Round Balls Remain King!

[longbow]

After a long time of not loading and shooting slugs, I finally made time to get the the range with a variety of slug and round ball loads as follows:


0.662" RB's in shotcups
0.678" RB's in shotcups
0.678" RB's with add on "tails" in shotcups
TC slug from home made mould internally ribbed like Lee but with 6 ribs
Lee Drive Key slugs
Lee Drive Key slugs modified with attached wad Brenneke style (cast on)
0.735" RB's over hard card wad column


All slugs were loaded over nitro card wads and the round balls also had a scoop of COW under them. The TC slugs were bore size.


0.662" RB's shot into a vertical string of 2" wide x 5 1/4" high (5 shots)
0.678" RB's shot into a horizontal group of 4" wide x 2" high (5 shots)
0.678" RB's with add on "tail" shot into 4" wide x 3" high (5 shots)
TC slugs shot very poorly (5 shots)
Lee Drive Key Slugs shot into 10" wide x 6" high (10 shots)
Brenneke'ized Lees shot into 8" wide x 6" high (10 shots)


All shots were at 50 yards.

I also shot:


one group of 0.678" RB's at 100 yards and 4 out of 5 were in a group 7" wide x 5" high. One shot missed the paper
one group of eight 0.735" RB's at 100 yards. These were left overs from previous testing and were hefty loads. 5 of 8 hit the paper
but were spread out over about 12" wide x 24" high. This same load had given me consistent 3" to 4" groups at 50 yards before so did something change or do they simply pick up a spin and veer off course at longer range? Odd since the 0.678" RB's in shotcups did quite well. Obviously more shooting is required to sort this out.
one group of five 0.678" RB's with "tails" at 100 yards ~ group would be measured in feet!


All shooting was done with my smoothbore single shot, cylinder bore, with open rifle sights off a bench.

So, once again the round balls win. So far, I can generally count on about 4" or under at 50 yards with good round ball loads.

I found the Lee slugs a little snug in the wads I had but not real tight. I used Win AA white as they were the only wads I had that gave reasonable fit. Recovered wads show some uneven petal damage so a different wad may improve groups some. Also, the Lees with attached basewad could be improved a bit with a better jig so both Lee slugs will get re-tested and have another chance against round balls.

I was hoping for some better results from the Lee slugs but was pretty much expecting the round ball groups. I find round balls easy to cast, easy to load and they give me quite decent dependable groups to at least 50 yards.

It was good to get out and do some shooting though. Loads were moderate so didn't beat me senseless this time. All in all a good day at the range.

Next time out I will shoot more groups at both 50 and 100 yards but may limit the shooting to 0.678" RB's and Lee slugs in both styles. Even with moderate loads shooting about 50 rounds from the bench in one sitting takes its toll.

So, nothing too exciting and no stellar targets to display. Maybe next time!

Longbow

[NZSarge]

You just convinced me to buy the 6 cavity 1oz ball lead fishing sinker mold.

I have been thinking about this mold for ages because it should cast about .662 and is 1/3 of the cost of a 1 cavity Lyman ball mold.
6x RB per pour.

If I leave the centre wire out that forms the hole in the middle of the fishing weights it just becomes a small sprue to cut off each side of the RB..easy.

Thank you for the results Mr Longbow

Regards Sarge

[35remington]

Longbow, I presume the .678" ball is of Lyman make?

Any of your more powerful loadings for this ball approximate the velocities of the upper end 1 ounce slug loads, that is, 1700 to 1760 fps? Or anywhere close?

[longbow]

NZSarge:

I can't speak for the fishing weight mould and how accurate a ball it will cast. Imperfections or out of roundness may cause balls to pick up a spin from air drag. If so they will veer wildly off course. Not sure if it will happen within 50 yards but even the best round balls can start to spin and veer of in random directions.

As long as the ball inside shotcup will slide through the tightest (choke?) constriction in your barrel, they will be fine to shoot though and may provide good enough accuracy for your needs. A multi cavity ball mould would indeed be nice! However, in all honesty I don't look forward to sitting down and shooting 50+ ball loads off the bench at a sitting where I can easily shoot 100 rounds of .303 cast boolit loads. So. less consumption doesn't require high casting rates for me.

35Remington:

Yes, the new mould is Lyman. I have 0.662", 0.678", 0.690", 0.715" and 0.735" all Lyman. They all cast very well and are all slightly oversize.

