Powder Coating Boolits

[prs]

This is a huge thread, I may have missed it, but can someone provide a link to the HOW TO details of piglet method.

prs

[bangerjim]

This is a huge thread, I may have missed it, but can someone provide a link to the HOW TO details of piglet method.

prs


Just go to the top of the page and on the right under the LEE ad there is the search window. Type in "piglet method" and you will find it!

Very simple to find things on this forum. Just use the search engine.

bangerjim

[Keola5o4]

Well got 100 harbor freight PC boolits made for my Beretta and glock 19, anyone have any expirience with leading in glock19 with these powder coated boolits?

[fastglock]

Just curious, If going the "Piglet" route, why use powder paint instead of epoxy paint? What is the point ?

[Dolomite_supafly]

Cost.

You can buy the materials for under $12 to do at least 1,000 bullets.

For those who are going to use the piglet method use lacquer thinner. The stuff I use is from Klean Strip in a blue and yellow container. It makes the process a lot easier.

[fastglock]

Cost.

You can buy the materials for under $12 to do at least 1,000 bullets.

For those who are going to use the piglet method use lacquer thinner. The stuff I use is from Klean Strip in a blue and yellow container. It makes the process a lot easier.

Oh ok. So about how many bullets could be done with $12 worth of epoxy paint?

[xacex]

There is no need to run gas checks.

I have pushed my powder coated bullets past 3,200 fps without a gas check. I had zero leading and they worked great. This was in a 223 bolt gun with a 9 twist barrel.

See post 1180 for details of my testing.

You still have not commented on accuracy, or range. The test for leading is fine, but I really could care less if it won't hit the broadside of a barn with 20x glass.

[KYShooter73]

would preheating prior to spraying be better?

I always do. I keep my boolits in acetone prior to loading in the jig. I do it to make sure all the acetone is evaporated, plus, the powder will get sticky as soon as you start blowing it on, that way none gets shaken off when transferring your jig to the oven.

[Dolomite_supafly]

*****

[xacex]

I thought I mentioned it here but I could be wrong. I know I posted the accuracy results on one of the boards.

Let me clarify. I have not seen any accuracy results for your .223 loads, with the PC and no gas check that you are pushing past 3000fps. You posted the effectiveness, but nothing on the accuracy of those loads at those speeds without a gas check. I am not trying to ride you, but that is the caliber I am having the most issues with getting acceptable results. The 300 blk, and pistol rounds showed great results like yours with the 300blk. I have achieved accuracy results as good, or better than traditionally lubed boolits with the slower stuff, but not anything over 1500fps.

[w0fms]

BTW, HF has the powder coating gun on sale until 7/31. With a 20% off coupon and the sale it's like $43. And it does work better than using lacquer thinner or acetone (I tried a few even though I bought the powder gun). It's interesting reading this thread. I didn't buy the HF RED because I read it didn't work from various places on the new. So I have yellow and white. Yellow supposedly doesn't work according to this thread, but oddly enough I have my test run of 55 TL452-230-2R Lees looking an orange-green-yellow and they seem fine (except the cured HF yellow is a little ugly). Maybe the white will be better? The next batch will be white. I'll let you know in a couple of weeks when I have time to get back to it. It's fun stuff and not that much more work that tumble lube... if it shoots well...

[bryonbush]

I run the white in my 40 with no issue

[bangerjim]

BTW, HF has the powder coating gun on sale until 7/31. With a 20% off coupon and the sale it's like $43. And it does work better than using lacquer thinner or acetone (I tried a few even though I bought the powder gun). It's interesting reading this thread. I didn't buy the HF RED because I read it didn't work from various places on the new. So I have yellow and white. Yellow supposedly doesn't work according to this thread, but oddly enough I have my test run of 55 TL452-230-2R Lees looking an orange-green-yellow and they seem fine (except the cured HF yellow is a little ugly). Maybe the white will be better? The next batch will be white. I'll let you know in a couple of weeks when I have time to get back to it. It's fun stuff and not that much more work that tumble lube... if it shoots well...

After trying all four of the HF colors, black is my standard and fav. It looks cool (black ops) and coats perfectly and will NOT come off with acetone wipe test like the yellow stuff does. I use for tooling coating also.

Have not tried any of the internet stuff yet. Too expensive. After all who cares about the color.............. if it REALLY works.

bangerjim

[popper]

76821
165 -401 TC. PC'd, WD after cooking. Nose is 0.410, base band 0.401. That's case dirt on the base band, coating is still good. Whenever I get shaved lead it is on both bands. Loaded after doing a bunch of H-T, AC PCd, everything is the same but the results. Lead & coating is pushed into the nose, leading to jams. These were never chambered, but all passed the plunk test. Coating doesn't scrape off with a knife, lead on the front band sheared, it & coating are pushed forward, so it occurred on seating. No problem with the H-T & AC PCd. Everything is the same except the WD! Besides the jams, leading will be really bad. Ideas as to what happened? Pulled these with the RCBS sizer die, sizes the brass & the carbide ring holds the CB in the die. Got to try that on a normal one, interesting way of pulling T/C CBs - no hammer. Camera doesn't do close ups good.

[Dolomite_supafly]

*****

[Dolomite_supafly]

*****

[Rangefinder]

I was asked by someone how fast you could push this stuff so that is what I tested. I rarely shoot 223 so I have no intentions of working out accuracy loads for my 223's. I already have an accuracy load for my 223's using 69 SMK's and I seriously doubt any powder coated bullet will match them.

My reason for powder coating has zero to do with leading or pushing cast bullets to the limit.

I am sure there are plenty of 223 shooters that will start using it that will give reports.

Now we're getting to a little more meat on the matter. Without accuracy, there's not much point. What I found driving a GC boolit PC'd without a GC was severe gas-jetting in the base of the recovered boolit--needless to say accuracy was dismal. A HEAVY layer of PC at the base would likely improve this, but I see that as taking more time and effort to apply multiple layers, likelyhood of a base that is no longer concentric, and wasted material. To be clear, We're talking about pushing 2800-ish FPS in a guestimated 40KPSI. Using a GC along with PC brought things right into line for extremely tight grouping. While I have my own solution to that issue (aluminum checks on Pat Marlin dies), the same thing could be done with the hornaday checks that were too tight after baking by giving the base of each boolit a quick acetone wipe prior to baking.

NOW, that being said, I'm getting fantastic results on the slower lower-pressure loads with nothing more than cast--piglet/bake--size--load. But I don't care how you slice it--high pressure loads are going to be troublesome without a check and will be subject to the alloy's compressional stability. The check shank offers way too much directed gas/heat/pressure directly on the rear drive band to withstand jacketed loads without something more solid to seal it.

My suggestion--cast a HARD alloy (to withstand the RPM rate), PC it, GC it, and then try driving them at jacketed velocities. From what I've gathered so far, it will perform to those velocities. I know PP'ing does, so there's no reason this won't.

[w0fms]

Interesting. The yellow dissolves in Acetone AFTER it's cured? I'll have to try that. Would that actually matter when shooting it if otherwise it holds up? The ones I tried last night look pretty good. And I am only developing the process. I'm only planning on using this for pistol bullets. I'll eventually get the black and red powder as well but I spent a small fortune in my last two trips because I also bought an on-sale tumbler there to try the wet with (e-bayed) SS pins for brass. So I limited myself to the two colors for now. I personally like the look of the Red.. but... I read it didn't work well... we will see. Maybe I'll just mix 50:50 White and Red and shoot all pink.. ;)

My "process" is going to be two coats, two racks in the $19 Wally "Regal" toaster oven. The first I'm going to do the base with the nose facing downwards in a rack I cut out of 1/4" hardware cloth. (if it works I'll post a picture.. the .357 sized rack is cut up differently than the .452 sized one, obviously). I can do about 70 of the .357 and 50 of the .452 per rack so a hundred at a time. Small potatoes for most of you guys but I work a lot and honestly that's about all I have time to shoot.. Then I'm going to flip them right side up on a Al foil coated rack and spray the other side. I originally wasn't going to bother with the bases but it's hard to get a good coating on the area with the lube grooves by just coating from the top with the bases flat. We will see..

One interesting thing about the "yellow" HF PC.. on the aluminum foil it's about indestructible. I mean you can crumble the foil, crease it, etc and the PC just sticks... it's rather amazing stuff. I'll be using it for anything that can survive a 400-450F cure... not just boolits...

[xacex]

Besides. What works in my guns will probably not work in yours.

That is a given, but I asked the question to clarify whether or not your results were worthwhile enough to warrant the time to go and try some experiments. Your results were what I suspected. I have to agree with Rangefinder on the matter. If there is no breakthrough results it is not worth pursuing further. The tests I am getting ready to try will be PC 223 with gas checks. I tumbled (pigglet method), but also have a jig that is put together for ES. I have done some shooting with PC Lee 312-155 without issue, but they were gas checked, not plain base like you had tried. Also, the 50 Beowulf is showing promise as a PC round, but also with a gas check.

[toddrod]

Just did a couple of batches today (piglet method). First, I used some gray 2 part floor epoxy paint which coated nice, only one coat seems to be enough (adds about .002" to the diameter). Second I used HFPC black which also coated nice and seems to add about the same thickness. I then got the idea of dumping the bullets into some powder talc right after tumbling, just when they become sticky. I tumbled them into the powder talc for about 1 minute and they got a very nice powdery look and feel to them. After that I blew some air on them to remove any excess powder and then cooked them in the oven for 20 min. @ 450F. They did not stick to each other or to the hardware cloth after removing them from the oven...Both batches (floor paint and HFPC with talc powder) sized quite nicely w/o any lube and paint stayed on the bullet. It seems that using the talc powder has some benefits, it remains to be seen how they perform in the barrel. I have the feeling that I'll get lower velocities because they are so slippery...Any thoughs on this?
On the picture below, talc powder coated ones on the left.
http://i1304.photobucket.com/albums/s527/sd61/HFPC/IMG-20130717-00154_zps387f2f08.jpg (http://s1304.photobucket.com/user/sd61/media/HFPC/IMG-20130717-00154_zps387f2f08.jpg.html)

Can you tell use what brand of floor epoxy you used and where to purchase?

[sd61]

Can you tell use what brand of floor epoxy you used and where to purchase?
Here's a picture of what I used, the can said it's tintable white, but it was actually gray. It's a 2 part epoxy and I mixed it 1:1. I don't remember where I bought it from (might have gotten it from my brother and never used it). It's been sitting in my garage for years, I had to mix it real well, especially the hardener settled at the bottom of the can in a thick, like putty mass...
A bit easier to work with as compared to HFPC...Keep in mind that I didn't shoot any of these bullets, so I have no idea how they'll perform in the barrel and at the target.
http://i1304.photobucket.com/albums/s527/sd61/HFPC/IMG-20130708-00136_zps93ed83cd.jpg (http://s1304.photobucket.com/user/sd61/media/HFPC/IMG-20130708-00136_zps93ed83cd.jpg.html)

[Dolomite_supafly]

That is a given, but I asked the question to clarify whether or not your results were worthwhile enough to warrant the time to go and try some experiments. Your results were what I suspected. I have to agree with Rangefinder on the matter. If there is no breakthrough results it is not worth pursuing further. The tests I am getting ready to try will be PC 223 with gas checks. I tumbled (pigglet method), but also have a jig that is put together for ES. I have done some shooting with PC Lee 312-155 without issue, but they were gas checked, not plain base like you had tried. Also, the 50 Beowulf is showing promise as a PC round, but also with a gas check.

What results are you talking about that I said?

Also, why is my time and my materials worth less than yours? If you are wanting to see if it will work in in your guns it seems like you should be the one doing the testing, not me. The materials are less than $15 which is NOTHING in the scheme of things. Heck, take a chance.

I am completely happy with how I plan on using PC and I have pushed them to 2,400 fps without gas checks and getting phenominal accuracy at the same time.

I come here and post my results to help out other shooters and get nitpicked by someone who is afraid to spend a little time or money to test it themselves. Either way I learned a very important lesson, keep my results to myself and try not to help out others on this board.

[Skip62]

keep my results to myself and try not to help out others on this board.

Oh don't do that, your results helped me and I truly appreciate it.

[jmort]

"Either way I learned a very important lesson, keep my results to myself and try not to help out others on this board."

That would be a big loss. Your input has been very useful to say the least.

[popper]

If the board is not about getting and giving help, I need to drop off.

[xacex]

Dolomite_superfly,

I didn't intend to offend you if I did. I was just asking for clarification so I could focus and direct my attention to the results I am looking for. Accuracy is as important to functioning in a firearm, but I just happen to focus more on the accuracy aspect. If you look further back I have had great results with the application of PC, but now that I know it works I need to bring these boolits into the realm of jacketed as far as accuracy is concerned. My time is as valuable as yours, and I don't have much of it to spare. Thank you for answering the question.

[Lights]

Has anyone tried to just tumble the boolits in the dry powder and bake them?

[Maximumbob54]

Dolomite -

You were the tipping point that got me to start ordering powder coat and since I figured I would try that it also lead me to try the epoxy coat that someone else mentioned (Klassic Kote). It was your posts that took 60 + pages of what I was initially laughing at to finally giving it a try.

