shooting 45s in 454s

[yman]

How about some info from you 454 shooters out there. I am looking a buying one of the super redhawks. I plan on shooting as much 45 fodder as 454 just for the price of brass & powder. What I want to know is does the redhawk shoot the 45s worth a hoot or do you get poor accuracy from bullet jump and do you get alot of cyl leading. Also can you tell me is the cyl throat undersized-452 or is it 454? Thanks.

[9.3X62AL]

No info on the 454 Casull/Ruger per se, but I stopped shooting "short-length" cases in my Magnum revolvers several years ago--32 through 44 Magnum. The chamber fouling issue is a PITA, and I got tired of dealing with it. I'm sure the 454 Casull case (or the 480 Ruger, or the 500 S&W) can be "down-loaded" successfully and accurately to 45 Colt levels--a 250-260 grain boolit at 950-1000 FPS. Most magnum revolvers seem to have a "sweet spot" for lead SWC's of "traditional weight" run at 900-1000 FPS. In the 45 Colt, that would be Lyman #454424 or #454490 (gas checked--superfluous at those pressures, but I attach 'em anyway).

In most of the Magnum cases, a 7% to 10% powder weight uptick from the "Special" loading data usually produces velocities equivalent to the "Special" loading--E.G., with hollow-based wadcutters in 38 Special, 3.0 grains of WW-231 produces about 775 FPS in 6" barrels. Bump the powder weight to 3.2-3.3 grains of the same fuel using the same primer in the 357 case, and the load goes about 775 FPS.

[45nut]

I have been the owner of a pair of those for a few years now. I get excellent accuracy from either the 45 Colt or the 454 and truly, have not had any issue with carbon fouling in the SRH. The Ruger cylinders are a rather tuff alloy in order to contain 6 rounds of 454 vs the 5 round cylinders of the other guys anyway. A few swipes with a brush and it's good to go. I used mine for a circuit of steel critters and with 56 Colt ammo was in the 30's, similarly a few years back at NCBS I walloped a steel pillow with a 454 first round down the line and dispatched it immediately.

[454PB]

I personally don't use shorter cartridges in any of my handguns. Many years ago it was all the rage to hot load .38 special brass for use in .357 magnums. I bought in and fired several thousand rounds in my S&W model 28. I began to have extraction problems when using .357 brass, even though I cleaned the gun thoroughly every 100 rounds or so.

With a high intensity round like the .454 Casull, I can see it being even more troublesome, and not worth it to me. I have .45 Colts for that use, if I want lighter loads I simply use smaller amounts of faster powders in .454 brass.

However, occasional use of .45 Colt in a .454 probably won't cause any problems, just be attentive and watch for erosion and carbon build up behind the chamber throats.

[leftiye]

Yman, If you decide to use somewhat reduced loads in .454 brass, about 21 grains of AA #9 will push a 300 grainer RNFP or SWC to 1300 fps. That still equals a max load in a .44 mag. I'm a little lazy in a way, -don't like the pain in the palm from full house loads, and this is still a buttkicking load. Couple of plusses- it is very low pressure- about 19000 psi. (will work well with soft boolits) and quite accurate, plus it burns very clean. I'm working on a hollowpoint version with 50/50 WW/pure for hunting.

[mike3132]

Ive been working with my SRH 454 the last couple of months and have been shooting 45 brass along with 454 brass. Ive only shot a couple hundred rounds so cant comment on brass sticking. Ive got a real good load using a 300 cast bullet in 45 case with 19.0 Lil Gun. Pushes it to around 1150 fps with nice recoil. Might be the load i hunt whitetail with this year.

I also down load 454 brass with 250 xtp to 1450 fps using 5744. Its a sweet shooting load.

From what I see these guys who have shot both for years should know what they are talking about. I might stop using the 45 cases too.

[45nut]

I have not had a problem mixing 45colt and 454's. Not a one, There is no ring forming, there is not hard extraction. LIke I said, the steel Ruger used for the 454 is extra tough, thats why they were able to go with 6 holes when everyone else just did 5. A quick brushing and you are good to go.

