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missionary5155
01-01-2013, 06:45 PM
Good afternoon and Happy New Year
Today 1 January was not too bad to go to the range. 26 degrees and 5-8 mph NW wind but sunny. Arrived about 12:30 and stayed 90 minutes. Goal was to fire the near finished 1873 44-40 2nd Model. Did take along the .357 Marlin and the 45 Colt DW just in case.
Fired the Marlin and those are the small holes on the targets. Wanted to verify I had sighted it for the load I had on hand. Then the DW just because I like revolvers that make big holes.
The large holes on the target are the 1873 44-40. Found it will load a .435 sized boolit of 215 grains. I went with the .435 as it is the absolute largest diameter that will chamber without any strain on the lever. Target stand is shown sitting on the 25 yard line. Load was 13 gr 2400 with 215 PB.
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The first 3 photos are the range photos. Wind was coming in from the 10 o'clock position but really had no effect at 25 yards. The rifle's special order heavy octagon barrel is easy to hold steady from a sitting position.
57315
The closeup of the target is the rest of the story. Upper orange dot. Hole marked "1" was the first spotter at about 10 yards. That load was 13 gr 2400. Having verified the sights were close I proceeded to fire the other 9 rounds at 25 yards which formed the nice cluster marked 9 rounds. Those rounds ejected easily, showed nor felt excessive pressure nor showed any case evidence of system strain.
Next I fired one round of same boolit with 14 gr 2400. That load extracted differently with some extra lever force so I ruled it out. Next was 17 grains of 5744 same boolit. That load was very mild recoil and no extraction effort. Dumb shooter fired the first three rounds on the upper orange dot "B" before realising he should have been on the bottom dot. There is also the one round of 14 grains 2400 mixed into that first group. Can cold air befuttle the thinking capacities. Finally shooter realised he was making a mess and shifted to lower orange dot. The "B" should read 17 grains 5744 but that is what freezing fingers and lower jaw can attest to.
So my idea at this moment is to return to 13 grains of 2400 with that 215 grainer and refire it on another hopefully warmer afternoon within two weeks. After two weeks all firearms must be wrapped in oil and wax paper and interned in storage. :( That is one moment I never enjoy. But I think this 1873 2nd model 44-40 has all the capabilities of being a fine shooter and maybe work in well to some short walks about the fields of eastern ILLinos.
Mike in ILL

Pb2au
01-01-2013, 07:09 PM
Great write up for a beautiful rifle. Thanks!

missionary5155
01-01-2013, 08:06 PM
Greetings
I will have to say I have had alot of fun and wondering moments with this project. What really makes it satisfying is to have a bunch of stray parts come together that fuction well without alot of fuss. Then stumble upon a nicely accurate load I could easily live with. It was so, pleasant to watch those first 10 rounds plop into a nice cluster. This has not been my history with three other old Winchesters in 44-40. But this rifle is certainly full of potencial. I am Blessed !
Mike in ILL

TXGunNut
01-01-2013, 08:18 PM
You are indeed blessed, and should be, for bringing this classy old rifle back to life! Nicely done.

KirkD
01-02-2013, 05:22 PM
Those are all very mild loads, according to my own chronograph results. 16 grains of 2400 gives me 1,270 fps out of a Model 1892. 19 grains of 5744 gives me 1,281 fps. Both loads are with cast 200 grain bullets.

missionary5155
01-02-2013, 05:36 PM
Howdy KirkD
I thought so also till I pulled the trigger on that first 14 g 2400 with the 215 sized .435. The 13 grainers were normal but that 14 grainer came out stiff and showed scrape marks on the case sides, flat primer with a hint of forming into firing pin hole.
This 14 grain load is completely safe in all 3 of my 1892's, my 44-40 Colt New service.
I decided to refire the 13 grain 2400 load. Have 40 rounds ready for the first afternoon above freezing and I am free. It does not make sence to me either but I am not going to fight results with this old barrel. Packed my Crono 2 weeks ago so that is out of the picture. But it sure shot nice with those 10 rounds. Could also be that these particular boolits are near pure WW. Only way I could get them to drop fat enough for my fat throated 92's. But whatever I will know more one fine afternoon.
Happy hunting with this fine caliber. Mike in ILL

