8mm cast lead bullets which powder to use and how much.

[ell198679]

I have just got into reloading for my 8mm Mausers,and I am looking into making some cast bullets. However, I am slightly confused if I am not mistaken you do not simply load a 170 grain cast bullets with 47 grains of H380, like you would with a jacketed spitzer 175 grain. I currently have Winchester 231 would this work? If so any one know how many grains? It seems most people use 2400 powder with about 20 or so grains of it. In other words any one have access to which powders to use and how much of em to use. Are your standard large rifle primers good for this as well? Thanks in advance..:???:

[BPT]

I have been loading 8mm mausers for a few years. Unfortunately I have not been learning my the different powders that I have access to. I believe I have been shooting a 170 grain gas checked bullet with 44 grains of IMR 4895. I will confirm that with felix in the next few days.

Hodgdon doesn't show any load data on their website for using H380 or Winchester 231 in the 8x57 mm mauser. They do say between 40 and 48 grains of IMR 4895 with a 170 grain bullet.

As far as the primers go, standard large rifle primers should handle your needs for most rifle powders in the 8x57 mm mauser.

[wellfedirishman]

I find that 12 grains of Trailboss makes an excellent clean cast bullet load for the old military Mausers like 8mm, 7mm, 6.5 mm etc with any typical bullet weight for the caliber (usually around 150 grain bullets).

[Old Iron Sights]

Regarding the OP, no you cannot subject cast bullets to the same pressure used for jacketed. They're too soft. Most people use a faster powder meant for pistol or shotgun. A chrono helps watching for max velocity, usually 1800 fps. Trail boss was basically designed for lead cast bullets. I like 2400 and red dot respectively. Finally found a really good 8mm combination this weekend. Lee 175 gr cast that I honed out to 325 and 18.4 gr 2400. I had three holes touching at 100 yds. 18.2 gr gave a 1.5" 5- shot group. Velocity was about 1680 fps. Going to try the same loads this weekend to make sure it wasn't a fluke. Oddly, 18.4 of 2400 is now my go to load in three different calibers.

[1Shirt]

I am fond of 2400 for 8x57 with all boolit weights for moderate loads up to about 1800 fps. Like Red Dot (about 13 gr with 175 gr.boolit), and also Trail boss for low vol loads at about 1000-1100 fps. A great old ctg.
1Shirt!

[ell198679]

. I like 2400 and red dot respectively. Finally found a really good 8mm combination this weekend. Lee 175 gr cast that I honed out to 325 and 18.4 gr 2400. I had three holes touching at 100 yds. 18.2 gr gave a 1.5" 5- shot group.

So as far as the primers just use the same ones? What do you mean you honed it out to 325 so you are shooting a 325 grain bullet?? Do you set these bullets to the same depth as your standard jacketed 8mm?

My cast is for 175 grain 8mm round. How many grains of red dot, 2400, or trail boss would be good for that cast bullet??

[ell198679]

"I find that 12 grains of Trailboss makes an excellent clean cast bullet load for the old military Mausers like 8mm, 7mm, 6.5 mm etc with any typical bullet weight for the caliber (usually around 150 grain bullets). "

How about 175 grains? http://mauserloader.wordpress.com/casting/procedure-for-accurate-cast-bullets/
So I know what do with 2400 powder :-\

[runfiverun]

i use 18 grs of 2400 with a 140-170 and,180 gr boolit.
you need the larger diameter so that the boolit actually grips the rifling.
the load is the easy part.
determining how big a boolit you need and how big your throat is, is the hard part.
just bout all the general kneed to know stuff is around here in various sticky's,and you can ask more specific questions about each step.

[Old Iron Sights]

+1. Lot of info on Mauser loads here. On honing.. My lee mold produced a bullet that was too small for my (or most any) mausers. I used a cast bullet, some honing compound and a drill to make it bigger. Tricky job.

[ell198679]

+1. Lot of info on Mauser loads here. On honing.. My lee mold produced a bullet that was too small for my (or most any) mausers. I used a cast bullet, some honing compound and a drill to make it bigger. Tricky job.

