Big batch of 45/45/10? NO WAY!

[Recluse]

A while back, I (very foolishly) posted about ordering some xlox from Glenn in order to make a large batch of 45/45/10 for a fellow caster and friend. I'd opined about maybe making a big enough batch or a second batch and doing a one-time commercial sales venture of the stuff.

Well, I'm here to tell you that that AIN'T gonna happen.

I make 45/45/10 in very small batches--as in 4 ounces on average. So little of the stuff goes such a long ways on so many boolits, it's rare that I ever need to make up more than four ounces in a year.

Won't go into the details except to state that I STILL have a raging, splitting sick headache from all the fumes--and this even with awesome ventilation in the shop--and my work table is a mess.

I got the big batch, which in reality isn't that big, made for my friend. What little bit I had leftover went into a couple of empty Lee LLA bottles. I should be good on this stuff for a number of years now. . .

It also reminded me of just how freaking bad I hate making lube. There was a time I kinda enjoyed it, what with the tinkering and mad scientist aspect to it. Whatever lingering love affair I might've had with making my own lube went out the window a couple of nights ago.

So, for everyone who PM'd me about wanting a bottle or a sample IF i decided to do the one "commercial batch," this is the official statement saying, "I am not making a commercial batch."

Now I'm off to down another handful of Advil. 48 hours later and I still have this damned headache.

:coffee:

[warf73]

Sounds like you had a great time in the shop lol
I myself was wondering how long it would take to cook off all the solvent in JPW to make a big batch of lube. Guess to long and the fumes must not be that good for you as your head is still pounding after 48 hours.

Was a good thought while it lasted?

Warf

[btroj]

Not that he needs another project or product but maybe Lars would be able to make it? He has most of the stuff on hand and is set up for lube production.

I made about a 16 ounce batch, it will last quite a while. I got a couple plastic squeeze bottles designed to hold ketchup and mustard to store it in. Works like a charm.

[Sakdog]

Organic vapor/Acid Gas cartridges and respirator ~$40-$50...Home Depot.. Might help in a couple years when you cook up your next batch.

I always wear mine while casting. Used to work in aviation cleaning dinotrol (Similar to alox) off of airframe structures couldnt live without that respirator.

[gwpercle]

The more I read of other people's experiences making bullet lube, like this post and the one where a fellow wanted to know how to remove lube from the floor and a few others...I think I'm going to listen to the GOOD IDEA fairy and just stay away from this mess it up yourself project. Cause if there is a way to make a mess I will find it. Thats why the wife won't let me paint inside the house anymore....although I don't know why...she got new carpet out of my last repainting project. I couldn't get all the spilled paint out ...sooo new carpet it was and if you put it in one room ...you got to put it in all the rooms. Repainting that room sure cost me a bunch....God only knows how much a batch of bullet lube would wind up costing....a man just has to know his limitations..right ?

gary

[pdawg_shooter]

This is why I LOVE White Label Lubes!

[JonB_in_Glencoe]

A while back, I (very foolishly) posted about ordering some xlox from Glenn in order to make a large batch of 45/45/10 for a fellow caster and friend. I'd opined about maybe making a big enough batch or a second batch and doing a one-time commercial sales venture of the stuff.

Well, I'm here to tell you that that AIN'T gonna happen.
...


Your previous post (and the interest you got) is what inspired me to make a quadruple batch (A normal batch for me uses one 4oz bottle of LLA). I yielded about a pint for myself, plus I posted the excess in S&S. If those who were interested want to PM me, I'd consider making another quadruple batch, which should yield (8) 3.5oz lots.
FYI, mine always turns out the consistancy of peanut butter.

[fecmech]

For those in no hurry for lube just open the can of paste wax and set it out of the way. I set one out in the garage last year and now it's just chunks of dried wax which I will use for my next batch, if I ever run out!

[runfiverun]

i posted a recipe a bit back for a simple lube.
you melt b-wax and pour in a few simple ingredients stir and pour out to cool.
no stinky and no solvents.
no extra long heating- stirring, or melting grease, no stink type recipe just for this purpose.
you can modify it with some alox if you want.

