358 Winchester build planing stage

[drumgool]

I think it time for a new project. I am planing on building a 358 Win. on a Savage Action . My objective is to build a dedicated cast boolit hunting rifle that is accurate, quick handling and . I am planing on a Savage or Stevens short action,20" Shilen chrome molly match grade barrel, have not decided on stock. What recommendations would yall make on barrel contour I don't think I want a sporter contour. Any advice or recommendations welcome I you have pictures of your build I would like to see them.

[felix]

You must define your objective to have a valid specification. ... felix

[onegunred]

Would you start out with a .243 or .308 donor gun? I like bull barrels on thumbhole stocks.

[drumgool]

You must define your objective to have a valid specification. ... felix

I mainly hunt in deer in Southeast Tennessee . Mostly stalking and still hunting shots are fairly quick and within 50 yds. But every once in a while get a long shot ,would like to be able to shoot to 200 yrds .I hunt hogs a couple of times a year in the Mountains same type of hunting . Is this what your asking?

[drumgool]

Would you start out with a .243 or .308 donor gun? I like bull barrels on thumbhole stocks.

The only gun I have for a possible donor is a Savage 25-06. I like that rifle and would not want to change it . I would not be opposed to buying a donor if I can find one. My problem is I want one of every caliber and once I buy they tend to stick around.

[onegunred]

The 25-06 is perfect just the way it is. The reason I ask about .243 or .308, they are the same case as the .358 but I know you know that and there should not be any gun smithing on the bolt face and rails. I think a beat up .243 would be easy to find and you may not get that attached to it.

[felix]

Yes, you want a small game hunting gun, with open field capability. What is the percentage of walking-and-shooting versus shooting from a stationary blind? That will determine gun length and weight. ... felix

[waksupi]

DO start with an action that is already set up for a .308 based cartridge. You DO NOT want to go through the process of making that finicky body shape feed.

[drumgool]

Yes, you want a small game hunting gun, with open field capability. What is the percentage of walking-and-shooting versus shooting from a stationary blind? That will determine gun length and weight. ... felix

I say I walk around about 50% of the time weather permitting (high wind or light rain)

[hicard]

I would go with the sporter/hunter profile. 200 yards is well in the reach and accuracy potential of the light 358 Win. and you will appreciate it when it comes time to walking with that rifle and quickly bringing it up to snap shoot at a target. The only trouble I've run into is feeding boolits with meplats too large to feed properly and they catch onto the barrel and jam.

[felix]

Do start with a 308-358 gun as Ric (Waksupi) says. Your choice of Shilen barrel is fine because the 14 twist is standard and will shoot the RCBS 200 grainer mighty fine in a windy condition through 200 yards. Because you are walking a good percentage of the rifle's time, keep total weight of gun fully loaded with ammo and scope under 7.5 pounds. Mate the barrel contour and stock to that weight. Any more than a 22 inch barrel would be counter productive to wood's shooting. Load the 358 to 2400 fps with that boolit. ... felix

[358wcf]

Gents- Just a note from experience here- be VERY careful about having both a 308win and a 358win in the same proximity, especially in poor light and/or hunting conditions! Don't EVER allow the two ammo types to become mixed! Yes, you can safely chamber and fire 308win in a 358rifle, and at close range, it will do the job on your intended game, as well, but not as you would like. (DO NOT ASK HOW I KNOW THIS!) You will find it very difficult to close the bolt on a 358round in a 308win rifle- very embarassing and dangerous-- don't try to do it, ever!

