44 mag powder

[Blammer]

I have a 10" contender in 44 mag.

I have been given 20 bullets, GC and wt of 260gr with an awesome meplat.

I have Bluedot, W296 and 2400.

(plus a few others)

I want to try to develope a decent load (accuracy and velocity) with the shortest amount of testing.

What powder would you start with?

[chevyiron420]

2400:castmine:

[MK111]

I would go with the W296. There is only one load and that is a full load. And It has always shot good for me.

[AZ-Stew]

+1 for 2400.

I'd also start with 100 bullets. Finding a "good" or "great" load with only 20 bullets is, to be kind, wishful thinking.

Regards,

Stew

[Bula]

I shoot full Lyman 429421's loads with 2400. They shoot great, relatively clean and very accurate.

[44man]

296 has always given me the best accuracy. I would work loads because the best will be just under max loads. I go 1/2 gr at a time.

[racepres]

I'll be the "lone voice" for Blue Dot. 15.0 gr. of it behind most any cb, gives at least acceptable accuracy in my Contender. MV

[felix]

Nope, not a lone voice. 14.5 grains of BD with the 245 lyman keith has been my mainstay load before the discovery of WC820. It is still the most cost effective performance combination there is. Cost includes the components and the wear and tear on everything. ... felix

[S.R.Custom]

None of the above... Heavy cast bullets + accuracy = H4227

[mag_01]

For me 2400 dose the trick with a 255gr. boolit and 25grs. of 2400 --- This is a hot heavy load --- should start with 18grs. and work up --- This load gives the x ring somthing to worry about. ---- Mag_01


:castmine: :Fire: :Fire: :Fire:

[Sundogg1911]

I'll second what Mag_01 says with the 2400
mine fly out of a Taurus M44 8 3/8" ported barrel
they bark, but i've found the 2400 to be the most accurate for me with heavy lead

[44man]

Supermag, get the barrel hot and tell us that!

[Lloyd Smale]

44 man i had a couple 44s out today and shot the accusprort with 20 grains of h4227 and a 300 lbt lfngc. It was 90 hear today. Pretty exceptional for this area. I shot a 6 shot group that went into an inch at 25 and then proceded to blast up a bunch of light stuff. I got dinking with the sights and had to reajust them at the end and fired 6 more getting them on target and 6 more into a less then one inch group. THIS GUN WAS HOT! It was shot amost unstopped except to load and unload and the few minutes i spent ajusting the sights. Sorry but im with supermag. The hands down most accurate powder for moderate velocitys (@1200fps) in both the 44 mag and the 45 colt has been h4227 with wc820 hot on its heals. Id have to rate 110 4th behind these two and 2400 when it comes to consistant accuracy accross the board with differnt guns and differnt heavy bullets. Dont get me wrong 110 can produce some good groups but ive yet to see a gun that ive gotten the absolute best accuracy using heavy cast with 110 or 296 and ill throw lilgun in there too. I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this one. If im looking for a economy load like felix is refering to the one go to powder has allways be hs6 its a much more stable powder then bluedot and has allways given be at least as good of accuracy. Only downside to it is that to make it work good it needs a mag primer. As does 4227. No big deal to me as i stock alot of them for the big guns and there no more expensive to buy.
None of the above... Heavy cast bullets + accuracy = H4227

[S.R.Custom]

Supermag, get the barrel hot and tell us that!

Blue Dot and the hot ball powders are probably the best for jacketed bullet loads, but they're way too hot for lead bullet work when you're firewalling. The Smith & Wessons like the ball powders, and the Rugers seem to favor a case full of Blue Dot.

When you switch to lead projectiles, I've found that 2400 works best with plain base bullets, to a point. As you can imagine, when the pressures start to escalate, accuracy goes to hell. Now when I put a gascheck on a 300 gr. lead bullet and squish it down on a case full of H4227, I get the best accuracy from just about any gun I care to put it through. Including the SuperMags. Now, you lose a spoonful of velocity with H4227, but not much. And what good is that measley 60 fps if you miss? :mrgreen:

As for barrel temps, well, I've found barrel temperature to be irrelevant in anything other than a rifle. That's assuming, of course, you don't let a loaded round sit for too long in a hot chamber.

[44man]

My experience with both 4227's in revolvers was very bad. I started with it for silhouette and got super 200 meter groups. But on the range, as the gun got hot the velocity would increase and shots would hit lower and lower until my last 200 meter shot would hit 50 yd's short with 16 clicks more elevation then the first ram. Primers would get flatter and flatter as I went. A reduced load also flattened primers. The powders are very heat sensitive. I kept inspecting my gun thinking the barrel split or something.
I switched to 296 and won Ohio State with 79 out of 80.
4227 NEVER goes in my .44 cases. It worked like a charm in the .357 max and it works in other calibers OK. If it was the only powder I had, I would buy factory loads.

