Question on Buying Used Ruger Blackhawks from Cabelas

[Jeff82]

I've been looking at 357 Ruger Blackhawks at Cabelas. I noticed that the used ones are priced nearly at the price of new ones, and the three-screw versions were more. I understand collectors liking the 3-screw version, but the prices for used models seems really high. Does anyone know why this might be? Is there something about older model Blackhawks that makes them better than the current models? Or, does Cabelas price their used stuff high?

Thanks,

--Jeff

[felix]

Jeff, they will charge what they think they can be sold for. They are NOT Walmart! A friend of my son's bought a like new Weatherby Vangard for 350 bucks just last Saturday. ... felix

[Silver Jack Hammer]

One way of looking at this is that Ruger single actions hold their value. 3 screws cost more because people -like me are willing to pay more for them. I'm not a collector, I'm a shooter. I shoot the 3 screw mostly. I've got a New Model Blackhawk, two 3 screw .357's and a 3 screw SBH. Used to have a New Model SBH but I sold it. All are good guns but I favor the 3 screw, especially since I shoot the Colt a lot. When teaching my son from a very young age to shoot single actions I only exposed him to 3 screw styles and he started out with the Bearcat with a 3 screw style action.

They all shoot well.

[HighHook]

I happen to some of each. They are all good shooters. Just Pick your barrel length and jump in...

[GARCIA]

I found an early model 3 screw in 41mag yesterday. Asking price was $399. I could afford it but did not want to face the music with my wife. It's hell being on a fixed income. Sent my oldest son a text message about it with the number from the LGS. He picks it up on Friday. Don't know if it has box or papers but it will be a shooter. Now all he needs is a Ruger Redhawk to round out his 41 mag cravings!!!
And he is not getting mine till I am dead!!!

Tom

[Tatume]

Hi Tom,

I know how you feel about 41 magnums. Since I started shooting them I've grown quite fond of the cartridge. Right now I have three revolvers, a S&W Mountain Gun, Blackhawk, and a Freedom Arms M97. They are accurate, powerful, and recoil is not brutal. It's just a perfect combination.

Take care, Tom

[Kull]

Were the used ones you were looking at unmodified without the transfer bar safety? That's my guess why they would be the most expensive.

Goggle Ruger Blackhawk 2 Screw vs 3 Screw. Lots of good info out there about all the little changes and possible variations.

[JohnFM]

3 screw Rugers are always in higher demand and go for high prices. A lot of us would never buy a "New Model".
As far as Cabelas goes, I've bought a fair amount of used stuff from them, but you need to watch it and generally I think it's all pretty high.

[Jeff82]

Thanks for the input. I'm looking for a Blawkhawk to compliment my Marlin 1894c and am pretty sold on the Blackhawk in 357 with the 6.5" barrel. Since I'm not that familiar with the ins-and-outt of hte different Blackhawk models, could you explain why the 3-screw is preferred to the 2-screw, and why a Ruger without the transfer bar is preferred to one with a tranfser bar? I think that's what I don't understand about the pricing. I'll look on the web to get a better understanding of the things you've mentioned as well.

Thanks.

[dualsport]

Just a thought; if you're looking for versatility check out the convertible BHs with a 9mm cylinder. Mostly just a 'for the fun of it' thing but could have real practical aspects. Lots of free 9mm brass to be scrounged, boolit load info here in Castpics. I really like mine. I especially like the Ruger/Marlin combo.

[opos]

Thanks for the input. I'm looking for a Blawkhawk to compliment my Marlin 1894c and am pretty sold on the Blackhawk in 357 with the 6.5" barrel. Since I'm not that familiar with the ins-and-outt of hte different Blackhawk models, could you explain why the 3-screw is preferred to the 2-screw, and why a Ruger without the transfer bar is preferred to one with a tranfser bar? I think that's what I don't understand about the pricing. I'll look on the web to get a better understanding of the things you've mentioned as well.

As to the bbl length I really like the longer barrels for target shooting and don't carry so the shorter barrels are not a real consideration...I have some and enjoy shooting them (except the really short 44 mags) so again it's all about what you plan to do with it...I'd sure rather carry a shorter bbl if in the field and only planning on a self defense situation. One more thing..the convertibles are fun...I have a 357/38/9mm that I shoot a bit...not so much with the 9mm cylinder because it's cheap enough to shoot 38 special because I load. I also have a 45 Colt/45 acp that I shoot a lot...it's a fun one. Both of the convertibles are "new model".