I would have to check load data as I have not chronographed any loads yet. The heaviest recoiling load I have shot was the 0.735" ball over 38 grs. of Blue Dot. OUCH in a light gun! While that should not be a max load I did get some sticky extraction so dropped to 36 grs. under the 585 gr. ball.

Not sure of the velocity there but certainly not 1700+ FPS.

I have some load listings for BPI AQ slugs which are 1 oz. that are around 1600 FPS but I do not think I have anything of 1700 and above.

I have not loaded the lighter balls particularly hot yet and won't unless I have published load data. I don't mind substituting an equal weight ball for a slug but do not want to venture too far from proven safe loads.

Ed Hubel could advise there as he has pushed some pretty impressive weight slugs to over 2000 FPS IIRC. He uses very large charges of slow powders. He has said he used a pressure barrel to develop loads and I think he is willing to share if you are willing to pull the trigger. I have been reluctant to venture into that sort of loading but as long as pressures are safe the recoil with slow powders probably isn't that bad.

It seems to me he commented on a rather large load of IMR4227 producing very impressive velocity at low pressures. You could search this thread for load info:

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?7916-12GA-FH-Slug-Tester

or PM Ed, he seems very willing to help people out.

Longbow

[35remington]

Not interested in absolute redline, certainly, but enough velocity to do the job with the balls of 1 to 1 1/4 ounce in weight. My own experiments with roundballs are ongoing, and no real velocity loads yet as I am most interested in accuracy first, if that is the proper terms for a smoothbore. Just wanted to know what others were doing safely.

[longbow]

So far I can't say I have not made substitutions but not without significant cross referencing and comparing. Some pressure tested data I have just says to use any straight walled hull so a little open to interpretation.

I have on occasion had some sticky extraction where powder charges were not at max. listings so quit shooting and backed off loads some.

I would have to look up my loading manuals and BPI info but I am thinking that 1600 FPS is upper limit for anything I have, and 1400 to 1550 with 1 oz. to 1 1/4 oz slug is probably more in line with the majority of high end loads I have. I am also talking 2 3/4" too not 3" or 3 1/2".

I figure a 1 oz to 1 1/8 oz slug traveling at 1400 to 1500 FPS is packing a bit of a punch! Of course round balls are not ballistically efficient so don't carry the punch real far but I am sure they would leave a mark out to 100 yards if accuracy is there.

On that note, the "tails" I tried were kind of on a whim. A friend told me about an article he read many years ago about a fellow loading round balls in 12 ga. and tacking about 3' of ribbon on, then folding it up under the ball when loaded in the hull. He claimed to get hunting level accuracy to 100 yards. I used a length of string with a "puff" of fly tying egg yarn to drag behind with the intent that it prevented the ball from picking up a spin.

At 50 yards they shot as well as naked balls in shotcups but they were all over the map at 100 yards. I have to guess the "tails" were wagging some. No tails or "puffs" came off though or I would have seen them on the snow. Too much snow to recover slugs too ~ there is about 3' at the range.

My Brenneke clones have been much better and will get tested some more too. But... as mentioned, I do like round balls!

Longbow

[35remington]

They may not be ballistically efficient but they're better than most slugs.

[longbow]

Okay, I just perused through the loading info I have and the highest velocity loads I see are from Alliant:

- 1 oz. slug
- Federal Gold Medal hull ~ 2 3/4"
- Fed 209A primer
- 49 grs. Blue Dot
- pressure = 10,200 PSI
- velocity = 1690 FPS


- 1 oz. slug
- Remington STS hull hull ~ 2 3/4"
- Win 209 primer
- 49 grs. Blue Dot
- pressure = 10,200 PSI
- velocity = 1673 FPS

Yup, two different hulls and primers with same powder charge and same pressure... and almost same velocity. I though the STS was a tapered hull but maybe not (never loaded those).

Most other loads I have, including for 3", range in velocity between 1400 to 1600 FPS, even for 7/8 oz slugs. I would have figured the 3" to produce significantly higher velocity than 2 3/4" but for the most part they are not a lot faster.

I am with you on the round balls. Easy to cast, easy to load and very dependable accuracy to at least 50 yards at 3" to 4" groups for my loads. I am going to start stretching the distances and see how far out I can get before groups get too big.

So far my results with hollow base slugs are generally poor and the best are no better than round balls.

Longbow