Rechamber Buffalo Classic .45-70 to .45-90?

[nicholst55]

I'm thinking about taking the plunge, and I'm seeking advice. Can .45-70 dies be used to load .45-90? How much of a velocity increase can I reasonably expect? I'm using real BP - Goex 2F at the moment.

I'm planning to continue using the rifle for a fun gun - no serious competition or anything, and maybe hunting. I want to be able to use heavier bullets - say 500 grains plus, and I want to achieve more velocity than with the .45-70.

Lastly, I see reamers for .45-90 Sharps and .45-90 Winchester. Can anyone explain the difference?

[smilie=1:

[montana_charlie]

I'm thinking about taking the plunge, and I'm seeking advice. Can .45-70 dies be used to load .45-90?
Yes, if your press and dies are dimensioned in such a way to back the dies out three tenths of an inch...and still have the die threaded into the press far enough to be stable.
Of course, you won't get 'full length' from your full length resize die, but (in most instances) that shouldn't matter.

How much of a velocity increase can I reasonably expect? I'm using real BP - Goex 2F at the moment.
I have yet to reach 1300 fps, but I have never squeezed more than 80 grains of Goex Cartridge into my cases with 500+ grain bullets...though it can be done.

Lastly, I see reamers for .45-90 Sharps and .45-90 Winchester. Can anyone explain the difference?
Sometimes my guesses come pretty close to the truth. On this question, I believe the difference is found in the throat/leade area.
The Winchester chamber would expect to handle bullets that function through a lever action, while the Sharps chamber should function well with the long, heavy bullets.

I could be all wet, here. Maybe Winchester never made a .45/90 lever action...I dunno. I'll post some pictures for comparison...

My Sharps rifle was a .45/70 when I purchased it, and was recut for .45/90 by Lee Shaver while on it's way to me. He is a 'single shot specialist', frequently shoots (and works on) Sharps rifles, and uses a reamer that he had made to his own specifications. The chamber he cut in my rifle most closely resembles the Winchester reamer in the pictures below.

I started out with a set of Lee .45/70 dies (for cost reasons), even though my rifle is a .45/90. After only a few months, I bought a set of .45/90 dies. Why? Because (for some operations) the adjustment limits on the short Lee dies were too near to being maxed out for my liking.

Normally, I don't resize cases at all. Now that I am actively trying to make my cases stretch...I am using the full depth of the .45/90 full length resizing die.
CM

[Boz330]

I could be all wet, here. Maybe Winchester never made a .45/90 lever action...I dunno. I'll post some pictures for comparison...

The 86 Winchester was chambered for the 45-90, but I think that it was an express rifle. Light bullet at faster velocity.

Just out of curiosity, if you aren't shooting competition what do you want with that much velocity out of a 500gr boolit. Besides the recoil from that BC will be brutal, on the edge of crippling.

Bob

[nicholst55]

Just out of curiosity, if you aren't shooting competition what do you want with that much velocity out of a 500gr boolit. Besides the recoil from that BC will be brutal, on the edge of crippling. Bob

Oh, mostly just for something to do. Now let me ask what the price difference is ebtween .45-90 brass and .45-70 brass. Double?

[Boz330]

Oh, mostly just for something to do. Now let me ask what the price difference is ebtween .45-90 brass and .45-70 brass. Double?

Just about double at Midway.

Bob

[SharpsShooter]

Just a suggestion for you to consider. Have your existing chamber throated to allow you to seat the 457125 out exposing two or three grease grooves. The increase in powder capacity will get you to 80gr easily (compressed) and the 457125 weighs 530gr in 20:1 alloy.

This will satisfy a couple of items without near the expense.

1. Your dies will work just fine.
2. Your brass will work and new 45-70 brass is half the cost of 45-90.
3. The throating can be done incrementaly allowing you to determine the most accurate OAL and velocity combo for your needs.
4. If you still don't like it and just have to have a 45-90, the chamber reamer will clean it right up.


My 2 cents worth............

SS

[WBH]

I'm with BOZ............my 45-90 weighs about 12+ pounds and since it has a steel buttplate I use a shooters friend when I am testing loads off the bench. Recoil in a light rifle will be miserable. And what for. You are not shooting 600+ yards with it. A 45-70 with a 525 grain bullet will kill anything in the Northern hemisphere and then some. my opinion, alot of expense....no need.

