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View Full Version : 44 Magnum Winchester 94 Lee 310 Bullet



cabezaverde
08-01-2005, 08:43 PM
I have an older Winchester 94, I believe mid 80's vintage, (whiich believe has a slower twist, 1-38, I think). I would like to give the Lee 310 flat point bullet a try in it. Does anyone have experience or input ? Am I barking up the wrong tree with the twist rate ?

If you have had luck, any data or learning you could share with me ?

Four Fingers of Death
08-02-2005, 07:17 AM
I have an older Winchester 94, I believe mid 80's vintage, (whiich believe has a slower twist, 1-38, I think). I would like to give the Lee 31o flat point bullet in it. Does anyone have experience or input ? Am I barking up the wrong tree with the twist rate ?

If you have had luck, any data or learning you could share with me ?


I get the Lee brochure every year and it is always on the floor with the latest gun mags beside the bed (annoys the wife something fierce, but she gave up trying to make me stop this about 20 years ago). That brocure is better value than any gun mag I ever bought, especially the mould page. I study that page over and over again, thinking about what moulds I should get, etc. I have a few, but that big 44Mag boolit mould gets me in. I'll have to buy one, I've been staring at the picture of it for years and years now. The big 30cal moulds get me in also.

I'm looking forward to finding out something about this from someone who has actually tried it. It would hit with a whallop being such a flat big boolit.
MIck.

Bullshop Junior
08-02-2005, 01:29 PM
sorry --- no message

Bull Shop Mom

Bullshop
08-02-2005, 01:37 PM
I get the Lee brochure every year and it is always on the floor with the latest gun mags beside the bed (annoys the wife something fierce, but she gave up trying to make me stop this about 20 years ago). That brocure is better value than any gun mag I ever bought, especially the mould page. I study that page over and over again, thinking about what moulds I should get, etc. I have a few, but that big 44Mag boolit mould gets me in. I'll have to buy one, I've been staring at the picture of it for years and years now. The big 30cal moulds get me in also.

I'm looking forward to finding out something about this from someone who has actually tried it. It would hit with a whallop being such a flat big boolit.
MIck.


I have been using the Lee 310 wfn/gc in a Marlin 94/44 mag for oh I guess at least ten years or so. I once did a test to see just how fast it could go from the Marlin. The week link in the Marlin is its stamped steel extractor. If cases begin to have drag from the chamber the extractor will pop over the rim and leave the case in the chamber. It does'nt take much drag for the extracter to fail. I loaded to the point where extraction was about 50% and Dr. Ohler said that was 1800 fps. I backed the load down to 100% extraction and it chronoed at 1700 fps so settled on that as the big load for this gun. I have two 6 cav molds I got years ago as prototype from Lee but I see it is now a reguler item. I just recently got a six cav in the same design in 45. As luck would have it they drop at .456". When I first started with the 44 version I recal one morning seeing out the window a large domestic rabbit and thought to try the 44 Marlin on it. At about 40 yds he sat faceing me so when the beed was on his nose it touched off. I could not believe the explosion of hair and rabbit limbs at the shot. The impact of that big flat nose compleately sepperated the four limbs. My favorite part the back was gone but I picked up the legs in good shape,they were blown a few feet apart of each other. My feeling has since been that the 94 Marlin 44 mag or similer is the lighest packege one can house this much power in. At one time I felt the 45 was equal but my feelings have changed on that. I now feel it is not as safe a venture with a 45 due to the reduced chamber wall thickness in the fairly slim barrel shank and receiver. I know many will not agree with me on this but I can legaly feel this way so I will continue, and others can do the same. I feel the same about 50 cal conversions on the 336. I know it is being done, but I wont do it. Anyways that 44 load has been trust worthy for a long time takeing much game and performing like a much bigger gun. To be honest I think that Marlin 94/44 mag load with its ten round capacity would handle anything on God's green earth. Sorry I am a bit hesitant about giving my spesific load but anyone with a good understanding of loading can figure it out.
BIC/BS

BlueMoon
08-02-2005, 02:19 PM
Bullshop,

I have a '94 Marlin in 44 also and suppose you have the 38" twist. Have you shot yours at 100yds or more to see if the bullet is still stabilized on paper target? I thought I was doing something getting my 245grn Keith bullet up to 1800fps using LilGun. Mine is a '98 model with ballard rifling and I have to have a 1.685" OAL to catch the crimp groove on this bullet. I'm still not sure I could get mine up to 1700fps with a 310grn bullet but has me wondering.

