Please tell me this too shall pass...

[2HighSpeed]

So as many of you know, my little guy was in a neuro-psych center for a good many months. Well he came home Feb 8. The first 2 weeks.... Amazing. Since then.... A nightmare. He was supposed to go to "step down treatment" right after discharge, however they had no room for him. On Friday he starts "partial day treatment" at a behavior unit/psych facility because he can't get himself under control. He is back to being violent to our pets, kicked my shih-tzu down the stairs 3 days ago an injured the dogs leg, picked the Chiuahua up by her neck as threw her, pulled the yellow labs tail and ears so hard she cried, threatened to run away, told his teacher "I'm done with this sh*t" when he was in speech therapy, ran out of his classroom and out if the school, is very defiant to me one minute the next hes all cuddly and loves me. Has started hoarding and stealing food from the cupboards again, no idea why because the boys have full access to 2 cupboard shelves full of snacks they have free roam
Too. Just ahhhh I don't get it. If partial fails, he will end up being admitted again, the 2nd time around it won't just be 3 1/2 months, it will be a minimum of 6 months. I just don't know what to do to help him understand he needs to get his behaviors under control.

[xs11jack]

My heart goes out to you, I don't know what to say, except that we are praying over your family.
Jack

[DLCTEX]

Praying for a miracle for your family!

[Edubya]

Had one like that in '81 (a 12 year old). I put him in a private institution and he hated it for a year or so. After he graduated he was still a stallion but he came to me and said; "Thanks, Dad, I would have killed somebody had I not gone in there." I felt that his mother wanted to always treat him as the baby that she had to deal with and I was opposed to treating him as a baby. I would bust his butt for sassing me or his mother. She would tell him that he could do something that I had forbade when I was gone. He needed standards without the goal posts being constantly moved by the two adults in his life. They were pretty strict on him, almost a boot camp atmosphere. He came out and was in excellent physical condition and much better self control. Yes, it was hard on the parents but I was proud of him for the self discipline that he had developed. I only had to kick his butt occasionally and it was more with a stern talking and not physical after that.

Best of Luck, and commitment from both parents.

EW

[2HighSpeed]

See the problem here, I am "stepmom", I so hate that term. But it's the truth. We almost have enough saved so I can adopt him and his brother. His birth mom did drugs while pregnant, beat him till he was bloody with belts, sticks, window blind switches, kitchen spoons and even a few times the table lamp. So we don't do any physical punishment, it sends him into this trance where he is cowering yelling "please don't kill me" and that is just beyond anything I can fathom. He lived a nightmare, in every aspect untill he was 3 1/2, he is 5 1/2 now. He does have moderate brain damage from the birth moms drugs abuse when she was pregnant with him


QUOTE=Edubya;2097430]Had one like that in '81 (a 12 year old). I put him in a private institution and he hated it for a year or so. After he graduated he was still a stallion but he came to me and said; "Thanks, Dad, I would have killed somebody had I not gone in there." I felt that his mother wanted to always treat him as the baby that she had to deal with and I was opposed to treating him as a baby. I would bust his butt for sassing me or his mother. She would tell him that he could do something that I had forbade when I was gone. He needed standards without the goal posts being constantly moved by the two adults in his life. They were pretty strict on him, almost a boot camp atmosphere. He came out and was in excellent physical condition and much better self control. Yes, it was hard on the parents but I was proud of him for the self discipline that he had developed. I only had to kick his butt occasionally and it was more with a stern talking and not physical after that.

Best of Luck, and commitment from both parents.

EW[/QUOTE]

[Randy C]

Yes Praying for a miracle for your family!

[2HighSpeed]

Thank you guys for the prayers, we need them. I feel like we or the doctors are missing some piece of the puzzle that makes this little guy whole... But what?!?!?!