Is see so the diameter is 325. I will look up the info, I find it strange that the mold lee advertises for 8mm produces too small of bullets. How, do you know if it is too small run it down the barrel and see if it engages the rifling?

[Old Iron Sights]

Do a search on slugging a barrel. You basically use a soft lead fishing sinker slightly bigger than the bore and drive it through. Measure groove depth with a caliper and use this to determine your bullet size needed. Usually a thousandth or two larger than the bore. A lot of these rifles differ in bore size.

[UBER7MM]

Try the minimum load of SR-4759 published in the Lyman handbook. Work up until you find the perfect load. You might be pleasantly surprised. IMR-4064 and 4895 are also good starting points for gas checked bullets.

Get the manual and start with minimum loads.

Safe loading and shooting,

[Larry Gibson]

I strongly suggest that you get a Lyman #4 Cast Bullet Handbook and read the information part before the data section. It will give you the basics to proceed with casting (as in the other question of yours regarding alloys), loading and shooting cast bullets. You will also get some good begining data in the data section. If you've a used bookstore around check for a #3 Lyman Cast Bullet Handbook (out of print) as it has a bit better informational section. Like the rest of us you really should learn the basics first....not hard to do just read the manual or other writings on beginning casting and your questions here will get answered plus you'll learn a lot more in a safer and more enjoyable manner.

There is no internet shortcut, we all had to learn the basics first. I'm not trying to discourage you BTW, trying to help. Some did learn the hard way but they did not learn it with 2 quick questions on this or any "forum". Real knowledge is learned the old fashioned way.

Larry Gibson

[smoked turkey]

ell198679 welcome to the best shooting/reloading/boolit casting place on the planet. Answers to all your questions are all here in the form of stickies at the top of each section. I also recommend you purchase the Lyman cast boolit handbook. I think you'll find answers to your basic questions there. Add the info from the stickies and you will be off and walking. I didn't say running because I recommend you take your time and study the information you are about to get from all those sources. Then when you have specific questions there are folks here that can and will give you whatever help you need. As has been stated I am not trying to discourage you from asking questions. I just think it will sink in and you will have a better understanding if you get the basics the old fashioned way..by studying. Along the way you need to put your information into practice by actual casting, reloading, shooting, etc. I also recommend you purchase a few different loading manuals so you can see the different loading recipes for your self for your 8mm.

[TCLouis]

As I have said in the past, 21.5 grains of 4759 behind the 175 grain RNFP GC Group Buy mold is great. 22.5 grains 4759 and the group comes apart.

[Wdog01]

My load is 28grs of ACC5774 (fast rifle powder), and GC bullet from 235grs LEE 8mm MAX moulds, you can use it for more 8mm calibers. Like 8mm .323 mauser, .318 mauser, 7.5x53.5mm swiss GP90.... 50/50 alloy lead with linotype, about 1900fps. It is my max. load with cast one, in case of stronger load it lost accuracy. For target shooting from 24grs of ACC5774. Bye Ales.

[calgunner]

Right at the moment I'm using 40.4 grs of H4350 using a 195 grain gc bullet. The muzzle velocity is about 2000 fps.

[Moonie]

I use 35gr of H4895 behind the Lee Karabiner, 1,850fps and fairly accurate with the military sights on mine.

[armexman]

STOP Wdog01, the use of this mold is not an easy transition to the other calibers. Without the reading of manuals galore, I would not even dare step into the realm of using in other calibers.
ell198679, how long have you been at casting??? reloading???
If new posters would just put their location, offers of mentoring would be flying through the web!!!
ell, please read stickies and search some more before you step into the wonderful world of casting and shooting lead-alloyed projectiles.
As you can see I live in Colorado. Anyone from work that is suffering from lack of ammo is welcome to learn from me and I just barley finished chapter one;)
STOP spouting off loads to a new shooter!!!
Sorry Mods. I am constantly seeing 2, 5 and 10 post memebers wanting to NOW get into shooting cast in their wonder rifles and thay are not beyond one search in these forums!!!

