Where do the "Shiny Boolits" come from?

[HeadLead]

I am fairly new to casting and still have so much to learn. One question I have is: How do you guys achieve "shiny boolits"? Mine are decent looking, but many of the pictures I have seen here are of really nice looking (shiny) bullets. Are these dressed up for the pictures or are they real? If they are real, what is done to produce these results.

I use a PID controller on my Lee Pro-4 20 bottom pour unit and I have nice clean alloy. My molds are brought up to temp before I cast and they are smoked for better release.

What can I do to get better looking (shiny) cast boolits?

Thanks for any insight or information.

[Sir Castalot]

Good question, I've seen some alloy batches come out shineing and some, not so much . So it must be the batching. I use a pencil, and draw all over the inside of the molds, I tried the smoke method, and went right back to the pencil. Luck

[savingprivateyang]

From what I understand it's all about alloy. Tin adds decent shine from my experience.

[Sasquatch-1]

Good question, I've seen some alloy batches come out shineing and some, not so much . So it must be the batching. I use a pencil, and draw all over the inside of the molds, I tried the smoke method, and went right back to the pencil. Luck

The next time you go to the hardware store look for a tube of lock lubricant. It's nothing but powder graphite and will make your job a little easier.

[btroj]

Shiny bullets are from the right alloy and right mold temp. Higher antimony makes it harder to get shiny bullets in many cases.
I don't really want shiny bullets, in most cases for me it means too cold a mould. I prefer a nice, even, consistent mat finish. It means the mould is consistent in temp and it makes for ore consistent size and weight bullets.
I want bullets that shoot well, not at all concerned with the surface finish. For me mat finish is better.

[winelover]

Shiny bullets are from the right alloy and right mold temp. Higher antimony makes it harder to get shiny bullets in many cases.
I don't really want shiny bullets, in most cases for me it means too cold a mould. I prefer a nice, even, consistent mat finish. It means the mould is consistent in temp and it makes for ore consistent size and weight bullets.
I want bullets that shoot well, not at all concerned with the surface finish. For me mat finish is better.


Been my experience, also.

Winelover

[shredder]

I have heard that booloits cast from a dipper are more likely to be shiny. Bottom pours run at a typically higher temp and produce less shiny boollits as a result. Since I do not cast with a dipper I can't comment on the accuracy of that statement. I do not get bent over a bit less shiny results.

[youngda9]

Shiny bullets are from the right alloy and right mold temp. Higher antimony makes it harder to get shiny bullets in many cases.
I don't really want shiny bullets, in most cases for me it means too cold a mould. I prefer a nice, even, consistent mat finish. It means the mould is consistent in temp and it makes for ore consistent size and weight bullets.
I want bullets that shoot well, not at all concerned with the surface finish. For me mat finish is better.
+1 to this.

I think there is a small temperature window between matte and wrinkled in which Shiny exists. My wrinkled bullets (caused by cold mold) are always shiny. Matte is what you should shoot for.

Cast Boolits is not a beauty contest :)

[badgeredd]

Shiny boolits do not go faster or are not more accurate. Sure they look purdy but do you think the target cares? Mine will continue to has a light matt finish and continue to be +/- .2 grains or less. Accuracy is the end goal not pretty>

Edd

[Jim Flinchbaugh]

AS has been stated, the shiny comes form the mold temperature. you can pour 650* lead
or 850* lead and still get shiny by controlling the mold temp, which is done by varying
your casting speed. I find that I get more consistent boolit weights achieving the the slight matte
finish Edd and others mentioned. Sometimes depending on the mold, I have difficulty getting the
boolits to drop free with a frosty finish on them.

[HeadLead]

Sounds like I must be doing it close to right then, just not getting shiny results. I appreciate all the good responses and look forward to continuing my education here.

[357maximum]

If you wanna make em pretty and shiny to impress your friends.... add lots of tin and cast them coooler than normal and do not waterdrop them, it ruins the shine. If your friends and the critters you hunt are more impressed by teeny tiny groups...keep doing what you are doing.

[runfiverun]

i'll have to ask my wife.
she is one of those that can make them a nice shiney chrome looking finished boolit.
mine are all grey [i can see the mold lines,and cutting swirls in my boolits though]
if i want them shiney bright i size them.

