Fryxell's Eds Red didn't work for cleaning molds

[Irascible]

In Fryxell's book from ingot to target, he modernizes the Ed's Red formula and recommends it for cleaning molds also. Well, I havn't used it to clean any guns yet, but I did use some to clean a couple of old LBT moulds I have. It did a fair, but not great job of getting off the old NEI graphite and Bee Wax sprue and alignment dowel lube and other assorted stains inside and out of the cavities. When I went to cast VERY wrinkly bullets. I cleaned again using MEK, same problem. I blasted the moulds with brake cleaner, same problem. I finally just kept casting. Over 100 bullets and the wrinkling is finally starting to clear up. WHEW.
Now, many years ago, Veril Smith of LBT told me to boil the mould halves in Oakite to clean them. Has anybody ever done this? If so, any tricks? How did it work? Did it hurt anything?
Thanks, in advance.

[imashooter2]

I boil new blocks in water with a little dish soap to get them clean. Many boiled, never a problem. I think the heat is the secret. Gets the oil out of the microscopic pores and scratches.

Not sure exactly what Oakite is. I would be leery of boiling aluminum blocks in anything other than soapy water though...

[Dan Cash]

Sounds like Ed's Red worked fine. The lube protection remained and the blocks did not rust:grin: Why would you want to remove the lubricating graphite only to replace it? As far as removing Ed's Red, a bath in paint thinner will do it; clean and shining mould blocks don't make shining bullets.

[cbrick]

Ed's Red, either the original or Glen's recipe contains ATF which is petroleum based oil. Of course ALL oil should be removed from the cavities BEFORE casting. I use denatured alcohol and a tooth brush to assure there is no oil left but whatever your prefered method of cleaning you still need to remove the oil.

Rick

[Maven]

I boil new blocks in water with a little dish soap to get them clean. Many boiled, never a problem. I think the heat is the secret. Gets the oil out of the microscopic pores and scratches. Not sure exactly what Oakite is. I would be leery of boiling aluminum blocks in anything other than soapy water though...

I do exactly as imashooter2 does and have never had a problem with any mold so treated.

[RobS]

If you are trying to get off the brown stuck on beeswax lube try a Mr. Clean Magic Eraser preferably the extra strength ones and a bit of dawn dish soap/warm water.

[Irascible]

There are 2 Dawn detergents the original great stuff now called "Ultra" and the new one which contains hand cream. Obviously the new stuff is not the one to use.
Oakite is some kind of heavy duty cleaner/floor soap.
Oh yea, LBT are aluminum molds and the NEI sprue plate/alignment pin lube just migrated everywhere.

[trixter]

A friend recommended two stroke synthetic motorcycle oil. So I went to a dealer with a pill bottle and he filled it for me no charge. I use a 'Q' tip; dip it , and blot it on a paper towel. Then on the back of the sprue plate, a light circle around each hole, the alignment pin holes and pins, the alignment bolt and hinge bolt for the sprue plate and the 'scissor' bolt for the handles. I always pre-heat it on a hot plate prior to use, always. When done and everything is cool, I use a stiff brush, Old military medical scrub brush, and Comet and really give it a good going over, till all of the brown crud is gone. This system has worked for many thousands of boolits.

[Irascible]

you do this on an aluminum mould?

[Ben]

I continue to read of casters pouring petroleum based materials into mold cavities.

For the past 40 years, when I accidentally did this, my chances for a decent bullet went SOUTH fast.

The rule of thumb for me is ...." No petroleum based materials in any of my mold cavities."

Yet, there are those who continue this practice and many say it is good for the mold.

Nope.....not me !

Ben

[rintinglen]

I continue to read of casters pouring petroleum based materials into mold cavities.

For the past 40 years, when I accidentally did this, my chances for a decent bullet went SOUTH fast.

The rule of thumb for me is ...." No petroleum based materials in any of my mold cavities."

Yet, there are those who continue this practice and many say it is good for the mold.

Nope.....not me !

Ben

Amen, Brother, Amen!
Oil in a cavity guarantees crappy boolits for at least the next two dozen casts. I have learned the hard way never to get petroleum based products or wax in my molds.

[Irascible]

I agree, but an "expert" suggested this, so I tried. I understood the solvents in Ed's Red for mould cleaning, but not the ATF. I tried anyway! What I can't understand now is that straight solvents won't take out the oil. Neither will 50 casts (although it has gotten better)! I have always used brake cleaner on new moulds, no matter the mould material, with no problems, but these old aluminum moulds were really gummed up, so I tried Fryxells cleaner. By the way I did contact Veral Smith at LBT and he says he never mentioned boiling the moulds in Oakite (industrial cleaner), didn't even know what it was. But he suggested cleaning the aluminum moulds with a SS toothbrush. YIPES! I think I'll try some Dawn Ultra which is the old grease removing dish soap. NOT the new Dawn with hand lotion in it.