Off my soapbox!
$1.52 of todays cents

[jonk]

Everyone will give a favorite load with a favorite powder and bullet. Yes, large rifle primers are fine. Beyond that you just have to experiment with what your gun likes. After slugging the bore that is. I also strongly recommend the Lyman Cast Bullet handbook as a good intro to the subject.

[Wdog01]

To armexman:
Yes, of course, I read lot of literature and manuals. Yes, of course, I use 8mm Max moulds bullets by different way in different calibers. Yes, of course, I (personally) tested all variants which I mentioned. Yes, of course, I measured speeds and it was OK. What is wrong???
... and I found, as little suprise for me, for more rifle 8mm or similar calibers I can use load of 28grs. of ACC5774. This my The Load for me. And this is my answer to the question "what powder and how much" ...

[ell198679]

3. 170-180 grain gas checked "200 yard target", 1500-1600 f.p.s., 16 grains of Hercules #2400 or equivalent.

4. 180-200 grain gas-checked "deer/600 yard target", 1750-1850 f.p.s., 26 grains of RL-7 or equivalent. " I have been searching for this online and can't seem to find an answer that is the closest I got. I casted about 46 bullets recently, only about 4 of them came out to about 180 grains after adding the gas check ,which it self weighs about 4 grains. So now the bullets weigh 184grains through 182 on average. How many grains of 2400 should I use? I was thinking of using a little over 16 grains, to make up for the extra weight, they are gas checked so I don't want to remelt them. fyi I have been casting for like two days...

[Larry Gibson]

60154Here is an example of expected accuracy;

The test was for accuracy difference between the Hornady GC and my own made of .014 brass shim stock. Bullets were from a 325291 GB mould and were visually inspected only. They were sized at .325 and lubed with Javelina. They weighed 195 gr fully dressed. Cases were '39 Turk pull down with berdan primers. Powder charge was 31 gr 4895 with a 1/2 - 3/4 gr dacron filler. Test rifle was a Yugo M24/47 with a 6X Leupold on top. Test was with 2 foulders and then a 10 shot group at 100 yards from a clean barrel with each GC. Velocity and other data on target.

Point is an accurate load is fairly easy to find with 4895, a dacron filler and an appropriate cast bullet. Had 400+ of those pull down cases, wish I'd had a thousand more..........

Larry Gibson

1" pasters BTW.

[swheeler]

To armexman:
Yes, of course, I read lot of literature and manuals. Yes, of course, I use 8mm Max moulds bullets by different way in different calibers. Yes, of course, I (personally) tested all variants which I mentioned. Yes, of course, I measured speeds and it was OK. What is wrong???
... and I found, as little suprise for me, for more rifle 8mm or similar calibers I can use load of 28grs. of ACC5774. This my The Load for me. And this is my answer to the question "what powder and how much" ...

5774 never heard of it, must be new

[Wdog01]

Yes, you are right, my mistake :oops:, right number is ACC5744. Text from their www:

"Accurate 5744 is an extremely fast burning, double-base, extruded powder. This unique powder can be used in a wide range of rifle calibers and magnum handguns. 5744 is characterized by excellent ignition and consistency over a very wide performance range. Low bulky density and superior ignition characteristics make 5744 an excellent choice for reduced loads in many rifle calibers and in large capacity black powder cartridges such as the 45-70 through 45-120 and 50-90 through 50-120. Made in Canada." http://www.accuratepowder.com/products/rifle/?view=20&product=5744

[budman46]

in my experience it's hard to beat 2400 in cast rifle loads. 18 gr in all my milsurps except the 8x56r (20gr) give 1700-1800 fps with 2-3", iron-sighted accuracy @ 100 yds.

i size .325", which seems to be most of you folks' recommendation and lube with liquid alox...zero leading.

[Eddie1971]

Using the Lee 175 gain .324 powder coated with checks I found that 35 grains of Winchester 748, with a magnum primer was working well. With the Karabiner Monster around 31.5 of 748 with same primer.

[KenT7021]

Read the article Cast bullets for military rifles at the top of the page.Good info by C.E. Harris.

[Eddie1971]

I have and it's a good starting point. I think with powder coating and using a check it kind of changes it up a bit for loads.