[Buckshot]

................The 45-90 chambered in Winchester's 1886 lever guns was a so called 'Express' round. It used a 300gr slug and had a 32" twist IIRC.

...............Buckshot

[nicholst55]

Okay, lots of good ideas. I just ordered a .458" throat reamer from Dave Manson yesterday. NEF chambers their .45-70s with NO throat to speak of, and I wanted to rectify that anyway. And I agree, the BC is entirely too light for seriously heavy loads/boolits in this cartridge.

Since I don't really NEED a .45-90, I guess I'll be content shooting boolits up to 500 or so grains. I don't have a 457125 mould, but I'm always in the market for new boolits!

I agree with you, WBH - if a .45-70 won't kill it, it doesn't need to be dead! I figure that the .30-30 and .303 British have probably killed more big game in North America than all the others combined!

Thanks for the input, fellas.

[Junior1942]

NEF sells an iron bar for instalation in the hole beneath the butt plate, but lead shot or reject cast bullets work just as well. That will add an easy 2, maybe 2 1/2 lbs to the rifle's weight. Me, I'd rather lower the velocity than raise the weight.

[nicholst55]

NEF sells an iron bar for instalation in the hole beneath the butt plate, but lead shot or reject cast bullets work just as well. That will add an easy 2, maybe 2 1/2 lbs to the rifle's weight. Me, I'd rather lower the velocity than raise the weight.

NEF likes them iron bars. I've got one of their Tracker slug guns, and it's got one in the butt, too. Think I'll fill mine with shot. Or something.

[Mr. Reaper]

I would be concerned that the rate of twist of your barrel is not fast enough for the 457125 or the 457132 Postell. 1: 20 would come close and 1:18 is better yet. I thought the BC was a 1:22 or 24. I just can't recall.

[Junior1942]

I would be concerned that the rate of twist of your barrel is not fast enough for the 457125 or the 457132 Postell. 1: 20 would come close and 1:18 is better yet. I thought the BC was a 1:22 or 24. I just can't recall.The BC 45-70 is 1 - 20.

[nicholst55]

I think I'm going to buy some different boolits to try before I invest in any more moulds. That way I won't end up with a mould that I can't use. I've got a bunch of 405 RNs, some 500 RNs, and some 480 Schmitzers. I'll give them a try once I get the throat opened up just a bit, and some shot in the buttstock.

[August]

make up some Lyman bore rider bullets. They seat way out in the case, making the 2.1 the equivilent of a 2.3. No need, really, to go to the expense of elongating the chamber. Also, if your rifle is a good shooter now, there is no guarantee it will remain so when a new throat is in place.

[nicholst55]

make up some Lyman bore rider bullets. They seat way out in the case, making the 2.1 the equivalent of a 2.3. No need, really, to go to the expense of elongating the chamber. Also, if your rifle is a good shooter now, there is no guarantee it will remain so when a new throat is in place.

Very true. The only good thing about it is that replacement barrels only run about $85. Unless OSHA decides to ban them, too. :???:

[NickSS]

I just bough 100 45-90 cases from Buffalo arms and they cost $85 plus shipping. I use them in my Sharps long range express fro 800, 900 and 1000 yard matches. The 45-90 gives me about 150 to 200 fps more velocity with the same bullet as I get with a 45-70. This is good for extream long range shooting. By the way Sharps originally developed the 2.4 inch 45 case for long range Creedmore matches when they loaded it it was loaded with around 100 gr of powder and a 550 gr paper patched bullet tha was just barely in the case. Winchester around 10 years later took the sharps case and loaded a 300 gr grease groove bullet with 90 gr of powder and called it the 45-90. Oringinal 1886 and 1885 winchesters in that caliber had a slow twist that worked with a 300 gr bullet but nothing heavier. My current made in Japan Winchester 1886 has a 1 in 20 twist which works fine with 500 gr bullets

[nicholst55]

Well, my neck & throat reamer and T-handle are here. Now, I just need to insure that I don't cut TOO MUCH!

[wonderwolf]

Is there much stopping one from cutting a 1871 out to 45-100,110 or 120?????? the thought came to me while cleaning mine today.

get a extra barrel for some small change and have it re-cut for any of the 3 digit cals just to experiment with and say I have one for the most part

[Freightman]

Look at greay berad outdoors there is a man who has a 45/120 BC he likes it.