[fecmech]

Rub your boolits on an old rag or towel and then they will be shiny!:-D

[Del-Ray]

I've never really got shiny before.

Then I tried my new Lyman mold for my 40-60 and after a light smoking bullets were dropping perfect. Well, I turn my LEE on until the thermometer shows about 650F, then off till it hits about 600F. This time I didn't notice as my bullets were coming out bloody PERFECT. They were shiny just like the "pros" get here. I looked at the temp, if the Lyman thermometer was correct it was at 550F.

I've never had good casts that cool before.

[HeadLead]

One day I will play with several different temp. ranges to see what results in size, weight and appearance I get.

Something to look forward to and keep me out of trouble.

[bosterr]

Yesterday, I tried out a new Lee TL314-90-SWC (new style 2 cavity with pins and bushings). PID controlled at 800 degrees and straight wheel weights. The mold is fantastic and they dropped out looking like chrome. Without adding more material, I started up a Lee C501-440-RF. Left PID at 800 degrees, should have dropped it to 750 at least. They dropped out with a nice satin finish. It took a long time for the sprue to harden. Way too hot, but it was working real good, so I left everything the same.

[MBTcustom]

I think I know the pictures you are referring to. If you mean shiny like a mirror, that aint gonna happen. Those boolits were polished with a rag for presentation. Smoking the mold, or rubbing graphite on it, will do nothing but make your boolits a tiny bit smaller in diameter. A properly prepared mold will be clean as a new penny, and will drop perfectly consistent boolits from clean cavities. The only stuff I put on my molds is Bull-plate lube, and that does a lot to make the hinge point last longer on the mold, before you have to take it to a machinist to have the top of the mold resurfaced (which will need to be done occasionally).
The prettiest boolits I have cast to date came from a mold I bought from Accurate. The cavities on that mold had a mirror finish, and the boolit was extremely smooth, but still not what I would call "shiny".
When I take pictures of my cartridges, I will often twist the cartridges in 0000 steel wool to polish the brass, and twist the boolit while pinching it between my fingers in a paper towel. That makes them look like a million bucks, but does nothing for performance. It's just a matter of showmanship. If you got somebody coming over to the house, you bust out the nice silverware, and rake a pattern in living-room rug, ya know?

[captaint]

My shiney boolits come from a mold that is not quite up to temp. Then again, we can wipe them off after loading and shine them right on up. I like mine a little frosted. They seem to fill out better. Mike

[AviatorTroy]

Mine are usually frosty. I go through a range where the mold is too cold, the I get a couple pretty ones, then they go frosty on me. But the frosty ones shoot the same, and may hold lube better since I mostly tumble lube.

[montana_charlie]

I think I know the pictures you are referring to. If you mean shiny like a mirror, that aint gonna happen. Those boolits were polished with a rag for presentation.

The prettiest boolits I have cast to date came from a mold I bought from Accurate. The cavities on that mold had a mirror finish, and the boolit was extremely smooth, but still not what I would call "shiny".

When I take pictures of my cartridges, I will often twist the cartridges in 0000 steel wool to polish the brass, and twist the boolit while pinching it between my fingers in a paper towel.
Do you suppose he was referring to pictures posted by you ... where you shined them up?
If that is your supposition, you are probably right.

But, if your claim is that all the rest of us 'polish' bullets before photographing ... how can you back that up?

I photographed this bullet and posted the picture simply to show a newby what a sharp base corner looks like. It was certainly not necessary to polish the bullet to illustrate that feature, and most of the bullet is not visible ... making a polishing even more unnecessary.
So just to establish context, would this (unpolished) bullet fit your definition of 'shiny'?

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=53265&d=1331866159

Ninety percent of my 'keepers' have a surface like this.
I don't polish anything, and most of the bullets I take pictures have been fired into snowbanks.
After all of that, some of them are still pretty shiny ...

CM

[phaessler]

Rub your boolits on an old rag or towel and then they will be shiny!:-D

The secrets out, I do it after I assemble my reloads, but only if they will be seen by my peers at the range.

Pete

[largom]

The Lone Ranger took all of my shiny boolits.

[lwknight]

The pretty bullets come from molds just barely hot enough usually requiring higher casting temp to get a good fill out. Running high cast temp makes you run the mold slower thus slowing your production rate.