[Ben]

Irascible


Sounds like petroleum based compounds have leached their way into the pores of your mold cavities now. Nothing to do now, but use the Dawn dish washing detergent and boiling hot water technique. ( May take 5 - 6 cycles of heat up the mold to casting temp and then clean again while the pores of the metal are open to ever get the cavities clean again ) Use a soft nylon tooth brush with the Dawn and hot soapy water in the cavities. It will eventually come clean again.

Keep us posted with your progress.

Ben

[doctorggg]

question: What are you guys using to prevent rust in a steel mold if you never let a petroleum based product touch the cavities? Thanks for the info in advance.

[WashingMike]

I just wait until the mold is cool. Then I put it in a sandwich bag with 3 in 1 oil. Put rubber band around the bag and put it away. When I need it again I put some Acetone in a metal bowl and give it a bath. Take it apart and use a little brush on the disassembled pieces. The acetone takes everything off. This is only if I put it away for a long time. I found that the bullplate stuff keeps most of the rust off if you leave a boolit in the cavity.

[DRNurse1]

I know this sounds silly, but I leave the last pour in my moulds and let them cool by ambient radiation. Faces and cavities on my steel mould blocks are pristine after 60 years (I have only used them for 20). Exterior is cleaned as needed with nonabrasive cleaners of what ever happens to be available.

My moulds original owner and my mentor instructed me to be methodical and careful when using his mould to minimize wear, and following his instructions must have convinced him I could take care of this mould (and subsequent moulds I purchased) so he gave it to me. I have my first brass mould and plan to try the same technique with it. I have no information regarding aluminum moulds, but suspect this technique will work with both brass and aluminum moulds.

[cbrick]

question: What are you guys using to prevent rust in a steel mold if you never let a petroleum based product touch the cavities? Thanks for the info in advance.

Here's how I do it.

Rust Free Mold Storage (http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?115858-Rust-Free-Mold-Storage-on-the-cheap&highlight=rust+free+mold+storage)

Rick

[uscra112]

I believe the key ingredient in Oakite was (is?) trisodium phosphate. TSP was driven out of household detergents a few years ago (thank you the EPA) which is why they don't clean well any more. You can still buy straight TSP in the paint section of many hardware stores, (but not Lowes or Home Despot). The brand name is Savogran. Not cheap, but a necessary addition to your home chemistry set. If you have a dishwasher that doesn't clean, add a teaspoon of TSP to the detergent load and watch what happens.

I boil molds in a TSP solution for 5-10 minutes, in a stainless steel pan, then rinse thoroughly in hot tap water. Iron molds immediately get dunked in alcohol to strip off the remaining water. Otherwise they'll start to rust as you watch.

TSP solution is about 1 teaspoon per quart of hot water.

[lavenatti]

There's a recent thread about penetrating oils and the best one tested was a 50/50 mix of ATF and acetone.

This isn't so different a mix from Ed's red. You probably found one of the best ways to get petroleum oils as deep as possible into the pores of your mold.

Keep cleaning and casting, it'll get better.

[quasi]

I believe Ed Harris recommends boiling Lee moulds in a TSP -water mix to remove the factory coolant -preservative they come with. Is Ed Harris a member here?

[btroj]

I continue to read of casters pouring petroleum based materials into mold cavities.

For the past 40 years, when I accidentally did this, my chances for a decent bullet went SOUTH fast.

The rule of thumb for me is ...." No petroleum based materials in any of my mold cavities."

Yet, there are those who continue this practice and many say it is good for the mold.

Nope.....not me !

Ben

Removing one petroleum based substance only to replace it with another seems silly to me. Sounds like a job chasing it's tail.

I use hot water, Comet, and a toothbrush. Always seems to work.

[Irascible]

I blast new moulds with brake cleaner. then I coat the outside surrfaces and both sides of the sprue plate with NEI mould prep, which I think is colloidial graphite. When I'm done casting, I too leave the last pour in the mould. Never a problem from rust, But the moulds are stored in my cellar where there is a furnace running in the winter and a de-humidifier running in the warmer weather. If the moulds are in a box, I also slip one of the VCI pro chip strips in with the mould. www.theinhibitor.com

[Shiloh]

When I got careless lubing the pins on a LEE mold with boolit lube, it was Ed's Red that dissolved the residue. Took a day and it wiped right off.

SHiloh

[HangFireW8]

I believe the key ingredient in Oakite was (is?) trisodium phosphate. TSP was driven out of household detergents a few years ago (thank you the EPA) which is why they don't clean well any more. You can still buy straight TSP in the paint section of many hardware stores, (but not Lowes or Home Despot).

http://www.lowes.com/pd_124762-68-63004_0__?productId=3010340