Marlin 30-30

[44man]

I just picked one up for the grandson. What is the favorite boolit you fellas use?

[PhantomF4E]

There are quite a few out there , but a lot of folks , including me like the Lyman 311291 170g It's a beaut for the 30- 30

[LAH]

I'm using the RCBS 30-180-FN. The nose is .301 but needs to be .300 for my Winchester.

[GREENCOUNTYPETE]

on the economy side the lee c309-170rf or c309-150rf work decent

if you can get one the ranch dog mold is well regarded


personally , my marlin gets fed the 309-170 at 18 dollars for the mold it's cheaper than a box of shells from the store. It works well enough and paid for itself already
mine drops at .310 so i don't even size just alox and load for plinkers

but i sure do wish i had a 6 cavity mold when i am casting them

[Wolfer]

I have the 311041. With 17 gr of 2400 I get 1700 fps. My mold only drops at .309 and my barrel slugs .308 so I size - check at .309. Boolit weighs 177 solid or 174 with small HP and 170 with the big HP.

This loads shoots better than factory ammo. I'm sure I could get more velocity with a slower powder but I don't really feel I need it. Most of my deer huntin I do with a pistol anyway.

[geargnasher]

My grandfather gave me mine, too, first gun I reloaded for and also the first one I cast for. The boolit I've gotten to shoot the best is the Ranch Dog 311-170 with the real lube grooves (or the NOE 311-165, shoots just as well). Hornady check, Felix lube, size to fit the chamber neck with minimal clearance and seat to "click" into the rifling with three fingers squeezing the lever and mine drives sub-half-inch holes with up to five in a row at 100 yards. Don't believe anyone who says leverguns aren't capable of phenomenal accuracy.

None of the other designs I've tried in the Marlins shoot quite as well, or quite as well as FAST as the RD nose design. The long chamber neck and abrupt throat makes bore-riders iffy at much over about 17-1800 fps, but the RD can get into the bore straight even approaching 2200 fps with water-quenched 50/50 alloy and the right powder.

Gear

[Shuz]

My 336 Marlin .30-30 likes either the RCBS 30-150FN or the Lyman 311291. Believe it or not, the "magic" load in this gun is 34g of H-4831 with either of those boolits. I seat them so the lever closes as gear mentioned above. Last week this gun shot a .896" 5 shot group @ 50 meters with a 4X scope using 19g of Tubal 2000 and the 311291. Velocity was 1601fps. A friend on this board gifted me 2 lbs of Tubal 2000 a few years ago and I just hadda see what I could do with it.

[KyBill]

so far 311041 , 311291 hollow point close to factory winchester super X 150 grain if you load I can send a few sized and gas checked to try

[btroj]

I am using the NOE 311165 with normal lube groovs.

Shoots great for me. Like Gear mine is set up so it it touching the lands when it chambers. I actually had to trim the brass a bit short to get the lever to close a touch easier.

I have no need for any other 30-30 bullet.

[44man]

Thanks fellas, gives me something to go on.
I got out my old 308-165-sil mold to find it has no crimp groove. The bore ride is very long too.
I found a few hundred cases in my shell box so that is good.
I have to clean and slug it today.

[44man]

so far 311041 , 311291 hollow point close to factory winchester super X 150 grain if you load I can send a few sized and gas checked to try
PM sent, thank you.

[btroj]

Yeah, the 165 sil bullet wouldn't work too well in a Marlin. I like it for about any other 30 cal rifle but a lever gun needs a special bullet.

I have a 311291 hp mould and just haven't messed with it much. It needs to be beagles to be large enough to size 311. I suppose with as well as the 311165 casts and works the older Lyman mould just isn't needed?

[BCB]

I use the 311041 also...

IMR-4831 or WC-852...

Velocities are between 1700 fps and 1724 fps for either powder...

This is an older model 336--probably from the very late 40's to the first few years of the 50's...

Not microgroove...

Good-luck...BCB

[cbrick]

I just picked one up for the grandson. What is the favorite boolit you fellas use?

So many good choices in 30 cal molds and my Winnie 30-30 likes most of them. It's only a matter of single loading with pointed bullets or a flat nose for the tubular magazine. If the load is for range time and will be single loaded don't worry about the crimp groove, different story of course for the field & hunting. The RCBS 180 SP (.302" nose) really shines in my 30-30 with the 180 FP (.302" nose) not too far behind, both chamber well for me.