Bill

Bullshop
08-02-2005, 08:45 PM
BlueMoon
The gun I used for this test was an old first model pre micro groove. I don't know the twist as I gave it to my Dad when I left Mt. The one I have now is a rebuild from a second model with the newer barrel. I have not yet tried that load in this gun. One thing I have noticed is the first model would handle a longer cartridge. The old gun would keep the big load at well under 4" at 100 yds and that is all the farther I would shoot with it. With that limit there was never a problem killing critters down to coyote size. A 250gn boolit will group better but good nuff is good nuff.
BIC/BS

cabezaverde
08-03-2005, 08:04 AM
I think this same bullet shape in a 230 - 250 grain model would be great for all those lever guns out there.

MTWeatherman
08-04-2005, 05:14 PM
Cabezaverde:

I've got a '94 Winchester .44 Trapper from the same era. Barrel looks like a Marlin Microgroove...12 groove and 1 in 38" twist.

I've never tried the Lee 310 gr bullet in it. However, I've known others to have problems stablizing a 300 gr out of a .44 Mag Marlin with a 38" twist Microgroove...seems to take .444 Marlin velocities to guarantee stabilization. Some claim the 38" twist will stablize the bullets...but most have a different experience. Would seem to me that the experience should be the same but my guess is that 300 gr. is right on the line of marginal stablization and those driving the bullet the hardest might have some success at least at shorter ranges.

I don't know what bullets you've tried in your rifle, but my vote for a good choice in a heavier .44 would be the old Thompson GC still made by Lyman (429244). Its pretty much a Keith design but Thompson committed heresy where Keith was concerned by slipping a gas check on the bullet. It may not have been necessary for a handgun but it works wonders in a rifle...especially a Microgroove. With WW alloy, gaschecked, and lubed it weights in a 159 gr. Can confirm excellent accuracy and stablization to 150 yrd with this one...1700 fps out of the 16" Trapper using 23 gr 110 and 3 shot groups of at least 1.5 inches at 100 yds. (Possibly better but that's the limit of these old eyes with receiver sights).

cabezaverde
08-04-2005, 06:25 PM
Thanks everyone,

My barrel sounds the same as MTWeathermans.

I have an RCBS 44-245 KT mold I will try. Any light load data to share ?

cabezaverde
08-04-2005, 08:00 PM
I did shoot some of the Lee 310's last night. The ones that were pushed by a light charge of Unique went throught the target sideways at 25 yards. Higher charges of 2400 had it going through straight and it looked like it could group decently with some tweaking. I did this more to shoot up the loads, as the sideways holes made me realize this bullet did not have 75 yard potential in this rifle. They kick a bit too.

MTWeatherman
08-04-2005, 11:24 PM
I did shoot some of the Lee 310's last night. The ones that were pushed by a light charge of Unique went throught the target sideways at 25 yards. Higher charges of 2400 had it going through straight and it looked like it could group decently with some tweaking. I did this more to shoot up the loads, as the sideways holes made me realize this bullet did not have 75 yard potential in this rifle. They kick a bit too.

Just checked my original post...should have previewed it before submitting it...that should read 259 grs. on the bullet weight for the Lyman 429244 but you likely already figured that out.

I did some work with the Lee 200 gr. in this rifle for a light plain base plinking load..The bullet weight was actually was closer to 210 gr. Wanted velocity to be near 1100 fps to provide a 25 yard impact near the full power Lyman as possible. Unique didn't provide the best groups...it turned out bullseye worked best which was not what I expected.