[runfiverun]

andrea i bet he responds to his father a lot differently.
you are actually dealing with two separate situations [the food thing is from the mother issues too and also from his medication]
the other is a different matter [bi-polar manic schizophrenia] hoarding and misplacing things is a classic symptom.
give him a place in the front room for "his stuff" it shows that it is his house too.
[to him] just a spot for a couple of his toy's.
direct and enforce the rules towards the other kids, this let's him know what's expected without being singled out.
once he makes the connection that he is being helped by you,his teachers,etc but has definate boundary's then things go a lot easier.

[Olevern]

No easy answers here. I'm thinking that perhaps the meds still need tweeking. For sure the boy needs very structured environment. Also, boy needs to know that, because of his treatment of the animals, he is not to be within arms reach of them without asking permission and having an adult supervising. Empathy awareness/training indicated. Prayers going up.

[Wayne Smith]

I'll second what Vern and five are saying. Structure is important, sense of ownership is important for one with his history, but the meds are not effective. Maybe his body is synthesizing them or rejecting them or adjusted to them. Remember that children's bodies change quickly. The MD should be re-evaluating him monthly in my opinion.

[shdwlkr]

Andrea
First you are not the "stepmom" get that dammed idea of your head!!!!!!!!! It does affect how you see your relationship to the kids.
Second your kids notice I said your kids need you to understand they have lived hell and are scared they can do something that will make you fit the idea that they have of "mom".
Third physical punishment is bad I know I used to use it but the divorce changed that and my kids are better when with me. Punishment now is tickles and hugs, yes they act up sometimes to just get punished. Also try and stay calm yes I know it is over the top at times but when you slip let them know it is ok to admit you screwed up.
Lastly I am studying to be a mental health counselor so listen carefully, you are at the cross roads of where you have to be something they didn't know and that is a loving, caring and most of all a mom who wants the best for them.
I have a son that hates my guts but we had a rough road and I screwed up didn't have my mental health understanding then so I will always have a sore spot in my mind for what happened and how some of it was my fault and some which he refuses to accept was his.
PM if you want and we can talk more about things to try.
The hoarding of food is typical when they feel unsafe and are scared. The acting out is what they received so they think that is how you act towards other living things.
The loving moments are what you want to build on as they are being themselves then and then the fear kicks in and they resort back to the monster because no one could really love them.
hope this gives you hope and yes I will pray for all of your family and the docs to help them accept it is ok to cry and feel scared, it isn't ok to react in bad ways.

[Reload3006]

My thoughts and prayers go out to you. I have not experienced psychiatric issues with my children but I did experience drug addictions with my eldest son and middle son. I was or I felt I was unable to be as stern a father to them as I needed to be because I had an ex waiting in the wings to move in and get taken care of. Crappy reason I know because if I had it all to do over again I would have been strict and did what was necessary to get them under control no matter the cost because in the end the cost was my eldest sons life. No parent should have to suffer what you are suffering but no parent should have to bury one of his/her children. Then there is the other children in your family that you have to worry about too. Other than a sympathetic ear and moral support and prayers I can offer you nothing. But there is hope while there is life. Do what you feel is necessary with out beating yourself up over the issue. Leave it in Gods hands what will be will be.

[x101airborne]

That is a dang tough spot to be in. I am a step-parent also, but I dont say that often. That is my son. Pure and simple. I treat him the same as I treat my own son. And I show him when my son gets in trouble that he is treated the same. That makes everyone in my house on the same level and both kids respond to it. And I do believe in corporal punishment. There are three rules in my house that will get your butt busted. One swat for backtalking. Two swats for lying and three for stealing. Other than that there are other ways to handle things here. I dont like doing the corporal punishment thing, but as a parent I have to be strong, firm, fair, and honest. That is my responsibility to my kids. And if you look at it like that, it is a little easier to impliment that type of punishment.

