Glock finger ??

[sagamore-one]

Got a deal on Glock 32 with an accessory 40 cal Bar Sto barrel. Went to the range today to try it out . Fired 250 rounds of 40 cal lead reloads and 20 rounds of factory 357 Sig. The trigger housing seems to have rubbed a blister on my trigger finger beside the nail. Got sore enough I ended up using my middle finger to trip the trigger.
I must be doing something wrong.
Any one else have trouble like this ?? I must admit being a diehard revolver shooter.But I never wore a blister beside the fingernail before.

[Moondawg]

Could your grip be a little off, or improper for a Glock? I have shot many many thousands of rounds through various Glocks over the years and never had that happen.

[Bwana]

Happened to me when I got my first Glock 12 years ago. It also was a G32. I solved that by taking the trigger out of the frame and trimming off the ridges and smoothing it with wet/dry sandpaper. I have done this with each of the other four Glocks I have purchased. No more "Glock trigger finger".

[sagamore-one]

The blister is on the other side ... opposite side from the trigger.... where it rubs on the inside of the triggerguard.
With any grip, my trigger finger is required to bend downward to enter the triggerguard. Yes, I have large hands and sausage like fingers, but this is a first.

[MakeMineA10mm]

Check the trigger. Is it grooved (Glock calls it their "target" trigger) or smooth (except for the safety flapper in the middle of course)? If it is grooved, I yank them out of the gun and replace them with smooth. It is a very simple switch-out and costs less than $15. I hate the grooved triggers.

If you already have the smooth trigger, then keep shooting. Your finger will toughen up! :)

[rbuck351]

I took a shooting class where almost everyone was shooting the Glock 22. At the end of a week and about 2000rds each of us fired, almost everyones shooting hand was plastered with bandaids. Many blisters were on the finger next to the trigger finger where it rubbed on the bottom of the trigger gaurd. Many others on the thumb by the web between the thumb and trigger finger. I'm not fond of the Glock 22 grips at all. My Glock 21 doesn't do that to me but it doesn't seem to have as sharp of a firing impulse as the 22 and has a bigger grip that fits me better. Smoothing up the wear spots with a file and sand paper seemed to help some with the Glock 22 but it didn't fix it completely.

[sagamore-one]

You may be on to something about the recoil impulse. It appears that the edge of my trigger finger is getting pinched upon recoil, between the bottom of the trigger and the trigger guard itself , thus causing the blister. I need smaller fingers. Or go back to 1911's and revolvers.

[EdS]

It is a result of the "high grip" that is part of the Glock design. The only way to get a straight-back pull for your trigger finger is to slide your hand down the grip by almost 1/2 inch. This, of course, is rediculous and not recommended. I've learned to use just the tip of my trigger finger, allowing the rest to bend away from the frame and trigger guard. I can shoot excellent groups two-handed, but the traditional "bullseye" stance one handed just won't cut it for me shooting my Glock 34. -Ed

[blackbike]

I am, like you sir, a die hard revolver shooter.
I, like you shoot with my middle finger, when it comes to Glocks. -,i,,
ha ha ha
Thats a new twist to " Glock finger"
just kiddin, OK?
bb

[sagamore-one]

Blackbike... I love it! Your sense of humor , that is.

[W.R.Buchanan]

I know exactly what you are talking about. Pay attention here

You have too much finger on the trigger.

You should under ideal circumstances have only the forward portion of the front pad of your index finger on the trigger. Only having this portion on the trigger facilitates pressing the trigger strait back which is the key to accurate shooting.

If you have a little more, the tip next to the nail will rub on the inside bottom of the guard. This is what you don't like.

Having too much finger on the trigger also invariably results in "mashing the trigger" which results in shots going low left.

The cure for this is to have your strong hand thumb pointing strait up next to the slide. This allows you to grip the gun between the lower three fingers and the heel of your hand. The thumb does nothing! And your trigger finger is totally free to only touch the gun with the forward portion of the finger while the rest of the finger is off the gun.