[9.3X62AL]

The hard carbon fouling left in my 357 and 44 chambers was VERY resistant to brush-out. I soaked the cylinders overnight in Hoppe's, which helped--but after several such interludes with several revolvers, I swore off the short cases.

Powder choice may play a role here, dunno for sure--the powders used were mostly Herco and Unique. If I were to learn that Herco/Unique and Javelina under heat and pressure together formed creosote unlike any seen in a chimney--I would believe it. Maybe this is the basis for all the complaints about Unique "shooting dirty". That deposit was a LOT more than just "dirty".

[longhorn]

I'm with 45Nut on this one--I'm on my 3rd revolver in .454, and have probably fired 20 times as many .45LC through each one as Casull rounds; never a problem with hard chambering or extraction of the longer hulls. No, I didn't wear the first 2 out-one was stolen, one went down the road for something I wanted worse!

[yman]

Well,thanks for all the help. I was just planning on using the 45 brass because I had some. I thought I would save the 454 brass for the heavy stuff. I have had lots of trouble shooting 38s out of my 357 s&w. Lots of leading & build up in the cyl. I finally bought a stanless steel cyl brush and that did the trick with 1 swipe.

[BluesBear]

Like everone else, I shoot a lot of .44 Special ammo in my .44 magnums. I even shoot a fair amount of .44 Russian. I also shoot quite a bit of .45 S&W in my .45 Colt revolvers.
I never have any problem with build up but then I do clean them on a regular basis.
I think the smaller the diameter of the chamber the more you have to worry about the buildup.


If I shoot the Miwall "bargain" .38 Special ammo in my .357s I'll sometimes start to notice a build up after several hundred rounds. (300+) But that stuff is rather dirty anyway.
In my range box, I usually keep a few aluminium fired CCI Blazer .357 cases that I've resized and then mouth expanded to be a tight fit in the chambers (on the mouth only). I chamfer only the inside of the mouth until it's got a nice sharp edge.
Pushing it completely into each chamber takes care of the problem in no time.


Over the years both by working in ranges/shops and by personal experience I've noticed one important thing.
A lot of people don't completely remove all of the buildup during cleaning.
And that buildup seems to act like a sponge that just loves to soak up solvent.
But when that dries you'll end up with SPS (smokless powder stucco™) in your chambers.

I think the smaller the diameter of the chamber the more you have to worry about buildup.

[Lloyd Smale]

I do it often and in the case of my 32 single six ive put hundreds of 32 longs through it in a range session and switched to 32 mags without cleaning and it runs fine. Were a guy might run into a problem is a tight chambered gun. Some guys have problems doing it in the FA guns and the customs but i doubt if your going to find a ruger thats all that tight. I guess if a guy was real conserned about how hard the fouling is to remove it would save time in the long run to polish the inside of the cylinder. It would make the fouling much easier to remove.

[Bass Ackward]

I always get a ton of crap in my chambers no matter what I shoot or whatever I use.

I paint my chambers from the front with a Qtip. I actually use Flitz gun polish for this because it has Bees wax and Carnauba but any car polish will do. Glob it in and put the gun or cylinder in a plastic bag and seal it up to keep the polish from drying. Return 8-24 hours later and clean out is easy. A CSI would have a tough time telling you the chamber was ever fired and the throats are prepared for the next secession. The added benifit is clean out will be easier from that point on as the stuff has a harder time finding a surface to grip to.

[44man]

Lots of good answers but I can add a little. Don't worry about boolit jump, it has no effect on accuracy.
Use a good cleaner like M-Pro 7 or Hoppe's Elite with a tight brush to clean chambers, this stuff cuts carbon real good. You won't find much leading if any there, mostly carbon build up.
The only reason I don't use the short cases is that I can't generate the velocity I need to match my twist for maximum accuracy for my shooting distances. If I was to shoot close and just have fun, then they are OK.
I also don't like to change my die setup to go back and forth, it is easier to download longer brass.
Tighter chambers need cleaned more often but I haven't seen many that are that tight in a long time. I would say you would only have that problem with a custom gun today.
If the .45's shoot to your accuracy standards, use them and have fun. You sure won't hurt anything.