Since you've already got the 310 gr. Lee and you and I share the same rifle, I'm curious to see if you can develop a usable load within acceptable pressure levels. If you're successful, would appreciate hearing about it.

drinks
08-06-2005, 04:55 PM
Greenhead;
I have been shooting the 310gr in a .44-40, 19gr H110 gives 1350-1375fps in the 20 " barrel.
Have just received a .44mag. barrel for my Handirifle and will be working on loads with the 310gr and the C429-240-SWC.
I was getting 1 1/2" 50 yd groups with the '92 and the 310gr at 1350fps +-, I thinkthe '92 has about a 1/36 twist, the new HR barrel is 1/16, but 12 lands/grooves, may take waterdropped bullets for much speed.

Don

Ranch Dog
08-07-2005, 08:44 PM
A lot of fellows shoot the bullet in both the 44 Mag and the 444 Marlin. I'm traveling but I believe I have a load for both. I see I posted this in Beartooth Bullets' LoadSwap, it is a 444 Load.

RD's LoadSwap Load for Lee Cast C430-310-RF (http://www.loadswap.com/comments.php?table=Rifle_Data&id=1610)

I'm pretty sure Lee's Modern Reloading II has a load for the 44 Mag. It's a bit undersized for Marlin bores (need .432" in either caliber) but I don't know about the Winchesters.

Captain Midnight
08-12-2005, 04:56 PM
All the bigger pistol bullets that I have tried print sideways at 50 yds. Could a shorter bullet be the answer? Captain

felix
08-12-2005, 05:04 PM
Yes, and almost a guarantee at that. Nothing longer than the Thompson 429244. We are also talking gas checked boolits. ... felix

45 2.1
08-12-2005, 08:46 PM
You'll have better luck with a 215 gr. bullet that is fat than anything else you might try.

gcp
02-27-2008, 05:51 AM
Hi guys, I am new to your list. Have a couple of questions for you, I have on my reloading bench about two hundred 300gr lead bullets FT which I'd like to put to good use with my Bullseye powder . I've been told that I should keep velocities to 1,000 ft/sec, or less, so as to keep barrel leading/fouling to a minimum. Is this true? And do any of you have a good recipe that would help me achieve my goal? Can this round develop into a potent hunting round as well as an accurate plinker for my new Winchester 94 Trapper (16.5" barrel as well as my Ruger Superblackhawk pistol)? Truth is I'd like to load one round that's good for hogs and well as target practice. No predators beyond coyote to speak of around here but it doesn't hurt to be prepared when walking through the woods which I do quite often at my property.

BTW I was also told not to use the old trick of shooting a jacketed round after shooting lead rounds to help remove barrel lead. In doing so one only increases the barrel's pressure to extremes with possibly devastating results. Do you agree?

Bass Ackward
02-27-2008, 07:10 AM
Hi guys, I am new to your list. Have a couple of questions for you, I have on my reloading bench about two hundred 300gr lead bullets FT which I'd like to put to good use with my Bullseye powder . I've been told that I should keep velocities to 1,000 ft/sec, or less, so as to keep barrel leading/fouling to a minimum. Is this true? And do any of you have a good recipe that would help me achieve my goal? Can this round develop into a potent hunting round as well as an accurate plinker for my new Winchester 94 Trapper (16.5" barrel as well as my Ruger Superblackhawk pistol)? Truth is I'd like to load one round that's good for hogs and well as target practice. No predators beyond coyote to speak of around here but it doesn't hurt to be prepared when walking through the woods which I do quite often at my property.

BTW I was also told not to use the old trick of shooting a jacketed round after shooting lead rounds to help remove barrel lead. In doing so one only increases the barrel's pressure to extremes with possibly devastating results. Do you agree?


gcp,

Welcome. Well if you read the posts above, you can see that guys are doing more than you've been told. Do things correctly and get no leading. Don't do them right and you can lead at 800 fps. You need another powder besides Bullseye. It will go bang, but not appropriate if you are just starting out.