With this grip, the rest of your trigger finger will be completely separated from the frame of the gun which facilitates just having the tip of your finger on the trigger. It also allows the trigger to be pressed strait back as opposed to sideways and down.

By having your thumb along side the grip it allows more of your finger into the trigger guard and thus rubbing on the inside of the guard.

After you get this part of the grip down you will then add your support hand to the grip and place your support thumb behind your strong thumb. This will insure that your thumbs impart no influence on the gun as you press the trigger rearwards.

You pull the gun into the heel of your strong hand using pressure from your support fingers which are on top of your strong hand fingers. By pushing forward with your strong arm into your support hand you build Isometric tension on the gun which steadies the gun.

By having your trigger finger completely separate from this activity it allows total control of the trigger. The Thumbs do nothing!!!

Another little tidbit: You can shave a little material off the trigger safety so that the safety is flush with the face of the trigger when the safety allows the trigger to move rearwards. This will help in the comfort zone.

Just don't cut too much off the face of the safety or it will NOT disengage.

It took me several trips to Front Sight before I got this grip thing down, but I assure what I have told you above is the exact answer to your question.

[sagamore-one]

This is going to take some time to digest. Please be patient.
AND .... thank you.

[W.R.Buchanan]

It took me nearly two years to fully get what they were trying to teach me. Primarily because I was having to unlearn a bunch of wrong technique that I had "thought" was what they were trying to say.

You will have to read these instructions many many times in order to completely grasp what I am showing you.

Nobody can learn a technique like this by only reading the instructions once. It requires repitition. It become a Rote function.

The key is to hold the gun many times with just your three fingers and the heel of your hand with the thumb strait up like in the first pic. This will become second nature. It is also how you shoot the gun strong hand only.

You will find you have complete control of the gun using just the three fingers and the heel of the hand.

You will also note that the trigger finger is free to move about and not influence the position of the gun while you move.

Do this until when you pick up the gun you automatically grip it in this manner. It will also help you keep your finger out of the trigger guard for safety, as you are not relying on that finger to help hold the gun. It just naturally sticks out the front.

After this add the support hand.

The most difficult part is getting the support thumb behind the strong thumb. This feels awkward at first. It is important that the thumbs have no tension on them. They just stick up in the air. The heels of both hands should be in contact with each other.(Pic 2 above)

Practice by using a magazine or other object as a pistol grip instead of the whole gun. I call it "Airgun," but the point is you don't need a gun to practice this. You can do it anytime or while driving or watching TV.

Here's a pic of me using my desk magnifier as a gun. Note position of thumb and forefinger. It is being held strictly by the three fingers pushing the gun backwards into the heel of the hand. The thumb and fore finger are not in the picture.

Once you get this grip thing down then you can work on speeding up your draw.

Randy

[W.R.Buchanan]

So how are we doing so far? [smilie=s:

I can teach this technique simply because I can verbalize exactly what I am doing with little room for deviation. This is why It took 2 years for me to learn it, I had a different teacher every time I went and they all had a slightly different approach. Mind you they all did exactly the same thing, they just had different ways of saying the same thing. [smilie=b: Which led to different interpretations of the end result.

This grip thing is the single most important part of defensive pistol shooting. It opens the door for a more consistant and repeatable Weaver stance, which is the cornerstone of this type of shooting. :mrgreen:

Randy

[sagamore-one]

I'm working on it, but 45 years of ingrained training and learning is not easily overcome. I try to keep an open mind, that is the reason behind the Glock purchase. I realize the Glock is a viable platform and I owe it to myself to learn as much as possible about it. I may never like the Glock but I will be able to shoot it well.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Sag: the best thing about a Glock is that it is the simplest Auto Pistol to learn.

