Pain don't equal fun.

[anthonytrkr]

My 45-70, and 45-90 beat me to death with heavy boolits. Is it better to use filler with black, or do most re loaders just seat the boolit deeper in the case with reduced powder charges? What type of filler would one use?

[littlejack]

Welcome to the CastBoolits.
You need top share a little more information. What type of rifle. What weight of boolit/bullet. Do you have a recoil pad on the rifle? How much black are you using in your loads? Are you big or not so big?
I shoot a Uberti Highwall in 45-70, with one of those soft curved metal butt plates. I use 70 weighed grains of Goex 2F under the Lyman 457125 boolit. It drops at about 522 grains. I really like it. Recoil is not at all bad for me.
How about starting with a lighter bullet/boolit?
Reguards
Jack

[country gent]

As littleJack said more information is needed here. Going from 2f to 1f powder will lower velocity and thus felt recoil. A lighter bullet will lower feltrecoil. More rifle wieght will lower felt recoil. A Past recoil shield will help with recoil. Are you shooting from position or off of a bench? A more erect bench position will help with recoil control. A slip on recoil pad will help, but risks leaving rub marks on the stock. With Black powder you dont want any airspace in the case between powder lube cookies and base of bullet. A lighter powder charge with one of the following added to bring load to same hieght. Cream of wheat, a stack up of felt card wads, or dacron fibers have all be used. I perfer the cream of wheat. For plinking / Gallery loads prime case drop powder charge, add over powder wad seat by hand, add appropiate amount of cream of wheat, seat card wad by hand. Compress with die to depth. seat bullet. Hint once the volume for the cream of wheat is found a second powder measure can be set up to throw this also.Or a simple dipper measure can be made. Just remember to have everything snug to tight under the bullet.

[John Allen]

Dropping the bullet weight will help if the gun is a lighter one. Try the lyman 405 grain it is a nice bullet plus it seats nice and deep. You can also use a larger fiber wad with grease cookie and top wad.

[Yellowhouse]

Shooters Friend Recoil Pad....you'll love it!

[Hogpost]

Yeah, me too. At age 68 & 145 lbs, kick's no fun anymore.
In my opinion (for what it's worth...)

1. As others have said, go to a lighter boolit (405 grns) and/or reduce charge.
2. Deeper seating means the boolit is further from the rifling at start,
which can mess with accuracy. If accuracy is important, avoid this.
3. Fill any resulting "empty" space with either wads or filler. Cream of Wheat has always worked for me.
4. Or, reduce the power of the powder you are using, for the same volume. If you are using 3FG,
drop to 2FG. If you are using Swiss, drop to Scheutzen. In either case, fouling will worsen a bit,
as will the flatness of your trajectory (muzzle velocity)
5. Not sure how/what you are shooting, but if you're prone or on a bench, try standing offhand:
obviously less accurate, but more challenging and a lot easier on the shoulder.

6. Or, more extreme, do as I did: go to 38-55. All the fun and boom of the 45-70, as accurate
if not more, but much less recoil. A little touchier, as bores vary and you must slug to find the
correct bullet dia; and there are two case lengths (only StarLine makes the original longer case),
but well worth it. I still enjoy my 45-70 rolling block, but not for serious work or more than 20 rounds.
I can do a coupla' hundred rounds of 38-55 (Swiss 3FG & magnum primers) with zero pain, and still
knock down those rams.

There is no shooting fun like black powder, and it does not need to be painful. Enjoy!

[StrawHat]

When the Springfield Armory dropped the charge in the 45-70 cartridge to make the 45-55 carbine load, they used three different methods to reduce the capacity of the case. First they used a paper or cardboard tube to take the place of the missing 15 grains of powder. Next up they used a wad column. In the end, the merely seated the bullet deeper in the case and made it easier on everyone to see the difference int he rifle and carbine loads.

Smaller bores are a lot of fun but the 45-70 (or 50-70) does have it's draw.

['74 sharps]

Everything in the case, bullet, powder weight, wads, filler if used, are factored in as weight when calculating recoil. I would look into a good slip on pad, such as the KickEez. This pad uses a patented material (sorbothane) to absorb the shock. Works well.

