Reloading 7.62x39 steel berdan cases with boxer LR primers in a pinch

[Revolver]

I understand this may be controversial but here it goes. A thread I saw today in swapping and selling that said steel wasn't re-loadable prompted me to post this.

When the recent craziness ensued and ammo shelves went bare in many places I did up a video (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwmmsZ-aX4g) demonstrating the 'concept' of reloading steel berdan cases with boxer primers (without modifying the case). No special tools required. In a SHTF situation a reloader may have to work with whats on hand. If supplies/ammo are unavailable and you have a bunch of 308 for your bolt gun you could potentially break some of it down and build some 7.62x39 using typically discarded berdan steel cases. There are more steps than reloading brass but none of them are difficult or too time consuming.

NOTES:

I was able to very easily and quickly hydraulically deprime the berdan cases with nothing more than a block of wood and a nut driver.
Boxer Large Rifle primers require a quick modification of anvil removal but the fit seems OK.
Every round I made this way has functioned, visual inspection of cases reveals no problems.
The steel was just as easy to work with as brass, I was expecting difficulty.
I also loaded lead cast boolits into 7.62x39 steel cases -- cheap 'disposable' ammo when you don't want to lose your brass.


Video: Reloading steel berdan 7.62x39 with boxer primers in a pinch.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GwmmsZ-aX4g

[FLHTC]

I experimented with this after finding some RWS Berdan primer in a box lot at my gun shop. I kept pressures low and used the rounds in my trail hiking ventures where it was pointless to recover empties. Plucking the anvil took some kahoanas at first but never had an accident. Now a lot of the stuff made of steel and aluminum is boxer primed like CCI Blazer.

[nhrifle]

That's awesome! Depriming is not an issue, but primer fit has been a concern for me. Genious with the super glue, never thought of it. Thanks for posting this!

[Finarfin]

I love your princess beer mug!

[xacex]

Next video turn you steel case 7.62x39 to 6.5 Grendel. I can do it, but I suck at making video's. Cheap Grendel ammo!

[khmer6]

holy hell i knew i was saving my yugo brass for a reason. what nut driver are you speaking of? like one of those screwdriver things for sockets?

[Revolver]

I love your princess beer mug!

It was Coffee... I did that to impress my 4 year old daughter. :)


holy hell i knew i was saving my yugo brass for a reason. what nut driver are you speaking of? like one of those screwdriver things for sockets?

Exactly, the screwdriver handle tool that you can put a small socket onto. I basically took an empty case into my garage and started trying things until I found something that fit reasonably well. Whee!

[khmer6]

Nice! looks like i will be using my berdan primed 308 and 30-06 as well. although a lot of the 30-06 berdan primed brass i have found were really light weight. very akward headstamp.

[khmer6]

just tried this on a few different head stamps. wanted to trial the proof of concept. tried a few different calibers. there was a 7.62x39 head stamp that would pop. it has like a red laquer glue on the primer. the 7.62x51 that had green on it was pretty easy. btw i used a 1/2" drill bit for the case and a 1/4" bit for the primer pockets. works well, wood gets all wet though

[MikeS]

Good video! If you're going to be loading these often you might want to just buy some berdan primers. Dagammo sells them, and I would imagine he still has them, but you might want to call and check. I'm sorry I don't have his number handy, but I would imagine a google search will find him. By using real berdan primers you will find that they fit much better than modified boxer primers as they are a slightly different size. Also, rather than reinstalling the expander with the decapping pin on it, why not just use a Lyman M die so you can do it much easier. Or another idea, Lee stuff is fairly inexpensive, you could buy a replacement decapping/expanding rod for just a few bucks, then you can remove the decapping pin, then you can do the resizing all in one step, just like normal.

And lastly, why did you load them with factory bullets rather than some nice home made boolits? :)
When I got my Mini-30 it came with close to 500 rounds of chinese & russian steel cased ammo, and not wanting to shoot steel jacketed bullets in the gun, I pulled all the bullets, dumped out the powder (I saved it, and used it to reload them) and reloaded them all with my cast boolits. I finally got a chance to get to the range and shoot some of them, and for the most part they shot great! Using the Lee boolits that were designed specifically for the 7.62x39, the CTL312-160-2R (I think that's the right number for it, but I'm doing this from memory so it might be wrong) I loaded them with 16gr of 2400 and got a load that's slightly lighter than factory ammo, but it still functioned the action. One load using a light boolit was loaded too light, so it didn't function the action, so I had to manually cycle the action after each shot. I'm starting to get off topic, so I'll stop now :) and just say again that you did a good job on that video!

[Revolver]

Good video! If you're going to be loading these often you might want to just buy some berdan primers.

Hi, thanks for your feedback. Actually I don't plan on loading much of this at all, it was more of a just for fun experiment to see if it could be done with supplies on hand.


Also, rather than reinstalling the expander with the decapping pin on it, why not just use a Lyman M die so you can do it much easier.

I was trying to do it with just what I had on hand, I will probably not be loading a lot of 7.62x39.


Lee stuff is fairly inexpensive, you could buy a replacement decapping/expanding rod for just a few bucks, then you can remove the decapping pin

Yep, good thinking... I almost did cut that darn pin off but decided against it since it was just an experiment.


And lastly, why did you load them with factory bullets rather than some nice home made boolits? :)

Because I had not worked up any loads, for the purpose of this video I actually used pulled bullets from identical ammo and the powder charges too. Since I was just making 10 rounds I didn't want to mess around with it. Since then I have actually loaded some lee boolits into these same steel cases with great success! I used 1680 and it cycled my AK just fine. I don't plan on loading boolits for my AK, maybe if I had something like your Mini-30 I would. :)


you did a good job on that video!