Don't let one voice silence your own.

[Dolomite_supafly]

Xacex, I wish I had your problem of having no spare time because of, I'll assume, work. I have just the opposite and have all the time in the world. My time is valuable as well because I do not get very many hours a week where I can actually do something productive. Unfortuantely I can't do 95% of what most people can and spend most days in bed.

It literally took me two days to powder coat and load that ammo because of my problems. And then I was pretty much done for the day and off to bed again. And then I had to wait on the weather to break and the first time I had decent weather to test I didn't feel well enough to do anything. And finally, after three weeks, the stars aligned in that the weather was decent on a day I felt decent. It took me about an hour to test it and I was in bed for 3 days a lot worse off than normal because of the heat as well as the activity. An hour may not seem like much but an hour to me is HUGE no matter what I am doing.

I posted the results because that seems to be the question that I was asked the most. There is no amount of testing I could do to determine how accurate any bullet, cast or not, will be in someone else's gun. It would be useless for me to post my accuracy results because the odds of it working with someone else's guns is a long shot. And as I said before I will never shoot cast bullets in my 223's.

[Smoke4320]

Supafly
I too was very skeptical about powdercoating eliminating the need for lube, the ability to shoot these coated bullets and the coating not coat the barrel and lastly get any accuracy at all.. Yours and a few others here made me try it and I am sold..have posted some of my own groups as proof to what I was getting in certain situations/loads..
is it the magic bullet for every situation (excuse the terrible pun) NO.. but if we keep working on it and exchanging ideas it just may in the future..
we have come a long way in a very short time and if we keep working on it progress will be made
I work 6 days a week many long hours so like you and a few others here my shooting/loading experimenting time is very limited..
Without the knowledge posted here about what works and what does not I would probably still be shooting jacketed bullets and have no reason to post or visit here..
Supafly Hang in there buddy I for one appreciate your posting ..
PS I am still working on the 6.5 Grendel subsonic loads just with cast PC'ed boolits now. I am so close .. have one using 160 gr .268 jacketed that function 100% in my mid gas length 18" trying to do it with a 170 Gr Pc'ed cast..

[fastglock]

Hmm, with your jig I think I would pre-heat for a more sticky adhesion

So about 10 mins of preheating? Powder gun just came in. Will get to it after work.CAN'T WAIT !!

[xacex]

I preheat while I set up the gun and booth. About 10 minutes is good. I notice the difference in adhesion if I do not preheat. You don't have to preheat,but it seems to me adhere more efficiently. The biggest thing is to remember to put the ground clip on your jig and hit the pedal. I use the medium size nozzle screwed in so there is about 1/8" of thread sticking out, and I do coat close enough to zap a boolit every now and again. Now that you have a gun you will start looking for things to PC around the garage and house. I started to prep motorcycle parts to get PC'ed last week. If I could get my son interested a little more I would let him finish the motorcycle and just give it to him. Don't tell his mom I said that.

[Smoke4320]

I agree with xacex on the preheating better adhesion using HF Red or Black .. also Powder by the pound Pink (for the wife)

[fastglock]

I preheat while I set up the gun and booth. About 10 minutes is good. I notice the difference in adhesion if I do not preheat. You don't have to preheat,but it seems to me adhere more efficiently. The biggest thing is to remember to put the ground clip on your jig and hit the pedal. I use the medium size nozzle screwed in so there is about 1/8" of thread sticking out, and I do coat close enough to zap a boolit every now and again. Now that you have a gun you will start looking for things to PC around the garage and house. I started to prep motorcycle parts to get PC'ed last week. If I could get my son interested a little more I would let him finish the motorcycle and just give it to him. Don't tell his mom I said that.

LOL...funny you said that, I'm already building a sandblast box for other stuff to coat!

[Keola5o4]

Any ideas on a rig that can help spray the whole bullet "Base and all"? I kinda get worried about the exposed lead at the bottom of the bullet .ha!

[Rangefinder]

Has anyone tried to just tumble the boolits in the dry powder and bake them? Yup, doesn't work at all without something to help it stick--either a liquid carrier to dissolve it into or the +/- ion charge created by the PC gun.

[Lights]

Yup, doesn't work at all without something to help it stick--either a liquid carrier to dissolve it into or the +/- ion charge created by the PC gun.

Thanks Rangefinder, I will use the piglet method of powder coating then with lacquer thinner.

[fcvan]

Rangefinder: I PC my 22 and 30 cal GC boolits on trays. For the 22, I drilled holes in a piece of aluminum to where the gas check shank fits in the hole. After PC and bake there is no PC on the shank. As an added plus the boolits don't get knocked over as easily when placing in my toaster oven.

For the 30 cal boolits I glued 30 cal gas checks onto a piece of sheet metal and then set the boolits into the checks. After PC and bake I just 'snap' out the boolits. Again, no PC on the shank. If I had the right size drill for the 30 cal shank, I'd probably do them the same as the 22. For now, the GC trick is working for 30 cal. BTW, my CheckMaker dies are from PatMarlins as well.

[xacex]

Any ideas on a rig that can help spray the whole bullet "Base and all"? I kinda get worried about the exposed lead at the bottom of the bullet .ha!

I did a jig you can make pretty easy back on page 50 of this thread. however, it is only for hollowpoints. If you have a flat point boolit you could just PC nose down, or use the Piglet method to coat the whole thing.

[fastglock]

Any ideas on a rig that can help spray the whole bullet "Base and all"? I kinda get worried about the exposed lead at the bottom of the bullet .ha!



Here's an idea

[xacex]

Here's an idea

Man, that is one cool jig! I have a plate with holes to do those lee 309-230's, but they won't get coverage like that. Let us know how it works. I have to fill all the pins on my jig to prevent the empty spots from getting coated. Every now and again I also have to hit the jig base in a spot with a die grinder/sanding disk to get a good ground.Keep the PC away from those threads.

[Keola5o4]

Here's an idea

Man that's a monster set up!

[bangerjim]

Has anyone tried to just tumble the boolits in the dry powder and bake them?

The adhesion comes from the static charge from the electronics and the gun. The powder does seem to sort of stick to things, but not evenly. And just the slightest touch from your fingers or any tools knocks it off in spots.

If you can come up with some kind of spray-on base that will allow the powder to adhere while tumbling AND handling to get in the oven......please......let us all know! I for one, am always open to new ideas!

The powder supposedly forms a bond with the metal surface and anything you spray on under it could interfere with that chemical reaction.

The e-static gun works just fine for me.

bangerjim

[KYShooter73]

So about 10 mins of preheating? Powder gun just came in. Will get to it after work.CAN'T WAIT !!

Usually only about 5, but I'm impatient that way.

[fastglock]

Well, I guess not bad.Tested on 20 boolits only, and used rejects that has some inclusions.I got another 20 in the oven mixed with HBN powder and it's looking good so far.I really gotta improve my lighting. I'm sure I could get a smoother coverage.I got the diameter that I wanted now, brought the front driving bands up to .310 .

[xacex]

Nice! Looks like black chrome boolits. Do you think you will have problems with the threads on the jig after a few runs? A small (skirt) of metal welded to the top rail covering the upper nails till about a quarter inch to the boolit may help shield the bolt from overspray. Or U-channel for the upper rail shielding the threads with the nut welded to the top, or inside the channel might work nice to prevent any stuck bolts.

[fastglock]

Nice! Looks like black chrome boolits. Do you think you will have problems with the threads on the jig after a few runs? A small (skirt) of metal welded to the top rail covering the upper nails till about a quarter inch to the boolit may help shield the bolt from overspray. Or U-channel for the upper rail shielding the threads with the nut welded to the top, or inside the channel might work nice to prevent any stuck bolts.

Thanks ! Your jig with the Hollow Points was inspiring. Its too bad that I don't shoot hollow points. Maybe for the 300BLK .

Yeah Im currently brainstorming a jig/skirt of somekind. I was so excited to start spraying ,that I just used duct tape to cover the bolts.Once I get that all figured out then the process should be all butter.

Don't laugh ! I started to spray for 30 seconds and was like ***! the powder wasn't sticking ! And I "up" the PSI and started spraying for another 30 secs! Sat down and thought that I got a defect unit...Then found the pedal still coiled with the twist tie ;-P


Not sure if im going to do all this for my pistol boolits though. Im not having any bad leading plus they are easier to teardown and clean. If I ever do try to PC pistol boolits ill try the"piglet" method first. My goal here is to oversize these LEE 230's and minimize lead going into the gas port, block, tube, and BCG. I'm really interested to see if PC boolits can handle mag dumps, rapid firing, hot barrel, full auto(not in my state).

[w0fms]

I've made a jig cut out of 1/4" hardware cloth for non-hollow point pistol boolits. I plan on just doing two passes. The first one on this jig with the ball face down and then the second on aluminum foil on a straight rack. I understand that I don't need to coat the bottom for pistol, but I find it very hard on the flat surface to coat the lube groove portion of the boolits evenly. By doing them upside down (and making a curing pass) and then right side up I think I can get a even coat on the whole shebang.

If it works I'll post a picture. It's just bending up the wire to a "frame" and then cutting out and bending wires so the boolits have a place to rest their "little noses".

The mesh means I can mostly spray through too if I need too. Time snips and a pair of pliers all is needed to form too.

[Keola5o4]

I've made a jig cut out of 1/4" hardware cloth for non-hollow point pistol boolits. I plan on just doing two passes. The first one on this jig with the ball face down and then the second on aluminum foil on a straight rack. I understand that I don't need to coat the bottom for pistol, but I find it very hard on the flat surface to coat the lube groove portion of the boolits evenly. By doing them upside down (and making a curing pass) and then right side up I think I can get a even coat on the whole shebang.

If it works I'll post a picture. It's just bending up the wire to a "frame" and then cutting out and bending wires so the boolits have a place to rest their "little noses".

The mesh means I can mostly spray through too if I need too. Time snips and a pair of pliers all is needed to form too.

Cool!I'm looking forward to see what it looks like. Right now currently experimenting with some thin wire and solder it to the base of the bullet "so they hang" then spray them down with powder coat.

[popper]

77030
50 yds. Bags under the handguard & butt.
The 30-30 180 gr. PB/WD/PC with 25 gr LveE worked fine( bull), I'll up it to 27 & 30 next time. Yes, that middle group is 5. GC AC load is 31 gr. LvrE (upper). 308 is 165 gr GC/WD/PC with 39 gr. H335 - worked pretty well (left). Shot the 308 with red dot, large 4" group but on paper, the switched to the scope. That one-piece mount sure is nice, didn't even re-zero. Sure is nice to NOT drive 50 mi. to shoot rifle. Oh, all were coated with the pin nail in the nose. Got to remember to put a dark paper behind the target when i scan it.

[Keola5o4]

77030
50 yds.
The 30-30 180 gr. PB/WD/PC with 25 gr LveE worked fine( bull), I'll up it to 27 & 30 next time. GC AC load is 31 gr. LvrE (upper). 308 is 165 gr GC/WD/PC with 39 gr. H335 - worked pretty well (left). Shot the 308 with red dot, large 4" group but on paper, the switched to the scope. That one-piece mount sure is nice, didn't even re-zero. Sure is nice to NOT drive 50 mi. to shoot rifle. Oh, all were coated with the pin nail in the nose.
Very nice grouping! If you don't mind me asking, what the "WD" mean?

[xacex]

Not bad Popper!

I need to upload the best groups I did with the PC 9mm experiment. I ended up doing 4 groups for each powder and averaged them. With the MiHec 125 grain 9mm boolit sized to .357 I got the best group with 6 grains of Bluedot. 1.09"AOL,CCI SPP, 7 yards was 2.23" average 5 shot group with my wifes 38 super match 1911 with a 9mm barrel. The second best was bullseye at 2.25" with 3.6 grains, worst was W231 at 2.30" with 5.4 grains. Universal was a tad better than the W231 at 2.62" average. All of these were shot resting on a sandbag. You could tell the difference is the size of the groups between the top two, and bottom two. I used to get the best groups with universal, and the worst with bluedot with cast loads, but now thy follow the same trend as jacketed.

[fastglock]

?Has anyone tried :

1- bullets on wire mesh then powder coat.

2- then "sandwich" bullets with wire mesh on top

3- carefully flip over

4-remove top wire mesh( that was on the bottom), then brush off powder paint

5-powder coat

6-sandwich ,flip over , then bake


I guess ill try it . Gotta pick up some wire mesh later.

[popper]

WD - water dropped to harden after PC cooking, right out of the oven . This is a test to see how hard I can drive plain base (no GC) that's powder coated. Edit:Don't have a crony but from data L.G. did for me and load charts, I'm figuring >1800fps for a plain base 180 gr. 30 gr. should get me around 2k, 35gr. ~2.2k, close to GC'd cast limit with this powder & rifle. My conclusions so far, save the GC for the 308, necks are not dirty now, HT after PC works fine and is needed for my alloy (<2% Sb, 1% Cu ) at these loads, my coating technique works good.

