Lee 230 5r ,bt.

[drinks]

I have the new Lee 230gr, 5r bt spitzer mold.
A friend has a program that can calculate the bc, at least close enough for my purposes.
It has a bc of .450 at 1800 fps.
I ran some tables on it, at 1800 fps, it still has 1400 fps and over 1000 flb of energy at 300 yds.
I can see some poacher special loads on the horizon!
Have not run it at 1200 fps yet, but it should be interesting there, too.

[frkelly74]

Where did you find that mold? I was sort of looking for one to play with. 308 black wisperer is what I was thinking of.

[drinks]

I ordered it from Midway.
I have just run the figures at 1200 fps and at 2200 fps.
This is likely to be a VERY popular bullet, at 2200 fps, it was going very fast at even 500 yds and with a lot of energy, just a very rainbow trajectory.
Would never bother us old .45-70 lovers!!!!!!!!!

[Bullshop]

I went to the Lee site but dont see this on their list of designs. Got a link to it?

[drinks]

Just try Midway, that is what I did.
They have it out of stock now.

[nhrifle]

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/938614/lee-2-cavity-bullet-mold-tl309-230-5r-30-caliber-309-diameter-230-grain-300-aac-blackout-tumble-lube-5-ogive-radius

That's the special order mould that Midway contracted with Lee to have cut. They designed it specifically for the 300 AAC Blackout to be shot subsonic. So far, I havn't had much luck shooting it much above 1000 fps or so.

[Bullshop]

What is the intended twist?

[Doc_Stihl]

I use that mold in my 30/06 at 1550 fps and at 1200 fps. VERY accurate.
I just finished putting together my lower and I'm waiting on a few more parts to finish my 300 AAC ar build so that I can try it in that.

Come spring I'll be trying to work a load up in the 30/06 to get 1800 fps with WC872.

[Tom Myers]

What is the intended twist?

According to calculations at the

Precision Twist Rate Calculator (http://www.tmtpages.com/twistrate.htm)

1100 fps would require a twist rate of 1 in 8.1"
1800 fps would require a twist rate of 1 in 10.3"

Keep in mind that these are only calculations and real world situations can be substantially different.

[Bullshop]

What twist is being used in the 300aac/ 300 black out?
Has anyone had success getting this design to the calculated velocity needed for a 1/10" twist, approaching 1800 fps?

[Ironduke]

I shoot this bullet from my 10 twist 300/221 fireball (pre-blackout, I have had this upper for 7-8 years) and it shoots great for me so far. I cast from 92%Pb, 6% tin, 2% antimony and the bullets weight right at 220 gr. Over 12gr of Reloder 7 the action cycles reliably, and velocity hovers around 1100-1130 fps. Accuracy with my rifle is on par with other J loads using this sighting set-up.

61799

You can see the holes are nice and round--no sign of wobble or keyholing. This is from a 10 twist barrel subsonic.

[runfiverun]

i think the blackout barells are mainly 1-8.
there are a few places that you can order them with a 1-10.
i have always wanted a 1-10 to try the rcbs 165 silh or the similar group buy for the k-31 in one at 1900.

[leadman]

I have been shooting it in my 1 in 8 300 Whisper and my 60's era Savage 110DL in 30-06. There are more accurate boolits than this one. It will accept a gas check and it does shoot better with one.
I shot it at about 1,800 in my Savage and got 2" groups at 100 yards. The Whisper is not shooting as well at subsonic or super sonic loads.
Some of my first boolits were bent dropping them out of the mold too soon so be aware of this.
It is a very long boolit and the cavities are very close to the alignment pins. I have to squeeze the handles tightly or a get a flashing on the nose.
I guess for $20 it is something to play with.

[Bullshop]

This is very interesting to me. The calculated required velocity from a 10" twist is about 1800 fps but we have shooters claiming good accuracy at 1100 fps from a 10" twist.
That is more than just a slight discrepency. Is there a flaw in the calculation system? Maybe we need a different system!
So I am still woundering if there is any chance at all that these may stabalise in a 308 Win with 1/12" twist.
From shooters input I think possibly but from calculator I think not

[stubshaft]

I shoot it in a fourteen 7.62X39 barrel on a Tender frame. It is loaded with 8.8 AA#9 and gets a whopping 950fps. When the wind cooperates it'll do <1/2"@ 50yds. It doesn't know that the 9.5" twist is not supposed to stabilize it.