[fryboy]

umm r5r ,amigo ... alox stinks no matter what you do it :P ( and that in it's self is enough to give anyone a headache lolz

my first can of umm refining JPW i was working in the shop casting , while i didnt have recluse's headache i did indeed have a solvent taste in the back of my mouth for a bit , the second batch i figured out where the temp was right ( yeah i made a index mark on ye olde hotplate knob ) and did it one day when i was doing yard work -outside away from the shop mostly , that batch i cooked down until it was as hard as a .. ummm dried out distilled chunk of JPW ( it was kind of brittle even once cooled ) i used it to make a special batch using beeswax as opposed to the tumble lube version , the current can being distilled gets a couple slow warming sessions on weekends when i remember to do it , it's at around the half way mark now ( almost ready ) , but yeah i aint nowhere around it when it's doing it's thing , i do check on it but then promptly leave ( usually to go back to trimming/sizing brass chores in the house )

[geargnasher]

That stuff will certainly make you ill. I felt pretty yucky for a full two days after boiling the solvents out of some Red Line two-stroke oil. Aliphatic solvent vapor goes straight into the bloodstream and doesn't make one feel well at all.

Another thing that usually makes me feel very fatigued and generally drained is huffing too much of the smoke from lithium grease. My lithium blood level is probably through the roof by now from all the lube cooking I've done in the last year (over 200 batches now!). On the plus side, my psychotic tendencies are easier to manage! :kidding:

Gear

[btroj]

Lithium is for manic/depression, not psychosis Gear.

Breathing in large amounts of any solvent is not a good idea. I don't know how much ventilation is required but I would want an open garage door and a fan as a minimum. Outdoors would be better.

Maybe we could ask the EPA? But I won't be the one calling!

[runfiverun]

the alox was just a suggestion for those that don't think they are accomplishing anything unless they are making a stink [you know like how medicine has to taste bad to be good for you]

[geargnasher]

Lithium is for manic/depression, not psychosis Gear.

Breathing in large amounts of any solvent is not a good idea. I don't know how much ventilation is required but I would want an open garage door and a fan as a minimum. Outdoors would be better.

Maybe we could ask the EPA? But I won't be the one calling!

Hmmm, maybe I haven't absorbed as much as I thought, it hasn't helped the manic/depressive disorder one bit :bigsmyl2:

Gear

[uscra112]

For those in no hurry for lube just open the can of paste wax and set it out of the way. I set one out in the garage last year and now it's just chunks of dried wax which I will use for my next batch, if I ever run out!

Hmmm. Good thing I never threw out those JPW cans that were 10 years old when my Dad passed away in 1998. They rattle now. Guess they're ready to use, eh?

[runfiverun]

pretty close i'd still heat them up and watch for solvents to vent off.

[rsrocket1]

I just made a 16+ oz batch yesterday. I placed a 1/2 full JPW can in a pot of water and "double boiled" it on a hot plate outdoors for an hour or so. Adjusted the heat so that the water was just at the boiling point but not bubbling. From the other posts I think its a balance between heat and time that cooks off the solvents. If you don't have the high temperature, just let the solvents cook off longer. At the end there aren't many fumes left. After adding the Oderless Mineral Spirits, the stuff doesn't smell too bad at all.

[Idaho Mule]

Things I have learned from this site: Gear is definitely certifiable, he can readily tell you what a Fuller 12513 is as well as a Spicer 10102A. I haven't quite figgered out run5run yet as far as occupation, but he is definitely into some strange science projects. Honestly tho guys, you are the BEST and never fail to deliver some great info wich I surely appreciate, thank you. BTW my wife makes me do all my cooking out in the barn. JW I gotta add a big thank you to Ben too. JW

[geargnasher]

You can skip the BS and make it out of Gulf wax, carnauba flakes, and Alox. Cook it all together for ten minutes just below the smoke point, cool it until just "warm", and add mineral spirits until it's about like 30-weight engine oil. Adding about 30/50% beeswax works, too.

Equal parts wax(s) and liquid Alox by volume, 5% carnauba, thin to taste after cooking.

Gear

[runfiverun]

that's 5% carnuba by weight of the gulf wax.
i use 25% chunk of b-wax [by size] compared to the volume of 50-50 liquid.

[kelbro]

I have made several batches without cooking off the solvents and it works very well. Just add less mineral spirits.

[lar45]

Hello everyone. I would be happy to put this into production if I could get a repeatable recipie that preferably didn't use JPW. I can make this up in 10-20 gallon batches and package into 32oz bottles. First thing is I need to make sure I'm making the right stuff.

Thoughts?

[tonyjones]

lar45,

I am not a lube cook and will not offer recipe suggestions. Perhaps Recluse and others will weigh in. I do not really care what's in the final product. If it works as well as or better than 45-45-10 I will buy it.

Good luck and best regards,

Tony

[pdawg_shooter]

Things I have learned from this site: Gear is definitely certifiable, he can readily tell you what a Fuller 12513 is as well as a Spicer 10102A. I haven't quite figgered out run5run yet as far as occupation, but he is definitely into some strange science projects. Honestly tho guys, you are the BEST and never fail to deliver some great info wich I surely appreciate, thank you. BTW my wife makes me do all my cooking out in the barn. JW I gotta add a big thank you to Ben too. JW

RT/RTO 12513 is old school and the 1010-2A has been out of production for years now. Fact is all the SST Spicers are history. The Mexican junk buyers wont even buy them anymore.

