Mech Tech CCU

[MGySgt]

While this is not a rifle by it's self, but when you add a 1911 frame - it becomes a pistol cartridge carbine.

I just bought the unit for an old 1911 I have. Breaking it in with some old factory stuff I have. Shoots Rem 230 grain Golden Sabers real good.

Any one out there have one and what is your experience with cast boolits? Which Boolits?

Thanks for any replies.

In case anyone wants to look at these things - here is the web site link.

http://mechtechsys.com/index.php#

[williamwaco]

Never heard of that.

I think I want one.

How much trouble was it to fit to the lower?

How does it function?

.

[Hairtrigger]

I have one in 10mm for a 1911. I bought it when they first came out. 2" at 50 yards easy! Functions well very few FTF's

[Griz44mag]

So how do they keep out of trouble with the BATFE in the process of converting a pistol to a rifle?
And more important, converting a now functioning rifle to a pistol?
TCA had to get special permission for it's interchangeable barrel systems.

[wv109323]

GRIZ44Mag,
That is a good question that I had never thought about before now. I think the trouble comes from converting a rifle to a pistol. I am waiting on others to respond.
The unit has been on the market for at least 10 years and they mention in their advertisement that you can use a 1911 frame with the unit.

[Hairtrigger]

Here is the answer
http://mechtechsys.com/faqs.php#a0

[M-Tecs]

So how do they keep out of trouble with the BATFE in the process of converting a pistol to a rifle?
And more important, converting a now functioning rifle to a pistol?

You can convert a pistol to rifle. The laws do not restrict this. However you cannot convert a rifle into a pistol. Shortening a rifle to less than 16” just makes it a short barrel rifle . The law allows you to have as long a barrel on a pistol as you want. If the barrel is over 16 you can add butt stock for a total length of 26". It’s the same for the AR15 lowers. If it’s stamped pistol you can do a rifle or pistol on it but you cannot use a AR15 lower not stamped pistol to make an AR pistol.

[MGySgt]

Never heard of that.
How much trouble was it to fit to the lower?

How does it function?

.

Take your slide off the 1911. Keep your slide lock/take down pin. Align the rails of the 1911 frame to the rails in the CCU, push forward to the stop and insert the slide lock pin to keep it together no fitting required.

All 3 safties on the 1911 frame still work like they did with the 1911 slide in place.

I am going to try the lyman 200 grain WC for 45 ACP's today. I had some problems with the PMC Star fires I shot - they were 6 inches below the Remingtons at 50 yards. the scope was maxed out and still below POA - that doesn't work for the star fires. Hope my Lyman 200 grain WC will get above POA (I hand feed a mag through it with no problems.)

More later.

Drew

[MGySgt]

I have one in 10mm for a 1911. I bought it when they first came out. 2" at 50 yards easy! Functions well very few FTF's

Do you shoot cast through it?

[Shooter6br]

Have one for years.I took a Galena receiver and use it.Use a Pro Point red dot on it.It is my go to gun for Zombie attacis and fun to shoot.Great customer service#

[Shooter6br]

Pic in my profile albums

[MGySgt]

got some cast down the barrel. I bought a new low power Mil Dot sight for it on Saturday at a gun show.

Zeroed it on Sunday. The attached PDF shows the final group of the sight in, 7 round mag.

The load:

RCBS 45-230-CM, LBT Blue lube, 7 grains of Unique, CCI LP primer in TZZ brass.

50 yards - Yea I know it is still a little left, but it was close enough to start ringin the steel targets.

I want to try it at 100 today or tomorrow to see if one of the Mil Dots with give me a good reference for 100 yards.

This thing shoots and there is hardly any felt recoil.

55226

[Four Fingers of Death]

Interesting, looks way too much fun to be legal in Australia! haha! What am I laughing at????? :(

[MGySgt]

Interesting, looks way too much fun to be legal in Australia! haha! What am I laughing at????? :(

FFOD - yes it is a lot of fun to shoot.

I have mine configured pretty much like my AR. It is a lot cheaper to shoot 45 ACP's with cast than it is to shoot 223's. In an urban environment where distances are short (under 150) I think I would take this over my AR. Only draw back is the mag capacity. 7 rounds don't last long and I would have to have a lot of mags on me to make up for 2 mags on me and one in the gun with my AR 15. It is still a good training gun although the controls are different.