[Keola5o4]

WD - water dropped to harden after PC cooking, right out of the oven . This is a test to see how hard I can drive plain base (no GC) that's powder coated. Edit:Don't have a crony but from data L.G. did for me and load charts, I'm figuring >1800fps for a plain base 180 gr. 30 gr. should get me around 2k, 35gr. ~2.2k, close to GC'd cast limit with this powder & rifle. My conclusions so far, save the GC for the 308, necks are not dirty now, HT after PC works fine and is needed for my alloy (<2% Sb, 1% Cu ) at these loads, my coating technique works good.
After WD the coating show no signs of peeling? Every time I take them out the oven they are a little tacky, "wanted to try wd once just didnt want to go back to square 1".

[popper]

Probably takes me < minute to get them all into the water, they don't cool much in that time. No peeling, cracking are anything. Using HF white & red, haven't gotten to black yet. My convection toaster oven runs 400F for 20 min., not preheated. I check with a thermo probe. Loaded up the last of the RD30-30 this morning, muffinized 20# of scrapped castings. muffinized another 40# alloy last week. When Tom gets me my new 9mm mould I'll be casting & coating for a week, about out of everything. Maybe I should slow down my shooting?

[Maximumbob54]

Probably takes me < minute to get them all into the water, they don't cool much in that time. No peeling, cracking are anything. Using HF white & red, haven't gotten to black yet. My convection toaster oven runs 400F for 20 min., not preheated. I check with a thermo probe. Loaded up the last of the RD30-30 this morning, muffinized 20# of scrapped castings. muffinized another 40# alloy last week. When Tom gets me my new 9mm mould I'll be casting & coating for a week, about out of everything. Maybe I should slow down my shooting?


You owe everyone some pushups for that statement.

[Keola5o4]

Probably takes me < minute to get them all into the water, they don't cool much in that time. No peeling, cracking are anything. Using HF white & red, haven't gotten to black yet. My convection toaster oven runs 400F for 20 min., not preheated. I check with a thermo probe. Loaded up the last of the RD30-30 this morning, muffinized 20# of scrapped castings. muffinized another 40# alloy last week. When Tom gets me my new 9mm mould I'll be casting & coating for a week, about out of everything. Maybe I should slow down my shooting?

I don't think you should slow down on the shooting, may come up with a way to make some primers, hahah! Man that will make a good thread

[destrux]

Someone said earlier that the HF red wasn't working well for this? Is that true? I'm just getting started with powder coating bullets and I coated and sized to .452" some .45 ACP bullets and they're leading pretty bad, the throat and all along the tops of the rifling. Am I not putting on a thick enough coating or is the HF red powder no good for doing this? I was coating the bullets thick enough that you can't see any lead exposed before baking them, and there's no exposed lead after baking or after sizing either. When I recovered some shot bullets you can see that the rifling scraped the PC off where the lands engraved into the bullets, and I think I see some signs of slight gas cutting at the base but it's hard to say since the bullets were shot into sand.

[Garyshome]

Welll I think I will PC the inside of my barrel, then shoot lead boolits! That will save all the time PC'ing the boolits. Wonder what color I should use?

[fcvan]

garyshome: I would think 'gunmetal grey' would be be good :) or maybe 'black chrome'

[popper]

I've got primers and it's a negative on the pushups - I don't want shoulder surgery again. garyshome - a new version of the nylon 66? I don't know about the red, I added red to the white - no leading in rifle so far. Destrux - I got a slight 'leading' collecting on the lands near the throat (using white in 40sw), it didn't change accuracy. Not really sure it's lead, cleaned out easily. Several OPs have pics of recovered PCd with not much coating left but no leading.
Keola - thanks for the complement. Counted the holes on the PB this morning - I had 15 rnds but only 14 holes. Guess that makes the 5 shot clover a 6 banger. I know I pulled the top one. Now to brag, that was after a couple mags of AR10, 95F & ~ 60% humidity. Got so hot, sweaty & tired I went home after I realized I'd forgotten to switch from safe to fire. Darn, I'd pulled the bolt, checked the firing pin, just couldn't see why they wouldn't go bang. Duhh.

[Maximumbob54]

I've been that hot and nasty at the range where I can't think clearly and that is always the time to pack up and go home.

[fastglock]

?Has anyone tried :

1- bullets on wire mesh then powder coat.

2- then "sandwich" bullets with wire mesh on top

3- carefully flip over

4-remove top wire mesh( that was on the bottom), then brush off powder paint

5-powder coat

6-sandwich ,flip over , then bake


I guess ill try it . Gotta pick up some wire mesh later.



Ok i tried... No Can Do.....some bullets move around while flipping. ...

back to the drawing board

[destrux]

Update for me as well. I was able to shoot a little today. I put about 40 PC'd rounds through my 1911 before the extractor broke.

That's funny, the extractor on my 1911 (well, it's a Ballester Molina, but I use a modified 1911 extractor in it) broke while testing my first batch of PC bullets too. I don't think it was because of the bullets though, rather because I dropped the slide on a round in the chamber by mistake.

[Keola5o4]

77351 alrighty got these ready for the range first thing in the morning. I hope every thing goes smooth.

[alfloyd]

I just today shot an ISPC match using PC boolits.
I shot over 200 rounds and had no leading in my Taurus 9MM pistol.
Very happy with the results.
I used the Piglet method to PC some 120 g TC cast boolits.
Works great for me. I baked them in my toaster oven at 400 deg F for 20 min's and put on 2 coats.
Here are some photos of my boolits.

77358

77359

They size easily in my Star sizer. The ones I used today did not have lube on them.
Next I am going to try some 228 g RN 45 cal slugs in my H&K USP compact.
I got them all powder coated, sized and ready to load.
I am going to see if they shoot well in a polygon rifled barrel.

77360

Lafaun

[Keola5o4]

I just today shot an ISPC match using PC boolits.
I shot over 200 rounds and had no leading in my Taurus 9MM pistol.
Very happy with the results.
I used the Piglet method to PC some 120 g TC cast boolits.
Works great for me. I baked them in my toaster oven at 400 deg F for 20 min's and put on 2 coats.
Here are some photos of my boolits.

77358

77359

They size easily in my Star sizer. The ones I used today did not have lube on them.
Next I am going to try some 228 g RN 45 cal slugs in my H&K USP compact.
I got them all powder coated, sized and ready to load.
I am going to see if they shoot well in a polygon rifled barrel.

77360

Lafaun
Looks good !any tips on how you get your coat so smooth? And yet please share the performance on the polygon rifle, because I been wanting to put a couple through my glock19, but its gonna end up going through my Beretta instead ha!

[fastfire]

Alright! Had a chance to go out and shoot some of these. The 9mm blew apart leaving just the base as expected from 25 feet. They went through 4 gallons of water with the front one taking the hydrostatic shock, and the three behind the first getting hit by fragments that pierced all four milk jugs. No leading after 50 or so rounds! This one I was having problems with getting an alloy soft enough to expand, but not lead. Problem solved!
Now this one is cool! This is a Mihec penta 452-200 at 25 feet. It went through two milk jugs and piercing the third where it was recovered. It expanded the size of a quarter, with no leading! I think the P/C ,and heat treatment made for a nice combination.
71430714317143271437

Which bullet? and mold?
I like the hollow point

[xyankeeworkshop]

destrux - The HF red powder has worked just fine for me both for both spraying and Pigletizing. The issue with the red (and many others) is on the Piglet side and finding the right solvent to actually dissolve the pigment. Mine didn't dissolve, but if you shake up your mix, it'll stay in suspension plenty long enough for you to use it easily. BTW, I've dropped anchor on this method and am now using it for my bulk 9mm and .45 practice and IDPA fodder. I'll experiment at the fringes, but I'm happy with the ease and the performance.

Keola - I chose to get into PC specifically to feed a Glock 17 with a factory barrel. From the start, I've never had any leading issues at all, but i did have to fidget a bit with sizing and powder charge to get past an initial keyholing problem.

[xacex]

Which bullet? and mold?
I like the hollow point

Fastfire, Welcome to Cast boolits! The mold in post #989 is the MiHec 452-200 sized .451 and loaded in 45ACP with Harbor Freight flat black powder coat. The red ones in post #984, and bottom right pic in post #993 are the MiHec 359-125 sized .357 and loaded in 9mm. You can get those molds here on the group buy section, or closed buy section by contacting MiHec or getting on an active group buy list. If the group buy is closed you may be able to get one of the extras he usually cuts by contacting him via PM.

[fastfire]

Thank you.
I have poured lead for fishing lures-sinkers for many years, just getting into casting bullets.

LOTS a info here and I will be back.

Thanks Again

[dverna]

Not bad Popper!

I need to upload the best groups I did with the PC 9mm experiment. I ended up doing 4 groups for each powder and averaged them. With the MiHec 125 grain 9mm boolit sized to .357 I got the best group with 6 grains of Bluedot. 1.09"AOL,CCI SPP, 7 yards was 2.23" average 5 shot group with my wifes 38 super match 1911 with a 9mm barrel. The second best was bullseye at 2.25" with 3.6 grains, worst was W231 at 2.30" with 5.4 grains. Universal was a tad better than the W231 at 2.62" average. All of these were shot resting on a sandbag. You could tell the difference is the size of the groups between the top two, and bottom two. I used to get the best groups with universal, and the worst with bluedot with cast loads, but now thy follow the same trend as jacketed.

Am I reading this correctly? Are you saying that your "accuracy" is groups of over 2" at 7 yards over a sandbag? Do commercial bullets also shoot that poorly?

[xacex]

Am I reading this correctly? Are you saying that your "accuracy" is groups of over 2" at 7 yards over a sandbag? Do commercial bullets also shoot that poorly?

For me with that gun I might get a little better with a jacketed, but I also have just started this experiment with PC in that pistol after I found my regular load that I was using didn't work. At 21 feet with a starting load I doubt I could do better.There were some groups that were less than 2", but these were averages of 4 groups at a medium pace. This conversion barrel has never been a stellar performer. Now if I had a Ranson rest...
I have had Lone Wolf Glock 22 9mm conversion barrels that have shot better than this one. The point of this was to find a powder to work up that performed well with the PC, and go from there. POI changes with each type of powder as well, and whatever works needs to be adjusted to that to make it work. Lots of variables such as mixed head stamp brass, and boolits that were not separated by weight, ect. will affect accuracy, but I am not that picky with semi auto pistol rounds.If this were rifle boolits, or fired out of a revolver for hunting I would be concerned. Here is one of the groups that was under 2", and as you can see it was one flyer that opened it up. There were several groups like this where it was one outlier that opened the group up. This one was 1.6" with the flier. 77708
For what I have into it I don't consider that poor.
The tool for this round which was assembled by me.
77709

[xacex]

Here are some of the 311410 I P/C'd today. I hope I can pull out some groups with these. If I can hit a milk jug at 150 yards to start I would be happy. Of course my son can hit a shotgun shell at that distance when I only hold well enough to keep it on a plate with the same gun. Time for new glasses, or less coffee. 77850

[LongGun1]

Very nice pic! :D

[Russel Nash]

Here are some of the 311410 I P/C'd today. I hope I can pull out some groups with these. If I can hit a milk jug at 150 yards to start I would be happy. Of course my son can hit a shotgun shell at that distance when I only hold well enough to keep it on a plate with the same gun. Time for new glasses, or less coffee. 77850

Those are a hollow point, too! Sweet!

Well, if you can hit a milk jug filled with water, maybe you can put a few more milk jugs behind it and capture the boolit after it mushrooms or fragments???

Sorry, I am not real familiar with cast rifle boolits yet or the lingo....which mould is that? and are you making your own gas checks? how much do they weigh?

[xacex]

Those are a hollow point, too! Sweet!

Well, if you can hit a milk jug filled with water, maybe you can put a few more milk jugs behind it and capture the boolit after it mushrooms or fragments???

Sorry, I am not real familiar with cast rifle boolits yet or the lingo....which mould is that? and are you making your own gas checks? how much do they weigh?

That is the 311410 group buy that just finished up. They weigh with COWW+2% tin about 125 grains with the long H/P pin. That hollow-point goes down to the first drive band,deeeeep...:bigsmyl2:
The other short pin comes in at 127, and the solid is coming in at 130.5 with my alloy. I do make my own gas checks, but I used Hornady checks in the pic. I intend on seeing what they do with the 300 Blackout, and 54R with "the load". We will see how accurate these are, and if I can hit a jug with them. I noticed a .001 variance in coating thickness before I sized to .310. Tempted to load them in the 30-06 with the load to see what that does, but that is set for hunting season, and I am afraid to mess with it right now.

[Russel Nash]

That is the 311410 group buy that just finished up. They weigh with COWW+2% tin about 125 grains with the long H/P pin. That hollow-point goes down to the first drive band,deeeeep...:bigsmyl2:
The other short pin comes in at 127, and the solid is coming in at 130.5 with my alloy. I do make my own gas checks, but I used Hornady checks in the pic. I intend on seeing what they do with the 300 Blackout, and 54R with "the load". We will see how accurate these are, and if I can hit a jug with them. I noticed a .001 variance in coating thickness before I sized to .310. Tempted to load them in the 30-06 with the load to see what that does, but that is set for hunting season, and I am afraid to mess with it right now.