[geargnasher]

Mmmmm, Maxitorque T-318, because sometimes two cluster gears and one reverse speed just aren't enough!

Gear

[pdawg_shooter]

OMG! A Mack man!

[geargnasher]

OMG! A Mack man! Not me, but many of my customers. When you have guys who run fleets of garbage trucks and construction waste containers that crowd 80,000 lbs on one chassis and have to get in/out of some very rough places, only Mack will do. Try backing 80K uphill and around several corners in the mud with both diffs locked with a KW or Peterbilt and an Eaton Super Whatever. Parts will be spitting out everywhere.

I even have a few customers running the ancient twin-sticks that only like six truckers left in the world still know how to drive. Those trucks are built like locomotives, and you feel like you've been hit by one (or a Mack truck!) after you've worked on one all day.

Gear

[pdawg_shooter]

Problem is, Mack is going away. Volvo is dropping Mack engines, transmissions and rear ends. Replacing them with Volvo components. Not NEAR the quality or toughness of Mack.

[Idaho Mule]

I knew I would get my chops busted for the old trannys but just couldn't resist, please don't take any offense cuz there was none meant. It's been a long time since I had to perform a tranny-ectomy on a truck. But I have to tell ya, it was fun work. Gear, I remember many of the old twin stickers too, there were lots of them here, mostly hauling logs out of the woods but quite a few ended up hauling wheat too. Speaking of parts spitting out, there is NOTHING like seeing what REAL torque can do!!! I do kinda miss seeing some of that carnage. Now I just put phone cable back together, both copper and fiber. It can have it's moments too but sure is easier on the body. JW

[tomf52]

Kelbro said"I have made several batches without cooking off the solvents and it works very well. Just add less mineral spirits" Exactly what I do. Works fine. Drys quickly, no leading. I'm just not sure I see the point in cooking off the JPW solvents only to add them back in later.

[fryboy]

it lets the user control both the vicosity and the solvent .... FWIW i dont believe that the solvent they use when making JPW is quite the same as we add back in the form of mineral spirits , yes i'm sure that they are related ( as are all petro products ) but not the same per say , end result is that all roads lead to mecca ( or wherever ) , and many variations of this lube will work ( of note generally minute exact quantities dont matter etc ) , the more demanding the application/pressure the more little nuances mite matter

[Boondocker]

Not me, but many of my customers. When you have guys who run fleets of garbage trucks and construction waste containers that crowd 80,000 lbs on one chassis and have to get in/out of some very rough places, only Mack will do. Try backing 80K uphill and around several corners in the mud with both diffs locked with a KW or Peterbilt and an Eaton Super Whatever. Parts will be spitting out everywhere.

I even have a few customers running the ancient twin-sticks that only like six truckers left in the world still know how to drive. Those trucks are built like locomotives, and you feel like you've been hit by one (or a Mack truck!) after you've worked on one all day.

Gear

I see you and raise you one,Mack Quadraplex 3 clubs can rebuild and also drive them lol. This tranny is the size of a small imported car lol. Man that brings back memories.
Now I just drive them terminal to terminal, with all the creature comforts and only 10 gears.

[geargnasher]

Boondocker, I fold! :drinks:

Fryboy, I believe the solvents are different too. At one point I knew the difference, it's something like napthenic vs. paraffinic or aliphatic. Mineral spirits (aliphatic) are different from what's in JPW, and evaporate more readily. Remember, when you cook the JPW and liquid Alox together before diluting with MS, you're also driving off some of the solvents in the liquid Alox, too, which helps a bunch with the dry time, as the stuff used in, IIRC, a 50% ratio to make liquid Alox doesn't evaporate very quickly at all.

Gear

[Boondocker]

I ordered two qts of xlox off of lars today. I am looking forward to making a batch.

Sent from my DROID RAZR using Tapatalk 2

[nanuk]

Hello everyone. I would be happy to put this into production if I could get a repeatable recipie that preferably didn't use JPW. I can make this up in 10-20 gallon batches and package into 32oz bottles. First thing is I need to make sure I'm making the right stuff.

Thoughts?

I think after reading the MSDS (http://www.freemansupply.com/MSDS/scanned/Other/Johnsonpastewax.pdf) and you can use pure ingredients to replicate it....

there seems to be a wide percentage swing in ingredients.

you could probably tweek it for your manufacturing abilities.