I bought 2 15 round mags for it at the Gun show last weekend and both of them I had to file the notch for the mag catch more towards the feed lips. They would not lock in the frame. I got that done this morning and I am going to try them today. I did hand feed some dummy rounds through the gun with them and they appeared to work fine.
I would have to guess this is the most fun I have had with my clothes on for a very long time.

Shot this thing at 100 yards at the steel targets the other day. The first Mil Dot down from the cross hairs is point of aim/point of impat at 100 yards. Rang my 9 in plates with every pull of the trigger - as long as I did my part.

I think the glock might be a better choice than a 1911 - grip angle, the 1911 is a little uncomfortable to get use to and the Grip safety is giving me a problem with FTF due to not having is depressed fully. One of the Grip Safties with the bump in it might help. I have been tempted to pin mine down (bad idea I know).
And maybe, just maybe, a 40 S&W with the 175 grain and a higher velocity might just be a better. At least the Glocks have high capicity mags.

[Four Fingers of Death]

[QUOTE=MGySgt;1946883]One of the Grip Safties with the bump in it might help. I have been tempted to pin mine down (bad idea I know). QUOTE]

you could always glue a small pad to it temporarily to see if that solves the problem. A bit of heat and thinner would clean it up later.

[MGySgt]

Good idea FFOD - I have to try that!

[xacex]

55578
If it’s stamped pistol you can do a rifle or pistol on it but you cannot use a AR15 lower not stamped pistol to make an AR pistol.

You need to look into that further, and decide if you are basing that on laws in your state. I have BATF letters stating that in fact it is not prohibited to construct a new AR 15 pistol on a new lower receiver that is not marked pistol unless it has been used to construct a rifle first. State laws such as Washington, and California have other laws regarding this. This may also be the case where you live, but federally you are allowed to build whatever you want on a AR lower receiver as long as it is new. It makes no difference if it is marked pistol. This is possible due to the Thompson Center Supreme Court case.
However, because of this spread of misinformation I recommend a copy of a BATF letter, and receipt of your lower receiver purchase with transfer paperwork form 4473 that will state lower receiver. All lower receivers can only be purchased by someone 21 or over, and the transfer paperwork has a box just for lower receivers because of this now. There are law enforcement that do not know all of the laws regarding AR pistols, and the manufacturing of such. As of 2009 all receivers sold without barrels that have not been registered as a rifle or pistol are transferred as receiver on form 4473 as noted above, and as noted in a bulletin to FFL holders regarding receivers. Tread lightly, inform, and be nice. A loud mouth will be an opportune time to stuff mouth with ones boot, and get cuffed and stuffed no mater how right you may be when dealing with law enforcement.

[Tracy]

There is also an ATF letter from earlier this year (2012) amending the rule on AR pistols so that a lower receiver can be legally changed from a pistol to a rifle and back again, provided that it was originally assembled as a pistol. That caused quite a stir over at ar15.com, because previously the lower could not be returned to pistol configuration once it had been assembled as a rifle.

Again, you must assemble it as a pistol before you assemble it as a rifle, if you ever want to use it in the pistol configuration.

[xacex]

Tracy, If you run across that letter can you link me to it.I read through it before and made a copy, but misplaced it.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Mgysgt: have a look at the Kel-Tec Sub 2000. I have one coming that is in .40 S&W using Glock mags. I will be expanding my thread on this gun as I make mods to it.

They are currently only available in 9mm and 40. We are trying to get the company to produce the gun in .45 ACP using Glock 21 mags which would also give the capibility of making the gun in 10MM G20 mags. It will require a different main receiver to do this as the G21 mags are physically bigger than a G17 mag.

There are 33 rnd Glock mags for 9MM, originally for the Glock 18 machine pistol. And Glock makes 22 rnd .40 cal mags. There are also aftermarket 31 rnd .40 cal mags made in Korea which seem to work OK.

have a look.

Randy

[MGySgt]

Thanks Randy,

IF I decide to build another one - I will be looking at the Glock (they only offer CCU's for Glocks and 1911's). Right now I am having too much fun with this 1911 CCU with the standard 7 round Mags.

I tried 2 15 round mags and that was a waiste of my money. Neither one would feed reliably. The nose of the round would not come up all the way and when the bolt came forward it would jam the nose of the round into the 1911 feed ramp and push the boolit into the case. Maybe they just need different followers - I may try a follower from one of the 7 round mags.