[Chicken Thief]

Will someone sell me one of those lovely Lee moulds?

Before you start, Midwayusa wont ship to Denmark and Midwaydanmark does not carry that mould.

So for now all i can do is drool http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm153/Chickenthief/Blandet/Smilere/smiley-excited001.gif

[Chicken Thief]

Got a RCBS 416-350-FN to trade?

[Chicken Thief]

Here is twist rate calcs with another "program"

It's a spreadsheet made by Don Miller:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Miller_twist_rule

Can be downloaded here:
http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=&esrc=s&source=web&cd=4&ved=0CEkQFjAD&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.bkmorrow.com%2FWestCoastTacti calRimfireLeague%2FLinks%2520and%2520files%2FTwist _formula.xls&ei=feg9Ub6vFITdsgabjIHQBQ&usg=AFQjCNEdPvP1v3Dn09UJQRjWwR_oA_6lkg&bvm=bv.43287494,d.Yms

Calcs:
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm153/Chickenthief/Skydning/Til%20andre/300AAC_zps3c0e670e.jpg

So this might give an idea as to why the boolit works at subsonic speeds in a 1:10 barrel. In a 1:12 speed needs to be above 1600fps.

Cant wait to test mine in my 30-06 and Schmidt_Rubin 1911

[cs86]

I'm still pretty new to casting, but isn't it after about 1200fps that you have to start gas checking the boolits? What would me a maximum velocity for a 30cal boolit for the weight thats been mentioned? 1600fps seems to be up there and I was wondering if it would work in my 308 with a 1/12 twist.

[Chicken Thief]

Nah if alloy is good the beast lives above 2000fps, but this design is not intended for a GC, so you have to go "naked".
If you run BHN above 12 then i see no problem gettin more than 1600fps out of your 308.
Remember this design is ment to go slow ie. under the speed of sound 1150fps'ish.

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm153/Chickenthief/Skydning/Til%20andre/R0011305_zps706414cc.jpg

[cs86]

So would wheel weight alloy be good enough to push up to...1800fps?

[Chicken Thief]

Leading has to do mainly with two things:
1) Boolit fit in the bore ie. sized diameter.
2) Lube, type and amount.

So yes it can be done, but unless you're experienced, it is a crawl not a run.

Shoot, measure speed and check for leading. Increase speed and repeat.

If you want a crash course in cast boolit shooting then the "Bible" is:
JACKETED PERFORMANCE WITH CAST BULLETS By Veral Smith

http://lbtmoulds.com/books.shtml

[Chicken Thief]

I learned more from that book than i already knew, and i've cast for close to 30yrs.

[cs86]

When people experience leading is it apparent after the first shot or does it take a few shots and it builds up gradually? I have casted some .45 and they are lubed. I was just giving it some rest time to harden so I could load them and shoot lead cast bullets for the first time.

[Chicken Thief]

Leading builds up. A little at first, but then a base is made wich adheres more lead and the snowball effect is at large.

[Jim]

63732

[DLCTEX]

Nah if alloy is good the beast lives above 2000fps, but this design is not intended for a GC, so you have to go "naked".
If you run BHN above 12 then i see no problem gettin more than 1600fps out of your 308.
Remember this design is ment to go slow ie. under the speed of sound 1150fps

http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm153/Chickenthief/Skydning/Til%20andre/R0011305_zps706414cc.jpg

Did you get a mould or find a pic?

[leadman]

This boolit will take a gas check with no problem. It does shoot much better with the GC even at subsonic speeds but it probably hurts the BC.

[Chicken Thief]

Did you get a mould or find a pic?

Yup :-D
Made a deal and got one from Midwayusa

[Chicken Thief]

I shot a little today with this boolit in my 30-06 at @ MACH1
Here's 15 shots in a windy 50m distance.
http://i295.photobucket.com/albums/mm153/Chickenthief/Skydning/Til%20andre/R0011313_zpsffee5ffa.jpg

The others are a sad 25-20 with boolits to long thus they tilt and make oval holes.