Star Adapter and Replaceable Pushrods for Base First Sizing

[theperfessor]

One of the members here sent me some pictures and the dimensions of the existing punch/bullet pushrod system for Star sizers. He wanted to be able to size bullets base first and also did not want the next bullet to damage the tip of the bullet that had not yet exited the die. It would be a bonus if the system used easily interchangeable punches that could be produced at lower cost than the complete threaded unit which is the current norm.

Pictured here is my solution for him to Beta test (I'm mailing this stuff out to him tomorrow). It features a 1/2-27 threaded adapter with a 17/64 hole. The end has a 1/8" wide by 1/8" deep slot milled in it. I also made a simple tool to be used to adjust the adapter to the right position. The next version will have a knurled stem to make gripping/twisting easier. The pushrods have a cup nose that will be filled with epoxy or JB Weld and molded to the nose of the bullet. The spacers also have a cup on one end and are also to be molded to fit. The pushrods use my standard O-ring stem and just push-in/pull-out with no other tools needed. The pushrods of course can be had in any standard caliber just like my regular nose punches. The ones shown are .30 caliber.

This is a prototype unit and until the Beta tester tries it out and sends me some feedback I won't put a price on the set. (The Beta tester gets the set for free by the way. I want to encourage other people to help me and share their ideas.) I want to make sure the dimensions are right, the pushrods are the proper length and so forth.

Any comments etc. are welcome, and I will ask the Beta tester to share his comments either in this thread or in his own thread (hopefully with pictures).

[ReloaderFred]

That looks pretty slick! I'll be interested in his feedback.

Fred

[VHoward]

Looks good. However, for those of us with a bullet feeder, it is a little difficult to adjust the punch depth via the main threaded body of the punch because of the requirement of mounting the actuator for the bullet feed system on it. If the section of your punch that has the "O" ring on it and the hole it goes into were threaded, then we could adjust the punch depth with that instead and leave the main body alone.

With the bullet feed system mounted to the star, there is not a lot of room to get in there to adjust the punch. The two piece punch system would work great there otherwise.

[dragonrider]

If I am thinking right the piece on the left is the install/removal tool for the adapter. A knurl on that may be handy.

[theperfessor]

DR, you're right, the leftmost item is the installation/removal/adjustment tool. If I make any more of these it will be knurled. I didn't think of it until it was too late and I didn't have any material to hang on to for knurling. The Beta tester can just use skateboard tape or something to help get a grip.

Caveat: I don't own a Star (yet) so I am working on this using the dimensions sent to me along with a half dozen photographs of a Star in action. I am relying on my Beta tester to tell me if I've hit the mark or not.

As I understand it, the punches have to be adjusted up or down so that the bullet's lube groove lines up with the die holes as the linkage straightens out and contacts the lube pump. Is this correct? Since the pushrods in my system won't allow for torque to be transmitted to the adapter to screw it in or out, I envision the tool being used to adjust the adapter. It may take several tries of removing/inserting/testing to get the depth right, but the replaceable punches should make that process easier.

Also note the collar on the pushrods is cut to about 0.445", as is the business end of the adjuster. This is smaller than the minor diameter of the 1/2-27 thread so it should allow the adjuster and pushrods to clear the jam nut, giving a little more adjustment leeway.

If I'm missing anything here please chime in.

Edit to add: VHoward, do you have a picture of the bullet feeder you talk about? Does my explanation make sense, is what you mention still a problem?

[41 mag fan]

Keith,
i got a used Star in a few weeks ago. If you want, let me know and I can bring it down and you can use it to help you make your dimensions ect that you need. I haven't got sizers yet for it, as it's not bolted on my bench either, but you're more than welcome to use it to help you out. Let me know, pm, email or give me aholler and I can get it there over the weekend

[theperfessor]

41 Mag Fan -

Thanks! Pm sent.

Guys, 41 Mag Fan is a great example of the best of the members here. If you knew everything I know about him you would understand and agree with that.

[dragonrider]

Keith I like the idea so one can use the nose punches from lyman or rcbs or yours but I don't think it will answer the problem Star users have with the boolit feeder.

[theperfessor]

DR, w/o having a Star w/a feeder I will take your word for it. Anybody care to post a picture of a Star w/a feeder? I have no frame of reference.

[454PB]

Very nice work.

How about making the adjustment tool body from hex stock instead of round? That would provide a better finger grip, and also allow for the use of an end wrench if desired.

[theperfessor]

Thank you, kind words are always appreciated. I like the hex stock idea, I just didn't have any on hand when I was making this. I need to get some 1/2" hex stock to replenish my supply of Saeco nose punch blanks, so there will be some on my rack to use the next time.