18.0-19.0 gr SR 4759 with 160 gr to 180 gr boolits shoots very well to 200m with mild recoil. My Winnie has a 26" barrel but all of these loads run from 1800 fps to 1950 fps.

Lucky Grandson you've got there. :mrgreen:

Rick

[popper]

RD311165 for marlin. Regular grooves. The TL one is too long in the nose for newer Marlins. Get Accurate to make one for you. I haven't gotten a good load for the PB yet, 3-4 MOA with unique or 2400. GC with LeverE it's 1-2 MOA. If it is a Remlin you might want to do a chamber cast to see what fits.

[geargnasher]

My best friend in high school had a Model '94 Winchester and it absolutely doted on both the 31141 and the 311407, but my Marlin didn't like the 31141 much, and still doesn't due to the oversized bore and generous throat.

44Man, I wouldn't even bother slugging the bore of the rifle, just clear out all the copper and check the boolit nose's fit in the muzzle end and do an impact cast of the throat/chamber neck to see how fat the boolit can be. I keep reading that the Marlins like "fat" boolits, and I'm realizing that it's not only because of typically oversized bore/groove dimensions in the MicroGroove guns, but also because a close chamber neck fit helps overcome the long freebore and abrupt throat, keeping the boolit straight as it goes into the rifling. All I care about anymore for a rifle is if the boolit will feed, fill the chamber neck, fit the bore if a bore-rider, and fit the throat.

Gear

[TCLouis]

Group Buy 150 and Ranch Dog 165 are the cats meow in 30 cal.

[44man]

My best friend in high school had a Model '94 Winchester and it absolutely doted on both the 31141 and the 311407, but my Marlin didn't like the 31141 much, and still doesn't due to the oversized bore and generous throat.

44Man, I wouldn't even bother slugging the bore of the rifle, just clear out all the copper and check the boolit nose's fit in the muzzle end and do an impact cast of the throat/chamber neck to see how fat the boolit can be. I keep reading that the Marlins like "fat" boolits, and I'm realizing that it's not only because of typically oversized bore/groove dimensions in the MicroGroove guns, but also because a close chamber neck fit helps overcome the long freebore and abrupt throat, keeping the boolit straight as it goes into the rifling. All I care about anymore for a rifle is if the boolit will feed, fill the chamber neck, fit the bore if a bore-rider, and fit the throat.

Gear
Good idea. That is what I did on my BPCR. I have time to play, stuff like dies, etc are on BO anyway.
I did slug and the groove, as close as I can measure is .3096". Hard to measure bore but it appears to be .300". Now I need to measure the freebore.

[cbrick]

.3096", good thing you did slug the bore and not simply assume .308" as most people do. My Winnie 30-30 has a great bore, smooth clean, sharp rifling with no loose or tight spots and it's a .3099" groove diameter. Shoots great but I do need to pay attention to as cast diameters, several of my 30 cal molds don't cast as large as the groove diameter.

I prefer to seat to a zero freebore in most of my rifles and let the nose slightly engrave when chambering.

Rick

[44man]

.3096", good thing you did slug the bore and not simply assume .308" as most people do. My Winnie 30-30 has a great bore, smooth clean, sharp rifling with no loose or tight spots and it's a .3099" groove diameter. Shoots great but I do need to pay attention to as cast diameters, several of my 30 cal molds don't cast as large as the groove diameter.

I prefer to seat to a zero freebore in most of my rifles and let the nose slightly engrave when chambering.

Rick
Sounds good to me. I might make a mold but getting the cherry right for the diameter might be tough. I don't know lead shrinkage for 30 caliber.

[runfiverun]

just do a circimference percentage based on the smallest mold you do know.
that should be close enough.
the nose is gonna be your most important part.
311 or slightly over on the body will be good.
but you want the nose to have scuff marks from chambering....
use the 311041 and the rcbs 30-150 the 150 engraves on chambering and the 041 has scuff marks from the rifling.
i can push the 150 as fast as i want and maintain accuracy.
i have to up the alloy a titch for the 041 if i want to go full jaxketed velocity it's all on makng the nose that extra half thou bigger not the body.
i'll live with the alloy i got and the load i'm using with the 041 [34 grs of old milsurp 4831] at least untill the last 3 lbs of it i have are gone.

