxy-ace torch, which holds zero consistency. I am working on getting some propane burners to mount under it so i can keep a consistent heat. its getting close, hopefully this all helps. thanks again for the help, i will probably be back with more questions sooner than later haha.

[ryan777s]

Also, I've heard of people using chalk on the ramp to help the lead roll down, does anybody know if this would work?

[runfiverun]

chalk might work i use soapstone.

[Agent1187]

I use the "Red Stuff" that came with my shotmaker. Unsure what it is, but smells like a high temperature axle grease?

[ryan777s]

alright, well chalks what I've got for now so I will try that, does anyone else have any input on why the shot would still have tails on it though?

[Shiloh]

I'm impressed that a young shooter is involved in such a project. There is hope!!

Shiloh

[300winmag]

I'm impressed that a young shooter is involved in such a project. There is hope!!

Shiloh
I have to say he is a ambitious young man. Yes, hope. Good work ryan777s.
Keep us posted.

[ryan777s]

thank you very much, I like to shoot a lot but cant really afford all of it right now so I reload for shotshell, handgun, and rifle. I also work on all of my own firearms and have built/extensively worked on a few. I guess I just like making things myself, which would explain why I am a machinist apprentice.

[ryan777s]

On a side note, I actually live less than an hour from Lee Precision and MEC (Mayville Engineering Company) and know a few people who work at MEC.

[leadman]

If you go to the Magma Engineering website and look at the Littleton shotmaker and the instructions for it. Do ignore what they say about All Free & Clear laundry soap though. From what I can see your lip that the shot travels down might be too long and at to severe a down angle. I would use 400 to 600 grit sandpaper from one side to the other on the lip to creat a little rough area fro the lead to catch on and start rolling. The welders' soapstone also helped with this.
The level of the lead in the ladle (that is what Magma calls it) is very important to creating round shot as too much head pressure causes too much lead to drip out and it slides down the lip. Temperature is also important and I kept my clip on wheel-weight alloy about 550 degrees.
The distance to the coolant is also very important and as someone else stated 1/4" is normal. I did hear of a guy that was dropping his several feet but never saw any of his shot.
I had a 9 gallon tank and the laundry detergent would get hot after about #60 of shot was made so a fan might be needed if you want to run alot of alloy.

Nice looking outfit and I hope you get it working well.

[ryan777s]

So do you think I should change the length and angle of the ramp that the shot rolls off of?

[runfiverun]

i'd try roughening it up first so the shot rolls.
you can tune the angle later.

[Cap'n Morgan]

Zinc anti-size paste works great for keeping the shot rolling and not sticking to the ramp.

[fcvan]

I didn't see what type of alloy the OP is using as I am following this and other threads for knowledge. I'd like to make my own shot dropper based upon some ideas learned here. I've seen videos of folks using hand crafted propane burners but would like to try something with an electric heating element. Keep the knowledge flowing!

One more thing, I wish I had all of you inspirational folks around when I was taking metal shop in high school. How cool that this young man is allowed to work on something 'gun related' without the school shutting him down. Look at the kid who chewed his pop tart into a gun shape and got suspended.

[ryan777s]

ya, my shop teacher ok'd it, as for administration, this is on a need to know basis, and they don't need to know. If it got to that point where they wanted to know what it was for, id just tell them its for the trap club, not that anyone in administration would know what a shot dripper would look like anyway.

[leadman]

You could sand the lip and add soapstone and if needed vary the angle by blocking up the front legs just to see if it matters.
I found in my Littleton clip on WW could be made to produce round shot easily but other alloys were hit or miss.
My use of the machine leads me to believe the head pressure in the ladle, alloy temperature and type, and having the lip in the proper condition were most important. Roundness of the shot seems to be controlled by the lip and distance to the coolant. The distance to the coolant will probably vary by what you are using for coolant. I did use ATF and got it to work but since I did this in my garage I did not like how fast it got hot and started smoking.
My coolant tank had adjustable legs to vary the height and to even it out so the ladle was level side to side.

[HDS]

Interesting stuff, so you want a short drop eh, thought you wanted a long as possible drop. I know in gyttorp in sweden they used to make shot in a huge tower where it fell the entire length.

[Cap'n Morgan]

Check out the Bliemeister process for shot making. Apparently the shot ramp are mounted below the surface of the coolant and the shot are formed while rolling submerged. This actually makes good sense as the increased pressure should help forming the shot into a sphere.

http://www.google.com/patents?id=PKBhAAAAEBAJ&pg=PA2&hl=da&source=gbs_selected_pages&cad=2#v=onepage&q&f=false

[ryan777s]

Thanks to everyone who has been posting to try and help, sorry I haven't responded in the last few days, I'm just trying to find some old propane burners for cheap to put on the dripper so that I can keep the temps more consistent.

[runfiverun]

you might wanna look in some back yards.
an old gas BBQ grill might give you what you need for about $0.00 dollars.

[ryan777s]

ya thats kinda what i was thinking, either that or a turkey fryer. my friend might have a few things in his shed so im gonna see what hes got first

[runfiverun]

one more thought I had.
you are cleaning your alloy before hand, and then using clean ingots to make your shot with....right?

[ryan777s]

yes i am

[Sgt Petro]

Good to see you doing this!
A few things that i learned the hard way...

- Fabric softener changed my life. I was about to give up on the whole thing until i bought 2gallons at the local dollar store.

