35 whelen loads

[stuffy]

Ok I have stopped procrastinating and bought a mold to suit my 35 whelen but can't find load data to suit. The mold is a 360300gc from cast bullet engineering here in Australia, easy to get powders for me are adi and alliant. So any suggestions
p.s. I don't own lymans cast bullet manual but i am willing to buy it, if it has the information I need

[Mike H]

Ok I have stopped procrastinating and bought a mold to suit my 35 whelen but can't find load data to suit. The mold is a 360300gc from cast bullet engineering here in Australia, easy to get powders for me are adi and alliant. So any suggestions
p.s. I don't own lymans cast bullet manual but i am willing to buy it, if it has the information I need

I have the same mould,the only data I can found is 45 grains of 2208(Varget),this gave 2,000 feet/second. I have used 2206,40 to 42 grains and 2209 @ 50 grains,however I cannot find the targets which have the velocities on them.Also used the old 2213,not the newer 2213 shortcut.
A friend also used 45grains of 2208 and was a good load.

[Fluxed]

I can't help with what Australian powder will work but how fast do you want to shoot the bullet? If full power, most any powder that would be suitable for the .223, .308, .30-06 cartridges would be good. American IMR powders like 3031, 4064, 4320 all worked well for me with 250-300 gr. bullets in a Whelen.

[stuffy]

Hi fluxed I need to achieve 1800fps to stabilize by my calculations and probably a little faster
Thanks for the interest I E-mailed the two powder companies that readily available both were little help
Stuart

[Mike H]

Hi fluxed I need to achieve 1800fps to stabilize by my calculations and probably a little faster
Thanks for the interest I E-mailed the two powder companies that readily available both were little help
Stuart
My barrel is a1-16 twist,it is not hard to get 2.000 fps.
Mike.

[stuffy]

sounds good i'm still waiting for my gas checks to arrive so I can't play
Stuart

[TXGunNut]

Lyman's book not much help. Reloader #7 may be a good place to start but I have no experience w/ that cartridge.

[skeettx]

http://www.alliantpowder.com/reloaders/recipedetail.aspx?gtypeid=2&weight=250&shellid=100&bulletid=150


This is the Alliant load for the 250 Grain J bullet

I would drop the powder load by 25% and work up, Should be about 2000 FPS and the cast bullet may stand that.

IMR loads here

http://www.reloadammo.com/35whelenload.htm

Mike

p.s. one of the old timers tricks was to fill the case to the bottom of the neck with the OLD 4831 powder.

[stuffy]

Thanks for the replies I've found some published data in Lee's modern reloading for h4895 which I already have and winchester 760 & 748
Both are for j words but give me some where to start
Stuart

[sthwestvictoria]

Stuffy have you cast any of the 300grain projectiles up as yet? I wonder how long they are. The greenhill formula would suggest that anything under 1.2 inches should stabilise in a 1:16 barrel.

I was thinking about this mold or the 250grain.
Hopefully some nice loads possible with the H4895 (AR2206H). Have you used any plinking loads with .357 molds? I have a Lee 358-158-RF. My dratted Whelen is still with the dealr, permit to acquire is taking an age.

Addit- just found the overall length on the CBE website - 1.23inches. I'll have to wait and see what the twist is on the one I have purchased.

[stuffy]

I went and measured some as cast and measured 1.22 inches . No I haven't loaded any plinkering loads yet
Stuart

[Blammer]

stuffy, are you waiting on GC's from me?

[leftiye]

Use data for the 358009? Pretty close to the 300 grains weight. 4320 is your friend.

[stuffy]

No blammer I'm not waiting for checks from you or complaining just being impatient cause no one locally had any

[robroy]

OK Stuffy I'll send you a box of hornady 35 cal checks if you send me a flat of Victoria Bitter. Learned to like it while on a trip to Mornington. that was a very short learning curve.

[stocker]

Stuffy:
40 grains of H4895 is the sweet spot for me using 358009, aircooled at 287 grains. Accuracy declines slightly as the load is increased but not so badly that 42 grains is not still under 2" at 100 for 5 shots. My rifles are 1/14 so you may be able to push a bit harder if your 300's stabilize for you. I think it was Waksupi who first suggested the 40 grain load to me and it was great info for an accurate load and apologies if it was some one else. Quite a long while back so I'm not certain. I expect 5 shots with this load to consistently be between 1" and 1.5" and penetration on large game is impressive to say the least.

[Stephen Cohen]

Stuffy
Both Varget and H4895 are made in Australia by ADI, Varget is our 2208 and h4895 is our 2206H, with H4895 you can use the 60% rule which is find a max load for the bullet weight you wish to use and multiply it by (.6) this will give you a good start point. I have used this method to work up cast loads for my 375 Whelen. I have friends who are loading cast for the 35 Whelen I could ask and let you know what they have tried. I believe you will find the H4895 2206H will serve you well.