And bless you for being honest enough to ask for help. When my son was in the first grade, his mother and I were newly married and it was a tough time. Not only for him, but for us. He was fighting back and I could not help but think that it somehow was because of me. And in a way, it was. Being a military person, I was intense even when I thought I wasn't. And sometimes when I didn't have to be. And that was on me, totally.
We went the route of medication and such. I was against it at first. I thought all he needed was more of a butt bustin and less time with his alcoholic homeless father. Well, that exactly wasn't so. I had to understand that there are things you cannot whup out of a child. Some of it, wether it is right or wrong, you have to take and choose your battles. And that was HARD for me. I thought everything was a battle. That is who I was and what I knew. But I cannot say I never tuned his father up either. He showed up here drunk dropping the kid off one too many times and I had enough. And yes, the Sherriffs Office was called, and yes I answered for it. I got a warning, but he found religion. It was a mess, but now he and I talk often and we let each other know what is going on. Not that that helps you, but sometimes your darkest moment is when the light gets turned on.
God Bless you, I feel your pain. It has been over 5 years now for me and I do not miss the old days. But my struggle passed and so will yours. Be strong. Be there. When one parent is treated different it is because there is a different set of consequences. Both of you need to be on the same page. And yes, my wife had the "you need to back me up" fight a lot. She has never spent so much time on the couch in her life. Even when we went to a marriage counselor she told her, yes I said "her", that I make her sleep on the couch when we fight about her not backing me up. The marriage counselor said "Well,??? Why the hell wont you? It's YOUR kid!" That is when the fight started. Then there was crying. Then understanding and now we are good. But both of you need to be on the same page.
I will pray for you all.

[Hamish]

My heart breaks for your son and your family.

[PULSARNC]

I worked ,for 32 years in a state run inpatient treatment hospital for children such as you are describing .I know first hand how difficult it is to establish a diagnosis and a treatment plan for these kids . It must be a multipart plan including mediacation and behavioral modification .PARENTS must be included in the treatment .families do not exist in a vacum and ALL member have to be included in the planning and treatment .His psychiatrist may have to try many different medication combos until the right mix is found but keep in mind that meds alone are not the answer .It may take longterm treatment to turn him around .You are to be commended for your dedication and love you are showing him .It will be a longhaul but do not give up .Please feel free to pm me if needed

[shooter2]

I never had this kind of a problem and cannot give any advice, but I can pray and will do that. Please keep us posted now and then. S2

[Houndog]

I am certainly NOT the person to be giving advice in a situation like this, but I CAN pray for your Son and the rest of the family for divine guidence! I was a VERY strict parent and if I could go back and have a do over I'd change quite a few things. In fact I get accused of letting the Grandson get away with too much! NEVER loose sight of the fact that getting an abused child to trust, feel loved and have a sense of belonging to the family won't happen overnight! NEVER GIVE UP or give in! GOD bless.

[41 mag fan]

Andrea, I know and understand what you're going thru. My son sounds like a mirror image of yours.
Mine was mean to dolls and toys, not animals though, that I knew of. Actually caught him holding a doll by the throat and had it up against the wall with his hand like a gun to its head. Where he got that from i have no clue, beyond maybe tv.
Our son was a hoarder, and would take things and hide them. He acted out defiantly in school, made up lies that the school knew wasn't true.
You'd tell him not to do something and he would do it regardless of the consequences.
He was for me a nightmare, as he was from my first marriage & I had full custody of him and my daughter, my wife of now, stepped in and took over as his mother, at first it was good, then it went south again.
We had him in psych therapy, on all sorts of meds, was diagnosed ADD & schizophrenia. He actually fooled the pshychologist into thinking he was schizophrenic, by saying he heard voices. I questioned him and he said yes i hear voices, everytime I talk I can hear myself....damn kid!!
It was what you'd call a living hell. Everyday something else with Seth, or something this with Seth.
Seth though, started growing out of it somewhat, his sophmore year. How he even graduated i have no clue, but he doesn't take change well at all. It takes him about 2 weeks and he'll start to act out.
At age 19 I told him to leave, he was a real mess after graduating. We couldn't handle him anymore living with us.
It was like he took a step backwards in time and became 16 again. He's 21 now, and still acts like he's 16 or 17 at times.
I know and understand to a point what you're going thru....I think in ways I've been there.