Cool! Thanks! I am kicking myself for not getting in on any of these group buys.

[popper]

Forgot to add to my rifle test post. I did NOT see the first shot cold bbl error common to normal lubes. I have seen it in pistol. Typically up-left.

[Russel Nash]

If you guys are looking for powder, I can beat Powder by the Pound's price. If I read correctly, it is $25 shipped.

[fcvan]

Russel, you're a powder guy too? You are truly a man of many talents. What colors do you have? I've been coating with black, and they look great, but I've seen some other colors and am tempted to try some out. For now, all of my boolits are Henry Ford Model 'T' specials.

[Russel Nash]

Well... I'm kicking around some ideas...

You all might remember me talking about my buddy with the powder coating business. He showed me all the large peanut butter type jars of powder coat he had around the shop. He said each jar was a pound.

I have a medium flat rate box from the post office. It looks like I could get 3 of those jars into a MFRB.

Looking at the color chart it looks like I have 4 shades of blue, 2 shades of green, 3 shades of yellow, 2 shades of orange, and 4 shades of red. There must be about ten different blacks.

EDIT: I can be back later with the actual color codes, if you all want to google them.

There are other colors too that my friend has that are not in my catalog, like the day glow green and "lawnboy mower" green he showed me.

[popper]

Russel - you might reconsider shipping powder USPS. Or at least check with them. PBTP requires air delivery which adds to the cost, making it really expensive. I've looked for PC shops around DFW, haven't found any willing to sell small amounts for a decent $.

[Skip62]

Russel - you might reconsider shipping powder USPS. Or at least check with them. PBTP requires air delivery which adds to the cost, making it really expensive. I've looked for PC shops around DFW, haven't found any willing to sell small amounts for a decent $.

They only require air delivery for silicone hi-temp. They told me it's because if it sits in a truck it could cure and turn into a brick. You can give them special permission to ship ground though. I did cuz it was cool out. They said it's only a summer thing.
Now I don't know if they ship USPS. I would think it could be a hazardous material, but I've been wrong before. Lots of times.

[Russel Nash]

Hmmn... I guess I will have to look into it some more. I thought as long as it wasn't a liquid, it was okay to ship.

[Russel Nash]

I am at the cardinalpaint.com website now looking at the colors section:

http://www.cardinalpaint.com/products/productcat.php?pcid=2

I went to the USPS website too, and I didn't see anything about powders. I might just have to call Powder Buy The Pound to see how they ship. Or just stop by the post office on Monday.

I am looking at their "deal" right now:

http://www.powderbuythepound.com/Jet-Black-Hammertone/

$16.49 for a pound? Is that shipped?

I will have to look through my texts with my buddy, but I could swear he said he gets a pound for $3 to $5, each.

[Skip62]

So I just faked an order on PBTP, and they ship USPS flat rate.

I don't think the $16.49 includes shipping. I would suspect that PBTP is more expensive simply because they set themselves up to be a small quantity distributor, which is more labor intensive than bulk. When you stop to consider how many bullets it coats, it's still cheap. I use 1 tsp/100 rounds, that's total for 2 coats. There is a lot of teaspoons in 1lb.

[Russel Nash]

What I'd be curious about is if you bought two or three, 1 pound'ers (same color, different colors, doesn't matter) do they ding you twice or three times for shipping? Does it all come in the same box?

Back in 2008 when I was shooting USPSA regularly, I shot 8,000 rounds just in matches. That's not including practice, sighting in, load development.

[Russel Nash]

I'd say there are 12 liquid ounces in a pound of powder. So that would be 72 teaspoons. Or 7,200 boolits.

[Wayne S]

LOTS of perrrr Deee bullets, but very few pictures of bullet holes;ie groups. Brings to mind a scene from The Dirty Dozen " some pretty looking solders Col. BUT CAN THEY FIGHT "

[Skip62]

Russel Nash, the shipping options change for the amount of powder, just like ordering from anywhere. It's price per package, not the number of things you buy.

There has to be a lot more than enough to coat 7200 rounds. I've coated about 1500, and haven't made a dent in the pound I have.

[Russel Nash]

I rarely buy anything online, and never bought two or three of the same thing.

That's why I haven't ever gotten in on any of the mould group buys, I don't have pay pal set up.

I'll call powder buy the pound on Monday.

[Russel Nash]

My buddy just texted me this link:

http://www.linetec.com/POWDERCOAT/Types_of_Powder_Coat.html

So I am educating myself on the different types of powder trying to figure out which ones would best dissolve in lacquer thinner or acetone for the piglet method.

[bryonbush]

has anyone had experience with the black PC from HF not sticking to the bullets? did a few hundred the other day and its flaking off on a lot of them

[KYShooter73]

has anyone had experience with the black PC from HF not sticking to the bullets? did a few hundred the other day and its flaking off on a lot of them

Are you tumbling or spraying? I always soak mine in acetone before spraying, then preheat them, spray, bake.

[xacex]

has anyone had experience with the black PC from HF not sticking to the bullets? did a few hundred the other day and its flaking off on a lot of them
Not had that problem.

[KYShooter73]

LOTS of perrrr Deee bullets, but very few pictures of bullet holes;ie groups. Brings to mind a scene from The Dirty Dozen " some pretty looking solders Col. BUT CAN THEY FIGHT "

They can fight, not done rifle yet, but these do just fine.

78287

78288

78289

[Wayne S]

They can fight, not done rifle yet, but these do just fine.

78287

78288

78289
Nice group, at what distance ? 10 yds. ??

[KYShooter73]

Woops, sorry. 20 yards. 9mm M&P pro.

[bryonbush]

Are you tumbling or spraying? I always soak mine in acetone before spraying, then preheat them, spray, bake.

Usually I pre heat but seeing that the bullets were sitting outside in 100 degree weather I skipped that part. Bullets were clean so that's not an issue. Maybe I didn't bake them long enough but I didn't do anything different than what I usually do for the white.

[w0fms]

Hmm... small minor disaster this weekend. My wife needed some screws (heads) powder coated to match a shelf she was putting up. In black. I ran to the local HF store, got some black. I decided that I might as well PC the wire rack of 50 (about 1/2 38 SPL and 1/2 9MM) boolits at the same time. The wire rack worked well.

But..

I use a $19 quartz element Wally World special toaster oven. Well... in Yellow PC running the thing at the full 450°F was no problem. In black.. well.. I figured turning it down to 375°F would make up for the extra "infrared heating".

It didn't.. most of the boolits melted before I could stop the process. I managed to save in time 10/50 (all 9mm). The 38 SPL apparently had a little more tin in the mix...

So this is why many would recommend a convection oven for the curing. The black PC actually took on enough extra heat to melt the boolits.. I'm guessing at least an extra 100-150°F. Like I said this is because the thermostat in the oven is measuring the wall temperature of the oven (which is silver colored). The Black PC made a big difference.

So in my cast I'm going to stick with white and/or Yellow (though I have all 4 HF colors now) and keep track of the curing better with the non-contact infrared thermometer. I figured I'd pass this on so you don't waste an hour recasting and repowder coating boolits.. possibly putting a rack or foil over and under the boolits would work as well...

The screw heads turned out great. My wife was very happy... hrrumph...

[Maximumbob54]

I didn't think pure tin would melt until 450?

[Boneguru]

I cannot find the PC system that is mentioned from Amazon...
Please help
Ray

[xacex]

I cannot find the PC system that is mentioned from Amazon...
Please help
Ray

I think you are talking about the Craftsman all in one model? From what I understand they stopped producing it, and you need to find a used one, or the harbor freight gun. I use the H/F one with great results, but you will need some source of compressed air.

[MJohnston]

If you are talking about the craftsman gun from amazon its been discontinued and is overpriced everywhere else I've seen it.

[w0fms]

Well, solder 60/40 melts at about 450°F from experience (I'm a EE and a ham radio op, so I use solder a lot). The 9mm is mostly range lead, the 38 spl I did out of pure WW's. The $19 toaster over is quartz type elements. Lets say I was quite surprised when the boolits melted. The string of profanity out of my mouth when it happen shocked my 12 year old who I was teaching how to powder coat with the HF machine. ;)

I have a PID controlled hot plate for my casting pot. Very accurate for temp. I'll take one of the deformed boolits of each alloy and figure out their melting point when I have time again. I have to cast more 9mm anyway... I'm out... on the way up to casting temp I can do a boolit on a piece of aluminum foil. Probably be good to know anyway...

I didn't see it mentioned here but if your toaster oven is the cheap infrared type and you use dark colors.. well.. compensate for it. It probably doesn't matter as long as the powder hits 400-450°F for 10 minutes.. so even if the air temp is only 300°F in the oven, it only matters what the powder is...

Like I said.. the screws turned out great... sigh...

[fastglock]

Shot 125rds yesterday at a USPSA match.

Glock 35 KKM
Lee 175 SWC
N320


I used the TGIC polyester powder.Light residue but that cleaned off real easy. No lube smoke and gun is waaaay cleaner. Gonna try epoxy primer powder next.

[Skip62]

Shot 125rds yesterday at a USPSA match.

Glock 35 KKM
Lee 175 SWC
N320


I used the TGIC polyester powder.Light residue but that cleaned off real easy. No lube smoke and gun is waaaay cleaner. Gonna try epoxy primer powder next.

Looking good.



Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk 2

[Boneguru]

thats what I was afraid of, craftsman model is done,
I have a compressor but 30 was a better price than 60 at HF
I will have to get one soon,
where is the best place for media?
Thanks all
Ray

[Maximumbob54]

On a whim I decided to give the cheap HF red another chance. Turns out once again less is more. I was using way WAY too much previously and now that I'm not trying to fully coat them they look far better. I poured just a tiny bit into the bucket and then poured the thinner over that and swished it around. I end up with what I can best describe as a bit of red slime booger that is rolling around in the lacquer thinner. I then add the bullets and shake them. And then shake them some more. And when I'm done I shake them some more. You get the picture, shake them and keep shaking them.

Then following the instructions on the bottle I bake them at 400 for 15-20 minutes and end up with this:

http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/Maximumbob54/Reloading%20and%20Casting/IMG_20130805_175450_485_zps6b3f4c8c.jpg (http://s1176.photobucket.com/user/Maximumbob54/media/Reloading%20and%20Casting/IMG_20130805_175450_485_zps6b3f4c8c.jpg.html)

[bangerjim]

has anyone had experience with the black PC from HF not sticking to the bullets? did a few hundred the other day and its flaking off on a lot of them

I use the black HF stuff ONLY. Spayed on with the HF gun.....one coat.......I can pound the boolit flat from nose to base and the coating does NOT even crack. If the lead splits, then it will crack....DUH!

All my boolits are as-dropped....not cleaned with anything....at room temp (shop is ~84F).....baked with standard infrared top & bottom cheepy toaster oven. Mine does not even have a working temp control knob. I use a HF temp gun to check temps.

Works perfectly every time. Check your time and temp settings.

bangerjim

[Maximumbob54]

Has anyone else noticed that if you start with warm bullets then the HF powder sticks way more even of a coating? But if you allow them to cool too much then as the lacquer thinner evaporates it cools the boolits and the coverage becomes far more uneven. I made a bit of a mess with the second coating on this batch above. They aren't going to be picture worthy the second time around. But this got me to thinking. I had a very small batch of some rifle boolits I wanted to test. I heated them by setting them in a small metal pan and just setting it on the oven while the other batch was cooking. After a few minutes (keeping an eye on the plastic bucket setting in the pan on the hot oven) I dusted them with powder and poured in the thinner. I could feel the evaporation start to cool the boolits and whammy the coating started to look ugly. I set the bucket back in the pan on the oven. Again a few minutes later I added the thinner and proceeded to shake them up again. I even added just a bit more powder. I did this three times with warming them adding powder and thinner and shaking and they now look like this:

http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/Maximumbob54/Reloading%20and%20Casting/IMG_20130805_193340_677_zps8146a6bc.jpg (http://s1176.photobucket.com/user/Maximumbob54/media/Reloading%20and%20Casting/IMG_20130805_193340_677_zps8146a6bc.jpg.html)

And after one baking they look like this:

http://i1176.photobucket.com/albums/x333/Maximumbob54/Reloading%20and%20Casting/IMG_20130805_200129_944_zpsde0401a1.jpg (http://s1176.photobucket.com/user/Maximumbob54/media/Reloading%20and%20Casting/IMG_20130805_200129_944_zpsde0401a1.jpg.html)

I'm going to run them through the sizing die to see what happens to Ranch Dog's design. There was a poster that asked for clear coat finish and I'm sorry but this was supposed to be the test batch for that and I ate them up...

In retrospect... Since it took me so long to type and do the pics... I think I am on the right track but still going in the wrong direction. The thinner evaporating is what's causing the cooling. Check mark. Adding more over and over... Uncheck. That's just adding A/C to the situation over and over. I think the real answer is to add the minimum amount of thinner to the powder to get it to go all slime. Then the shake shake shake action until they are starting to dry. Less thinner... Less cooling... Better coverage. I bet the first batch I didn't even notice I didn't add enough thinner.