[Bass Ackward]

Lots of good answers but I can add a little. Don't worry about boolit jump, it has no effect on accuracy.
Use a good cleaner like M-Pro 7 or Hoppe's Elite with a tight brush to clean chambers, this stuff cuts carbon real good.


44,

From my experience, bullet jump affects accuracy from the standpoint that you have to have harder bullets the farther you jump for the same loads. My guess was that the bullet was going faster when it slammed into the rifling.

So if you want another option than shooting rocks, minimizing jump is a good thing. :grin:

And I have Hoppies Elite. Buddy raved about it so I bought the big spray bottle. I read that it cleans down to the pores and is basically the same stuff the Air Force uses to clean aircraft skin. Well .... I stuck it in the bathroom and told the Ol'lady to use it to remove make-up.

I tried gargling with it this morning and it kind comes up short in that department too. :grin: At least the regular Hoppies could be used for after shave.

[44man]

Hoppe's is not as good as M-Pro 7 but will still remove carbon. I always use no. 9 first to get the lube oils out. The above cleaners are not that good for oils.
Bass, my 45-70 revolver has a LOOOONG cylinder and the boolit has to travel 9/16" before reaching the end of the cylinder yet it shoots 9/16" groups at 50 yd's and has been kept on steel at 500 meters. I had 3 shots in 2" out there. All of my BFR's have a lot more room in front of the boolit yet shoot better then I can. You will NEVER convince me that a short jump is important. I believe it is nothing more then an old wives tale.
Yes, I read all of the crap about that and worried about it all the time. Then when I got my first BFR and seen the boolit WAAAAY down the hole, I really got worried. The first shots changed my mind real fast! I have never shot as accurate a revolver, ever!
It will shoot WW boolits almost as good as my harder ones. If you want to shoot pure lead, get a muzzle loader!
My 6.5 Swedish Mauser has a LOOOONG throat and a pitted bore yet will hold 1/2" or less at 100 yd's all day.
Think outside the box! Some one elses opinion sometimes doesn't hold water.
Same as the saying that you MUST use mag primers in the .44 and .45 with 296 and H110---NOT SO unless you want to triple group size.
The reason I get such good groups is that I don't believe anyone else. It is also the reason I get ANY broadhead to shoot from a bow perfect and worked out the best bow tuning method ever. I dispute what others claim is fact and prove them wrong. My favorite pass time.

[felix]

If you get full twist, that is all that is required. Shorter the boolit, shorter the jump must be using the same ignition. This is one reason the slower powders shoot the shortest boolits best. Always, yes, always, shoot the mildest primers for a full power load, until proven otherwise for that particular load. BR condom folks need to shoot the most consistent powders/primers without regard to heat/force. The ammo specs usually come with the gun and are otherwise standard for the caliber. ... felix

[45r]

what primers do you use 44 man with h-110.I've allways used cci 350's with good results but I like to try different loads to see if I can get smaller groups.lately I've found that rem 2 1/2 primers are more accurate with unique and 2400 in a lot of my loads.It is a mild primer and I really like how well they shoot in my 41 mag.I'm finding that lil gun seems to like win primers better than mag primers.Vitt-110 likes win primers.Fed primers have been my favorite but been checking out others and been surprised that the others do better sometimes.

[Bass Ackward]

It will shoot WW boolits almost as good as my harder ones. If you want to shoot pure lead, get a muzzle loader!


44,

You didn't read the statement. Please read it again slowly.

Look, my case is simple. And your results and writings are on record to support the same conclusion.

How hard are your bullets? Are harder bullets more accurate in a handgun than soft? Do you realize that you can shoot pure lead to that level in the same caliber rifle? How far does a bullet have to jump in a muzzle loader?