[stuffy]

robroy how dare you ask a Queenslander for the devils drink and in cans no less:kidding:
stocker and stephen ar2206h is going to be the first powder I try as thats the powder I use with jacketed I found loads in modern reloading 2nd edition of 45.8-48 grains h4895(ar2206h) behind a 300grain jacketed bullet so I am planning to back off and work my way back up
Thanks for the input all
Stuart

[robroy]

Well it'd sure beat the devil out of that roo p---:takinWiz::bigsmyl2: Fosters we can get here in the states. My 35 Whelen has the Ackley name added on the end and was built on a 1917 Eddystone Enfield and has a 16 twist. I've got so many projects going on right now I haven't got any Pb loads to contribute. All the same, I keep reading the thread with interest.

[stuffy]

Fosters is good nowhere
Once the rain stops here I should get a chance to see where this goes
Stuart

[stuffy]

I finally got my stuff together and loaded a few rounds
so off to the range this weekend to see how they work
I attached a couple of photos
Stuart6001560016

[Blammer]

very nice! can't wait to see how they'll do.

[HandLoad]

Reading this thread with great interest - I have a .35 Whelen, AI also - an Heirloom from my Father, he had it built on a SAKO action - No idea about the Twist - guess I'll have to measure!

[texasnative46]

stuffy; all,

Pardon me for "butting in" but has anyone tried that 300grain bullet in a 1-16 barrel?

yours, TN46

[sthwestvictoria]

p.s. I don't own lymans cast bullet manual but i am willing to buy it, if it has the information I need
A good book for other reasons but don't buy it for the 35 whelen loads - it only has two for the Lyman 195grain (#358430) and 204grain (#358315) molds, nothing heavier. The Lee book goes to 250grain jacketed, nil cast data.

The Lee data does provide for 2208 (varget) and 4895 (2206H). I plan on using the Lee 1grain reduction method for 4895 to arrive at a load for the CBE 250grain boolit, hopefully giving 2000-2200fps with good accuracy, nil leading. I have a 1:14 twist.

[stuffy]

Hi Guys
I finally got to where this boolit is showing promise.Sorry it took so long to get back to this project but it broke two scopes and I had two hunting trips to attend to.I had to reduce the powder charge and lengthen the oal till it can't go any more groups are only 1.5" but stable, now I can start fine tuning my powder charges. I will post some more detail tomorrow as it is late
Night all

[Blammer]

Do you air cool or water drop your boolits?

With my 35 whelen I found I needed to water drop my WW alloy to get them a tad harder then they shot great!

[stuffy]

water dropped blammer but I need to work on my consistency i am still discarding 25% percent or so of my boolits
Stuart

[sthwestvictoria]

Keen to see some of the results.
What powder are you using? I have been using AR2206H. I am having some group size consistency issues, no longer with powder position but just wider groups than I would like. I am doing some trials currently with OAL. My re-bored 98k seems to like them long, the best accuracy I have had so far jams them right into the rifling, too tight for a hunting load. This was an OAL of 80mm which would stick a boolit in the throat if you wanted to remove it. I have some to test now 79.5mm and shorter. My best group at 100metres has been a five shot 3.5 inch group. I'd like to do a bit better and get down to the 2 inch group.
Velocity with 39.5grains 2206H under the CBE 250grain was 1970fps.

[TXGunNut]

H4895 (AR2206H) is what I have in mind if I find a 250 gr boolit I like. Will be interested in knowing how that CBE boolit works out for you. Sending some Chevy parts to a friend in Hamilton, Victoria tomorrow. Maybe he can send me a mould in trade. ;-)

[35 shooter]

Bet it will put the smack down on a grumby.(water buff). Did i get that right?

[stuffy]

I'm using ar2206h. At the moment i am doing a long ladder test 1 grain either side of 44 grains shows promise. I am only shooting at 50yds to reduce my errors. I will be going to the range this weekend to continue testing and try to post some results. My oal is 83.3 mm but my throat is long once i decide on a powder charge i will try shortening it a bit
CBE has changed hands and will be slow to produce moulds at the moment the good part is they are moving to my backyard 1/2 hour from here the move started 1st july.
35 shooter you might be meaning brumby (wild horse) i have only heard a buffalo called a buff here

[35 shooter]

My bad. I really thought it was a word for buff. Don't know where i got that. Wouldn't want to shoot the horse and i'm too old to ride em. Looking forward to your results tho. All this has got me interested in one of those molds.

[stuffy]

hi everyone just back from the range what a thoroughly unsuccessful trip I re-sighted the red dot that is the backup scope on this rifle but couldn't reproduce the groups i got last trip so I continued the ladder test with the groups steadily getting worse (the last group of cast was larger than the target) when I noticed the dot position in the tube appeared to to shift between shots so rifle-3 scopes-0 So unfortunately no data worth having today. Will try again in a few weeks - family commitments for the next few weekends - sigh.