Only 3 things you can do to a Glock

1. Insert Mag

2. Rack Slide

3. Pull Trigger!

I was up against the same hurdles you will be against, except I only had 40 years of bad habits to get over. What you ahve got is the best pistol to get over those bad habits that there is.

Dry Practice is the answer, as you can do that at home in a safe place.

I have also been looking at buying a practice gun that shoots a red laser and has the same trigger pull as my real Glocks. The advantage of this tool is being able to practice multiple shots in rapid succession.

You only get one shot with the real gun then you have to rack the slide to reset the striker.

I want to be able to go bang, bang, bang, or bang, bang,,,,, Bang, bang.

I heartily recommend going to a shooting school and getting the basics of using this gun firmly ingrained, then you can work on speed and accuracy at your local range.

Also It is not a wrong idea to look up the local IDPA group in your area and hook up with them. They are all about practical application of your shooting skills which is what we all do this for in the first place. I bet there is a group near you, adn they always greet new comers with open arms.

This is where living in CA is a good thing because I can drive less than 1 hour to Piru CA which is where all of the big pistol shooting competitions are held. But we also have two lesser skilled groups that are even closer. I go there due to convenience most often.

I also go to Front Sight in Nevada about twice a year and get myself drilled up proper, and then try to maintain it when I get home with dry practice and shooting the local events.

The fact that you got a Glock Pistol is a good thing. If you need it, there is little more to do than draw and pull the trigger. Most guns require a much higher degree of fine motor skills to operate effectively.

Glock is the most simple, and as a result is the best choice for the vast majority of shooters.

Randy

[sagamore-one]

Well, I have been hesitant to reply, but yes, I have been to many schools, numerous Gunsite and Thunder Ranch degrees hang on my wall. I was awarded " Meister Schuetzen mit Kopfen Jaeger by Col. Jeff Cooper, I won "B" class IPSC, Indiana with a model 29 Smith in 1982, am a "Master Blaster" Second Chance Combat veteran, and so on and so forth. It is not that I am not competent in other platforms, I just felt the need to expand my shooting knowledge to include the newer platforms, like Glock and Sig. The Glock finger was quite unexpected and unwelcome. Your input is MOST welcome, and I thank you. I am proceeding with the learning curve of the Glock crunchenticker, but progress is slow due mainly to my colorful past.

[bigboredad]

sagamore I can feel your pain. I grew up shooting 1911's and single action revolvers then I purchased a springfield xd it has the same basic trigger idea that glock has and I have had the pinch and the callous to prove it. For me it was poor form not paying attention to what I was doing and just throwing my finger on the trigger. When I do things properly and pay attention to how I hold the gun and finger placement I shoot much better and its pain free but it took almost a tear to get used to that trigger. Yes I'm a slow learner

[W.R.Buchanan]

Trigger control with a Glock is not an easy thing to master. However things you can do that will speed up the curve are to practice certain things during your draw.

With a Glock it is imperative that in the transition from position 4-5 that the trigger finger engages the trigger and takes up the slack. This is the easy part. AS your sights come to bear you must be increasing the pressure on the trigger to what is known as "Slack plus" or the point 'just' before the trigger breaks. This is the point where the trigger bar is sliding down the sear on the striker.

After many times of drilling this it will be come second nature, however it goes away quickly when you don't dry fire practice frequently.

With the trigger at slack plus it only takes a thought to break the shot as soon as the sights are where you want them. Unfortunately there is no way to do this in slow motion. It has to be done at full draw speed because it doesn't feel the same when done at slow speed.

Sag/Bigbore: If you trim the excess material off the trigger safety so it is nearly flush with the face of the trigger when it allows the trigger to be pulled, it will greatly improve the feel of the trigger, and will completely eliminate any pain associated with the process.

The safety should be about .010-.020 above the face of the trigger when it is fully depressed. SEE pic . If you look closely you can see the black line of the safety just above the thumbnail, the light line to it's right is the amount the safety is proud of the trigger face.