How hard are the bullets in your Swedish Mauser? What happens to accuracy if you soften them there?

You don't have to answer these because you already have time and time again. Just .... think outside the box. :grin:

[44man]

Yeah, everyone knows I shoot too heavy a load for soft boolits! I get leading that I don't like. I never tried a soft one in the Swede though, bore is way too rough.
If I reduce my handgun loads, soft shoots OK. I don't think I want to try soft boolits in the 45-70 because of the jump, they would really deform and skid, so you are correct in that harder lead has to be used.
But my thinking about the question was that maybe he was worried about the boolit being just a little below the chamber mouth instead of reaching the end of the cylinder and I don't think a little distance like that would harm any boolit, even a soft one. I just wanted to show that even a long distance doesn't harm accuracy at all if the proper alloy is used.
My 45-70 boolits are 18 Brinnel with Felix lube, shoot as accurate as a jacketed bullet and do not lead the bore. They are moving at 1632 fps. I have had them to 1800 fps. Powder choice also effects why they shoot so good too.
I will never dispute what you say Bass, only that boolit jump is not the terrible problem some think it is. I think you also know that and at the velocity I shoot, a dead soft boolit that was right at the end of the cylinder would turn into a putty ball at the gap and forcing cone.

[felix]

Boolits that soft will require a reinforcing gascheck of sorts, assuming there is no powder slow enough to maintain boolit integrity for the cylinder-gap and/or muzzle, or fast enough to meet the flight trajectory requirements. ... felix

[44man]

45R, I only use 296 in my revolvers. I only had one .44 that loved H110 and that was the regular Redhawk. All of my other guns do not like it at all. The Redhawk loved H110 and hated 296. Years of testing, working loads and changing primers kept giving me the same answers.
Yes it is the same powder, made by the same company but each is from a different burn rate as specified by Hodgden and Winchester. I have never worked around the difference.
I use the Federal 150 primer in the .44 and .45 Colt with any powder. My larger calibers need the Federal 155.
I shot consistant 1/2", 50 meter groups with model 29's. (Open sights, when I could still see.) My Rugers will hold around 1" and my BFR's have shot many at 1" at 100 yd's with most 50 yd groups running from 9/16" to 5/8", with 4 minute red dots. The funny thing is that when my eyes were good, I could hit pop can after pop can at 100 yd's with my SBH, open sights from Creedmore.
Every time I tried a mag primer in the .44, worked loads and changed between 296 and H110 to try and match it, groups were always 3X larger. That includes every make mag primer. I can't explain it, it shouldn't be, but I have been playing with this since 1956. I keep getting the feeling that the stronger primer is not a match to the case and no matter how tight the case tension or crimp is, the boolit/bullet gets blown out into the forcing cone by primer pressure at varying amounts before the powder reaches full ignition.
A larger case like the .475 can absorb the pressure without moving the boolit and needs the hotter primer for accuracy. I also use the Fed 155 in my BFR 45-70.
Step in Bass and tell me if I am right or wrong. Maybe you can explain it.

[44man]

Feix, that reminds me of a friend shooting a musket with heavy loads and a thin skirt Minnie' ball. When it left the muzzle, the skirt would flare into a shuttle cock. It made great noises going down range!

[Bass Ackward]

Boolits that soft will require a reinforcing gascheck of sorts, assuming there is no powder slow enough to maintain boolit integrity for the cylinder-gap and/or muzzle, or fast enough to meet the flight trajectory requirements. ... felix


44,

Yes. There are many ways that you can look at issues. Like is the purpose of a lube to seal or to lubricate? Do leaves come out on the trees because it is spring and it's getting warmer or because day light is longer? Chicken or the egg.

All things being equal, I prefer to minimize impacts to lead. I believe that this is a major reason why some bullet designs shoot for some people while others don't. Have you ever shot rock hard bullets in a front loader? They can handle fouling better? It's a pain, but you can WDWW and seat the bullets while soft. Then push them back out and use a magic marker to mark the top so that you can index them properly later and let them harden. It can be eye opening if that solves a particular problem for you.