Someone use to catalog after market 1911 mag followers - don't remember who - it has been so long since I did anything with my 1911 - like about 30 years so the memory isn't working too well. :)

Drew

[2wheelDuke]

Has anyone tried to use one of these left handed?

[MGySgt]

Has anyone tried to use one of these left handed?

I don't see any difference in using a Mech Tech CCU and any other right handed firearm left handed. The Safety would probably give you a problem as it is located on the left side of a 1911 (as if you didn't already know that). There is no cast off for the stock.

If I get a chance to shoot tomorrow I will shoot it left haded to see what happens to the brass as it is ejected. That would be the only real problem I see.

Drew

[jmsj]

Drew,
Thanks for posting your results. I have been considering getting one. Do you have the M4 stock or the telescoping stock? I am debating getting one in 460 Rowland or 45 ACP for a stow-away truck gun.
Thanks, jmsj

[xacex]

does it have a last round bolt hold open feature?

[xacex]

I too am interested in the left hand shoot. i rejected the CCU as an option because it looked like it would shoot brass back at my face. I have ambi safeties on my 1911's. Is there clearance for the ambi safety?

[MGySgt]

Drew,
Thanks for posting your results. I have been considering getting one. Do you have the M4 stock or the telescoping stock? I am debating getting one in 460 Rowland or 45 ACP for a stow-away truck gun.
Thanks, jmsj

You are welcome - I think with the iron sights or a Red Dot they would make a good stow away truck gun.

[MGySgt]

I too am interested in the left hand shoot. i rejected the CCU as an option because it looked like it would shoot brass back at my face. I have ambi safeties on my 1911's. Is there clearance for the ambi safety?

It normally ejects at close to a 90 degree angle - so yes they will go past your face (lower part as the sights are high).

Ambi Safties? I know they state the safety must be of the original configuration.

I would suppose that as long as the right hand side does not come above the slide rails you would be ok. I can see the rub mark where mine use to be - but I never trusted mine (30 some years ago) so I took it off and never went back to it.

Send me one of your frames and I can test it for a few years and get back to you! :)

Too bad you weren't closer we could try one of your frames on mine. I know a few that have read this post have one maybe one in 1911 configuration lives close to you and can try it.

[MGySgt]

does it have a last round bolt hold open feature?

Nope - no slide lock you have to count your rounds or wait until a click!

[xacex]

Lol, sure I would send one right over, but between my wife, and son I would be in for a fight taking one away. The ambidextrous safeties are something I put on and are a mirror to the left side slide safety, but doesn't go into a notch in the slide. Only the left side goes into the notch on the slide with this type of safety. They took quite a bit of tuning to get them to be 100% and smooth functioning. I don't blame anyone for taking them off if it wasn't needed. I used to carry with only the standard slide lock, but found I didn't like my reaction time using my index finger for the safety, and the trigger when cocked and locked, or having to rely on a two hand grip to use my other thumb. tried a Glock, but hated the feel and accuracy so it went away after a year. 90 degree ejection isn't a problem. The AR's are at that once the brass hits the Brenton bump. Its 120 degrees before brass becomes uncomfortable. Thanks for the info it is interesting none the less.

[MGySgt]

ambi Safties - without some modification to the safety or the CCU unit - It won't work. On the left side there is a small cut out that the safety moves into.

you would probably need to duplicate that notch on the right side of the CCU. I just looked at it again. I don't think there would be a problem.

I did shoot a few mags left handed today. No cases bounced off my forehead or hat. :) They all ejected 4 to 5 inches infront of my face.

[MGySgt]

Shot this thing again today - ran a test with the one piece mount I have. Fire a mag at a target, take the scope off, put it back on and see where it hits - shooting at 50 yards. Impact of the rounds were right over the first group. Did this twice and no noticable difference in the impact.

Ok - it is only 50 yards and really hard to tell if the group was a half inch left, right, up or down. For the purpose of this rifle and the limited range, I see no difference in point of impact when you remove the scope and put it back on.

Sure wish I could remember where I got this one piece mount - should have bought a couple of them. I had picked it up for my AR, but the scope I have on it now has a built in quick release for the picitinney rail. And yes that one returns to zerro when the scope if removed and replaced.

