Roll or Crimp 00 Buckshot Loads

[Four-Sixty]

Folks,

Is there a disadvantage to roll crimping 00 buckshot loads? Does it impact accuracy?

I'm considering gettting the new BPI 12ga roll crimper, but I'll mainly use it for buckshot loads. I plan to use the #47 buffer, and think the roll crimper would be more forgiving with column height.

Or, would it be best to stick with a fold crimp?

[pipehand]

I originally bought a roll crimp tool to make a copy of the Dixie Tri-Ball in 3" Cheddite hulls. I bought a hundred 2&3/4" Cheddites, and some clear plastic overshot wads because I wanted a 12 or 15 pellet load of .311" buckshot and the roll crimp maximizes the available volume. Need to order some of Precision Reloading's TUWSBL35 wads, and see what fits. Will send off my best guesses to be pressure tested. There isn't a whole lot of data out there for roll crimp loads unless you're loading 2&1/2".

[Four-Sixty]

Let us know, please, what kind of accuracy/performance you get to.

[Nix]

I don't really see any advantage to it. I've always star-crimped and it continues to work well for me. If you roll-crimp shot you'll definitely need an overshot card as has been pointed out, which is added expense and work. Also, I know some folks really like the BPI roll crimpers but I've bought two (a 12G and a 20G) and I swear to god I've never gotten them to work well.

Tried heating the hulls, tried lubing the hulls, tried cutting the star-crimped tips off and even unused hulls, never works right for me whether I'm using a hand-drill or even a drill press. Frustrating as hell, too, because I cast up maybe 500 Lyman foster slugs in 12G and 20G and the recipes all insist on a roll-crimp.

[oldtoolsniper]

I have both the BPI roll crimper and an old lyman roll crimper. Do yourself a favor and watch ebay for an old lyman crimper they work much better than the BPI one. It's a leaning curve to get it right but once you get the feel you can roll out some shells on a drill press pretty fast. I use the Mec super sizer clamped to my drill press to hold the shell, it performs double duty as the holder and re-sizer. I am not a machinist and the two crimpers look close in comparison but they perform ok for BPI and really smooth for lyman. As far as loads I would find out what BPI has to offer in their books and load data they produce. the first edition of lyman shotshell reloading offers a lot of roll crimp loads but is is for long gone components, mostly Alcan powder and strange numbered primers.

[Nix]

The Supersizer as a vice... That is brilliant... I've been struggling for a while now trying to come up with something that would grip a hull without crushing it. I've tried wood with a hole bored out, vices with cotton batting, all kinds of crazy stuff but that's a terrific idea.

Now if I could just find something to hold lead slugs so I can trim or HP them...

[John in WI]

I have a BPI roll crimper and it works great. I found out that it doesn't work worth a darn with skived (is that what it's called--where the open end of the hull is thinned a little bit?), but for regular hulls it's been working great.

I load mostly #1, but if you get the height exactly right, you can dial it in so that it just compresses the wad a tiny bit. Just enough that the balls aren't rattling around.

I haven't been using a vice on mine. I do it on my drill press and just hold the brass tightly in my fingers. When there is enough pressure on the crimper and the crimp is complete, the friction goes up and the brass grabs and spins. (it's a wimpy 1/2 horse drill press with a really low rmp)

As to using a roll crimp, the BPI Buckshot manual said that a roll crimp was shown to actually drop the pressure slightly over a roll crimp. They made it seem like they can be used interchangeably. As to accuracy, I don't have anything to compare my #1 and size F loads to. But I'm especially impressed with how well the F patterns. What's also surprising is that those clear overshot discs wing out with enough speed that they will embed in cardboard at a good 20'.

[oldtoolsniper]

Nix,
I read about using the Mec sizer as a vice somewhere on the net. It was one of those why didn't I see the obvious right in front of my face moments. I was sizing the shells with it to build loads less than three feet from my drill press.

As for holding a slug for hollow pointing look at the roll crimp vice BPI sells and I am betting you can make a clamp just like that but drilled to fit your slug. The other option would be to look at www.pennstateind.com or any other pen making supply store, they have vices for drilling pen blanks that may work.

Jon,
I got the same impression from the BPI manual. It has a lot of good information in it. I cut my own clear overshot cards from the plastic packaging everything comes in. Interesting that the BPI clear overshot cards are hitting the target at 20' since they are supposed to break apart according to their catalog. I also get my Tyvek overshot cards by cutting them from used USPS tyvek envelopes.

I never payed attention to whether the hulls were skived or not! I bet you are right and it makes perfect sense!

[Nix]

It's funny you say that, oldtoolsniper, because my supersizer is also literally only a few feet from my drillpress. I guess great minds fail to think alike, ha ha. Thanks for the tip on the pen vices, I'm definitely going to check into that.

The overshot cards from that miserable plastic blister-packaging is a great idea. I had been considered making like a large hole punch (similar to what you use on paper for 3-ring binders) and using it on cardboard or bristol-board but that's even better. With the plastic you could see through to the load inside, no more "What did I load this with" moments again.

[oldtoolsniper]

I hate those blister packs, but they are good for that. After buying them from Ballistics products it occurred to me to make my own. i have a 12 wad cutter that Hornady used to make that I use in the drill press to cut my wads. I got it off Ebay in a buch of reloading stuff I bought, it's pretty dang slick. Once I figure out which pile I have it under I'll post a pic.

My friends are fascinated by my roll crimped clear snout shells. They all want some but I refuse to allow anyone else to shoot my reloads. They have yet to take me up on letting them use my gear to roll their own.

I get felt from www.durofelt.com and punch out my own felt wads for some of my loads.