Undersize balls vs. coning the barrel

[shane438]

I was reading on a muzzleloader forum about the lack of relic short starters in any collections. The debate ran into coning the barrel and people didn't seem to think they did that either. Then one guy comes along and says that from the original rifles and molds he's seen they ran balls that were more undersized than the norm today and didn't need short starters. It interests me a lot, should I try a .340 or a .345 for my .36 cal? Any ideas here?

[DIRT Farmer]

I haven't had much trouble with renagades comming around the house lately since the evil black hotgun has been in the corner, so I follow what the target shooters use. I use a .319 in the 32, 400 in the 40, 495 in the 50 and 530 in the 54. all are green mountain with ticking.

[fouronesix]

This is brought up here once in a while. Other than a bunch of anecdotal stuff, it's kind of hard to document accuracy today with accuracy 200 years ago. I wouldn't doubt most of the early PRB rifle shooters used the easy-to-load fit that didn't require a starter. Not hard to do a few tests of loose vs tight PRB, at least from one rifle. Then report results.

[GARD72977]

I haven't had much trouble with renagades comming around the house lately since the evil black hotgun has been in the corner, so I follow what the target shooters use. I use a .319 in the 32, 400 in the 40, 495 in the 50 and 530 in the 54. all are green mountain with ticking.

I would like to hear more about the .319 in a 32cal. What twist? Powder charge? Please tell us a little about it.

[shane438]

I was looking on the Pedersoli website and they make a .345 rb mold for the .36 cal. I think I'm going to try that out if I can find one.

[fouronesix]

I was looking on the Pedersoli website and they make a .345 rb mold for the .36 cal. I think I'm going to try that out if I can find one.

You can also check here: about $27 shipped- Just a thought in case the Pedersoli is expensive or you can't get it.
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=329934117

[Hanshi]

For many years I seated ball using nothing other than the under barrel wood rod. No trick at all with young hands. Never tried coning.

[10 ga]

I prefer the smaller RB deal. Shoot .490 in my 50s and .562 in my 58. Easy enough to seat the PRB with thumb pressure and then down the tube with the ramrod. Just as accurate as tighter fit IME and way easier to load. 10

[bob208]

it mite shoot good enough then it mite not. i know we tried some coned barrels they did not shoot all that good. not as good as a loser fitting patch and ball combo. if you get into a real rush like the bad guys are closing in just run the ball down the barrel with out a patch. i did that once on a woods walk hit a man size target at 25 yards 9 out of 10 times in 1 min.

[Mike Brooks]

Loose fit = fouled barrel. Tight patch/ball = superior accuracy and a clean bore. The old timers used coned barrels and loose fit. That's fine for them, but I want better accuracy.

[shane438]

I think I'm going to try some .345 balls. I can always use the mold for buckshot if I don't like it.

[DIRT Farmer]

Gard, I use Green Mountain barrels the 32 is 1 in 48 The gun is a flinter I built with a 42 inch barrel. The ball is from a Lyman .319 pure lead or as close as I can find and ticking patches. 25 grains of Goex fffg.

My brother and I used to shoot green walnuts from the tree in the back yard shooting up at a steep angle like squrriel hunting. the rule was if any of the nut or hull was still on the stem you had to shoot it off before going to the next one. When I could see, that combo would take the stem off.

[GARD72977]

Gard, I use Green Mountain barrels the 32 is 1 in 48 The gun is a flinter I built with a 42 inch barrel. The ball is from a Lyman .319 pure lead or as close as I can find and ticking patches. 25 grains of Goex fffg.

My brother and I used to shoot green walnuts from the tree in the back yard shooting up at a steep angle like squrriel hunting. the rule was if any of the nut or hull was still on the stem you had to shoot it off before going to the next one. When I could see, that combo would take the stem off.

You have inspired me to try larger molds.

[Boz330]

Accuracy is a relative term. If you want minute of squirrel head accuracy that is one thing or use a trade gun. Minute of deer or man wanting to separate you from your Top Knot is something different and doesn't demand the same parameters.
Modern man shoots a ML for fun and can afford to demand maximum accuracy. Our forefathers depended on a gun for protection and to put meat on the table and everyone had one. I'm guessing that most of them weren't the marksmen that we would like to think they were. They used what worked for them. Best all around weapon would have been a trade gun, RB or shot as needed. In the backwoods they didn't have the luxury of powder and ball on every corner and probably didn't shoot a lot just for fun or practice.

Bob

[mooman76]

You could also try a slightly thinner patch for easier loading.

[Hanshi]

I find myself agreeing with Mike Brooks. Though I own a couple of guns that require a patch of .015" to .018", I normally use a .024" patch. My .45 flint shoots amazingly well with either .440" or .445" ball and a .024" patch. They both load with the same ease since each shot cleans the bore of the previous fouling. While I don't like to struggle trying to seat a prb, I detest a loose prb. My only requirement is that they seat safely using just the wood, under barrel rod. That's what I do in the woods and if it doesn't work, then I don't want it.

[Mike Brooks]

I find myself agreeing with Mike Brooks.
SHOCKING!:holysheep

[DIRT Farmer]

Mike I may not always agree on every point of shooting with you but from what I have seen of your work you build a way purdderyer gun than me.

[Marvin S]

I dont believe in coneing but instead a nice smooth radius crown and a tight fit PRB bumped in with a short starter. I dont see much difference between excess cleaning rod wear and coneing.

[DIRT Farmer]

Proper coning is most likely more consistant than ram rod wear unless you are anal about rotating the gun while loading.
A good many poor shooting guns have been saved by cutting the barrel back an inch and recrowning.

[Hanshi]

SHOCKING!:holysheep



He, he, he, he...... Weird things do happen from time to time.[smilie=f: I even saw a pig flying on a tv commercial the other night!