Now- I made my 358 rifle a few years back for my last trip to New Zealand for Red Stag (think something like a Rocky Mtn Elk with a bigger rack- very impressive creature!) Tore down a Rem700 varminter in 243 for the action- had Pac-Nor put a 20" barrel on it with a 16" twist (hasn't failed me yet up to 250 grains), and went to MPI stocks for one of their Kevlar Mannlicher beauties with a cheekpiece for lefties like me- backup iron sights due to previous scope failures in NZ. 2-7 Leupold in detachable Leupold mts. Puts 3 shots into a cloverleaf at 100yds if the shooter managers that shilen trigger properly. Short, stout, handy, a deadly gray machine she is- I use her on ground squirrels here in the off-season to stay in touch with the trigger-God- they seem to just vaporize!
Heavy is okay if she's accurate!
358wcf

[MBTcustom]

Unless you like to experiment with looong boolits (that would be 275 grain plus, boreriders), you don't want the added weight and headache of the long action (although I have built several exactly like that).
If I were in your situation, I would sell the Savage, and add some money to get a Remington model Seven.
Unless you have the capability to re-profile the barrel to make sure the outside is running true with the inside, I would shy away from Shillen barrels, or at least check it very carefully between centers before you take so much as a file stroke.
Once you have ascertained the concentricity of the barrel, I would plan on a 20" semi-heavy profile. Short is stiff, stiff is accurate, and at less than 200 yards, you will not be missing the 100FPS or so that you give up for a shorter barrel. I can tell you that if you do any serious walking in the woods, you become very aware that every inch shorter or pound lighter you can make your rifle, adds to the miles you can go, and the hours you can stand, without getting fatigued.
Give it a nice recessed 11 degree target crown, and headspace it GO + .001-.002. (rent the gages and use them.)
I would buy a nice 98% stock from Richards Microfit. Finish it with Trueoil and bed it with Devcon.
I would install a Timney trigger (great folks BTW).
I would use Leupold rings and at least a VX1 or a rifleman.
Viola! a 200 yard, short, light, cast boolit, deerslayer delux.
That's just what I would do, YMMV.

[drumgool]

Thanks for all the responses gives me a lot to think about .

Goodsteel I am not a machinist I will be purchasing a pre made barrel I am not apposed to another brand of barrel. I built a 243 Ackley on a Savage Action and used a Shilen select match barrel . It shoots great , I have also thought of Pac- Nor and some others . I like the idea of 20" barrel though. I have a small lathe but I know just enough to be dangerous. I guess build is not the correct term , more like parts assembly.

[Adam10mm]

Drumgool, I'm planning a build in .358 Win too. My platform choice is the Remington Model 7 and sticking with a 20 inch barrel length.

Was aiming more at what cast boolit would work well, but there is discussion about the rifle platform that may be of help to you.
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?162037-358-Win-plan-Just-right-or-do-I-need-more

[MBTcustom]

My gosh! The 358s are taking over cast boolits!

[waksupi]

My gosh! The 358s are taking over cast boolits!

For good reason!

[Junior1942]

Add me to the list of those who'd like to own a 358. I have a Turk 38 still in cosmoline, and maybe one day . . . . But there isn't much difference between .358 and .323......

[drumgool]

My gosh! The 358s are taking over cast boolits!

Well it is time for another project this winter I just browsing this sight for ideas,read a few post on 358 Win. Saw pictures of dramatic wound channels talk of great cast boolit accuracy . Easy to load develop for. Why would any one want one ?

[Bren R.]

I've had a barrel waiting with Ron Smith to be bored/rifled for my 358 Winchester build on a Savage 99C action now for 9 months.

Hoping to see it by next season, but... he's got a really long wait list.

Bren R.

[MBTcustom]

I've had a barrel waiting with Ron Smith to be bored/rifled for my 358 Winchester build on a Savage 99C action now for 9 months.

Hoping to see it by next season, but... he's got a really long wait list.

Bren R.

That will be an absolutely covetous rifle when it's done. Good call!

[Bren R.]

That will be an absolutely covetous rifle when it's done. Good call!
Thanks, Tim...

I keep second guessing myself on the strength of the 99C action, being that it's prone to twisting with all the meat gone for the magazine well.

Even cooler part about it, is... I got the gun as a "non-shooter parts gun" from my ex's uncle. I'd had one as my first hunting rifle, and when I made the switch to a bolt-action Savage, mine went to a cousin of a cousin, to their cousin, etc. When I got this one, something seemed familiar (though definitely not the shattered stock or the rear sight blade tack-welded onto the dovetail)... so I checked against my old registrations - I'd gotten my first gun back!