All part of the process of trying to work the kinks out and standardize the materials needed to make a product cost effectively.

[41 mag fan]

41 Mag Fan -

Thanks! Pm sent.

Guys, 41 Mag Fan is a great example of the best of the members here. If you knew everything I know about him you would understand and agree with that.

Thats what friends are for, my friend.

[Powersgt]

I would assume that this system can be used for conventional sizing as well (nose first.) I like the Idea of just change tips without having to unscrew the punch out of the sizer (potentially cross threading it.)

[runfiverun]

a beveled lock nut on the insert adapter would fix the boolit feeder problem.

[VHoward]

You can just use the jamb nut that Magma provides with the bullet feeder. I will go down and take some pictures. Hopefully they will show what I mean.

[VHoward]

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j262/howard-v/viewofpunch.jpg
In this picture, you see the punch and the jamb nut. Right above that is the bullet feeder actuator collar. There is not a lot of room there to get in there to adjust it.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j262/howard-v/behindpunch.jpg
In this picture you can see the vertical bolt that is screwed into the collar.

http://i82.photobucket.com/albums/j262/howard-v/overallview.jpg
And this is an overall view. Just would be easier for a two piece punch where the punch part is adjustable and the body that the punch screws into could be left mounted permanently so the bullet feeder actuator collar can be left mounted and not be messed with.

[StratsMan]

Hey All...

Sorry I've been a little slow to add to this thread. I'm Keith's BETA tester on this punch project, and I've been busy enjoying the tools. I've sent extensive photos and feedback to Keith, but I'll summarize here for all of you who are interested.

The tools I received are pictured in the first post of this thread. The pushrods and spacers have deep cavities for casting the JB QwikWeld. As soon as I opened up the package, I got right to it. I screwed the adapter into the Star and set about cleaning up the parts for casting two Lyman boolit shapes; 311329 (left) and 311334.

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The -334 is a longer version of the 311332... I really like the looks of the -329 profile, though it's short on bore ride. On the other hand, the -334 has a long bore ride and a shorter ogive than the pointy -329. To cast the pushrods, I greased the boolits for a mold release and centered the boolits base-down in the 309 sizing die. I mixed some JB QwikWeld according to their instructions, worked it into the cavity in the pushrod, let it sit for a minute to begin to set (so it wouldn't run out) then pushed it up into the hollow adapter and gently lowered it down onto the boolit tip. I let the JBWeld set up for about 45 minutes, then pulled the boolit out for curing.

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To cast the inserts, I stood the boolits up, filled the insert cavities with JBWeld, and waited for them to begin to set. With the inserts sitting on the boolits, I used my Mark I Eyeballs to keep them centered and straight on the boolits until the epoxy was sturdy enough to prevent them from falling over. Again, 45 minute wait and I removed the boolits. Trimming the excess was a quick cut with a utility knife, and I let them sit overnite to cure. Sorry for the text in the photos. I’m putting all the content in here, too…

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Now to making the pushrods work… These boolit designs are single grease groove designs, so I only use the bottom row of grease holes in my 309 die. So, I screwed the adapter deep into the Star, inserted the pushrod, and put in a boolit. These pushrods are long. It pushed the -329 almost all the way out of the die, and the -334 did push all the way out the die. So when the pump squeezed in the lube, it was over the top driving band.

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Finally adjusted, the adapter was screwed into the Star over an eighth of an inch beyond flush. Yeah, it worked, but I couldn’t put a lock nut on it so I couldn’t be certain of holding adjustment. Keith already plans to make the next ones short enough that the lock nut will be able to engage. The other anomaly I ran across was that the rubber O-ring you see on the pushrods didn’t have enough friction to hold them in the adapter when retracting the press. The rod would stick to the boolit a little bit, and pull the rod out of the adapter. I put some case lube on the interior of the rod, and that helped for a few cycles, but it would get sticky again.

Finally, the inserts that go between the boolits worked wonderfully. I was able to stack them and run one boolit after another.

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I also tried putting the Magma 30 cal punch back in place and using the inserts between the boolits. That worked perfectly as well!!!

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In the photo above, you can see the boolit sitting in the insert. There is a sized boolit in the die, then the insert, and boolit go in and push ‘em through. Bottom line, with these tools we have the option of running our boolits base first OR point first without squishing the point. Here’s a photo of a sized -329 and an unsized one (just sitting on a GC so the length is the same)…

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Dave "StratsMan" Stratton