Antimony causes the matte finish and a higher tin content can make the finish smoother.

A slight matte finish and good fill out just means that everything is running smoothly.

[Sasquatch-1]

After following this thread for a while, why are you worried if they are shiney or not? You're just going to put lube on them and dull them up. [smilie=1:

[MBTcustom]

Do you suppose he was referring to pictures posted by you ... where you shined them up?
If that is your supposition, you are probably right.

But, if your claim is that all the rest of us 'polish' bullets before photographing ... how can you back that up?

I photographed this bullet and posted the picture simply to show a newby what a sharp base corner looks like. It was certainly not necessary to polish the bullet to illustrate that feature, and most of the bullet is not visible ... making a polishing even more unnecessary.
So just to establish context, would this (unpolished) bullet fit your definition of 'shiny'?

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=53265&d=1331866159

Ninety percent of my 'keepers' have a surface like this.
I don't polish anything, and most of the bullets I take pictures have been fired into snowbanks.
After all of that, some of them are still pretty shiny ...

CM

No, that is what I consider normal. I saw a guy that posted pictures of some assembled cartridges that put the Lone Rnager to shame! I'm talking about almost seeing the cameraman in the reflection of the boolits. I'll see if I can find those pictures.
Looks like you got some wrinkling on the base of that boolit there MC, you might try getting the mold just a touch hotter LOL!:kidding:
I'll tell ya who has about the pretyest boolits strait from the mold, check out Cbrick's avatar. That's about is good as it gets.

[montana_charlie]

I'll tell ya who has about the pretyest boolits strait from the mold, check out Cbrick's avatar. That's about is good as it gets.
That's just a frosty one that has been run through a sizing die that made the corners sharp and the bands shiny.

CM

[swheeler]

Where do the "Shiny Boolits" come from? San Francisco;)

[dragon813gt]

My bullets are not worthy of this thread since they're dull :(
http://i198.photobucket.com/albums/aa39/dragon813gt/Firearms/Reloading/83B54A3A-0E40-4D7A-84E3-78314C4F0AA0-10463-0000057F34BB2501.jpg

Anytime I have produced shiny bullets they're also wrinkled. They always end up back in the pot.

[Bullwolf]

I use a lead alloy that is mostly a blend of printing press type metal. My family was in the offset printing press business before the computer age, and consequently I ended up with a large quantity of lead type on hand when the printing press became somewhat obsolete. It will cast a real shiny boolit, but less so when cut pure or softer lead, or even enough WW (Wheel Weight) lead.

The majority of my lead stash is made up of this alloy. Before someone tells me how wasteful it is to cast handgun boolits out of straight Lino, I need to point out that this was the only lead that I had when I first got started casting any kind of lead at all, let alone casting boolits. I had many 100's of pounds of it on hand, and it was also free. Most of my projects were cast out of this lead many years before I ever cast my first boolit.

I would melt lead into automotive ballast, Soap Box Derby weights, lead toy figurines, Pine Wood derby cars, lead diving belt weights, fishing sinkers, and even my first black powder round balls were cast from printing press lead type. I would use a gas Coleman stove or a torch to melt lead into whatever form I need or wanted. It was only a matter of time before I made the next logical step and tried to make the print type lead into my first cast boolits.

It was a quite a while before I bothered to melt Wheel Weights at all, or started scrounging for other kinds of lead, simply because I had so much lead printing press type. Once I even swapped a few (3-4) full 5 gallon buckets full of type to another caster, in trade for a S&W J-frame chambered in 9mm at a gun show. The lead wasn't in ingot form yet, just buckets full of loose metal type.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52418&thumb=1&d=1338931223http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52416&thumb=1&d=1338931223

While that trade seemed like a good idea at the time, I would likely keep the printing type around today instead of trading it, since it would be somewhat difficult to replace now. I have since learned the value of it as a sweetening alloy, and I try to stretch it out by cutting the type metal with pure or softer lead whenever possible.

I had more printing type on hand than I was willing to smelt down into ingots. At some point I simply gave up and left a large quantity of it still in type form. I then stored it all in various 5 gallon buckets, boxes, and other containers. I smelted as much as I could a into many a muffin pan ingot, and diving weight ingots and stored those in the square boxes that you use to carry milk cartons.