It's not a non-shooter by any means, it always just prefered 180 grain bullets and the scope was damaged from years of scabbard use.

Anyway, decided to turn it around into a 358 Winchester and give the old girl a new lease on life - I've got .308s coming out the ying-yang already. Barrel's by Ron Smith, some other CNC work by our own Red River Rick and I've got a start on a wonderful set of furniture for her.

Bren R.

[waksupi]

Add me to the list of those who'd like to own a 358. I have a Turk 38 still in cosmoline, and maybe one day . . . . But there isn't much difference between .358 and .323......
True enough, Junior, but some people can't be convinced! I could be perfectly happy with a 8X57, but I don't have to be!

[Adam10mm]

Add me to the list of those who'd like to own a 358. I have a Turk 38 still in cosmoline, and maybe one day . . . . But there isn't much difference between .358 and .323......
There is with bullet selection. I love "the" Mauser, but I'll take a .358 Win or .35 Whelen any day of the week.

[lastborn]

Tag for reference.

[308w]

I have a neat little 6mm br on a rem mdl 7 with 20" pacnor barrel,no 5 taper, I keep thinking how nice it handles and how versatile it would be to have it made in to a switch barrel and add a 358 win chambering to it. Yall ain't helping none either.......

[Just Duke]

I wish my Savage 99 was 358.

[MBTcustom]

I wish my Savage 99 was 358.

How badly do you wish it? It can be done in a matter of months you know.

[Just Duke]

How badly do you wish it? It can be done in a matter of months you know.

I'll check for a shooting star. ;) That's how bad.

[Just Duke]

You have fan mail.

[Marlin Junky]

My Ruger M77 in .358 is a nice handling little gun with a 22" barrel. It's also shorter in over all length than my friend's M'99. Lop 2" off the barrel and all you will gain is more muzzle blast.

MJ

[KLR]

This winter I put together a rifle like you've described. I used a magnum profile barrel because it was what fit my budget and then cut it down to 20." I've experimented with a only few loads, but it's accurate and fun to shoot. I only shot one 3-shot 100 yd group (cold, clean bore - 1.1") and then took it hunting. The short barrel offsets the heavier profile and it's not bad at all to carry. It's lighter and handier than my Remington 7600 pump. If I had to do it over again I might go for a 22" barrel in a slightly lighter profile just to cut down on muzzle blast a little, although it's not bad at 20."

http://i424.photobucket.com/albums/pp330/305178/358WinMod11_zpsb21c7019.jpg (http://s424.photobucket.com/user/305178/media/358WinMod11_zpsb21c7019.jpg.html)

[Bren R.]

I wish my Savage 99 was 358.

Why wish? Just do it. I did!

101060

Bren R.

[Piedmont]

I've thought many times of building a .358 Win on my M7 .308 and may yet do it. Thought enough about it to check out different types of barrels and twists. If I do it I will go Krieger because they offer a cut rifled barrel with fairly deep rifling and the customer may choose the twist. Mine would be a 1-16 because there are no large beasties in this part of the country. If I won't be shooting at an elk, moose, or grizzly, I won't need heavy bullets. The slow twist will allow higher velocities with my bullet of choice (200 gr. RCBS) should I want them. I will think of it as a super .35 Remington and probably load it like a .35 Remington also. But that rifle has a fantastic trigger (worked on) and will be glass bedded and should shoot lights-out.

Oh and on the barrel lengths....Jeff Cooper got my into the whole Scout Rifle concept and this little M7 is set up with a Scout scope and three position sling. I've tried it and for a long time. Fifteen years ago I got heavily into older milsurps and that made me a fan of longer barrels. The eyes don't work with irons anymore so I don't need sight radius, but there is no reason to subject the ears to lots of muzzle blast. Mine will be somewhere in the 22-26" range and have a conventional scope on the receiver.