[fastglock]

I think the real answer is to add the minimum amount of thinner to the powder to get it to go all slime.


Yes .
I use the lacquer just to "liquefy" the powder , dump out the laquer,dump in the boolits, tumble and shake, lay boolits out on the mesh ( all theses steps is done in about one minute)

Then dry 5 mins, bake.


If I take any longer than 1.5mins then it turns to clumpy powder

[bstone5]

Over the last several weeks i have shot a hundred each 45 ACP 200 grain SWC bullets that were plain powder coated, bullets coated with Gold Hi-Tech color, bullets coated by the piglet method and bullets powder coated with the powder coating gun with a soda pop can gas check.

After shooting 100 rounds of each the best and most consistent for accuracy were the powder coated with the powder coating gun with a soda pop can gas check.

The gun is a Colt Gold Cup Series 70 that has always shot very well.

The gas check just seems to seal around the bullet better than the coatings and clean the barrel with each shot.

I takes more time to make the gas checks and install the gas checks but these bullets seem to be much more accurate with more rounds down the barrel.

All of the combinations resulted in no lead in the barrel with very little effort required to clean the bore of the barrel.

[jmort]

No surprise that electrostatic PC with check would work best.

[popper]

30 gr LeverE load is too much for the PB 30-30 (336 MG), 26 is OK. A fellow shooter had a crony today so I got him to check my loads. 308 was 2240 (40 over what I guessed, ~300 below Hodgdon jacketed, I should be able to get near max, ~ 2500, with no problem), then he blew the sky screen off so I didn't get him to test the 30-30 loads. Fortunately no damage to the screen. If my luck at guessing, the 26 gr. load should be just over 1800 fps.

[KYShooter73]

Ive read all the PC threads myself, but the length would have to be very daunting for someone looking to get started, so I made a photo tutorial on the electrostatic method. Posted here: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?209151-Powder-Coating-101-Electrostatic-Method

[Dolomite_supafly]

After some thought I will again post this information

*******WARNING*******
There are several separate compilations of 842 powder, SMP and WC being the most common from what I have seen. And each version is vastly different as far as what is safe. I have and decided to use SMP842 for this testing. I have a lot of experience with this powder and feel comfortable.

DO NOT USE THIS LOAD DATA FOR ANY OTHER VERSION OF 842!

And if you do decide to use this load data with SMP842 use proper hand loading techniques and start low.


I tumbled them using the "piglet method" except I used Klean Strip brand lacquer thinner rather than acetone. The results are amazing because the powder coating is ONLY sticking to the bullets and not the plastic bucket when using lacquer thinner. You can also pour off the essentially clean lacquer thinner after the bullets have been coated. It also uses about 1/3 less powder to do the same coating, no doubt because I am not coating the bucket, too. I am using powder from Powder By The Pound to coat. The powder I use is the polyester TGIC 400 degree powder. Harbor Freight powder tends to be very finicky and it does not work as well as the PBTP powder. HF powder will work but it isn't as easy as PBTP powder.

I did NOT use any type of lube. I did NOT use gas checks.

I was sent some 22 caliber cast bullets to try. They are ~45 and ~48 grains. I coated the heavier ones with a base color, red, and the lighter ones with a metallic paint, copper. I was going to push these HARD to see where the standard color fails and where the metallic fails.

They were coated at the same time and baked at the same time. I then sized them all to the same size, .224". They do NOT have gas checks and have a shank to accept gas checks.

I loaded them in surplus LC brass that are virgin, as in never been shot before. I am using SMP 842 with each bullet's powder charged being weighed individually. I loaded two each with the same amount of powder using each bullet. I have a total of 20 shots to be fired with each bullet weight and each charge weight having two rounds identical.

I shot them out of a Savage with a factory 9 twist barrel that is 22" long.

I chronographed each shot and between each two shots I inspected the bore for anything odd.

I was expecting the velocities to start around 2,900 fps and get to about 3,300 fps. If these things are going to fail this is going to do it. Afterwards I am going to load more and shoot them into water jugs to see how they perform.

Pictures
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/Adyth/4EEC20A2-993A-4F28-AE54-9D4780D96B51-233-0000000EF75456A4_zps9287c29d.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/Adyth/E065EA4E-3BE8-4B5E-AB4E-B0B951E7C3A4-233-0000000EF0192444_zps6b93a9dc.jpg
I feel these are too heavily coated and the next batch I will use about 1/2 the amount of powder.

So I was able to chronograph and actually push these powder coated bullets to the limit. After that I shot one into water to see how they perform. I used a Savage bolt action with a 22" barrel that has a 9 twist.

The velocities are averages of two shots. There are two separate compilations of 842 powder, SMP and WC. And each version is vastly different. I do not want to publish data for SMP842 and have someone mistaken the data for WC842. Each list is the same load data with the only variation is the bullet itself.

Heavy using SMP842 and base color
3,132 fps (I think something was funky with this result, I stepped away from the chronograph and continued)
2,818 fps (cleaned fine with no lead)
3,192 fps (cleaned fine with no lead)
3,331 fps (cleaned fine with no lead)
3,486 fps (hard to patch and lead came out on the patch)

Lightweight using SMP842 and metallic powder
3,051 fps (cleaned fine with no lead)
2,983 fps (cleaned fine with no lead)
3,293 fps (started getting resistance with the patch but no lead on the patch)
3,247 fps (hard to patch and lead came out on the patch)
3,489 fps (hard to patch and lead came out on the patch)

What is really surprising is even after the bore had lead the second patch came out nearly clean. The third patch could have been used again it was so clean. At no time did I see any powder coating powder or plastic on the patches. When the patch met resistance and lead came out the second patch went down the bore smoothly with less resistance.

I would feel safe pushing the red to 3,200 fps. Even though it was clean at 3,300 fps I like to give myself a bit of latitude in case something does go wrong. I don't think the copper worked as well as the red.

I also shot one of the red bullets into the water jugs. The bullet weighed 48.7 before and 21.9 afterwards so it lost 1/2 its weight in the water. It passed through 2 jugs and sprinkled the third with pieces.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/Adyth/IMG_0070_zps59f7f6a9.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/Adyth/IMG_0067_zpsdae928dd.jpg

If anyone is interested I can also detail my method of tumble coating and baking bullets.

Ask if you have any questions.

[Smoke4320]

Great report .. I have been shooting alot of Pc'ed bullets and so far love the results.. been spraying mine but am going to try this method as well
Have shot some 308 at 1800-1900 FPS and no leading .. and great accuracy
have a 458 socom load going 1660 and no leading and great accuracy
working on 300 Blackout up to approx. 1600 on it with no leading
Like you all gas check boolits but I am not gas checking

5 shots at 200 yds .. Bottom left is 2 shots.. looks like 1 big hit
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78630&d=1375984150

[Russel Nash]

Great report .. I have been shooting alot of Pc'ed bullets and so far love the results.. been spraying mine but am going to try this method as well
Have shot some 308 at 1800-1900 FPS and no leading .. and great accuracy
have a 458 socom load going 1660 and no leading and great accuracy
working on 300 Blackout up to approx. 1600 on it with no leading
Like you all gas check boolits but I am not gas checking

5 shots at 200 yds .. Bottom left is 2 shots.. looks like 1 big hit
http://castboolits.gunloads.com/attachment.php?attachmentid=78630&d=1375984150

what weight .308 bullets are you talking about?

Yeah, it would be great if I got to that point of casting boolits for rifle if I could avoid the whole gas check thing too.

[popper]

Dolomite_supafly - what alloy are you using for the 223? Accuracy? Mine is ~ WD 50/50 COWW/Pb, is working good for 165 GC 308 @ 2240, very accurate, no leading. Same alloy in PB 180 RD 311. No leading but accuracy is bad at hotter load. Both 1:10 twist. I'm wondering if the GC design sans GC allows a PC ring to be thicker and seals better than the thin sharp edge of the flat base.

[felix]

Good question there, Popper! Verify which is most acceptable by an accuracy test. Base expanded properly at ignition versus base destroyed at exit. ... felix

[Dolomite_supafly]

Dolomite_supafly - what alloy are you using for the 223? Accuracy? Mine is ~ WD 50/50 COWW/Pb, is working good for 165 GC 308 @ 2240, very accurate, no leading. Same alloy in PB 180 RD 311. No leading but accuracy is bad at hotter load. Both 1:10 twist. I'm wondering if the GC design sans GC allows a PC ring to be thicker and seals better than the thin sharp edge of the flat base.

I have shot some very nice groups with PC's bullets in my various 300BO guns, both subsonic and supersonic at 2,000+ fps. I have also shot pure lead in my 300BO and had zero issues at subsonic velocities.

I had some people ask at what point PC fails and that was the purpose of the testing, not for accuracy. The alloy for testing the 223 was COWW lead.

I have shot bullets with a flat base and for a gas check in my 300BO at supersonic velocities ranging from 1,900 to 2,300+ fps. I could not see a difference between them as far as leading.

I will have a lot more accuracy testing in the coming weeks using my 300BO but not the 223. I just don't enjoy shooting my 223's.

PM me your address and I will send you some of the 223 bullets.

[popper]

Don't have a 223, just trying to get answers to apply to my 30's. Thanks anyway. Think I'll try upping the Sb in my alloy a bit for the PB.

[Smoke4320]

This group was shot from a Milhec 312-159 using the FN pin .
98% COWW and 2 % High Speed billet ( for the tin and bit of copper)
mine weight out at 147-148 Grns in the FP and 143-144 with the HP pins ..
they were Pc'ed with HF Red and then sized to .311... OAL 1.930

Shot another group last night.. not quite a good but I had just fast walked 400 yds and sat down immediately to shoot .. heart was still beating a little fast.. should have waited a few minutes but it confirmed I am on the right track accuracy wise .. just a little fine tuning to do and chronoing to figure the drops at ranges..

what weight .308 bullets are you talking about?

Yeah, it would be great if I got to that point of casting boolits for rifle if I could avoid the whole gas check thing too.

[Russel Nash]

I went over to my powder coating buddy's place yesterday. I got a tub of some fluorescent green powder, to make zombie boolits. Picked up a toaster oven this morning off of Craig's List. Then went to Home Depot for some wire mesh. I forgot to get one of those plastic tubs though... Argghhh... So maybe this afternoon ... Maybe... I'll be baking boolits. :-)

[Maximumbob54]

I went over to my powder coating buddy's place yesterday. I got a tub of some fluorescent green powder, to make zombie boolits. Picked up a toaster oven this morning off of Craig's List. Then went to Home Depot for some wire mesh. I forgot to get one of those plastic tubs though... Argghhh... So maybe this afternoon ... Maybe... I'll be baking boolits. :-)

I can't wait to see someone else's efforts!!!

[sbeatty1983]

what is the wire mesh for russel?

[Maximumbob54]

Line the drip tray / cooking sheet that your oven comes with so the boolits don't have too much surface contact while baking. And don't let anything epoxy based touch each other or you just made two objects into one.

[sbeatty1983]

Line the drip tray / cooking sheet that your oven comes with so the boolits don't have too much surface contact while baking. And don't let anything epoxy based touch each other or you just made two objects into one.
ah, ive just been cooking mine on tin foil, maybe I should get some mesh though, would be easier to get the bullets off of and i could save more powder by letting it fall through.

[Maximumbob54]

If you cook on foil I highly recommend the non stick version that Reynolds makes. I bought some to try with Klass Kote and the epoxy doesn't stick at all after baking. Parchment paper also works. The hardware cloth may leave tiny contact marks but they either are removed during sizing or are irrelevent anyways. The contact marks don't seem to be that bad though with epoxy or powder coat so I'm not sure if one is really better than the other but the mesh does help them to not roll around and end up maybe baking to each other.

[sbeatty1983]

the mesh should save me some powder too, since it will fall through between the bullets

[Maximumbob54]

You shouldn't have any falling off. The powder breaks down in the thinner and really sticks to the lead. You will end up with a tiny amount stuck to the mesh when baking but it's minimal. You wouldn't want to reuse the baked powder anyways.

[sbeatty1983]

ah im using a PC gun. I end up with alot of powder still on the tin foil when baking. it ends up wasted

[RobS]

If you cook on foil I highly recommend the non stick version that Reynolds makes. I bought some to try with Klass Kote and the epoxy doesn't stick at all after baking. Parchment paper also works. The hardware cloth may leave tiny contact marks but they either are removed during sizing or are irrelevent anyways. The contact marks don't seem to be that bad though with epoxy or powder coat so I'm not sure if one is really better than the other but the mesh does help them to not roll around and end up maybe baking to each other.

Put the Reynolds non stick aluminum on top of the hardware cloth/mesh so the boolits don't roll around.

[Maximumbob54]

Put the Reynolds non stick aluminum on top of the hardware cloth/mesh so the boolits don't roll around.

I agree but then you open up to more surface contact spots in the coating.

[RobS]

I agree but then you open up to more surface contact spots in the coating.

If a person was going to originally lay the coated boolits on the non stick aluminum then how is putting the aluminum foil on the mesh going to have more surface area?

[Russel Nash]

I have been over in the piglet method thread. That's what I was using the mesh for.