This was all done with an xacto knife with a fresh blade and some patience.

Hope this helps;

Randy

[bigboredad]

well yesterday I tried gripping the gun the way you explained on the earlier post instead of the thumbs forward grip that is all the new rage. My poa came up and my groups shrank quite a bit. Thanks W.R.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Glad to be of service; just keep at it and you'll surely benefit.

I tend to be somewhat verbose. I try to cover a subject as precisely as I can, and still communicate with others on whatever level is needed.

Don't be affraid to ask questions If I have not been clear.

The idea is to promote understanding of the subject, not just listen to me talk. Interaction is a good thing.

Randy

[sagamore-one]

I'm still workin' on it.
Takes a little longer with some people. But at least I have an open mind.

[refloyd]

Thanks for the info that you have presented here. I have been trying to learn how to shoot my glock 20 accurately but havent been able to do it until now. My groups have got much smaller. Alot different than the way I grip my M9 Beretta.

[W.R.Buchanan]

Once you get the grip, the trigger control, the sight alignment, and the isometric tension all working together your shooting will dramatically improve.

You do have to drill it frequently once you understand how all the facets work and interact. but what will be the end result is when you press the trigger the bullet will go where you want it to, and the gun will hardly move up in recoil.

When you work in trapping the trigger after the shot and resetting it only as far as necessary to reset the disconnect you will find it is pretty easy to get two well aimed shots off in <1.5 seconds from the holster while wearing a conceilment garment of some type.

Dry practice as much as possible. It is the key to getting this stuff all sorted out. And it costs nothing to do it.

Randy

[bigboredad]

I'll tell you I used to use the high thumbs grip but i read all the current so called experts and did a lot of research on the thumbs forward and for me while it does help to keep the muzzle down during recoil it also keeps my group low. So now going back to the high thumbs feels a bit awkward and while I have never been that god of a semi auto shooter this has made a pretty big difference. My last range trip I shot better groups at 15yds with the high thumb grip then I could at 10yds with the thumbs pointing forward grip and I would get so frustrated with that grip I would end up trying to hard and that just made things worse. Now I'm sure this grip isn't the "fix" for everyone but for me and my stubby fingers it has made a huge difference and I would think short fingered people would benefit most from the high thumbs grip but that is just my observation

[W.R.Buchanan]

Bigbore: The whole thumbs forward thing came out a few years ago and the idea is that you are tilting your wrists forward and ''locking them down" to counteract the recoil impulse. Thus allowing you to get back on target quicker.

I talked to Jesse Abbate (now Duff) at the SHOT Show and she showed me exactly what she was doing. She also told me she shot 1000 rounds a day for two months prior to a major match. I told her I could teach my cat how to shoot that good with 60,000 rounds practice, and she said she would try it with her cat.

My take on this technique was "carpel tunnel syndrom." She also told me her wrists were very sore for the first several weeks of converting to this technique.

Conversely Todd Jarret uses a more conventional Iscolese style grip using his support hand to pull the gun into his strong hand. I have watched him shoot closely and he can almost completely counteract the recoil of a .45. With his 9mm 1911 only the slide moves strait back, there is no muzzle rise whatsoever. He also has a grip like an alligator.

When I am practiced up I get just a small amount of rise,,, maybe an inch out of either my G35 or G21 The G21 actually recoils less than the G35 as the slide is alot heavyer.

The more you work at it the better you will get and once this all becomes second nature you can work on all the little fine points.

just keep at it!

Randy

[bigboredad]

Jesse is quite a girl she is just amazing with about any gun she shoots and she's not bad looking either. I figured recoil control was the biggest reason for the thumbs forward grip. Whats kind of funny is watching Jesse when she was on the shooting shows a lot more is where I started paying more attention to grip and what I was doing. I was able to shoot better just from seeing how she shoots but I'm not sure I could shoot that good even with that much practice