Felix,

What is interesting is to look how techniques with cast have done a complete 180 for shooters.

The GC was to allow you to shoot cheaper or softer mixes at higher pressures. The softer barrel steels and softer mixes of that day made a check .... desirable. And check cost made the application practical.

With heat treating techniques in common use today, cheaper allows .... can be either soft or hard and the "need" for checks has dropped. Check cost has risen to the point that for many, it simply isn't worth it anymore. I have to admit. I used to check everything with a handgun just for the flexibility it offered. I shoot virtually all PB today. Just funny how the pendulum swings.

The biggest thing is as 44 says. I don't care if someone is getting 5000 fps from pure lead at 40,000 psi. If I try the technique and Professor Gun says it won't work for me, then I need to "do" what Professor gun demands. Like hard bullets in my 38 Special cases.

Sometimes, people work too hard to try and duplicate what someone else is able to do because of their set of conditions instead of listening to "their" Professor gun and his assistant Mr. Target. If the good and sometimes bad Professor say, standard primers, listen to what he is saying.

[SharpsShooter]

I gotta agree with Bass. I shoot 40:1 boolits out of a couple 45LC's and I absolutely do not want that boolit travelling any farther than it has to before it engages the rifling. In this case, the longer distance equates into additional velocity gained before the soft boolit hits the forcing cone , rifling etc. I want the boolit to do the majority of it;'s accelleration in the more controlled confines of the bore and not be up to nearly full speed when it hits the cone.

Hard boolits combined with an absolutely perfect throat, and bore condition may allow you succeed some of the time, but that has never been the case with my experience.



Ss

[44man]

Bass, well said! You MUST listen to your own gun. No one can give anyone else the solution to a problem.
I go through the same regimen with every new gun, alloys, primers, powder, changes with sizing, case tension, crimp and on and on. I never do this for plinking loads, only hunting loads. I let the gun tell me what it likes. I can only relate my experiences and suggest to try other things and never stick to what some books say. The gun owner just has to do his own work and try all of the things we all post. There is no one answer. Some will get entirely different results then any of the rest of us.
Thats why I like it here! There is no end to suggestions for a new gun owner to try and he should never stick to only one idea. If what any of us tells him doesn't work for him, thats fine, I won't argue about it, just keep trying.
Many of you are a lot smarter then I am and can figure out what should work before doing it. I can't. I do the work and when something comes out right, I can't explain why. It is the end result that counts.
I have spent all of my shooting years looking for the one hole, 100 yd revolver group and the closer I get, the worse my vision gets to make it impossible to achieve and the less money I have to play with. Thats worse then all of it.
And all of my testing is done from a couple of sandbags or off the side of my leg, no locked down guns or special rests or high power scopes. The old age shakes are playing hob with that too. Value your youth and keep trying now before you get too old.

[45r]

44 man I tried the fed primers with h-110 and they shot a sideways 2 inch group with 21 grains and the 255GC lbt boolits in my 41 mag.I went back to cci350 primers and it shot a 1 1/8 inch group with the first 4 going a tad under 3/4 inch.I tried the mild rem 2 1/2 primers with 10 grains unique and got a 1 1/8 inch group at 50 yards.went up to 10.5 but got slight cratering on the primer pockets.I think I'm not going to get a better hunting and practice load than these 2 loads for this boolit.I'll get some 296 and see if it does better than h-110.Kinda hard to get and is allways more expensive around here.got away from h-110 for a while but seems like I'm finding it hard to beat for heavy GC boolits in 357 and 41 mag.I think I might load some h-110 in 45 colt brass loaded hot and shoot them in my 454 casull.Loads with hs-6 shoot well but I think h-110 will do better.I've had no problem removing lead build up using a nylon brush wrapped with copper scouring pad material soaked with #9.The steel is so high quality in F/A I don't think it will hurt it.I don't think boolit jump will hurt accuracy using a slow powder either.