There's alot more stories i could tell or nightmares with Seth, that started at age 2....it was that though, a nightmare

[OeldeWolf]

I have had more experience with the mentally ill and the abused/abusive than I really want to admit. I appreciate the difficulty of what you are going through.

What it comes down to, in the end, is perseverance, and working with his medical people to get the best outcome. Just remember, best may not mean perfect. I have seen some excellent advice handed you here. All I can offer is encouragement. And that there should come a time, when things are better.

[hithard]

Andrea
First you are not the "stepmom" get that dammed idea of your head!!!!!!!!! It does affect how you see your relationship to the kids.
Second your kids notice I said your kids need you to understand they have lived hell and are scared they can do something that will make you fit the idea that they have of "mom".
Third physical punishment is bad I know I used to use it but the divorce changed that and my kids are better when with me. Punishment now is tickles and hugs, yes they act up sometimes to just get punished. Also try and stay calm yes I know it is over the top at times but when you slip let them know it is ok to admit you screwed up.
Lastly I am studying to be a mental health counselor so listen carefully, you are at the cross roads of where you have to be something they didn't know and that is a loving, caring and most of all a mom who wants the best for them.
I have a son that hates my guts but we had a rough road and I screwed up didn't have my mental health understanding then so I will always have a sore spot in my mind for what happened and how some of it was my fault and some which he refuses to accept was his.
PM if you want and we can talk more about things to try.
The hoarding of food is typical when they feel unsafe and are scared. The acting out is what they received so they think that is how you act towards other living things.
The loving moments are what you want to build on as they are being themselves then and then the fear kicks in and they resort back to the monster because no one could really love them.
hope this gives you hope and yes I will pray for all of your family and the docs to help them accept it is ok to cry and feel scared, it isn't ok to react in bad ways.

That is good stuff there. Having raised a daughter that came from less than desirable conditions and being a CASA volunteer (deal with abused children) I can identify with these points. Please don't forget to take care of yourself too. You are no good to anyone if you are not good, mind, body, and spirit.

[Silvercreek Farmer]

My wife an I took in two foster children 4.5 years ago, half brothers, then ages 2 and 5.5. The oldest had severe defiance, destructive, ADD, hyperactive, and low IQ (54) issues, more than what we were willing to take on permanently. At the time, the plan was for him to go back to his "paternal unit", so we stuck it out rather than sending him back to DSS. After about a year, those plans fell apart, but by that time he had made some progress and he had become "ours". We continued to nurture and discipline him (without spanking since he was a foster child) and two years in we adopted both boys. After 4 years we were finally able to wean him off the ADD meds and while every day with him is still a challenge, he has made a considerable amount (albeit slow) progress. The teenage years are looming and we still worry quite a bit about what his adult life will be like, but we will cross that bridge when we get to it. We get all sorts of advice from people that have never lived, much less even witnessed, what these children are capable of, sometimes I am polite, sometimes I am tired of being polite and I am direct, very direct in sharing reality with them. I share so you know that you are not alone in your struggle. Hang in there, pray for strength, wisdom, and patience, I will do the same on your behalf.

[2HighSpeed]

Thank you silvercreek. Well the issue I first talked about in this thread where he kicked the dog down the stairs, I just took him to the vet. He has a broken rib, a fractures rear hip and fractured shoulder. Hip dysplasia as well which is not from Nathan. Never thought I'd see a vet bill that high $1,971. And more to come if these fractures don't heal right. Gonna be selling alot of lead to get that paid off my credit card. Yikes. I don't know how to make him understand he can't keep doing this to our pets. This is the 3rd time he has severely hurt this same dog.

[45nut]

I never had this kind of a problem and cannot give any advice, but I can pray and will do that. Please keep us posted now and then. S2
Seconded!

[blackthorn]

Sadly at some point you may have to decide whether now is a good time to have pets in your home. I feel so sorry for you and your family during these trying times. I have some idea what you are going through because for many years I delt with a cousin who was manic depressive. In the end he took his own life, at least in part because our Canadian universal health care failed him.