Now to take the scope off and put the irons on it and get them zerroed. Tomorrow is another day.

[jmsj]

MGySgt,
I was wondering what kind of velocity you are getting with the 230 grain loads?

[MGySgt]

I have been having so much fun shooting this thing, that I have yet to run them over the chronograph. I wouldn't test the load I am currently using as these were Blaster Ammo made up for my 625 in moon clips with the Lee 45 230 TC, normal GG. Still have about 300 of them left - that won't last long as I am shooting 8 mags a day.

I worked a load with with the RCBS 45-230-CM and 7 grains of Unique. I am stting up the Dillion tonight to crank out about 500 of them.

All 3 of my presses are on quick change blocks to give me room on top of my bench. Also helps keep the clutter off of the bench.

I don't think I will have time tomorrow to set up the Chronograph - better go Xmas shopping for SWMBO - don't even know if I will get a chance to shoot.

[MGySgt]

Put the iron sights on the CCU today. Front sight needed 4 clicks of elevation (down) That was the easy part. The rear sight took almost all of my right windage to get it centered at 50. I think I have 3 or 4 clicks remaining before I am out of right windage.

I did pull both the front and rear sights off tonight and reset them. There could have been a problem with mounting of them. (they go on the picitinney rail, one on the 'receiver' and one on the barrel.) I will find out if that was an issue or not.

I did most of my shooting at 50 yards, but just had to try some at 100 on the steel. I gave it one more click up and hit slightly above point of aim.

Last 3 rounds went into the center of one of my 9 in plates.

This is just pure fun to shoot!

More to follow with chrongraph results.

[45FP]

I've had one of those for some years now, your right they are allot of fun to shoot. 100 rounds goes pretty fast.
I shoot allot of cast out of it, mostly 200 gr tc and the lee 452-200 RF. I just got a 230 gr tcfp mold and will try them for sure.
With my reloads the carbine gets 160-190 fps more vel. than the 1911.
If you want bigger mags try the shooting star 10 rd, I've never had a problem with them in about 10 years now.

[MGySgt]

Thanks for the info on the Shooting Star mag's.

Is that 230 gr tcfp the lee 6 banger? I had to hone mine out to get .452 from it and straight WW. Now the boolits just fall out when I open it.

I shoot it on top of 7 gr of Unique or the RCBS 45-230-CM or the clone of the RCBS mould.

All shoot right at 1 to 1.5 in at 50 yards.

Still have to dig out the Chronograph - it is just a pain in the butt to set up (Ohler 35 with 3 sky screens). Maybe today.

[jmsj]

MGySgt,
Now you have done it! All this posting about the Mech Tech has driven me to order one for myself.
I have talked with Frank and Robin at Mech Tech and have decided to get one in 460 Rowland, monorail and the M4S (short stock). I got the 460 so I could step up to the extra power of the 460 Rowland if I wanted to but shoot the 45 ACP for plinking and target shooting. Frank said that shooting 45 ACP loads in it should be no problem. I just need to seat the bullets out as far as functioning (magazine, feeding and chamber) will allow and it will sort of headspace on the bullet ogive. and the extractor will hold the rim. Even though the Rowland cartridge is 1/16" longer the OAL is the same. He did say that before I use 460 Rowland brass that I need to make sure the chamber is completely clean.
They also said that their business has gone up substantially lately and that it would be 4-5 weeks before I received it. They are real friendly people and spent their time answering my questions. I know they are swamped but they made sure I had all my questions answered to my satisfaction.
Thanks, jmsj

[MGySgt]

JMSJ,

Welcome to the Club. Glad I could help you spend your miney. :) When I ordered mine they told me 2 to 3 weeks and I had it in about 10 days. I would rather a company give a worse case estimate than say they will ship today and 3 weeks later they still haven't shipped it.

The Lee 230 TC (I have the full grease groove) should allow you to load it long and jam into the rifling. Does the 460 Rowland take a different mag than the 45ACP? If not the mag length may restrict your length.

I had ordered the Mini Quad rail to alow me to put a front sling swivel on it and of course the Iron front sight. Max sight radius for mine with the irons is less than 13 inches! You might want to go with a single point sling mount. I am thinking about that, just have to order the part and install it.