[sthwestvictoria]

Bad luck stuffy. My whelen does give a good shove however it is very heavy which probably helps. My scope is an old 1.5-5 tasco pronghorn with the glass etched reticle in the Hillver/Lynx mounts. Seems to be holding up so far. Only downside is I can't use the military Mauser paddle type safety due to the eyepiece being in the way. I need to hunt around for one of the Model70 type of side lever safeties.

[TXGunNut]

If it makes you feel better the brand-new VX-3 from my Whelen is boxed up and ready to go back to Leupold. Nothing rifle-related, just ran out of vertical adjustment.

[sthwestvictoria]

Getting some good results here with the smaller 250grain CBE boolit, this is a 15/16th inch group at 100metres (109yards):
77660
This is very gratifying as this has taken me a good while. The real clincher to get sub-MOA was really having the boolit out long. This is 79.5mm OAL with significant engraving but still extractable. At 80mm OAL I have had a boolit stick in the bore so not a hunting proposition.

[stuffy]

I finally got myself sorted to go to the range - turns out I didn't break the old red dot But i did shoot the barrel loose on my rifle (its a remington 7600) so I disassembled all the way cleaned the hell out of it while it was apart and reassembled. Any how I got what could be called groups across 5 different loads Here are pics of the most predictable load. At least it gives me something to work with7962579626
Also the importer of my scope rang and sent my scope back (should be here tomorrow) and the local bee keeper gave my 2kg of clean wax to play with lube

[stuffy]

I finally got myself sorted to go to the range - turns out I didn't break the old red dot But i did shoot the barrel loose on my rifle (its a remington 7600) so I disassembled all the way cleaned the hell out of it while it was apart and reassembled. Any how I got what could be called groups across 5 different loads Here are pics of the most predictable load. At least it gives me something to work with7962579626
Also the importer of my scope rang and sent my scope back (should be here tomorrow) and the local bee keeper gave my 2kg of clean wax to play with lube

[sthwestvictoria]

Looking good. Any idea about velocity? Was the recoil acceptable, I don't know how heavy the pump Remingtons are.

[stuffy]

my rifle weighs 7lb2oz bare i haven't weighed it with the scope on. I haven't chronographed any of the cast loads it is on the cards but first i need to replicate my groups and see if the scope will stand up this time.

[TXGunNut]

Looking good, next steps should be interesting. I'm thinking that big boolit delivers a pretty good thump, how's the shoulder?

[stuffy]

TXGun shoulders ok but I have a slip on recoil pad on at the moment to increase my length of pull. Before my eye injury I shot it open sights and A day at the range often ended in a blood nose from my thumb hitting me on the tip of my nose. I've got ammo loaded for the weekend to sight in the scope and try to shoot something loose. If I can't I'm good to go again (got two more hunting trips in the planning stages)
Stuart

[TXGunNut]

I use a P.A.S.T. pad with almost any rifle cartridge on the bench these days. I'm shooting 200 gr boolits in my Whelen for now but have some BP 45-90 rounds on the menu for this weekend as well. Sharps doesn't have a recoil pad. Also built an elevator for my rests so I can shoot from a more upright position.
Good luck this weekend, looking forward to a range report.

[sthwestvictoria]

I tried some more loads today in the Whelen, the 250grain CBE mold but I swapped across to AR2208 (varget to the cousins).
81852

This is a trial today using 2208 under the 250grain CBE mold. I achieved 2100fps with this, what really impressed me with the AR2208 compared to the AR2206H was the velocity consistency. For the 48.5grains of 2208 load velocities were 2105, 2107 and 2104fps - lovely!

Obviously I need to test some more with 5 shot groups but this has told me I am getting near my velocity target of 2100-2200fps. The lower group is 1 1/4inch. Either I pulled or need to re-shoot upper group. There was nil leading with WW, 2%tin, oven HT, gas check and pan lubed bee-wax, Vaseline, lanolin.

The only thing getting me down about cast in this rifle is the rather blunt face of the 250gran CBE means I can't reliably feed more than one from the magazine without mashing the meplat onto the edge of the chamber. This is a re-bored Mauser 98K and was obviously designed to feed the spire point FMJ 7.92mm. I have some slightly pointier 200grain cast to trial soon and will see how they feed.

[NYBushBro]

Reading this thread with interest (ie: 300 grain loads in a Whelen.)

Picked up an H&G 141 HP mold last year (originally made for .35 WCF). H&G website lists it as a 300 gr. mold. I measured the cavity and it comes out right at 1.21" (same length as 8MM MAX, IIRC.)

It has a rather blunt RF nose (almost like 311440), so I think it would make a good hunting bullet (with or without HP.)

The reason I haven't cast any yet is because it came w/o the HP pin. I'm hoping to to get Erik at HP to fabricate an H&G style HP pin (with knurled metal grip).

Looking forward to hearing more about loads for this weight bullet in the Whelen.