KirkD
01-02-2013, 05:59 PM
Mike, I know that chrono results do vary according to bores, bullet hardness and diameter, etc. One thing I have noticed with 2400 is that I can often get 100 fps E.S. in the 44-40 cartridge. That is why I no longer use 2400 as a 44-40 load and have gone to either 5744 or SR4759.

missionary5155
01-03-2013, 08:11 AM
Howdy KirkD
Gonna have to try some 4759 next time around.
Been using 2400 a long timme and it has always produced good shooting groups. I do put a 1x1" piece of tissue on top to keep it all packed to the rear of the cartrige. Have also used COW with lots of loads in 44-40 when they are going to be in the tube all day long. Just irritating to shuck old rattle trap and see the next cartrige has a short nose.
I sure wish I had not packed away my BP Last month. I just did not expect to get the 73 together so fast.
Mike in ILL

KirkD
01-03-2013, 12:18 PM
The tissue should help reduce the E.S. Funny thing about my 2400 loads ..... in spite of significant velocity variation, the groups are usually pretty good. 2400 will often give me better groups that other loads. I just don't like an E.S. that gets close to 100 fps. On the other hand, I've not done a lot of experimentation with 2400 and filler, which may solve the problem. I did have a 2400 44-40 load that I used with a previous original '73 that was very good. I may do more experimentation with 2400 and cotton filler next summer. I like SR4759 in the 44-40 because it fills the case a bit more.

missionary5155
01-04-2013, 05:52 PM
Howdy KirkD
Well I have it on my to do list to get some 4759. I like loads that fill cases.. I guess that is why I like 3F in those old cartriges. Really forms a solid base for the boolit to butte up against and 3F gives a good velocity gain over 2F. Plus it burns nicely.
Mike in ILL

44magLeo
01-24-2013, 05:19 PM
Have the wife collect the lint of of the lint trap in your clothes dryer, I hear it makes great filler and it's free.
Leo

1Shirt
01-24-2013, 05:33 PM
Leo, Yes it does work as a filler, but it is flamable, and you will learn that quickly when you have a smoldering wad of it out in front of your bench at the range. Better to go with dacron fill, cheap and less hassel than the lint bit.
1Shirt!

missionary5155
01-24-2013, 07:13 PM
Greetings
I forgot all about lint. Have used it before and it worked well. The tissue was consumed somewhere in the barrel leaving no smoldering wads in the dry grass.
Mike in ILL

pakmc
02-02-2013, 11:15 PM
hi Bill Weddle, what loads and/or bullet can you get or what have you using in your spencer. I just brought a new one in 56-50 but I have a friend with an orginal that looks almost as good as my new ARmi sport. I have a feeling I'll be helping him learn how to reload soon.(and did he pay a rather large price for it.!)

w30wcf
02-04-2013, 08:26 PM
Mike,
Great report on your vintage 1873....and nice shooting!:-D
What 215 gr bullet are you using?

w30wcf

78wildman
02-22-2013, 10:13 PM
where did you end up finding your lower tang for your 2nd model. I am in need of one as well

cajun shooter
03-04-2013, 01:57 PM
That barrel is large for sure. The first Winchester 73 rifles had barrels's that only went to .425
I have and love shooting the 44WCF cartridge. It has become my most favorite caliber. I of course only shoot 100 % 2F powder in mine.
My very good friend w30wcf who has posted here is a very knowledgeable man on the caliber and I have read his material many times.
I have a few questions for you, as I'm also aware of your knowledge on old guns. Have you ever tried the 8 grains of Unique load with your 44WCF? My second question is that you stated that the rifle will chamber a .435 bullet. Is this the cause of throat erosion and is the barrel a smaller diameter further down the bore. Have you ever taken measurements from the muzzle down and towards the center of the bore?
Is the bullet the original style 427098 or a different style? Later David