[44man]

just do a circimference percentage based on the smallest mold you do know.
that should be close enough.
the nose is gonna be your most important part.
311 or slightly over on the body will be good.
but you want the nose to have scuff marks from chambering....
use the 311041 and the rcbs 30-150 the 150 engraves on chambering and the 041 has scuff marks from the rifling.
i can push the 150 as fast as i want and maintain accuracy.
i have to up the alloy a titch for the 041 if i want to go full jaxketed velocity it's all on makng the nose that extra half thou bigger not the body.
i'll live with the alloy i got and the load i'm using with the 041 [34 grs of old milsurp 4831] at least untill the last 3 lbs of it i have are gone.
Perfect and what I want.
Now just how do you still have old 4831? :holysheep I used to buy it in 40# kegs but it is long gone.
I still have half a keg of red dot in the huge, red metal keg! I am older then dirt!

[DLCTEX]

I have great results using a Lee 311-170 mould I got from Junior (it's no longer made) and seating them to imprint the rifling. I also have about 18 lbs. of H-4831 I bought from the widow of a shooter, it was 27# at the time. It had been sitting in her garage for 25 years then. Still great powder.

[geargnasher]

You fellas realize that H- and IMR-4831 can still be purchased new, right? :kidding:

Gear

[44man]

You fellas realize that H- and IMR-4831 can still be purchased new, right? :kidding:

Gear
You chain puller, you! :groner:

[DLCTEX]

You fellas realize that H- and IMR-4831 can still be purchased new, right? :kidding:

Gear

Not at $2.00 a pound.(:

[runfiverun]

the cardboard can of hodgdons says 1.29 on the back of it.
the 4895 says 1.79
the other 3 lbs got dumped into some old green mec reloader bottles with metal sprite screw on caps.
i know they make new,i really should save this older 4831 stuff for important hunting loads.
the new stuff just don't quite cut the accuracy mustard. [thank god for rl-19 and federal primers]
i have a bunch of 4831-sc which will go into the 30-30 cases next, hopefully i can get another grain or two in there.
i just emptied a red can of herco about a month ago.
the cardboard kegs/drums make a great storage bucket too.
the 8 lb ones i cut a rectangle in the top and the inside liner, so i can line the holes up to pour shot into the ponsess warrens.
they hold 25 lbs of shot easily.

[dsbock]

Has anyone tried the Ideal/Lyman 311157 165 gr? I would prefer a non gas check round of traditional weights and profile.

Thanks.

David

[geargnasher]

Not at $2.00 a pound.(:

When surplus 4831 was $2/lb, you could pick the best SKS or Swedish Mauser out of a barrel for fifty bucks. If it weren't for the recent and fantastic advances in medical technology pertaining to managing diseases of the eye that enable me to keep shooting, I'd say I was born at least a generation too late. But.....we ARE in the true Golden Age of boolit casting thanks again to technology.

Gear

[cbrick]

If it weren't for the recent and fantastic advances in medical technology pertaining to managing diseases of the eye that enable me to keep shooting,

Hey, I resemble that remark! :mrgreen:


But.....we ARE in the true Golden Age of boolit casting thanks again to technology. Gear

Yes, we certainly are.

Rick

[w30wcf]

44man,
Is the rifle a micro-groove or an older 4 groove? I have both and the barrel on the 4 groove is .310" and the RCBS and Lyman molds mentioned sized to .311" shoot great from that rifle. The micro-groove (1977) 336A measures .308" in the groove and .309" bullets work very well as do .310 and .311 :).

w30wcf

[JIMinPHX]

I have had outstanding results with the inexpensive little 150-grain flat point from Lee in a microgroove Marlin .30-30. RE-7 works best for my hunting speed loads. Unique does well for plinkers. Most other people go with 170-grain in that caliber, but the 150 worked out so well for me, that I have no desire to try anything else. Cast is shooting out of that gun better than factory ammo ever did, even with the cast up at the same velocity as factory ammo.

[44man]

It is a new micro groove, 12 lands and grooves.
I plan on making a mold soon and am drawing one up. Target will be .311" to 312", shorter bore ride at .301" tapered to .302". Band in front of crimp to almost kiss the rifling.
I used my bullet seating tool to push an upside down boolit to the rifling and it looks like .122" out of the case.
I am going to take one of my bad molds and using cutters, I will make test cavities in the bottom to see how much to allow on the cherry. A 5/16" end mill is .3125" and should give me a starting measurement. I don't know how much shrinkage to allow for with these small boolits.

[cbrick]

I plan on making a mold soon and am drawing one up.