Depends. If your bore is leaded to where you can't see your rifling, then you can have a real issue. But if your leading is more smearing, just like with a copper wash, You are OK. You shoot over copper that is harder don't you?

You can use the search function at the top of the page, third from the right and get a wealth of information that all it will take is your time to get through. Welcome aboard.

gcp
02-27-2008, 08:53 PM
....thank you for your welcome and your input :drinks:. But I am confused on your Bullseye comment since the Lee reloading book specifies 6.1-6.8gr for 310 gr leads. Are you saying this will not be a good performer for the 300s?

Frankly I don't use lead bullets much that's why I am trying to learn the details and their possible effects on the barrel from you experts. Maybe casting will be something I'd like to get into but I have much learning to do. I've reloaded for many years btw, pistols and rifles of many calibers.

Thanks,
gcp

Poohgyrr
03-07-2008, 11:32 AM
bump n tag

jlchucker
03-07-2008, 11:59 AM
I agree with 45 2.1 re: 215 gr bullets. I have a Winchester trapper 44 mag that I bought in 1987. The 429215 gascheck bullet over 21 gr 2400 from that rifle cuts a ragged hole at 25 yds, and shoots flat enough to allow me to plink clay pigeon fragments at 100 yd, hitting them with every shot. The 240-255 gr gascheck bullets work ok, but don't group on paper nearly as tight. They also kick a little more. I have no experience with a 310 gr 44 mag load, but I think my Winchester prefers the lighter bullet. However, one that doesn't work well seems to be the 200 gr plain base one commercially cast of linotype with 44-40's in mind.

MTWeatherman
03-07-2008, 05:00 PM
GCP....
What do you mean by "new" Winchester? Manufactured within the past few years...or new to you, but an older Winchester? Its important because older Winchesters had a 1 in 38 inch twist...the newest ones 1 in 26.

That Bullseye load could be utilized with a 1 in 26 inch twist Winchester or your Ruger with its faster twist. Difficulty is in the use of a fast powder with a heavy bullet. In general, best accuracy with fast powders would be achieved with lighter bullets...say 200 to 220 gr. Although it could be done safely, odds are that Bullseye, as among the fastest powders made, would not be the best choice for that heavyweight due to the rapid pressure peak.

However, if you have the 1 in 38 inch twist...odds are you may have problems using the bullet at all...especially if it is a plain base. No merit in discussing that one, however, until we know what the twist really is.

gcp
03-12-2008, 07:35 AM
...yes, this rifle is new to me. It is a 1994, one hundred year anniversary model 6,XXX,XXX range but I don't know what the barrel twist is. If you do please share.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0703/George/Winchester%2094/44magcombo.jpg

The rifle is in as new condition with very strong, clean rifling. I'd say it hadn't been shot but a few time prior to me.

Over the weekend I reloaded and shot 30 rounds of 240gr JSP with 9gr of some milsurp powder I have (Lot #102 which is comparable to AA#2) and regular rifle primers proved to be a very-very mild load. They all went bang but accuracy was horrible (had about 6 keyholes). I am not the best shot in the world but I've not missed the paper since I first started shooting so I knew something was up. I then shot 6 factory made rounds and I got about 2" grouping at 25 yards which is still not good but acceptable I guess for open sights and old eyes.

It is obvious that my Bullseye and milsurp powders won't work and that I'll have to develop a more accurate load with a different powder but I am hoping I can find something that'll work equally well on both my pistol and rifle (I have in my workshop about 200 bullets of 300grain lead, and 500 bullets of 240 JSP). All recommendations will be welcomed

Scrounger
03-12-2008, 08:35 AM
Buy a loading manual, they have dozens of safe, usable loads that will work, and complete instructions.