Thank you very much!

[jdgabbard]

Revolver, although I'd see quite a few videos on loading steel cased x39, it was a great walkthrough that did go much further in the process then most videos you see. Good job.

[Jailer]

Have you reloaded the cases more than once? Just curious if the primers will pop out after being super glued in.

[snuffy]

Awesome! I wonder if some loctite 271 red wouldn't serve to hold those primers in? I used it to hold .410 primers in some cheap .410 shells that would shoot loose in one firing!(Ballistic products ****, bought as primed new 3" hulls!)

As for the decapping pin, why didn't you just run it up further in the collet? It would still expand the neck, but being up further would not hit the bottom of the case. Hmmmmm, thinking further on that, the short case like the 7.62X39 may not have enough clearance! Duh! Oh well, that would work for .308-30-06.

Off topic but, I bought a box of tulammo 45 acp BOXER primed steel ammo. I got tired of hearing you can't load steel cases. I'll do a write up when I fire that ammo, I loaded it with the H&G-68 replica 200 SWC from the mihec group buy. As factory ammo it was terrible for accuracy. The 230 FMJ ball bullets were all over the target. I plan on seeing how many times they can be loaded before cracking.

[lxk308]

Thanks for the video. Not having much to do on a cold Saturday, I decided to try your method to reload some steel case x39. I could not find anything in the garage that would fit into the case for primer removal, so I used a bullet in backwards. I cut off the primer stem on my Lee decapping rod. I remove all my boxer primers using the Lee Universal Decapping die, so I really don't need the primer stem. I used red Loctite to glue in the primers. I loaded them up with 30 gr. of 844 (H335) with a 123 gr. bullet. I'll have to see how the steel case reloads do in my 7.62x39 AR at the range.

[Revolver]

Thanks for the video. Not having much to do on a cold Saturday, I decided to try your method to reload some steel case x39...

But the beginning of my video said "You are advised not to attempt this." :)


Have you reloaded the cases more than once? Just curious if the primers will pop out after being super glued in.

Hi, yes, the superglued primers pop out fine using the same depriming method. I reloaded a few of them numerous times to see how they held up... doing fine!

[Shiloh]

Thanks for the info.

Shiloh

[lxk308]

[QUOTE=Revolver;2028342]But the beginning of my video said "You are advised not to attempt this." :)

Oops. You know what they say about 'idle' hands.

I'll have to use my Lyman neck expand (M) die to resize the neck after sizing with the decapping red removed. Also, I'm going to feel pretty strange picking up once fired steel cases at the rifle range - oh well.

[khmer6]

How hot have you guys ran these loads? I assume something light and warm because of the blue holding the primer? I haven't had a chance to actual load anything up, don't have the equipment for the x39 yet. Still have too much surplus ammo to go through

[Muddydogs]

I saw your video a couple weeks back and decided to try and deprime some 7.62 x 54r brass and all I ended up doing is getting a shower. I found a punch that just fit in the case neck but water still squeezed out around the punch. I eventually gave up as I didn't really see a need to reload the steel cases. If times are that bad but I still have primers, powder and bullets then chances are I will have brass to put them in.

[khmer6]

The 7.62x54 will suffer the same fate as all surplus calibers. Once cheap as dirt and plenty now no more. And brass for these calibers.... Not so easy to come by

[lxk308]

How hot have you guys ran these loads? I assume something light and warm because of the blue holding the primer? I haven't had a chance to actual load anything up, don't have the equipment for the x39 yet. Still have too much surplus ammo to go through
I used 31 grs of 844 (H335) and 123 gr FMJ bullet. This is the starting load in Lyman's Reloading book. Also, I have loaded RCBS 130 gr and Lee 155 gr cast bullets with a reduced load. Unfortunately, I have had crazy glued primers fall out because of the recoil of the VZ58. The primers end up on the shooting bench or in the action of the rifle. Also, the steel reloads made for some good conversation at the range.

[fcvan]

checking at Powder Valley this AM, I noticed that Tula Berdan primers are the only primers they have in stock at $22/thousand.

[lxk308]

checking at Powder Valley this AM, I noticed that Tula Berdan primers are the only primers they have in stock at $22/thousand.
Thanks for the info. I'm thinking about ordering some. On another forum classified, a poster wanted $200 for 3000 Berdan primers and hydraulic decapping equipment (whatever that is). I'm filling the cases with water and using a press to knock out the primers. When the expander rod of the sizer die goes into the case neck, the primer is blown out. This method works good for me but it is messy.

[farmerjim]

Excellent video and information.

[dbuzalski]

Hello, I'm new here, but have been reading (these posts are great) and trying to figure an easy way to reload Berdan by converting to boxer. the only problem that I can see is the over sized primer pocket on the 7.62x39 (~.007 over), this may be a stretch, but has anyone considered the idea of copper plating the pocket or entire base to build up .002-.003, that would then remove the need to use glue and you could run them thru a progressive press for future reloads, as long as the plating holds up. I would think this could work for both steel and brass, but I haven't tried it...yet, I just wanted to see if anyone had been down that road. thanks.

[khmer6]

There's another thread where they drill they drill a flash hole and pocket to fit boxer primers. Check it out. I might try it on a few, but from what I've read a lot of the cases split or cracked after 5 loadings. So I might go hydraulic route