Eagerly waiting to see pics of the boolits. :mrgreen:

Rick

[44man]

I have been looking at a picture of the Lyman 31141 so I might go with one like it.
Can anyone give me the length overall and the nose or drive band lengths?

[cbrick]

Do you mean 311041 or 311410?

I have 311410 and can give you dimensions on that, don't have 311041 however.

Rick

EDIT to add: Just checked my notes, my 311410 I had Erik open the driving bands to cast .312" and it was also HP'd by Lyman back when they still did that. There is an active group buy from Miha going on right now for this bullet.

[44man]

Do you mean 311041 or 311410?

I have 311410 and can give you dimensions on that, don't have 311041 however.

Rick

EDIT to add: Just checked my notes, my 311410 I had Erik open the driving bands to cast .312" and it was also HP'd by Lyman back when they still did that. There is an active group buy from Miha going on right now for this bullet.
Yours would be close enough, I think they change the number long ago. My old 1980 Lyman book shows the 41. It looks like the bottom grease groove was a little larger back then.
I have to go look at the group buy, thanks.

[cbrick]

When we designed the 311410 for the group buy we made a couple of changes, on the Lyman bullet there is no forward driving band & we added one changing the nose slightly, in the group buy there are two HP pin lengths and blank pins for casting flat points using the Cramer style plus plain base or gas check option. Also the meplat on the group buy is slightly larger per Miha to accommodate the HP pins. My Lyman has a round lube groove, the group buy will have a square lube groove & should hold a bit more lube. My Lyman was originally a bevel base, when Erik had it I had him remove the bevel base and make a HP pin shorter than the Lyman pin.

The group buy page has bullet drawings with dimensions drawn up by Longbow. This should help ya out some. There is also a photo of bullets from my 311410 as it now casts after Erik worked his magic on it.

http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?167692-MiHec-311410-Brass-Cramer-HP

Hope all this helps ya out.

Rick


Rick

[44man]

Yes, nice looking boolit.

[w30wcf]

44man,
311041 from my mold measure .98" long. Bullets from my mold in w.w.+2% tin weigh 180 grs.

This bullet by Accurate Molds looks like a winner. The base would be pretty even with the bottom of the case neck wheras the 311041 extends slightly below that. B
http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=31-170E-D.png

w30wcf

[44man]

44man,
311041 from my mold measure .98" long. Bullets from my mold in w.w.+2% tin weigh 180 grs.

This bullet by Accurate Molds looks like a winner. The base would be pretty even with the bottom of the case neck wheras the 311041 extends slightly below that. B
http://www.accuratemolds.com/bullet_detail.php?bullet=31-170E-D.png

w30wcf
Great, gives me something to go by. I am still fiddling around trying to figure shrinkage. Don't know if .001" is enough to add to the cherry. I hate to ruin one of the few blocks I have left.
Test holes did not work, I bored with a 5/16" end mill and the hole is larger so a cast came out .318". Crazy that I can't drill or bore a hole exact. I worked up with drills so hardly any was cut with the mill but I can stick the end mill in the hole and wobble it. How in the world can you make a perfect 5/16" hole?
I am NOT a machinist and have cheap equipment.

[cbrick]

I am still fiddling around trying to figure shrinkage. Don't know if .001" is enough to add to the cherry. I hate to ruin one of the few blocks I have left.

In a .308 boolit .001" is probably not enough but it is different for different alloys. The following link has a rough estimate of alloy shrinkage from the mold based on alloy. If nothing else it should give the grey matter something to chew on.

Almost half way down the page on the left side.
http://lasc.us/CastBulletNotes.htm

Rick

[Marlin Junky]

I just picked one up for the grandson. What is the favorite boolit you fellas use?

I know this got started about a week ago, but are you talking about an old gun, new gun, or something in between?

If you're talking about an old gun, I would suggest RCBS 30-180FN unless it's got an odball chamber. I've got an oldie but a goodie that loves LBT 30-180 LFN.

MJ

[44man]

MJ, it is new. I sold some stuff to get it on sale and don't really want to buy stuff to shoot it unless very cheap.
I can buy some stuff but worry about molds like Lee and the size they cast at. Lyman and custom molds are out of reach.
Yesterday was my 75th birthday and the wife splurged for a cheap bottle so I can cut straight!

[cbrick]

Hey, happy birthday 44man.

56251

Rick

[44man]

Thank you Rick. You are free to call me an old codger! ;)