If you have an electrostatic gun, I am thinking hollow point moulds are the way to go. Just run some sheet metal screws or those black drywall screws meant for metal studs up through some thin plate.

[sbeatty1983]

I was thinking of building several frames out of 1/8 mesh and spraying my bullets on them. The loose powder would fall through to be recycled. and Im sure the pc could be sandblasted off of the frames after use.

[Dolomite_supafly]

I found some aluminum pizza sheets at walmart. They are also a lot cheaper. I think it is 3 sheets for like $2. They seem like they are going to work better than the hardware cloth. Using wire mesh does leave a few marks on the bullets but they do not affect performance at all.

I was able to do some shooting today with a Contender in 300 Whisper/Blackout. I fired about 75 rounds and could not tell it had been fired other than some powder residue. I fired 100 grain Lee, 157 grain Lee and 200 grain NOE bullets that were all powder coated. They were minute of clay pigeon using irons and a scope. The amount of smoke seemed a lot less as well compared to Lee Alox. They all stabilized just fine in the 10 twist barrel, even the 200's at subsonic velocities. I even tried several 245 grain bullets at ~1,000 fps and in the 10 twist barrel they all hit the 100 yard target square. This is important because I am going to be building a suppressor in a few months and I need something heavy that will remain stabile in the can.

I need to cast, and coat, a lot more bullets as I am getting low on bullets now. I have seriously fired close to 1,000 so far and have yet to have any problems that can be attributed to the coating.

This is a lifesaver for me because I am doing it to prevent further lead exposure from shooting my 300 Blackout. I wear protective gear when casting so I do not believe that is the source. I have also started tumbling cases outside but even before I rarely tumbled my brass, mostly just reloaded them without cleaning them. That leaves the times when I would shoot my AR using cast bullets and when I did I would get a face full of smoke. And that smoke, no doubt, contained lead. At the end of a few hours shooting my face would have what appeared to be soot on it and my nostrils would be sore like I was in a house that was too dry. The smoke comes out the vents in the side of the bolt of an AR and if the wind is nonexistent or the wrong direction you get a lot in your face. And hopefully now this will cut down on the amount of lead I am exposed to. I was getting sick in February and decided to check the lead levels and they were elevated. The point of concern is 4 on their scale, my level was 10 and they recommend chelation therapy at 40. So it was not serious enough to be treated but the doctor said if I was tested again and it was elevated again he was required, by law, to notify the feds. He sad it was so they can do an enviromental study to determine if my exposure is enviromental exposure or not. And I don't want anyone at my house unless they are invited.

[Maximumbob54]

You might think of trying a piston rifle. The gas in mine all goes into the hand guard. I assume you are already using green (lead free) primers.

[KYShooter73]

So it was not serious enough to be treated but the doctor said if I was tested again and it was elevated again he was required, by law, to notify the feds. He sad it was so they can do an enviromental study to determine if my exposure is enviromental exposure or not. And I don't want anyone at my house unless they are invited.

I do believe I would have had an honest 2yr old tantrum. If you can't be honest with your doctor, lawyer, or clergyman it is a sad state of affairs. Rant off. Sorry, back to powder coating.

[Russel Nash]

Tell them that you repair stained glass windows as a hobby. The lead strips between the glass panes is called "came". A cut off wheel in a dremel works really well for cutting out the lead came to get to the broken glass. Unfortunately, that cutoff wheel spews lead particles into the air.

Under Obamacare, doctor's offices will be getting financial incentives for each piece of data they enter into the databases, which will be easily searchable (even by third parties who have nothing to do with your healthcare) for keywords like "guns" and "lead".

Kinda back on topic, but I wear latex or nitrile gloves when handling brass or boolits.

[Russel Nash]

So far, I haven't had much luck with the piglet (tumbling with lacquer thinner) method and baking on wire mesh. I had some thin plate around, so I cut the plate to fit my toaster oven. Then I drilled some staggered holes, 5/16" diameter.

http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt112/gryphon1994/59921F53-7073-424F-90E3-C94598391DDE-568-000002723458E8BE_zps0286d9db.jpg

I plan on covering it with the nonstick Reynolds aluminum foil. I'll get the Harbor Freight electrostatic powder gun tomorrow. With my tests tonight, my 9mm boolits will punch through the foil, nose first, leaving the bases up in the air, and I'll be able to carry the whole shabang over to my toaster oven without the bullets tipping over.

Well, that's my plan anyway. ???

[popper]

Try vitamin C for chelation. 1K mg/day. Water soluble so no damage to the body. Do you anneal the necks? Even shooting cast with veggie oil didn't leave any lead in the BCG in my AR 308 & no smoke in my face.

[sbeatty1983]

So I tried spraying my bullets on aluminum mesh screen, works quite well. I wrapped the wire rack that came with my toaster oven with aluminum mesh screen that I got from the hardware store. I was able to recover most of my powder like that and spraying a couple times from the bottom through the screen covers the base pretty well. For those of you coating bullets upside down on pins, you may want to give this method a shot. there will be small areas of bare bullet on the bottom where the screen touches, but it is minimal. I should have taken some pictures, but Ive already loaded them for testing.

[fastglock]

So I tried spraying my bullets on aluminum mesh screen, works quite well. I wrapped the wire rack that came with my toaster oven with aluminum mesh screen that I got from the hardware store. I was able to recover most of my powder like that and spraying a couple times from the bottom through the screen covers the base pretty well. For those of you coating bullets upside down on pins, you may want to give this method a shot. there will be small areas of bare bullet on the bottom where the screen touches, but it is minimal. I should have taken some pictures, but Ive already loaded them for testing.

Ya still can take pictures :D

[tyeo098]

My red .30 carbine'ers :)
http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s249/tyeo098/20130807_221511_zps71d781f6.jpg (http://s154.photobucket.com/user/tyeo098/media/20130807_221511_zps71d781f6.jpg.html)

[Russel Nash]

Made by Revlon, right?

Just joking...

Looks good!

[Maximumbob54]

Tyeo098 - How the devil did you get them to look so perfect?????????? :shock:

[Skip62]

i'm guessing, but I'd say he's using a powder coat gun

[tyeo098]

Maybe she was born with it.
Maybe its loaded with Maybelline.

Heres some 'WHITE POWUH' 38 Spl rounds I'm taking to the range today.

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s249/tyeo098/20130814_224156_zpse246bc0f.jpg (http://s154.photobucket.com/user/tyeo098/media/20130814_224156_zpse246bc0f.jpg.html)

[bangerjim]

Tyeo098 - How the devil did you get them to look so perfect?????????? :shock:

ALL of my boolits look like that! Every time! :bigsmyl2: That is why you use an electrostatic powder spray gun rather than trying to dissolve the stuff in a darned bucket and slop it on.

Mine are smooth and perfect...........every time!

I gave up on that "dissolving thing" months ago. When the goop did actually sort-of/did stick to the slugs (and not the bucket!), I had lumps, clumps, thin spots, and ugly touch marks where the slugs contacted the screen..............just an absloute total mess in my book.

Spraying is the only way to go. After all, that is how the pro's that coat car/motorcycle parts and lawn furniture do it......right! They sure do not dissolve the stuff in acetone/laq thinner and tumble in a bucket.

$59.00 (less the 20% coupon) at Harbor Freight is not a whole lot to spend for the gun that gives you perfect boolits (and bragging rights) EVERY SINGLE time.

bangerjim

[bangerjim]

ah im using a PC gun. I end up with alot of powder still on the tin foil when baking. it ends up wasted

If you are getting a lot of powder on the foil and other places that on the boolits, you are using waaaaaay too much air pressure. I use no more than 15# thru a 1/8" aquarium plastic line. Works perfectly and there is hardly any powder wasted.

Even if there is, at about $5.50/pound at Harbor Freight............who cares! I coat thousands of slugs with a pound.

Back off on your air. And only put about an 1½" of powder in the jar. I have seen guys just screw the new full jar on the gun and waste most of it! I do not even try to collect the tiny bit of powder that is wasted.

You have to play around with air flow (the knob on the lower back of the gun), air pressure, and bottle fill to get the right mix for your method and style of spraying. Also use the smallest dispersion nozzle that screws onto the front of the gun.

bangerjim

[tyeo098]

I get as much of a coat on the foil as I do on the boolits.
It all has the same charge anyways.


I have seen guys just screw the new full jar on the gun and waste most of it! I do not even try to collect the tiny bit of powder that is wasted.
Guilty :D
Did that my first time, THEN I read the instructions!

[ReloaderEd]

Nice boolits pretty.
Pure lead would make NO difference.
Gas checks not needed in pistol looks good to me!

[Edubya]

Can anyone provide the preferred powder website by page?

I paid $15.00 for my powder PBTP.

EW

[Russel Nash]

Sounds like you made out good. When I called Powder Buy The Pound, if I recall correctly about flat rate shipping, it was like $11.83, something like that. And they could get 5 or 6 pounds of the powder into a medium flat rate shipping box. Last Friday when I was helping my buddy powder coat this motorcycle trailer a customer brought in, he was dipping his powder out of this 5 pound box which would be just the right size for a medium flat rate shipping box.

[xacex]

http://www.harborfreight.com/16-oz-powder-coat-paint-matte-black-93306.html

Go in and pick some up!

[bangerjim]

Tyeo098 - How the devil did you get them to look so perfect?????????? :shock:

Using the HF powder (red and black ONLY. Yellow does not work....thin and splotchy and dissolves in acetone wipe test. Haven't tired white yet.) I get perfect non-smear/dissolve boolits everytime. Here are some examples of what I get:

79250


Sorry the site turns the pix upside down! But they all turn out nice & smooth with electrostatic coating.

And you can smash 'em flat from noze to base and the coating does not flake off!


bangerjim

[sbeatty1983]

Im using one of the cradtsman pc guns that doesnt use a separate air source. I pc on a screen and it works very well. Easy to ger the bullets off. http://i996.photobucket.com/albums/af88/sbeatty1983/IMG_20130814_222513_331_zps5923d907.jpg

[Skip62]

But the bases are exposed lead?

How long does it take to set each bullet up? I can tumble 1000 bullets with 3 coats in about a 30 minutes. So how long does it take you to spray 1000?

Asking cuz I legitimately want to know cuz I could switch if it's fast enough. Not trying to start a fight.

[KYShooter73]

Its all about cook time, only takes me 3-4 minutes to load up my jig and spray. I do 68 at a time. Only have to bake them once this way. If I had a couple double rack toaster ovens I could turn out about 260 every 30 minutes.79269

[bangerjim]

The bases of standard lubed and tumbled lubed boolits are exposed lead too! Only high velocity rifle slugs and mabe magnums need gas checks. Having exposed lead on the bottom of sub-sonic and standard pistol boolits is no problem. Never has been. Leading happens from the SIDES of the boolits where the high lands of the grease grooves form the seals with the barrel & rifling. Or from undersizing and they "rattle around" going down the barrel.

I can spray a rack in about 2 minutes. If you have the system set up right, it ges on fast and there is very little waste.

I bake up to 150 (2 racks) at a time depending on caliber. Loading the sheets takes very little time once you get a system down.

AND............I only have to coat & bake (10 min) them ONCE.......not 3 or 4 times as with liquid stuff. They are perfect with no "lay" marks, globs, streaks, or thin spots.

And why do you need 1000 bullets at time anyway? I do not have that much time to shoot!!!!!! More power to you if you have that much spare time!!!!

bangerjim

[Skip62]

Thanks KYShooter73, one of the reason I'm asking about this method is only cooking once, instead of twice. So it's really about the time it takes before that.

Bangerjim, exposed base is a problem for me with a compgun, always has been. So I guess this is a no start for me.
As far as 1000 bullets at time quickly, it would give you more time to shoot. I like casting a lot, I do NOT like lubing, coating, painting, whatever, so the less time I spend doing it, the better. I've got the Piglet method down so I don't get "lay" marks, globs, streaks, or thin spots. Do they "look" as good as spraying, no, do they perform as well, I'm sure they do, actually better in a compgun. I've gone back to Klass Kote, because I don't even have to bake, and they look better than tumbling PC.

[Maximumbob54]

Has anyone tried these in a bullet feeder die yet? I'm suddenly curious if this would break the lead bullet malfunction in the various designs of bullet feed dies. I have a Hornady .45 die but I need to cast up more .45 ACP boolits as I've been mainly casting .40 SW right now.

[MJohnston]

Using a screen on the wire rack instead of foil looks interesting but how many uses before the screen is too clogged up?

[xyankeeworkshop]

Waaaay back in the thread, someone mentioned dousing the screen in something flammable and burning the baked-on powdercoat off to rejuvenate your jig.

[sbeatty1983]

The screen is cheap. I just use it once then put a new one on

[tyeo098]

So is PC powder ;)

I'd rather use foil and coat everything than try and reclaim the powder haha

[sbeatty1983]

Its easier to get the bullets off the screen plus the bases get covered

[Russel Nash]

Thanks KYShooter73, one of the reason I'm asking about this method is only cooking once, instead of twice. So it's really about the time it takes before that.