MTWeatherman
03-12-2008, 01:49 PM
GCP....
I don’t know the twist of your rifle...but would put my bet on a 1 in 38. I believe the production of ‘94s with a 1 in 26 began closer to 2000. Easy way to determine twist is with a cleaning rod...insert a tight patch through the bore, pull it back so it’s into the throat...mark the cleaning rod at the muzzle with a dot...pull it back til it exits the muzzle...and check the dot to see how much of a revolution it's made...with a 16.5 inch barrel, a 26 inch twist will rotate nearly 2/3 turn...a 38 less than half.

Main issue with a 300 gr bullet in a 1 in 38 twist, as noted earlier in the thread, is bullet stabilization. Since most 300 gr. bullets are only marginally stabilized in a 1 in 38 (some better than others...its length that matters...not weight) and require heavy loads of slow burning powder to drive those bullets to 1400 fps plus to accomplish it...the use of Bullseye which would top out near 1000 fps is a non-starter.

Pushing a cast bullet beyond 1000 fps is not an issue with the correct alloy...plain base hard cast (and most commercial are) can be usually be pushed to 1200-1400 fps and gas checked beyond 2000 fps. However, that means you'll need a gas check to hope to stabilize that 300...so going to a slower powder won’t solve the issue if it's plain base.

You won’t have trouble stabilizing 240 gr. class bullets in a 38 inch twist rifle...either cast or jacketed. For full power performance and accuracy, H110 or W296 are tough to beat. However, they don’t safely lend themselves to any real load reduction. So, unless you want nothing but heavy loads, 2400 or especially BlueDot would make better choices because they don’t give up too much at the top end, yet work well with more sedate loadings. Any of those powders would work well for both your Ruger and Winchester.

gcp
03-12-2008, 10:06 PM
Scrounger, I own 3 reloading manuals, plus frequent online sites like Accurate, Alliant... and use them all the time for my various reloading needs :-D This 44mag Winchester is my first lever action and it's been giving me a bit of an accuracy problem. That's why I am asking my questions around here.

MTWeatherman, you are a wealth of information, thank you very much for your valuable input. I'll report back with my findings.....

Bass Ackward
03-13-2008, 05:35 AM
....thank you for your welcome and your input :drinks:. But I am confused on your Bullseye comment since the Lee reloading book specifies 6.1-6.8gr for 310 gr leads. Are you saying this will not be a good performer for the 300s? gcp


Gcp,

Sorry, I missed this before.

I own two 44s both with 38 twist. One will shoot this bullet. One will not. No matter what I do. But the one that does, stabilizes it at what can be termed top velocities. And anything that produces less velocity fails. So as MTW tells you, Bullseye is not helping your odds.

Some guys have good success with this, but that is my story.

gcp
03-13-2008, 07:08 AM
I understand Bass. Funny thing is that the 300s produced better accuracy than the 240s. I am now going back to the basics of separating brass, measuring my 240gr bullet diameters.... btw the bullets I recently bought are a Remington made (240 gr JSP), Midway bought value pack of 500 for close to $80 I believe. Maybe they are a defective product! In any case this weekend I'll shoot both the rifle and the pistol and see what gives with my loads. I have a bit of 2400 left so maybe I'll load some of it as well for comparison. I'll keep you posted guys.

JesterGrin_1
03-13-2008, 10:53 AM
There are LOTS of threads on the .44 Mag and 1-38 Twist. But I will give you two loads that work decent to me. One is a Lee 310Gr RNFP GC with 18.5Gr of W296 and CCI-300 Primer that gets about 2 1/2 group at 100 yards. Another is a 300Gr TCFP PB with the same powder charge and primer and will get a bit better than 2 1/2 group at 100 yards. You can get these two from Mike at MasterCast Bullets here on the forum at .431 size.

Another I have heard good things about here on the forum is the Ranch Dog 265Gr and 300Gr but have yet to try them. But I have some loaded up when the range opens back up to give them a go. :)

I would like to add when testing loads on the target load only 1 round at a time. :)

gcp
03-13-2008, 09:28 PM
JesterGrin_1, thanks for the recipes.