My type metal alloy is mostly a mixture of Lino, Mono, Foundry type, and lots of spacers. It will cast with a somewhat strange pink/purplish color, and it is quite hard. If not thinned out with softer lead, it can be brittle almost to the point of being prone to breakage. It really rings when dropped on concrete.

More relevant to this thread however, is that this alloy casts a VERY shiny boolit when air cooled. The pink/purple color seems to be some kind of surface oxidation. The truth is I really don't know what it is, as I have never had the alloys exact makeup definitively measured. So much for repeatability. I suspected the color might be a result of Bismuth being in the alloy since that could be pink, or maybe it's from dissolved copper. For a while there I even thought it could be some kind of residue from old printing ink that didn't manage to burn up completely during smelting and casting process. Perhaps it's something else entirely. I do know that you can polish the pink/purple surface oxidation color off a boolit, if you work at it some with a paper towel, or a piece of cloth and some Flitz metal polish.

Here's a few really shiny boolits cast from this alloy.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52393&d=1305608071
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52879&d=1321511755

The pink/purple surface oxidation color thing is somewhat difficult to catch in a photograph, but I think you can see it a little bit in some of these pictures.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52449&d=1308462430
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52468&d=1308732009
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52469&d=1308732009

I have not tumbled, or polished these boolits at all. They don't seem to oxidize and turn grey or white over time either, the way that my other lead alloys do when exposed to the elements.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=52374&d=1305080033

I have cast my fair share of diving weight ingots out of this alloy as well. The ingots weigh quite a bit less than WW lead ingots, or pure lead ingots, but free is free. A diving weight mould makes for an interesting ingot mould. You can also string the diving weight ingots up on belts if you so desire for space constraints.

The diving weight ingots do not seem to oxidize, even after a fair amount of exposure when they are cast out of type metal. The tougher type metal diving ingots still remain shiny (despite the rusty water residue) after being repeatedly submerged underwater, they still retain that pink/purplish hue.

I assume the shiny part is simply a result of a very high tin content in the alloy, which also explains why the print type metal alloy tends to cast so much lighter weight wise than pure, or WW lead. WW lead doesn't seem to cast as shiny of a boolit for me, even when I cast from a cold mold. It does seem to be the default alloy for the majority of boolit casters however. The dullness becomes even more noticeable when water dropping WW's. If you want a really pretty boolit to show someone, or to stand up on your loading bench, the Linotype boolit wins hands down. I use them a lot for dummy boolits that I use to set up my loading dies with too. They seem to take handling abuse better, and they oxidize very little. I also find them easier to distinguish from what I am currently working with from the shine, and the pink/purple color.

Even though the boolits are real pretty, they do not shoot any better than ugly X-ray foils, WW lead, or much of the other mystery metal that I have managed to scrounge up over the years. In some cases, they will perform worse even (prone to breakage or shatter) and can be extra fussy if what your loading for doesn't seem to prefer a super hard alloy.

They just look real nice in pictures, and in a pinch the alloy will also cast larger than pure lead, or straight WW lead does. That can be somewhat handy if you have a mould that is prone to casting undersize boolits.


- Bullwolf

[shredder]

Wow thanks for the great photos. I believe I have developed a case of alloy envy!

[Bigslug]

Matte, non-reflective boolits are far more "tactical"

[HeadLead]

Great feedback. I am certainly learning a lot here.

I like all the pictures you folks are adding. Much more interesting with graphic representation.

Seems there are many sides to this "Shiny Boolit" thing.

[shredder]

And many experienced hands blowing myths to bits!

[Fishman]

Where did you buy your new lee mould?


Yesterday, I tried out a new Lee TL314-90-SWC (new style 2 cavity with pins and bushings). PID controlled at 800 degrees and straight wheel weights. The mold is fantastic and they dropped out looking like chrome. Without adding more material, I started up a Lee C501-440-RF. Left PID at 800 degrees, should have dropped it to 750 at least. They dropped out with a nice satin finish. It took a long time for the sprue to harden. Way too hot, but it was working real good, so I left everything the same.

[zomby woof]

Get a mold thermometer and keep it a constant temperature, around 380-400. Keep your alloy cool, around 635-650. If you keep all this constant, you'll have shiny, consistent boolits. With a good alloy, YMMV.