There is mention of the convertible 357/9mm and also you mention the 357 in the 6 1/2" bbl...I have both and seldom shoot the 9mm cylinder as I load and it's really cheap enough to load for the 357/38 so the 9 mm cylinder is sort of "stored away"...I also have a 45colt/45acp convertable that gets shot quite a bit with both...I like the longer bbl lengths like the 6.5 and 7.5 inch for target shooting but they are a bit long for holster carry (which I seldom do any more.)...they all shoot great!

Thanks.

I collect and shoot Rugers...your wondering about the "old model" 3 screw and the "new model" 2 pin is asking a Chevy collector why they prefer a small block 57 Chevy to a small block 65 Chevy...some do and some don't...the "old models" have a mechanism that is different and is the old original Ruger design..it's similar (in some ways) to the old Colts, etc in that it should not be carried with the hammer down on a loaded chamber...it can discharge if dropped or if hit on the hammer...the old days the old Colts were always loaded 5 rounds and the gunfighter (so the story goes) carried a $10 bill in the empty cylinder for gambling money. Ruger got into some legal issues with the trigger situation and offered to "modify" and "improve" the old 3 screws free of charge...lots of folks sent them back in for the "transfer bar modification" that eliminated the need to carry 5 instead of carrying 6...but for collectors and purist shooters that was a mistake and had impact on the collector value...Ruger used to send back the parts when the did the modifications in a plastic bag so the owner could convert them back if desired to maintain the "originality and collectability" of the gun....now, also because of ongoing legal mumbo jumbo I had heard they will not sell nor return those parts. I have a number of the 3 screw originals and would not think of converting any of them...I have several that were converted and have the package that was returned...I don't mess with them but do hang onto the parts and I have any number of new models that I shoot a lot...there is a difference in how the cylinder releases to load and unload, how it "free spins" to load and unload, etc but basic point and shoot is much the same. Find a Ruger single action that fits your needs and get it...you will get more and more (almost a guarantee) and if you want something different you can get it then....it's all what makes a horse race.

The picture is of an old model Blackhawk in 30 cal (M1) that is a 3 screw "old model" that's been converted...the 6 pieces in the plastic bag are the parts replaced and returned by Ruger after doing the transfer bar safety modification (no, the parts are not for sale)..

[crazy mark]

Ruger still returns the parts. I had a single six done recently and they sent the parts back.

[JohnFM]

That's a nice 30 Carbine BH. I have one just like it made in 1972.

[rintinglen]

Part of the reson people used to prefer the older three screw model 357's, is that they were made on a smaller, lighter frame than the 2 screw New Model Blackhawks. In 1973, when Ruger went to the transfer bar action, they standardized on a single, large frame for center fire revolvers. It made them hell-for strong--there are Ruger Only loads for 45 LC that will turn most other makes into ruins--but then they were several ounces heavier and balanced different. In recent years, they have resumed manufacturing the smaller framed guns in response to the requests of the Cowboy shooting crowd, but with the Modern safety action. Me, I prefer the modern guns, having never been enamored of the prospect of shooting myself when I drop my gun if I screw up and get a round under the hammer. (Not that I plan on dropping it, but stuff happens and Murphy never sleeps.)

[opos]

Part of the reson people used to prefer the older three screw model 357's, is that they were made on a smaller, lighter frame than the "2 screw" New Model Blackhawks. In 1973, when Ruger went to the transfer bar action, they standardized on a single, large frame for center fire revolvers. It made them hell-for strong--there are Ruger Only loads for 45 LC that will turn most other makes into ruins--but then they were several ounces heavier and balanced different. In recent years, they have resumed manufacturing the smaller framed guns in response to the requests of the Cowboy shooting crowd, but with the Modern safety action. Me, I prefer the modern guns, having never been enamored of the prospect of shooting myself when I drop my gun if I screw up and get a round under the hammer. (Not that I plan on dropping it, but stuff happens and Murphy never sleeps.)