The only real issue I am having is finding a scope mount high enough. I had picked up a one piece mount for my AR from a Gun Show about 4 years ago and that is what I am currently using on it. I would like a little more height and I might just go with the Kwiki See Through mounts.

Choose your boolit and get a LOT of them cast/sized/lubed up - you sure will go through a lot of them in a hurry. Shooting this thing is addictive!

By the way - I have in excess of 1200 rounds of cast through it and I have only gotten one or 2 small slivers of lead out of it. The boolits/load I am shooting is not leading the barrel. Diameter = .452.

[jmsj]

MGySgt,
The 460 Rowland has all the same dimensions as the 45 ACP except the brass is approximately 1/16" longer than 45 ACP but the COAL length remains the same as the 45 ACP. The longer brass stops it from being able to chamber in guns not modified for 460 Rowland. Because the COAL is the same for both rounds they both fit in standard 1911 45 ACP magazines and will feed in a 1911 platform. The 460 is loaded to much higher pressures than the 45 ACP. I believe the 460 can be loaded up 40,000 psi vs 21,000 psi (max) for the 45 ACP.
I will probably shoot way more 45 ACP than the Rowland cartridge. I was really surprised when I found out that a gun set up for 460 Rowland can fire 45 ACP.
Thanks for the heads up on the sight height and ammo suggestions. Unfortunately I have spent all my play money on getting this upper and will have to wait to get a sight on this. Mech Tech says the are going to raise prices in 2013 and I wanted to get one before the prices go up or the guberment reclassifies this type of upper.
My 45 ACP walking around load for out here in the sticks is the Lee 452-255-RF. It shoots well in my Taurus stainless PT1911 and it will probably be the first load I try.
If you have any other tips I would appreciate them as well.
Thanks, jmsj

[MGySgt]

Before this is reclassified they will have to reclassify all the switch barrel weapons out there, like the TC Encore/contender and the new TC Switch barrel and a few others I can't think of right now.

Other tips??????

I don't like the fact that it is not easy to take completly apart to do a detailed cleaning. Tehy reccomend you clean the barrel as you would any other rifle, but use one of the spay cleaners to flood out the dirt and grim (which I have done twice) snd then use a spray lube to lube it.

I normally clean what I can get to with a Q-tip and Breakfee CLP. I do ensure that I put a few drops in the back side of the firing pin and hold the gun with the muzzel down to let the CLP work it's way through the bolt so the firing pin moves freely.

There are two types of malfunctions I have had so far;
Failure to feed - mag issues - Dirty! Cleaned the mags and problem went away.

Failure to eject last round of the mag - caught in the ejection port. Don't know if this was caused by Dirty Mag, Dirty Chamber, or the rounds I was using were border line and the loads should have been heavier. Documentation states for best results use +P loads. Mine are not. According to Quick Load I am at least 3/10s of a grain under max for a standard load. As this only happens once or twice per 100 rounds - I am not really worried about it. If I were going to use it to hunt with, I would take the load to the MAX and only use that one for hunting.

I have decided to go with the Lee 45 230 TC boolit as my standard 'plinking load'. This was after spending about 3 hours casting up a bunch of the Lee clone of the RCBS 45-230-CM boolit (6 cavity group buy a few years ago) . Oh well those are the ones that I would use for hunting - guess I don't have to cast anymore of them - I probably have 10 life times supply of them :) I dug out the 45-230-TC and I will start casting them tomorrow (it is a 6 banger too).

Haven't had a chance to shoot in the last few days - weather hasn't been the greatest and while my range drains well - everything else is wet to include my bench. Looked down there a few hours ago and I could still see puddels. Rained this morning again.

[W.R.Buchanan]

We want pics,,, please.

Randy

[MGySgt]

Randy,

Range or CCU - Both?????

Tomorrow

Drew

[MGySgt]

Ok Randy you asked for them;

5726457265

The one on the left of course has the scope and 2 point sling. That is a standard yard stick above the rifle.
I tried to find the web site for the single point sling but no such luck. The card I have has a general web site but no real information. It has a velcro attachment to the rifle - works ok and you can switch it fron one rifle to another (AR style) quick and easy.

Some Range Pic's incase that is what you were asking about

5726657267

Drew

[W.R.Buchanan]

Drew; thanks for the pics.

I like this gun! One of the main things I like is the .45 ACP part. Nice and compact, and I like the AR stock as well. Maybe I should find another Glock 21 and get the top end for it from these guys.