[BluesBear]

I don't think it's the length of the jump as much as it is the diameter of the jump.
We all know that accuracy suffers when we shoot the .45 Colt in the .45/.410 Contender barrels.

And I've never heard of anyone getting superior accuracy shooting .45-70 in a .45-90 or .45-110 chamber.
However, as it has been pointed out, the BFR seems to perform admirably with it's longer cylinder and resulting bullet jump.
I attribute this to the simple fact that the proper sized cylinder leade acts just like a smoothbore barrel and contributes to projectile stability as it reaches the forcing cone.

The more stable the projectile the less "forcing" the cone has to do.

A slight "jump" often is negligible on accuracy. Such as shooting a .38 Special in a .357 Magnum chamber.
The same goes for .44 Special in .44 Magnum and .45 Colt in .454 Casull.

Shortly after my 21st birthday (1976) I bought a brand new Colt Python.
Searching for affordable ammunition a local hardware store has several boxes of .38 Short Colt that had been languishing on their shelves for years and they were more than happy to be rid of them. Remington loaded theis with an inside lubricated bullet and while Western used an outside lubricated one.
There was a noticible improvement in accuracy with the Western ammunition.
I soon attributed this to the fact that the outside lubricated bullet was a better fit in those long .357 Magnum chambers.

I started buying all of the Winchester and Western .38 Short Colt I could fine.
Unless it was super cheap I would skip the Remington stuff.
In later years I used the W-W ammo for Starling control with my .357 Contender.

I still have a few boxes of Western .38 Short Colt ammo and every now and then I shoot some of it. It's still surprisingly accurate



Also while we're on the supject of "force" I feel S&W was wise to resurrect the old concept of gain-twist rifling in their new X-frame revolvers. With the momentum imparted to these projectiles as they leave the case any reasonable rifling twist would be traumatic to even the stoutest boolit.

[44man]

I use 21.5 gr's with a 335 gr LBT and a Lyman boolit that weighs 347 gr's, in my .45 vaquero. When you change a primer, work loads to max again. If you just change a primer with the same load, you won't learn anything.
The .41 is a different animal and might need the mag primer. I don't have one so I can't say for sure. But you must work loads in any gun with any change.
What I am saying is don't take a good load and just change the primer because it changes everything else.
Here is what my Vaquero does at 50 yd's with the Lyman boolit. Fed 150's and 296.

[BluesBear]

My all time favorite caliber is the .41 magnum. It loads just any other straight walled cartridge. I rarely use magnum primers if it. Just plain ol' CCI 300s.

Anytime you change primers you alter the pressure curve.
Sometimes it evens out but often is doesn't. A warm load can turn Max and a Max load can turn dangerous just because of a simple primer change.

Same goes for changing bullets.
All bullets of the same weight are NOT created equal. Even sized diameter and alloy (as well as seating depth) can alter the pressure curve.

Pressures increase exponentially and differently for each component combination.

[Lloyd Smale]

dont know if a blanket statement can be made as to a gun with a long throat being inaccurate or a revolver shooting specials in a mag chamber. Ive got a tc 410 that shoots 45s into an inch at 25 yards. it took some load developement but they can be made to shoot. Ive also seen guys at the bulleye line do pretty dammed well with smith 19s shooting specials. Ive seen weatherby rifles with extreamly long leads do well and i had a #1 458 that had about an 1/2 inch of freebore with most loads shoot into an inch at a 100 yards. Im sure if a guy is shooting a bench rest rifle it may help to get precise with bullet seating. But I dont think its near that big of a deal in something like a revolver or even a rilfe being used in the hunting field.

[45r]

the fed primers were'nt burning all the powder in the bottom of the brass so I'm sticking with the mag primers since I am in a cold climate area during hunting season.the load I'm using always puts the first 3 boolits under an inch and burns all the powder.maybe ya need to shoot those heavy 335 grain boolits to get the great groups your getting with fed 150's.I really like shooting the 41 mag.seems like shooting a target gun after playing with my 454 casull shooting 300 grain lbt's and 300 grain rcbs swc's.