So are you saying that my 3 screw Super Blackhawk from 1972 is a smaller frame and less durable 44 magnum 7 1/2" bbl. than my "new model" 2 pin Super Blackhawk from 1984 in 44 magnum happens to be a 4 5/8" bbl? Think I might have to disagree. The old model flat tops have re emerged with things like the Lipsey specials in the big bores and they are not suitable for the extreme loads called "Ruger or TC only" loads but they are a separate set of guns from the full size Ruger single actions that have been made for years...3 screw and 2 pin. I have a couple of the 357 frame size 44 specials from Lipsey's a few years ago and while they are called a flat top Blackhawk they are not full size nor will they handle the super hot loads (or at least I'd not shoot them) but if the indication is that an old model 44 mag Super Blackhawk is weaker than a new model 44 mag Super Blackhawk or vice versa I think I'd need to see something from Ruger. If you are talking about the Vaquero series the full size frame models were made through 2005 as I recall and then Ruger came out with a model called "New Vaquero"...they are definitely lighter and smaller framed than the "original" Vaquero models and have the "shape" and sighting plane similar to the old Single Action Army Colts of Western fame.

Editing the post....I just went back to the Ruger.com forum and looked up what had been posted recently that might shed some light on the old model strength vs. the new model strength...and I'd bet the farm on this...just wanted to get some "back up" from a couple of guys that have been collecting Rugers for years and years. Here's the cut/paste:

"The Old Model .45's were built on the Super Blackhawk frame."

Indeed, as were the .30 Carbines and .41 Magnums . . . and the original Vaqueros.

When the New Models came out, even the .357's were on the "large frame".

The New Model flattops and New Vaqueros are another matter altogether."


The old Super Blackhawk (original 44 mag) is as tough as any single action Ruger has ever made and the early (3 screw models were built on that same frame)...The New Models in the full size Blackhawk series are built on the same basic frame...the "New Vaquero's" and the "New model flat top Blackhawks" are built on a lighter frame and probably are not suitable for the Ruger only or TC only loadings.

[1bluehorse]

I would also like to add to opos excellent post, the 3 screw Rugers also had better triggers than the New Model.....I had mine (SBH) changed over to the transfer bar (got the original parts back) several years ago and the trigger is really the only thing about the change that annoys me..it's not "bad", just not as good as it was even after having the action worked..

[GARCIA]

Hi Tom,

I know how you feel about 41 magnums. Since I started shooting them I've grown quite fond of the cartridge. Right now I have three revolvers, a S&W Mountain Gun, Blackhawk, and a Freedom Arms M97. They are accurate, powerful, and recoil is not brutal. It's just a perfect combination.

Take care, Tom

My oldest son has got a very serious addiction to 41 mags. Think he is up to 5-6 handguns and one 1894 Marlin. Heck he even went out and bought one of the new S&W mod 57's. Then he tells me he bought a limited production flattop Ruger. When he graduated from Medical School I gave him a dealer exclusive (Lipsey's) Ruger Bisley in 41mag as a graduation present. Even got him one of the Ruger SBH Hunter's in 41 mag. Yeah, he loves them 41's!

Dang kid keeps yanking my chain about inheriting my S&W 57. Have had it since 1974. Been back to the factory once for a total rebuild. Pretty much retired it when I switched over to the beefier Rugers.

[pietro]

could you explain why the 3-screw is preferred to the 2-screw -

FWIW, There's no such thing as a Ruger 2-screw. There's only 3-screw Old Model's (OM's) and 2-pin New Model's (NM's).
OM's are more desireable by Ruger SA cognesenti due to nostalgia, simplicity/less parts, and an abhorrance of lawyer-induced safety features.

and

why a Ruger without the transfer bar is preferred to one with a tranfser bar? -

All New Models have transfer bar actions, the only Old Models that do are those returned to Ruger for a (free) transfer bar conversion (new/different lock parts).
Most of the reasons for preference are above.



I think that's what I don't understand about the pricing. -

It's about demand - one can always obtain a New Model from Ruger, but certain Old Models are virtual unobtainium.
It's also about some sellers asking for the moon, while hoping to get at least the sky, even though reality may be a tall hill.





I hope that helps you.



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