Bangerjim, exposed base is a problem for me with a compgun, always has been. So I guess this is a no start for me.
As far as 1000 bullets at time quickly, it would give you more time to shoot. I like casting a lot, I do NOT like lubing, coating, painting, whatever, so the less time I spend doing it, the better. I've got the Piglet method down so I don't get "lay" marks, globs, streaks, or thin spots. Do they "look" as good as spraying, no, do they perform as well, I'm sure they do, actually better in a compgun. I've gone back to Klass Kote, because I don't even have to bake, and they look better than tumbling PC.

By "compgun", do you mean "competition gun" or a gun with a compensator?

[Russel Nash]

Has anyone tried these in a bullet feeder die yet? I'm suddenly curious if this would break the lead bullet malfunction in the various designs of bullet feed dies. I have a Hornady .45 die but I need to cast up more .45 ACP boolits as I've been mainly casting .40 SW right now.

Is it the bullet feeder die or the collator that drops the bullets down the tube to the die and press?

I am guessing that there are guys using Precision/Bear Creek/Black Bullets International moly/poly coated bullets with a Mr. Bullet Feeder to load up ammo for their USPSA/IDPA/Steel Challenge matches.

[Skip62]

By "compgun", do you mean "competition gun" or a gun with a compensator?

Compensator. I don't like clean whatever build up in the comp from exposed lead bases. I stated another thread about that, and lots of interesting views.

Sent from my MB886 using Tapatalk 2

[Russel Nash]

Are you shooting USPSA open division then with your compensated gun?

[Skip62]

nope, just for fun.

[Russel Nash]

Somebody on another forum was asking about if the powder coated bullets and compensated open division guns play well together.

I responded with, basically, "You should ask the .300 Blackout guys who are shooting theirs through a suppressor."

I reckoned you could shoot a lighter weight supersonic bullet through a suppressor, and if it was "user serviceable" and there were no baffles gunked up with powder coat, it should be good to go in a compensated pistol.

[Smoke4320]

I have shot about 300 rds so far thru a 308 YHM suppressor..
Some were 300 Blkout and some 308 ..and even some 6.5 grendel..
likewise some were subsonic and most were 1800-2000 FPS ...so far there is no detectable buildup in the suppressor at all with powdercoated bullets
my barrels are as clean or cleaner after shooting 30 to 50 PC'ed bullets as shooting a jacketed bullet would be..
generally its 1 patch thru and back to get the powder fouling .. 1 to dry the solvent and another to oil the bore done ..

so after that long answer .. I would say it would be just as safe as a jacketed bullet would be.. If you are not getting copper jacket buildup on the comp you will not with PC either

[Keola5o4]

Got these ready for the range 79388
Anybody have problems with the sizing die doing this 79391

[popper]

Not with ES applied PC on rifle or pistol.

[Russel Nash]

I have shot about 300 rds so far thru a 308 YHM suppressor..
Some were 300 Blkout and some 308 ..and even some 6.5 grendel..
likewise some were subsonic and most were 1800-2000 FPS ...so far there is no detectable buildup in the suppressor at all with powdercoated bullets
my barrels are as clean or cleaner after shooting 30 to 50 PC'ed bullets as shooting a jacketed bullet would be..
generally its 1 patch thru and back to get the powder fouling .. 1 to dry the solvent and another to oil the bore done ..

so after that long answer .. I would say it would be just as safe as a jacketed bullet would be.. If you are not getting copper jacket buildup on the comp you will not with PC either


Some people on this other forum had tried to shoot those black moly/poly bullets through an open gun (a compensated gun). I think they basically had to jack hammer the black gunk off the comp's baffles.

[bangerjim]

Got these ready for the range 79388
Anybody have problems with the sizing die doing this 79391

Are you using electrostatic application with a gun?

I looks like you are not, because of the rough uneven too thick surfaces. It's hard to tell from the one picture.

And those high spots will be flattened and/or scraped off when going thru the sizing die!

I have virtually NO problems like that with the HF gun appliation. Smooth....even....perfect coating everytime single with just a single coat. Harbor Freight gun is the most inexpensive way ($59 -20%) to do ES coating. There are others out there but a lot more $$. And don't bother with the Craftsman thing.........it's gone.

"Ya gets what 'ya pay fer". :D

Have fun at the range!!!!!!! Too hot here to shoot outdoors. 110+ today with heat warning.

bangerjim

[popper]

high spots will be flattened and/or scraped off I've had the HF chip off its self when seating but not off the lead. Wondering if it is some surface dirt?

[Keola5o4]

I own a craftsman gun I got 5 years ago , I currently do both piglet method and e.s. with the gun depending what I feel like that day, I send 500 of these bad boys down range this morning and I get a handful that gets rubbed off like the pictures above " they don't get loaded if rubbed off ". Can I recoat them or is just better to remelt?

[bangerjim]

When I have PC boolits that are not up to my standards, I just melt them back down in the next batch. The coating floats in a little glob on the surface of the melter. Recoating makes the coat too thick. I do not want to see over 2 thou thickness or the case scraps it off when fired.

bangerjim

[bayjoe]

Anybody try water dropping after you PC?
I did and it made my coating brittle and it flakes when I resize and add GC

[Keola5o4]

Anybody try water dropping after you PC?
I did and it made my coating brittle and it flakes when I resize and add GC

Popper water drops his 300b.o. right after he bakes them, I haven't personally tried it yet.

[bangerjim]

Anybody try water dropping after you PC?
I did and it made my coating brittle and it flakes when I resize and add GC

I do not water drop either after PC'ing. The object of the coating is not to need hard lead anymore. Some here have wrote of using much softer lead and not having any problems with leading.

Again, I do not water drop, but do not rely on that to gain any hardness anyway. Any hardness comes from my blend.

Others, please chime in here if you have any info on after-PC water dropping restoring hardness without damaging coatings.

bangerjim

[bayjoe]

I stopped water dropping and bullets turn out great. I think next is to let the gun see what it likes

[popper]

I WD with GC already on, only size after PC. This is for 308 GC & 30-30 PB, not 300 BO. 1" @ 50, plan on going to 100 next week. These are near full case of powder loads. Alloy is 1-1 1/2% Sb but I poured ~500 with 3% Sb for the 308, to go even hotter ( & try H-T in 308). Accuracy W/O WD is really poor @ 50. Going to try without GC in both, PCd & H-Td. Just finished preping cases for 9mm with H-T from the XDs, 3" bbl., attempt to use WST & 231. Thinking the WST is faster and will give a better burn in that short bbl.

[Garyshome]

Have some good results with HF red/w/gun. Coated whole except bottom, then coated whole except tip [PC gas check?]. I like RED BOOLITS!!! Will try to post pics. Also will try white and black soon. Will shoot 250 rounds in pistol and carbine soon as the rain stops.

[popper]

Garyshome - I used white for 40SW, coated base shot just a tad better but my moulds are FB, not BB. Seems like most here set the base on something to get coating around the BB which works fine as a GC. You will like the results.

[tyeo098]

I lit off some white ones, but I'm a terrible shot with my 38 snubbie.
All were on paper at 25 yds though!

I thought I saw lead skid marks in the barrel, and I got sad. Then I ran a patch though it and it was just fouling haha.

All clean!

EDIT: Adding this: SEAT THEN CRIMP.
DO NOT TRY TO DO IT ALL IN ONE STEP YOU WILL MESS UP!

Run all your rounds though the seater with the crimp backed waaay out.
Then move the seater plug waaay out and adjust the crimp.

Wish I had learned that first.

[Russel Nash]

I lit off some white ones, but I'm a terrible shot with my 38 snubbie.
All were on paper at 25 yds though!

I thought I saw lead skid marks in the barrel, and I got sad. Then I ran a patch though it and it was just fouling haha.

All clean!

EDIT: Adding this: SEAT THEN CRIMP.
DO NOT TRY TO DO IT ALL IN ONE STEP YOU WILL MESS UP!

Run all your rounds though the seater with the crimp backed waaay out.
Then move the seater plug waaay out and adjust the crimp.

Wish I had learned that first.

Hmnnn.. Good point!

My Dillon 650 has dedicated tool heads for 9mm, .40, and .45 ACP. The last die in each toolhead is a Lee Factory Crimp die. I can't remember if I kept my RCBS dies from when I had a single stage Rock Chucker press.

I might have mentioned it already, but I bought the Harbor Freight powder coat gun last week. So in a day or two I will be doing the electrostatic gun method on nonstick Reynolds foil. :-)

[xacex]

I might have mentioned it already, but I bought the Harbor Freight powder coat gun last week. So in a day or two I will be doing the electrostatic gun method on nonstick Reynolds foil. :-)

Get some 1/4" short nuts to put those boolits on. Even with the non stick foil I was getting flashing on the base that needed to be trimmed off. I only use the non-stick foil for the non- hollow point boolits. The hollow point boolits are a breeze to get perfect with a pin jig.

I drilled a plate for the .22 boolits this last week to spray some MiHec 65 grain 5.56 boolits, and those came out great! I think you will like the results you get with this method.

[Russel Nash]

I drilled a plate last week full of holes with a 5/16" drill bit. I was planning on covering the plate with foil, then rubbing my finger over the holes so I could see them through the foil. Then I was planning on shoving my boolits nose first or nose down through the foil and into the holes. Then with the boolits base up, I was going to coat them with the electrostatic gun.

As of right now, I don't know how much of a ridge of cured powder coat that will leave on the ogive.

Long term, I am envisioning swapping out all my current moulds for hollow point moulds.

[tyeo098]

Eh?

I tried the nose down thing, it didnt work out well for me.
My 9mm and 45 loads are all plain base anyways with LLA, just getting enough coat on the sides to prevent skidmarks will do just fine.

[Russel Nash]

Eh?

I tried the nose down thing, it didnt work out well for me.
My 9mm and 45 loads are all plain base anyways with LLA, just getting enough coat on the sides to prevent skidmarks will do just fine.

What about it did not work out for you, specifically?

[Smoke4320]

I drilled a plate last week full of holes with a 5/16" drill bit. I was planning on covering the plate with foil, then rubbing my finger over the holes so I could see them through the foil. Then I was planning on shoving my boolits nose first or nose down through the foil and into the holes. Then with the boolits base up, I was going to coat them with the electrostatic gun.

As of right now, I don't know how much of a ridge of cured powder coat that will leave on the ogive.

.

Pam is your friend with this method .. rub a little around the holes.. exactly how I do it .. a few of the bullets will get a buildup of coating in a small area of the ogive but I just flick them off knife

[sparkeyu]

Just thought I would let you guys know how I powder coat. I put my 40 cal. Lrf on 1/4 inch tek screws drilled into sheet metal plate over non stick foil and spray and bake, it coats part of the base. after cooled dab the base on a rag soaked in acatone and dab on plate with thin coat of powder, place nose down in holes drilled in another plate and bake again. Works for me.

[xacex]

As of right now, I don't know how much of a ridge of cured powder coat that will leave on the ogive.



From what I have experienced with just putting them base down on non-stick foil I think you will be disappointed. The powder doesn't stick to the foil, but a pancake of cured powder sometimes comes with the bullet.

[Garyshome]

These baby's are fine! All PC'd with HF gun. I tried 2 ways here, One for a PC gas check, the other for braggin rights.

[bangerjim]

Just thought I would let you guys know how I powder coat. I put my 40 cal. Lrf on 1/4 inch tek screws drilled into sheet metal plate over non stick foil and spray and bake, it coats part of the base. after cooled dab the base on a rag soaked in acatone and dab on plate with thin coat of powder, place nose down in holes drilled in another plate and bake again. Works for me.

That is what this site is about.....fresh ideas! I never thought of your method if coating the bottoms! EXCELLENT!

THANKS! :drinks:

bangerjim

[Garyshome]

My tumble coat with Lacquer thinner [HF powder in all these pics]still needs some work. But got my first batch ready to try out!

[cstrickland]

anyone done anymore testing specifically in regards to accuracy and velocity on the AR 223 front ?? I got my NOE 70 gr mold this weekend, so I am getting one step closer to making some boolit.

[cstrickland]

These baby's are fine! All PC'd with HF gun. I tried 2 ways here, One for a PC gas check, the other for braggin rights.

gary couple questions on these.

1- do you find any issue with leading or accuracy by not powder coating the bottom of the bullet
2- same thing with the top. looks like you stood some of these on the nose and coated.

[HDS]

I am using powder from Powder By The Pound to coat. The powder I use is the polyester TGIC 400 degree powder.

Is this the powder you used, or near to it anyway? As long as it's the right tech-specs I assume it don't matter what color it is.

http://www.powderbuythepound.com/RAL_3016_CORAL_RED/

Very interested to try this for my .223, a bit busy at the moment though with moving and house building, got all my reloading stuff packed up somewhere amongst lots of boxes right now.

[sly mantis]

what HF powders gives the best results with piglet method? From the sounds of it some work better than others.

[Maximumbob54]

I've tried both the red and the black and I don't see a difference in coating ability.