I just got through loading nine rounds of 2400 @ 17.5 grs, with large pistol primers (Federal No 150), and the 240gr JSPs on top. Never used regular primers with 2400 before, hope it'll do the job. These should be quite a bit hotter than the others...

dukers65
03-14-2008, 03:45 PM
you'll be fine with those federal primers. i always use winchester large pistol,that way i do not worry whether to use a mag. or regular primer,win.'s. are designed for either.

gcp
03-14-2008, 06:01 PM
Thank you for your inputs gentlemen, I 'll report back on Monday after I shoot my rounds :Fire:

OBXPilgrim
03-14-2008, 09:43 PM
What did yours slug out to?

My 1972 vintage 20" M94 saddle ring was at a whopping .432", which prompted me to get in on a Wide, Flat .44 Lee 6 banger GB (285-290gr) - drops .434", which was great.

Wish I could report that I've throughly rung out a clover-leaf cutting group out of it, but without much of in the way of range availability, I've just one decent load. My Lyman 429215 mold only drops .430" & I haven't even tried it. Guess I ought to anyway, never know til you try, huh?

Did get some good plinkers using Lee 240gr TL SWC with a 44 spl load.

gcp
03-16-2008, 09:14 PM
The milsurp Lot 102 didn't do good for me, again! Herc 2400 produced decent enough groups @ 25 yards but nothing to brag about. I am beginning to dislike this rifle!

Do any of you have personal experience with Jeff Bartlet's WC 820 powder? I talked to him 3-4 days ago and he suggested that I try it. It meters like AA#9 but it'll be a hot load like today's 2400, which was not bad at all, only a bit more.

PatMarlin
03-17-2008, 12:58 AM
I've got that aniversary model 94 in 45 colt. It's a shooter... :drinks:

Does yours have the brand in the stock?

gcp
03-17-2008, 07:33 AM
I don't believe so....which part of the stock are you referring to?

PatMarlin
03-17-2008, 08:00 AM
Here it is, a real cattle brand.. :mrgreen:

Mines not a large loop. I bought that rifle for $300 in mint condition right before Winchester bit the dust.

44man
03-17-2008, 08:42 AM
The 1 in 38 twist is the biggest pain in the butt ever made. I have the Marlin here, grandsons rifle, and have tried every boolit from 240 to 330 gr's. I have shot some VERY small groups at 50 yd's but from there to 100 it is hit or miss. The Lee 310 actually shoots fair at 100 but groups vary all the time from small to large. I have never had any key holes with any boolit. The gun has a tendency to throw one shot high right all the time.
I might have to buy the 429215 to try.
I made up a boolit and am trying something different. It weighs about 277 gr's with lube. I have 2 gas checks on it and so far I have put 4 out of 5 in 2" at 100 yd's but still got the high right shot. I made some more to test but it is a pain trying to get the front check straight in the mold and I toss back a lot of them so I can recover the check. Too expensive to waste! :-?
Anyway, here is a picture of it.

MtGun44
03-17-2008, 07:41 PM
Pretty trick. I assume you drill a hole in the front check/driving band.

Bill

44man
03-17-2008, 08:59 PM
Years ago I made a special punch setup that takes the center out perfectly. The check sits in a recess and has a guide that fits into it and the punch goes through the guide. One wack with a hammer cuts a nice little disk out.
I don't think anyone would try and drill the thing! :roll:

IcerUSA
03-18-2008, 01:00 AM
GCP , what I have found out with my 44 Blackhawk is with a 300 or 310gn GC boolit is that you will have to shoot it a little on the hot side , that being said , I used 296 and double checked my Lyman and Lee load books , I wasn't at max but about mid point in the load range and it shot well enough at 25 to take to the woods for deer season here in Michigan , still going to work on loads for it this year as soon as the weather get a tad warmer tho .
I also loaded the 310gn in my 444 and you do have to run it on the warm side there also , if I remember correctly I was over 2000fps in the Marlin , did a couple test loads with H110 and that also looked like it might work also , for sure H4198 worked in the 444 . IMR was a little too slow to get good groups from as I was testing and when I light off the H4198 load I knew it was the load as it went about 100 fps faster than the IMR load at max and the H load was at min .
I think you will find that a lighter boolit might be the ticket with a lighter load but I don't think it will be whole bunch , thinking about 1400 to 1600 in the rifle mite be about where it will turn out to do good , just my thoughts so take it for what it worth.
My Blackhawk has a 7.5 barrel and a scope on it so that also helps with the recoil so I don't think it shoots too bad , a shorter , lighter weapon might just make you hurt a bit also .
OK , I'm done rambling .