Part of the reason I got the Kel Tec was to have a gun that was nice and short like these and used Glock mags as my pistols are Glocks, but there are no .45 ACP's in the Kel-Tec gun. So it was a compromise. It does fold in half however which is a good thing, but it would be the best of both worlds if it came in .45 and folded in half.

Being able to use a 1911 lower with the safeties would be a good way to be configure this gun. The Glock version wouldn't have that option. I don't think a Glock trigger safety alone would be sufficient on a rifle.

Randy

[MGySgt]

Randy I agree about the Glock safety - I don't like them on a pistol either - why I don't know because a revolver sure doesn't have a safety on it. Maybe the trigger block that is soft rubber (or whatever) that goes behind the trigger. It would be a force fit so it could stay in place with a short lanyard (3 or 4 inches) on it attached to the rifle (trigger guard). That would eliminate and inadvertant trigger pull, you should be able to push it out with your trigger finger. Just a thought.

8 to 11 rounds of 45 sure would be a good fight stopper.

Also with the Picatinny rail system you can add any attachment that you would put on the AR's. As a matter of fact the iron sights are for the AR. And change them at a whim. I remove and replace the scope and iron sights whenever I choose. The scope goes back to zerro as long as I remember to push it forward in the slot and push it from the none moveable side (opposite of the thumb screws) when I put it back on. I only tighten them down by hand - found it groups better (doesn't tork the scope). This is a one piece mount - don't know if the weaver style with thumb screws would work as well.

Drew

[MGySgt]

Finally dug out the chronograph and set it up and did some testing.

Here is the results:

Lee 230gr TC, 6.1 grains of Unique in WCC 84 (Mil spec) Brass

Gun shot 1 shot 2 shot 3 shot 4 shot 5 ES Averg SD
Kimber 842 848 856 827 858 31 846 12
1911 870 870 901 894 894 31 886 15
Carbine1064 1077 1064 1071 1055 22 1066 8

RCBS 230 CM, 7.0 grains of Unique, TZZ 85 Brass

Gun shot 1 shot 2 shot 3 shot 4 shot 5 ES Averg SD
Kimber 889 881 912 862 876 50 884 18
1911 930 895 935 913 903 40 915 17
Carbine1144 1157 1161 1140 1146 21 1149 8

The kimber is 4.25 in, 1911 is 5 in and the carbine is 16.

[Bullet Caster]

Hey there, Master Gunnery Sergeant. When was you in the Corps? I served Oct. 1969-1973, made Sgt. in 3 yrs. Vietnam '71-'72 with Marine All Weather Attack Squadron 224 out of Cherry Pt. NC. We went aboard the USS Coral Sea after flying to NAS Alameda, CA. You must have made a career out of it being a MGySgt.

I've been following this thread for a while now and you've sure got my interest up on the 1911 CCU. I'd love to have a .45 acp carbine. Sounds like you're having too much fun with that toy. Lol. Now I've gotta save up my spare change and get me one of them their carbines. BC

[MGySgt]

Semper Fi Brother!

Feb 70 - Feb 96, I was in and out of Nam a few times in 71 - 72 as part of a reactionary Bn from Oki. Don't ask me where I was, we were in and out in a few days to a week and never the same place twice. They sure don't tell LCpl's much! :)

Made a slight mod to the 1911 frame I use for the CCU - changed the Mag release to right handed. It was a PITA to change Mags with the standard mag release.

Two things I don't like about shooting it - sure does put a hurtin on your lead supply and picking up the brass - I swear the brass morphs to a different world and then about an hour latter it comes back so you can find it, maybe!

[Bullet Caster]

Semper Fi, my friend. Ohhhh Rahhhh. I was in the Tonkin Gulf so I knew where we were most of the time. Just wouldn't want to revisit that duty station as I'd have quite the swim. They called it Yankee Station. BC

[acemedic13]

I'm getting my ccu back from the factory this week. I sent it in to have a few things tweaked, mainly having it bored out to 460 Rowland. I shoot mine just about everyday, and I wanted a little more out of it. It's an awesome piece of gear and functions flawlessly. Any info on 460 performance would be great.

[Shooter6br]

Have a first model with metal "grease gun " stock.Red dot scope.Works great.AKA "Thumper "