- the surface of the coolant can't be more than .25 - .50 inches away from the edge of the ramp. Made a huge difference in the percentage of rejects.

- The level of molten lead needs to be kept consistent. This keeps the pressure and temp consistent. I actually use an old lee bottom pour to feed my small shot maker.

- Chalk the ramp! I have yet to over chalk it...not sure if you can.

- i did notice your ramp looks long (hard to tell in the pic). Not sure how this will affect things. My ramp is only about an inch long. You really don't need it any longer. You're just causing the hot lead to cool and drag on a surface longer.

These are just my observations. By no means should you stop experimenting!
Good luck!
Feel free to post updates and questions. I encourage it!

[mtgrs737]

I have found that lead temp in the ladle and the coolant temp to be very inportant in making round shot. I use Sun liquid laundry soap and preheat it to 70-80 degrees before I start the dripping of the lead. The speed of heat absorbtion is the key to round shot. If the coolant gets over 120 degrees it is time to stop dripping lead until the temp goes down. Water will cause the lead to cool too fast and it will pop like popcorn. Too slow of cooling and it may form teardrop shapes. I also use a deep colant tank, mine is 22 inches deep with a valve on the bottom and a V shaped sheetmetal funnel to drain the shot and coolant out the bottom. I tried fabric softener and it rusted everything it touched and made poor shot for me so I went back to soap, antifreeze was no good for me either. I use the Red Stuff on my ramp but would like to try spray on graphite from the farm store, they also have powdered graphite in 1 lb. bottles for about $10 which is a lifetime supply for us shotmakers. I apply graphite in a vibratory tumbler, 5 pounds of shot, a pea sized amount of graphite is all you need, run it for up to 1/2 hour to coat and polish the shot. I store my shot in 2 liter pop bottles, each holds about 31 lbs. of shot. I use a 2 gal. plastic bucket from Home Depot with holes drilled in it and a window screen epoxied over them to drain the soap form the shot, then a 5 gallon bucket set up the same way to wash the shot with the hose. I dry the shot in cheap wally world sheet cake pans with a towel in the bottom to suck up the excess water. After about a half hour I remove the towel and let it air dry on the hot summer concrete driveway. For sizing the shot I have sieves I have made from wire cloth purchased from industrial supply companies like Graingers, MSC, and McMaster Carr. I have openings of .088". .090", .093", .097" for sizing shot. I made frames out of 2x4 wood and the 12" squares of wire cloth. PM me if you have any questions I can help you with.

[ryan777s]

Thanks very much to Sgt Petro and mtgrs737 for the input, this info is very valuable to me, as this is my first experience with this type of lead working. I have cast many boolits before, but thats alot different than making shot. i will take into account all of the input here and hopefully i can get my hands on some propane burners soon enough.

thanks again everyone,
-Ryan.

[JSAND]

ryan777s, I have really enjoyed reading about your progress with your shot maker. I hope you get your needed propane burners soon. I have been wanting to try my hand at making one of these for a little while now, and I appreciate the intrest and responses your thread has generated. I believe I will turn this into my next project. Thanks for the inspire and I hope for continued success in your endeavor, keep us posted.

jsand

[grubbylabs]

for those of you who have these lead shot drippers, where are you getting them from or how are you making them, I think I can manage most of it, but I have no idea how you are doing the holes. Are you just drilling holes the size of the shot you want?

[Faret]

Ryan sharpen up the ramp so the shot falls straight off like a cliff. I use a turkey fryer burner under mine and I got 50 # an hour with 6 drippers. I have a new one built with double drippers and 7 holes looking to put out about 110# an hour using the same burner and preheating the lead. Make sure the ramp is at least 3/16 thick I used 1/8 and it does not hold enough heat to keep the shot from sticking to it. I have also used 2 stroke oil on the ramp with good results too. Pics coming when it gets warmer I am just west of ya!

[ryan777s]

Alright, I will try to find some material to make a thicker/shorter ramp out of, im still trying to get propane burners though. thanks again for all the responses

[RonK]

For consistent shot you need to use a coolant that has no water in it. We have tried a lot of things but have found the best consistency to be ATF fluid. Any amount of water will cause the shot to be deformed in various manners. The "tail" your getting is probably from the lead being too hot, the lead is streaming and not running in drops. You need to maintain 635F to 650F as close as possible. Also maintaing a drop distance between the lip of the machine to the surface of the coollant must be 1/4". You also must circulate the coolant to keep it from getting too hot itself. Coolant temperature much over 140F causes strange things to begin to happen too.
Order some RED STUFF from James Stewart to coat the lip with...many things work just OK but RED STUFF is the best.

[heathydee]

I am currently working on a lead shot dripped as my high-school shop project. If anybody can help me troubleshoot it would be greatly appreciated. I Have been testing it, and whenever the lead drips roll off into the coolant (soapy water) they pop and end up looking like corn flakes. I have tried changing a few things but none seem to help. If anyone has experience with this, I would appreciate the help.

Pellets which burst into a furry blob are caused by using the wrong coolant . I use a soluble oil/water mix which works well until it gets up to around 180 degrees F.
Look in the Casting for Shotguns forum for the thread entitled "Gonna Build a Shotmaker"

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?208460-Ultimate-home-shotmaker

Water can be used as a coolant but it has to be pre-heated to about 190 degrees F . My thread "The Ultimate Home Shotmaker" again in the Casting for Shotguns forum describes using water as a coolant .