Lube Groves

[Hal H]

Does one style of grove hold lube better than others? (straight walled flat bottom, round bottom or a slopped wall).

Do the different grove designs aid lead flow and help bullets drop from molds ? Or are the grove styles different to ease manufactering?

Hal

[runfiverun]

to me it seems the grooves that cast easiest also holds the lube the worst.
the more square a groove is the narrower the draft angle is, making it harder to release from the mold.

[462]

Everything anybody would ever want to know about loob grooves is contained in this thread: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?24972-Loob-grooves-for-sale&highlight=loob+grooves

Be advised, though, that once you start reading it, you won't want to quit till you've read it all.

[Hal H]

462

Thanks for the link. I did a search but struck out.

Hal

[Hal H]

I'll have to wait to read it.
I haven't been a member long enough.

Hal

[runfiverun]

yeah...
that is in the off topic comedy section,funny,but no help.
go to the LAHSC sight and see what's written about how lube is "pumped" from a lube groove and you'll make up your own mind.
i prefer more square grooves myself. and not just because of how they hold the lube.

[Hal H]

runfiverun

Why do you prefer the square groves ?

What is the LAHSC sight?

Hal

[rhbrink]

I think that there are many things to consider. What are you going to use the boolit for pistol, revolver, military rifle with a worn out rough bore, match grade target barrel, factory barrels which can be anywhere in between. Black powder, smokeless, fast, slow, hunting this list could go on and on. I own molds that perform very well both round grooves and square if you're buying factory you'll pretty much have to go with whatever they make. Custom is another matter it would be best to talk to the mold maker personally and discuss exactly what would be best for your application. I will say that I like square grooves but the mold has to be very well made or they are a PITA to get out of the mold. Every custom made square cut lube groove bullet that I have cast beautifully but you pay for that quality.

RB

[462]

yeah...
that is in the off topic comedy section,funny,but no help.

Well, you never know. Considering the current round of hoarding, once he determines which loob groove he prefers, he should have no problem selling those he doesn't, and at a substantial profit. I'm keeping all mine, in case Hillary gets elected.

Elmer Keith got more than a little upset, when Lyman changed his 429421's grooves from square to round.

[MikeS]

As I understand it (and I can be totally wrong), Elmer was upset about the change from square lube grooves to rounded ones, not so much because of their shape, but because they held much less lube. Today with modern lubes & smokeless powder it's not as big an issue as it was back when Elmer designed the boolits. I have a 452423 with rounded lube grooves, and an NOE clone of the 454424 that has the nice big square lube groove, and when shooting smokeless either one is fine. When loading with black powder, I would only load the 454424's as the lube groove is large enough to carry the BP lube. With BP the lube has an extra job to do, that is keep the fouling soft, something that's not needed when shooting smokeless.

If you compare the size of the rounded lube grooves on the 452423 & 454424 (the Lyman rounded lube grooves) with the rounded lube groove in the H&G #68 & H&G #130 you can easily see what Elmer was upset with. Actually, if you compare a Lyman 454424 with rounded lube groove to a 454424 that has the proper square lube groove, again you will see the difference.

[runfiverun]

if you compare the square grooved 454424 to the origional 429241 square lube groove.
you'll see about half the amount of lube being used.
odd when you look at the 452664 and it's back to having the larger lube groove and it was in no way intended for b/p use.

the only reason i like the bigger more squared lube groove is simply because i can use a dryer lube and then tweak it as necessary to fling off the boolits at the muzzle.
i don't have to worry about it making the cylinder gap jump and such or it falling--blowing out of the rounded grooves.
there is a debate about base strength and whatever.

[MikeS]

Wasn't the 452664 designed for CAS? If so, then I'm sure the subject of BP came up in the designing of it, which would explain the large lube groove size. Talking about base strength, isn't the compressing of the base part of what pushes the lube out against the bore of the gun? And, wouldn't the lube being in the groove help keep the base intact, sort of like how it does when sizing a boolit down a large amount, it's always recommended to fill the lube grooves with lube before doing the sizing to keep the shape and size of the lube groove?

I would think that for accuracy, the lube either has to blow off right outside the muzzle, OR stay in the groove(s) for the entire flight. It's just lube flying off at random times during the boolit's flight that would hurt accuracy.

[runfiverun]

i dunno about the sass thing i started really casting the 452 about when sass come along.
it's really similar to the 429667 44 boolit if they both come out along that time i'd think they were for the sass game,i don't know what the 357 equivelant is though.
rcbs put out a cowboy version of a boolit they allready had shortly after that.

i really don't think lube get's pumped anywhere,it either flows and seals the edges of the lands or it don't.
if it don't you see it in the barell.
if it does and stops [changes back from flowing to not] you see it in the barell.
the design of a lube groove doesn't determine how a lube works,it just holds it in position to do it's job.

[deltaenterprizes]

I think a member has some for sale with great prices too!