Need opinions from the think tank.

[fanner 50]

.303 Brit sluged barrel at .311/.313 shooting Lyman 314299 as cast at .314 with GC and LLA dip. 42 gr IMR 4350. At 25 Yds big key holes. sugestions????

[fourarmed]

What do you mean by ".311/.313"? What is the diameter of the nose of your boolits?

[dromia]

Also what sort of alloy are you using?

That sounds like a reasonably pokey load for cast in the .303" especially with a design like the 314299 which likes to have that long nose supported, soft alloy could deform at those velocities even with a slow powder.

Looks as though you are after 2,000 FPS + so I would also use some stick lube other than or as well as the LLA.

Is there any leading in the barrel and/or unburnt powder?

Have you worked up to this load or is this your starting load.

[NVcurmudgeon]

Fanner 50, not to pile on, but the listed slug results (.311/.313) are confusing. Also, is your .303 a five groove, and if so, how did you measure it?

P.S. My favorite was the Kilgore SAA replica with no engraving, brown plastic grips, and using the six at a time caps. Those were the days!

[mag_01]

Fanner50 ----- The 303 can be a challenge for many reasons and to make it easy for you ---- First of all use the largest Diameter boolit that will chamber ___ I use a .316 diameter boolit sized .3155 as a .316 wont chamber ---- also a filler may help and is well covered on the 303 site -- believe it is (303.com) and they do go into it deep. If you are splitting cases then more than likely you have a head-space problem --- rough indication of head-space can be detected by using solder --- and to reduce or eliminate head space is a simple matter ---- A small amount of weld on one lug at a time --- rework the lug to fit your rifle --- Removing head-space can improve accuracy. Did I write all this bull ???? ---- Well fanner I have been thru the 303 boolit tumbling and splitting cases and have solved all my problems --- As it turns out the 303 britt can be a pleasure to shoot--- hope I have helped you ---- Mag


Play the cards you are dealt and play them well ---- :coffee:

[fanner 50]

OK guys. Barrel when sluged from the muzzel measured .311 bore and .313grooves it is a five groove barrel. The first two rounds made nice holes about 1" apart and on target. The next 8 were a mix of nice holes and holes that looked like the boolit went through sideways. At 25 yards I had a 15" 10 shot group. I have shortened the barrel to 20" and recessed the crown. Could this be too short to stabalize the big boolit? I guess I'll try some factory ammo through it and start elliminateing possibilities. Barrel shows no leading or fowling of any kind.

[fourarmed]

Well, I am no SMLE expert, but I think the grooves are considerably deeper than .001". A five-groove is hard to measure properly, and there have been many discussions on here of ways to do it. My suggestion would be to push the nose of one of those 314299s into the muzzle. If it goes in and wobbles a little, your bore diameter is too big for that borerider. The thing to do then, is beagle the mold until you get a tight fit on the boolit nose. When you get to that point, mike the nose diameter and add about .009". Try sizing your driving bands to that size, and see if it doesn't improve things.

[Char-Gar]

Something amiss. If the bore is truly .311 and the grooves. 313 ,the rifling will be all but invisable. You will have in effect a near smooth bore and for sure and for certain those bullets will keyhole.

The SMLE rifling are not deep like the mauser, but they are deep enough to do the job. For a bullet to fit well in a .311 x .313 barrel is would have to be a near cylinder with a point.

Either you measured wrong or that barrel is shot out...way shot out.

[KCSO]

Usually a 303 will go from 303 on the small side to up to 307 in the bore and grooves up to 316. Instead of pussing a slug through upset a buckshot in the bore and try measuring that. As to the keyholeing I would try a bullet that runs 315-316 in that pup and see how that goes. The other option is to use cream of wheat filler in a few lighter loads and see, that sometimes stops the keyholes. I had a 2 groove that went from nasty to 2 -3 " at 100 yards just with addition of a filler.

[Banana]

OK guys. Barrel when sluged from the muzzel measured .311 bore and .313grooves it is a five groove barrel. The first two rounds made nice holes about 1" apart and on target. The next 8 were a mix of nice holes and holes that looked like the boolit went through sideways. At 25 yards I had a 15" 10 shot group. I have shortened the barrel to 20" and recessed the crown. Could this be too short to stabalize the big boolit? I guess I'll try some factory ammo through it and start elliminateing possibilities. Barrel shows no leading or fowling of any kind.

Yeah,I agree with you.:drinks:

[44man]

I agree too, can't get much leading or fouling in a smooth bore. Bore is either worn out or measured wrong and from the dimensions given I think wear is a possibility with a .311 bore.

[26Charlie]

You probably need a fatter bullet. If you are measuring a 5-groove bbl. you need v-blocks at a certain angle (144 degrees?) so the flats are on the grooves or on the lands when measuring.
Also, I have not tried the case-full of slow powder loads, but have had good results with this bullet (314299) and 22.0 gr. 4198 in several SMLE's, including a "tanker" shortened rifle.
I do not advocate fillers although I used them in the past for some calibers, due to too many stories of ringed chambers.

[fanner 50]

Rifleing is sharp and I do not have the right equipment to get a better measurement on the bore but measures .313 to grooves. I'm going to try some SA surplus that a friend says shoots well in all of his SMLE's. If holes are nice then I can asume it is the boolit. If they tumble I can take a look at other things like barrel and crown etc. Thanks to all.

[9.3X62AL]

I did the following with my BSA (1918) SMLE to get close to groove and bore diameters. It sounds like oral surgery through the anal vent, but bear with me.

1) Mic the outside diameter of the muzzle.

2) Take caliper measurement from bottom of all grooves to muzzle's outside diameter/edge. Average these values, then double that number, and subtract from muzzle outside diameter. The result should be your GROOVE diameter. My rifle's is .316"

3) Repeat Step 2, this time measuring from the land tops to the muzzle's outside diameter/edge. This will provide the land diameter. My rifle's is .3055" or so.

[26Charlie]

I have tried a very light load of Bullseye with heavy cast bullets, like 2 or 2.5 gr. to kick the bullet through the bore, then catching it in LOTS of wadded up rags and towelling in a box. Use at least 25-30 layers of cloth wadded up - this load is STILL fast enough and has momentum enough to go through 1" pine boards and anything else in the way, and is dangerous. Then you can see how the rifling marks it up and what the bearing surface of the bullet is.
If you get it stuck in the bore you need a piece of drill rod to drive it on through - cleaning rod won't get it, and will be damaged if you try using it to get the bullet out.