[44man]

When I shot silhouette I always used Fed 150's with 240 gr bullets. But I will agree that extreme cold might need mag primers. You just have to test under the conditions you shoot under.

[BluesBear]

I was looking up some .38 Super loads the other day in this issue of Handloader that I keep in my loading data folder when I rediscovered this article where Brian Pearce is teaching about primers.
The first part of the atricle discused primer basics.
The second part discusses how to choose a primer for magnum revolver cartridges.



Several years ago I was on the Buena Vista, Colorado, shooting range with my friend Allan Jones, editor of Speer Reloading Manual Number 12. I noticed that in this particular manual one of my favorite magnum revolver powders, Hercules (now Alliant) 2400, was giving rather low velocities in .357 and .44 Magnum cartridges, especially when compared with Hodgdon H-110 and Winchester 296 powders. I had also noticed the data had been obtained using CCI Magnum Pistol primers. I mentioned to Allan that in my experience with 2400, it had always given better accuracy, lower pressures and extreme spreads when ignited by a standard primer. And Hercules had always recommended using standard primers and never Magnums. Allan seemed genuinely interested, stating he would take a closer look at it upon returning to the Speer lab.

I thought little about our conversation until the Speer Reloading Manual Number 13 was published a couple of years later. In referencing it I noticed 2400 data for both the .357 and .44 Magnums had been "re-shot" using CCI 500 and 300 standard primers, respectively. This time, however, 2400 gave substantially higher velocities, while staying within SAAMI pressure limits. Allan even commented in the .357 and .44 Magnum chapters that when they changed from Magnum to standard primers, performance was "significantly improved."

In discussing this matter with Allan (as well as other labs), this change in components alone can affect pressures by as much as 20 to 25 percent. For example, one lab reported more than a 10,000 psi increase in pressure when changing from a CCI 300 to a 350 primer in .44 Magnum loads that were running 35,000 psi with 2400. (This illustrates the importance of using loads exactly as shown from a manual or reputable source.)

Later in that same article he refers to a test he had performed previously (2000 as I recall).



A few years back a Ruger Bisley .357 Magnum with a 7½-inch barrel was used to conduct some unusual tests. Seven primers were used, standard and Magnum, to ignite a load consisting of a 158gr Speer JSP combined with 17.0gr of H-110. In each instance the Magnum primer gave greater velocity than it's non-magnum counterpart. Other common revolver powdersthat generally prefer a Magnum primer include Hodgdon Lil'Gun, HS-7 (at least when used in big-bore revolver cases) and Winchester 296.

As I recall in that same test when using a similar load with Alliant 2400 powder, it was the standard primer that gave higher velocities, with lower pressures, than the magnum primers.


Back in that general timeframe Handloader also had a very good article on pressure signs that was very eye opening.
If any one is interested I'll try and find it later.

[Miner]

I shoot 200 to 400 45lcs a week in my 454 SRH. Yes I get carbon fouling and hard insertion extraction if I try to load 454s after shooting a couple hundred 45lcs. The answer is to shoot the 454s first if you are going to shoot both on the same day.

A buddy of mine told me of an easy way that I use to clean carbon from a cylinder.

I have only done this with my 454 Super Redhawk and a FA 454 so SS guns only not sure of affect to blueing. Try at your own risk

Wear rubber gloves if you try this.

I use a swab with Easyoff oven cleaner on it (the cold app. kind). Swab cylinder and let sit 45 min or an hour. Then swab with hot soapy water to remove Easyoff. Brush with brass brush 3 or 4 times and clean as usual. 454 Boolits fall in and out with no problems.

[unclebill]

miner,
thats a good idea!
thanks.
bill

[Whitworth]

Just load down the Casull.......no reason to use the shorter cases, really.......