[Hip's Ax]

I ordered my two CPA's with Pachmayr Decelerator pads installed. My 45-70 weighs a little under 13 pounds and my 45-90 a little over. Shooting 550 gr Hoch bullets and 68 grains of Goex 2f in the 70 and 88 grains of Swiss 1 1/2f in the 90. Recoil is no big deal at all, never even thought about it.

[wch]

If you persist in shooting your rifle with heavy loads, try putting a bag of shot betwen the buttplate and your shoulder.

[Gunlaker]

I've never been a fan of fillers. I'd buy a slip on recoil pad, load it with Fg, and use a lighter bullet. Bullet weight can make a huge difference as can a slip on recoil pad. With Fg you'll probably have around 8gr less powder required to fill the case and you can still find an accurate load with it.

Chris.

[Texantothecore]

I shoot roundball in my 45-70 with 70 grains and it is very little recoil. With 15 grns of bp,corn meal filler and a roundball there is virtually no recoil. One my friends shot this load a few weeks ago and he swore that it was a misfire it wasn't, just a light rabbit and squirrel load.

[missionary5155]

Greetings
Cross sticks. I stopped hammering my 152 pounds with bony shoulder some years back. Sit behind my cross sticks and with a folded towel on my shoulder. I shoot Rollers, Trapdoor, Peabody and lever 45/70's with up to 480 grainers. Sitting behind the sticks gives the whole body a normal pivot point at the waist and the whole upper torso rocks back.
Mike in Peru

[AkMike]

If you want to try a real kicker stop by and crank a few thru my 10# 600 NE spitting out 900-1040 grn boolits. Those squirrel guns can't hurt too much. ;)

Or I've got a couple of shooting buddies with 4 bores! that's tossing out 1/4# of lead at a shot.. They like to watch folks on the learning curve.

[Ramar]

I agree with 'Mike in Peru' on taming the recoil with shooting cross sticks. If I stand and use the cross sticks there is even less felt recoil than sitting. The whole body gets to move and absorb the recoil. (I can't stand very long though) That's the way I see it.
Ramar

[Texantothecore]

I use a PAST shoulder pad and it seems to really knock down the recoil. I recommend it as it just works.

[johnson1942]

all the recoil pads are good and one of them will make the difference. one more trick, go to brownells and look up dead mules. they are a recoil reduceing tubes that goes in your butt stock under the butt plate. all you have to do is drill about a 7/8 th hole deep enough to insert and put the butt plate back on. i put them in two guns of mine and they make a big difference. i have one on a .50 cal that shoots a 700 grain bullet and uses a 100 grains of black under it. no recoil pad just a shotgun style butt plate. i never think about recoil with the dead mule in its stock. it weighs 11 lbs.

[anthonytrkr]

I am shooting a Pedersoli Billy Dixon chambered in 45-90. The bullet is 535 gr. I am filling the case full enough with ffg to get slight compression when I seat the bullet. I am using one veg. fiber wad. I have been shooting from a bench, but it is low and I have to lay over on it. I now have a recoil pad, a 405gr, and 300gr. mould. I would like to reduce recoil as 20 rounds left my boney shoulder black and blue. I must admit I was only wearing a T shirt.

[Don McDowell]

I have been shooting from a bench, but it is low and I have to lay over on it.
Right there is your problem, do what ever it is you need do to get that gun up so you're in a more upright position, and you'll be able to shoot that rifle all day with no problems.

[montana_charlie]

I am shooting a Pedersoli Billy Dixon chambered in 45-90.
I have been shooting from a bench, but it is low and I have to lay over on it.
There are two elements helping to cause your discomfort.
The Billy Dixon has the military-style buttstock, which is not real comfortable for shooting prone.
Then, your bench is so low it simulates prone shooting.

Don McDowell's advice should help a lot. If you can't raise the gun, get your tail closer to the ground so the tabletop hits you just below the nipples.

[RMulhern]

Kick? Recoil? BP doesn't do anything but give a big push! Here....try this:

http://farm9.staticflickr.com/8510/8564691829_2e4c63c67d_b.jpg (http://www.flickr.com/photos/61286670@N08/8564691829/)
Shootingbench (http://www.flickr.com/photos/61286670@N08/8564691829/) by Sharps45 2 7/8 (http://www.flickr.com/people/61286670@N08/), on Flickr