boolits spining loose in case.

[fanner 50]

Do most of you use some sort of crimp on cast bolits? I loaded some .314/ 303 British in new WW cases tonight. Using Lee dies I ran the cases through the collet neck die first then through the universal case neck expander just a little to allow the boolits to slide in easily.Then set up the boolit seating die as instructed and adjusted for COAL. When finished I took my silicone rag to wipe off the cartridges as is my normal practice. The boolits turned in the case neck. I see that the lee seating die says it does not crimp at all so I assume there is good reason to get a factory crimp die now. What do others do? Would a taper crimp be better with lead boolits?What is the general concensus? I use factory crimp on all of my 45 LC stuff:Fire: :confused:

[454PB]

Crimping is not going to solve the problem, you need either a smaller expander button in your sizing die or bigger boolits.

When I bought my first .338 Win. Magnum, I had problems with the recoil pushing the bullet into the case on the rounds in the magazine. I put the expander button in my lathe and polished it down .001", and that cured the problem.

[chevyiron420]

my son just bought that die set two weeks ago, and we loaded up a box with j. bullets. the bullets would pull right out with fingers. we had to start over and lean on the press more than the directions and turn the case a little and do it again for each case, then it worked o.k.. he went ahead and got a regular sizer and crimp dies just in case.-phil[smilie=2:

[Ricochet]

I have that problem with several of my Lee collet sizers. Lee says to turn the mandrel down .001". Maybe they should've made them that way in the first place.

[Whitespider]

454PB has the answer, you need a bit more neck tension on the bullet. Nothing can replace proper neck tension, not even crimping.

Measure your expander, it should be .001-.003 smaller than the bullet diameter. My personal preference is .002 smaller, tight enough to hold but won’t easily deform cast bullets.

If your expander measures OK, could be that your sizing die is not bringing the case neck diameter down enough. I’ve had that problem with two sets of Lee dies. You may have to replace the sizing die or use cases with thicker necks.

I’ve never used the Lee Collet Die, can you get different collets? Adjust the collet?

[Scrounger]

Sounds like your Lee Collet Die needs to be turned in another quarter turn or so. And the flare introduced by the neck expander needs to be very minimal, you just want the bullet base to fit into the neck. If you can see the neck flare, it's probably too much...

[Ricochet]

The collet die will adjust to a certain point where the collet sections lock up solid. Tightening it past that can't squeeze the neck down any farther. Forcing it can cause the cap of the die to shatter, quite explosively from reports I've read.

Lee also suggests annealing case necks to prevent springback. Funny it doesn't happen with the regular sizing dies, though. I don't understand the difference, unless it's that the regular sizers squeeze the neck undersize and then expand it again with the expander ball. The collet is just squeezing the neck down to final size.

[versifier]

I had a similar problem with my 7x57 collet sizer. Another quarter turn did it. If I were going to shoot jacketed bullets in that rifle, I would turn it down, (or FL size) but I'm not - the rifle likes cast. This particular rifle (a 95 Mauser) patterns jacketed like a shotgun, even with FL sizing and really good neck tension. I was going to rebarrel it until I found it will put 5 cast boolits into around an inch at 50yds.

Occasionally, though, it has happened with other collet dies when the case neck is too thin. It's usually only one or maybe two cases in a lot and I just toss those in the recycling bucket. Once it was a whole batch of cheap imported .308 cases. At first I thought it was me or that something went out of adjustment, so I switched to some Rem cases and the problem disappeared. Never one to let a mystery go unsolved, I got out the calipers and started measuring. The cause was instantly apparent.

If the minor die adjustment doesn't solve it right away, you really do need to measure. Ricochet has the right of it. The die caps are aluminum and will launch like a champagne cork when they are overstressed and let go. I witnessed it once and warned the loader in question that an extra turn and a half was going to be too much. He still doesn't listen, but he's one of those people that make me head to the opposite end of the firing line when he shows up at the range anyway.

Personally, I would rather have them a little oversize than undersize, if it's bigger I can fix it if and when necessary. With so many oversized cast boolits that my various rifles shoot, it can be and is a definite advantage. I think it's a good idea when I get a new or new-to-me die set to measure the mandrel or expander button and write it down in my loading notes for future reference, but being me, I generally only do it if there's a problem. [smilie=1: (Four of my die sets out of around 40 have such notations.)

[Scrounger]

You could cut off some .30-06 cases and neck them down. That would give you thicker necks.

[BOOM BOOM]

HI,
The only time I had that kind of loose bullet problem was in my 7MM MAG and it was a bunch of bad brass. Try a different brand of brass & problem may dissapper.

[1hole]

"I don't understand the difference, unless it's that the regular sizers squeeze the neck undersize and then expand it again with the expander ball. "

You have the answer. Standard size dies sqeeze the necks down a LOT, then it's easy enough to get them back up with the expander ball. But that really works on the necks and produces splits far sooner than need be.

Most times, the folks who can't get sufficent bullet tension simply aren't squeezing the necks down enough. A "quarter turn" of the die is likely far too much, turn it down in eigthths of a turn until the bullets won't fall in. Going too far down in a single step is what usually produces stripped caps. Lee makes the caps of aluminum so they can serve as a "fuse", blowing-out if the load is too great.

Stripping a Lee collet die's cap will produce a little noise if the loader just cranks down on it but the cap won't fly out, it will just pop up a quarter of an inch or so.

[Ricochet]

Hadn't thought about thin brass necks, but that would do it, too.

[versifier]

1hole,
I watched it bounce off the ceiling, almost caught it, but wasn't quite fast enough. It probably would have just stripped out if he hadn't tightened it so much, but a lot of force was applied with a rugged RCBS press. He put all of his weight on it and he is not a small man, then blamed the press & die. :roll:

[georgeld]

from what I've found with my own doings and coming up with the same thing.

Figured I'd squeezed the boolit down a bit and the case sprung back out.
I just jack with the dies til its' working right.