Keith

gcp
03-18-2008, 07:52 PM
OK guys, first off I am very appreciative of all your valuable inputs.

Shooting my 94 on Sunday indicated to me that this rifle's design does not allow it to be dead-on accurate. Can it do better than what it's done so far for me? Probably, but it'll take searching for the right recipe. Will it do as well as my Swiss or Swedes? Definitely not but one should not expect it to. So, today I ordered 8lbs of WC820 'cause after talking to Jeff Bartlett I figured it'll probably be a much better powder match for both my 44 mags and 45 LCs than the powder(s) I'm now using.

Got some pretty good recipes for the 44 mag but do you have suggestions for the 45 LC (200 gr lead)?

gcp
03-21-2008, 05:59 AM
Gang, I received the WC 820 powder yesterday so this am I loaded 18 rounds with 20gr of this particular WC 820 (Lot # 50272 pull-down), with my 240gr JSP. It seems to fill the case to where the bullet will be seated so lets see how well this 94 of mine likes this recipe.

gcp
03-23-2008, 06:34 AM
Eurika! Finally my rifle produced some decent results on a load I can improve on. 20.5 and 21 grains will be next and maybe even a scope to see how much I can dial it in. At least I won't be getting rid of the rifle under the lemon clause......

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0703/George/Winchester%2094/IMG_3523.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0703/George/Winchester%2094/IMG_3524.jpg

PatMarlin
03-23-2008, 10:18 AM
Wooohoo... some good shootin' now.. :drinks:

JesterGrin_1
03-23-2008, 10:28 AM
Well Pat he really needs to step out to 100 yards to really look at what he is doing. 25 and 50 might look nice but it could all fall apart at 100 lol. :)

PatMarlin
03-23-2008, 10:36 AM
Weel I know that Jester but keep your voice down cause he don't need to know that!... It's a start in the right direction.

gcp
03-23-2008, 11:17 AM
True enough, 100 yards will be the next step but if one is attempting to dial in a rifle one's got to start with methodical small steps before taking leaps.

Frankly, I've never had such problems with a rifle, with the exceptions of an AK and an SKS. And I'd hate to think that this Winchester can rate as badly as those two but now days one never knows. After all American engineering and workmanship does not appear to be what it once was. But I'll keep working at it, for nostalgia's sake if nothing else. After all IT IS the cowboy lever action of the infamous west [smilie=1: and it nicely complements my two Vaqueros

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0703/George/Vaquero/IMG_3459.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/0703/George/Vaquero/Vaquero.jpg

PatMarlin
03-23-2008, 11:52 AM
That's some nice leather GCP.

I used to do leather work when I was a kid, and I still have all of my tools. I was looking at them the other day, and I have every one of those stamps that are used on your holster.

I need to get set up, and start with it again. To many hobbies and not enough time.

gcp
03-23-2008, 12:14 PM
Pat, that's Old Western Reproduction work there, guy does an excellent job!! Waiting on a wide belt now to be made that'll keep these two rigs on me.

Leather work is an impressive art get back into it.

PatMarlin
03-23-2008, 12:34 PM
Beautiful.

It's really not difficult. If you can cut and trace a pattern, draw a line, hold a stamp on the line and use your imagination you can make that holster.

My Gerber multi tool knife has a belt holster that's worn all to crap. I'm gonna loose it if I don't make one pronto.