[454PB]

35 years ago when I started loading for .44 magnum, Hercules 2400 was THE powder. I went through a lot of it, in both .44 and .357 magnums, but began having problems with unburned powder jamming up the works. I'd see a lot of yellow powder residue and it would find it's way under the ejector ring in my S&W .357 to the point that it locked the cylinder closed. I tried magnum primers, heavier crimps, and still could not get it to burn cleanly. IMR 4227 was an extremely accurate powder, but I could not get enough in the case to propel my favorite 429421's and 429244's to equal the velocity of 2400. I began trying other powders and H-110 became my "go to" powder for all my magnum revolvers. I also tried some of the slower shotgun powders like Unique, Herco, and Bluedot. I bought a chronograph back when they still used fragible screens, and soon learned that Bluedot would achieve nearly the same velocity as H-110, WW 296, 2400, or 4227 with a 20% lighter charge weight, and the same accuracy levels.

More recently I've been using WC 820 and Lil'Gun, both are fine powders in the .44 magnum. I've found WC 820 to be nearly the same burn rate as the old Hercules 2400, and 22 grs. pushes a 250 gr. cast boolit to the same velocity as my old records indicate. I like the Lil'Gun so much I ordered another 24 pounds.

[S.R.Custom]

44man: Wow, that's weird... I was turned onto H4227 years ago after reading an article by John Taffin where he used H4227 to coax magnum-like velocities out of a Model 24 with very .44 special-esque pressures. My experiences more resemble his than yours...

[mtgrs737]

I have always like Blue Dot for the least charge weight and the most velocity. I have never had an accuracy problem with Blue Dot, I have had a problem with 2400 leaving residue that I didn't want to clean up. However 2400 did shoot as well as Blue Dot. I have also used 296 and H110 and I like the way they measure. Still a BD fan though. +1

[Bass Ackward]

Ever wonder why I have sizers in 44 from .429 to .435 in .0005 increments?

Well ...... when you are an obturator, your options are limited. You can only get so much neck tension and so much crimp. If the pressure comes up too slowly, you gas cut.

So why can one guy shoot 4227 and another can't?

For faster powders in a 44, I obturate.
For slow powders I size exactly to throat. Not push through, but exact.
If I want to shoot 4227, I either size to throat or go .001 over.
If I want to burn RL#7 I might go .003 over throat which is as big as I can reliably chamber without dirt problems. I don't get hot barrels and I can burn anything up to that point.

The most common thing to change for caster is bullet hardness. That's a PIA and not for me. I mold in the winter for shooing all year and consider it an inconvenience to stop shooting and mold any other time unless it's for experimentation.

You have to be flexible or risk being pigeon holed to a few powders.

[44man]

Supermag, I was using jacketed silhouette bullets at the time. Maybe there is a difference in how 4227 acts in a single shot or a revolver. I always use very tight neck tension too, it fact you can see the GG's through the brass with my cast boolits.
With a boolit against the lands in a single shot, maybe the burn is evened out.
I always loaded for extreme accuracy, my model 29's would shoot 1/2" groups at 50 meters using 296 and open sights. Problem is the 29's are super grip sensitive and never did good in silhouette.
I tried H110 and never got as good with it except in a standard Redhawk. The Redhawk hated 296. My BFR's and Rugers, including the Super Redhawk I had, all love 296 and hate H110. Hodgden and WW have different burn rate specs for the powder and it will show up in whatever your gun is. You have to test both.
When I was first loading the 4227's in my SBH, I shot many sub 3" 200 meter groups with open sights and thought I could win any shoot. But I shot the gun very slow and it was cold out so the gun stayed cool while I walked the distance to check targets. The speed and heat of a shoot showed a different side to the powder.
Using 4227 in my Ruger .357 max, I shot a 39 with no sight settings since it was a new gun and I only went to the shoot to get the settings. I could not miss!
Anyway, it never goes in my .44 or .45 again. Velocity doesn't mean a thing if you just blow holes in the air.
I use Unique and 231 in the .44 for plinking, Blue Dot is very accurate but for velocity with accuracy, 296 is all I use. I once put 12 out of 12 shots through a 5 gallon bucket at 400 yd's with my SRH. What more could I ask for? I wish I still had the vision I had then!

[felix]

Looks like you guys pretty much summed it all up. BA via engineering, 44Man via heuristics to obtain the final objectives of accomplishing the goal of accuracy with commensurate power. Perfect teamwork if you ask me. ... felix

[Blammer]

YEP! thanks!

no DEFINITIVE powder choice just a bunch of good ones! Meaning everyone didn't pick the same powder.