[Garyshome]

CS I haven't shot enough yet, It's been raining so much, haven't had the opportunity. I will shoot 300 or so by the weekend and post my results[3 diff 9mm's, S&W, Tarus, Marlin camp 9].
I wanted to try the gas check way and see what happens, Haven't shot them yet. I drilled a bunch of holes in a piece of aluminum and set them in there and sprayed them. The others were set on Hex screw heads and sprayed.All the powder is HF stuff. Doesn't seem to make much difference what color it is for the piglet method. I like RED Boolits!

[bangerjim]

what HF powders gives the best results with piglet method? From the sounds of it some work better than others.

I have tried ALL 4 colors using every solvent I can dream up! NONE of them work nearly as well as the ES gun. Liquid coating leaves globs, streaks, thin spots, and lay marks....and usually takes 2-3 ten minute bake sessions from what I have seen. The HF gun does an excellent job providing total & even coverage and a smooth professional finish that is hard as nails.

And requires only ONE coat & bake! I turn out about 150-200 slugs (depending on cal) each batch. That is about 20 minutes total time.

I would highly recommend the HF or Eastwood gun method to anyone getting into this no-lube coating method.

bangerjim :guntootsmiley:

[cstrickland]

Get some 1/4" short nuts to put those boolits on. Even with the non stick foil I was getting flashing on the base that needed to be trimmed off. I only use the non-stick foil for the non- hollow point boolits. The hollow point boolits are a breeze to get perfect with a pin jig.

I drilled a plate for the .22 boolits this last week to spray some MiHec 65 grain 5.56 boolits, and those came out great! I think you will like the results you get with this method.

XACEX do you have some pictures by change of the .22 set up ??/ I am getting ready to try ther 70 gr NOE and would like to see your results

thanks

[xacex]

XACEX do you have some pictures by change of the .22 set up ??/ I am getting ready to try ther 70 gr NOE and would like to see your results

thanks

Sorry, I didn't take a picture of that one, but I will tell you about it. It is one of the plates in this thread http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?207699-Powdercoat-jig-thread with the holes drilled between the 30 cal holes in rows of three. I cant remember the bit size off hand, but pick one that is about the shank size, and less than a quarter inch to set them in. Worked great! Here are some results. The 30 cal and 223 were done this way, and the 50 cal were put on tin foil and sprayed.
79907

Sorry, using up all my zombie green.

[Garyshome]

Nice Job!

[cstrickland]

Sorry, I didn't take a picture of that one, but I will tell you about it. It is one of the plates in this thread http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?207699-Powdercoat-jig-thread with the holes drilled between the 30 cal holes in rows of three. I cant remember the bit size off hand, but pick one that is about the shank size, and less than a quarter inch to set them in. Worked great! Here are some results. The 30 cal and 223 were done this way, and the 50 cal were put on tin foil and sprayed.
79907



Sorry, using up all my zombie green.

are you gas checking the boolits after powder coating ?? I was wondering if you could get by with out coating the gas check area, and if you would see elading from that are as a result.

[xacex]

Yes the boolits are gas checked after P/C with exception of the 50 cal boolits. I gas checked and sized those first so I could bump up the size again with the P/C. In a gas gun I would gas check, or powder coat the entire boolit, and not have an exposed base.

[Russel Nash]

Sorry, I didn't take a picture of that one, but I will tell you about it. It is one of the plates in this thread http://castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?207699-Powdercoat-jig-thread with the holes drilled between the 30 cal holes in rows of three. I cant remember the bit size off hand, but pick one that is about the shank size, and less than a quarter inch to set them in. Worked great! Here are some results. The 30 cal and 223 were done this way, and the 50 cal were put on tin foil and sprayed.
79907

Sorry, using up all my zombie green.

I have probably asked this before, but what mould did you use to make those hollow point .300 Blackout boolits?

[popper]

I prefer to check, coat, size my 30 cal. I use a larger sizer to install the checks. Cleaned the AR 308 carbine this morning after 3 range trips shooting PCd. The last trip was max H335 jacketed load under 165 GC cast, ~ 2400fps. Virtually nothing to clean. 1st #9 wet patch, then a dry one - nothing much on either. Finished just with an oil patch. BCG was clean also. Probably 200 rnds since last cleaning. Previous shot 20 rnds @ 50 into a 2" group, 2240 fps. This time ~2400fps, 12/20 into 2" @ 100, 3" high.

[xacex]

Page 67 post #1328. Yup, asked about it before, but it was a couple of weeks ago. I don't think I posted a picture in this thread with them loaded in the blackout yet.

[Garyshome]

Popper I like the sound of that... oh and also the fps! Sounds very promising.

[popper]

Garyshome - primers looked ok but I think it's about as fast as it will go with this powder in the carbine. Got to turn the gas down so I can handle the recoil. Going to coat some harder alloy and compare, try a little slower powder and call it a day. Then I'll drop back to finding the accuracy load. Then an adjustable GB for the 24" upper and test it.

[Russel Nash]

Page 67 post #1328. Yup, asked about it before, but it was a couple of weeks ago. I don't think I posted a picture in this thread with them loaded in the blackout yet.


Okay, sorry about asking again.

I went ahead and welded some "feet" to my plate:

1. To straighten it out or take the bow out of it

2. When it is flipped right side up, and the boolits's noses are pushed through it, the nose sticks out below, through the plate, so having the feet gives it enough height where the noses will clear.

Here is my plate, upside down:

http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt112/gryphon1994/3E0E41F5-1FF9-42BB-B0D6-705D1DD38780-1770-000004649FF7F469_zps1bb26ab1.jpg

Then here is the plate right side up with some piglet coated 9's, some still in need of sizing .40's, and .45 SWC's, with some Hornady .45 230 grain lead round noses in the back (just to demonstrate how my LRN's will stand up when I cast my own):

http://i603.photobucket.com/albums/tt112/gryphon1994/D9DFE2D1-78ED-4FA5-A323-205E73BE4C8A-1770-0000046806DA1260_zpse47229e6.jpg

[xacex]

I think that will work great if not for the base up coating, for gas check rifle boolits if the holes are small enough.

[Russel Nash]

I think that will work great if not for the base up coating, for gas check rifle boolits if the holes are small enough.

I don't have any rifle moulds, that's why I keep asking about yours. So when I do get a .308ish mould, it will be a hollow point one like yours. I have some more of that metal. Way back when, when I used to do metal studs and drywall, we had a special kind of fine thread black drywall screw that had cutting tips on it like a self tapping sheet metal screw. We called those screws "cutters". So that is what I plan on doing for the next sheet once I get a rifle mould in. The sheet above is drilled a 1.5" on centers. I will go to 1 inch centers for the screws on the next one.

[popper]

Anybody try pop rivets dropped into a hole yet. Should be easy to replace & first coating would hold the semi-permanent in place.

[NineInchNails]

^ ^ ^ That sounds like a very good idea.

[ckcadavona]

Is the funky smell these produce while shooting a concern? I know in the harbor freight instructions it mentions baking in a ventilated oven.

[sbeatty1983]

I wouldnt breath it in any more than i had to. Also dont bake in an oven that will be used for food prep.

[Skip62]

Funky smell from Powder Coat? I haven't noticed that, I certainly do with HT though

[bangerjim]

There is some smoke and smell from the HF powder when baked at 400F. Not much. I do it outside so I can see it in the sunlight. And smell it when a breeze blows in my direction. I would NEVER EVER bake these in my shop or a garage.....there is some outgassing and smoke that takes place. We breathe enough crapola shooting and smelting and fluxing and casting that we do not want to inhale anything more!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

bangerjim

[a.squibload]

Dang this thread is really moving along!

How thick a coating can you get with PC?
A friend & I are learning the ropes with 50 cal muzzleloaders.
My .495 cast balls seem to do well with .010 cloth patches,
making an extra .020 or so of padding in the barrel.
Would I be wrong to equate thickness between cloth and PC?

In other words, what would my chances be of using PC
to avoid dealing with patches?

Might also be convinced try PC on .40 S&W boolits for a polygon barrel.

[Garyshome]

Alright I shot around 200 or so 9mm out of 3 different guns, All loads were 4.5gr universal with a lee 356-125-2R lead boolit sized to 356 after PC'ing, piglet method with lacquer thinner. The tarus pt99 picked up some leading[in- correct boolit size I think], average fps was 1124. S&W 469 picked up some leading[haven't slugged barrel yet] 1063 fps. Marlin camp 9 No leading!!!! 1293 fps! I am happy with the results good fps, I wanted to see what these would do. Loaded more this afternoon. Need to get lee 358-125-2R mold for the Tarus.

[prickett]

Alright I shot around 200 or so 9mm out of 3 different guns, All loads were 4.5gr universal with a lee 356-125-2R lead boolit sized to 356 after PC'ing, piglet method with lacquer thinner. The tarus pt99 picked up some leading[in- correct boolit size I think], average fps was 1124. S&W 469 picked up some leading[haven't slugged barrel yet] 1063 fps. Marlin camp 9 No leading!!!! 1293 fps! I am happy with the results good fps, I wanted to see what these would do. Loaded more this afternoon. Need to get lee 358-125-2R mold for the Tarus.

My Taurus PT99's barrel had the largest inner diameter of all my 9's. At .356" it wouldn't hit 8x11 paper from 7 yards. I had to shoot .358" sized boolits to get no leading and be able to hit the paper. Once I did that it out shot my SIG and CZ. I use the Lee .356 TCN mold, but use aluminum tape to beagle it to .358".

[popper]

Just don't size for the Taurus. If that works, just beagle it or add some Sb (or reduce the Sn).

[tyeo098]

Made 100 red 45 ACPs and had a bit of lead in the barrel.
I attribute this to some 'shadows' I had one some boolets where you could see some lead, but Id dint think it would be a problem.

Oops. :P

Coat them all the way!

Stuff was pretty accurate though... RIA 1911 at 15 yds :)

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s249/tyeo098/20130825_220935_zpsd52ad445.jpg (http://s154.photobucket.com/user/tyeo098/media/20130825_220935_zpsd52ad445.jpg.html)

[Garyshome]

I slugged the Tarus barrel and it was about .3575", and these lee casts are dropping at .356". But the leading is much less with the PC, then without. Also I could not check BIN before, but I can now. OK got it now. My numbers were wrong.

[Garyshome]

All my 9's were very accurate. For the second time with the Tarus and first with the S&W. Haven't sighted in the red dot on the marlin yet, but it's pretty close. No keyholes.

[alfloyd]

"I slugged the Tarus barrel and it was about .3755"

That is way large for a 9 MM.
My PT99 slugged at 0.3575 inch.
I powder coat using the piglet method and size to 0.358.
I have shot over 400 of these in Action Pistol matches and have no leading. :)

Lafaun

[prickett]

"I slugged the Tarus barrel and it was about .3755"

That is way large for a 9 MM.
My PT99 slugged at 0.3575 inch.
I powder coat using the piglet method and size to 0.358.
I have shot over 400 of these in Action Pistol matches and have no leading. :)

Lafaun

Ditto everything you just said with mine.

[Dolomite_supafly]

I picked up a powder coating gun yesterday. After messing around for a while I think I will be using it rather than the piglet method.

I use a piece of 3" long copper wire to hang the bullets from the rack that came with my toaster oven. The wire is wrapped around the bullet in a lube groove and twisted in place. I then hang them from the rack. I can do about 25 at a time. It is a bit slower but I can prep the 25 bullets in about the same time it takes to bake the bullets. I think this method give results are are more uniform and definitely a lot better looking.

I tried using bullets poked through aluminum foil and through a pan. Bascially I was leaving the base esposed to the powder coating. Worked great until I removed the bullets. Every bullet now has shards of the aluminum foil attached to it. I can still use them but they look pretty bad.

I barely coat the bullets. It is more of a light misting that a coating but when I baked them the coating becomes more uniform and better looking. I am afraid that if I add to much to the bullet my bore rider bullets will have problems chambering in my 300 Blackout.

[popper]

dolomite - are you shooting subsonic with the BO? Have you tried the H-T for SS? I did some green H-T for 30-30 that I'm going to try at plinker loads. The non-stick foil may help with your foil covered noses. I found twisting to break them loose before cooling left less of a divit.

[bangerjim]

dolomite - are you shooting subsonic with the BO? Have you tried the H-T for SS? I did some green H-T for 30-30 that I'm going to try at plinker loads. The non-stick foil may help with your foil covered noses. I found twisting to break them loose before cooling left less of a divit.

Non-stick foil is a miracle on a roll! I use it about 3-4 times B4 the coat on the foil starts forming "flash" on the boolit bases. Twisting off works. Actually the 1st couple batchs on new foil actually FALL off before I can get them back in the shop to remove them. I do 50-66 (depending on cal) on a sheet x2 racks at a time, so it moves pretty fast. And I have extra racks so I can fill them up while the others are baking.

If you are worring about the base being coated, just do what another member suggested: after baking, pour a little actetone on a rag in a dish, dab the base on the wet rag, tap the base in a thin layer of powder, and bake again laying down. You can use a different color! Black boolits with red "gas checks" look cool.

bangerjim

[bstone5]

I was powder coating 45 ACP 200 Gr bullets this weekend with the powder coat gun.

I saw a post where someone was putting the cast bullets on screen wire to keep them from sticking.

I put the non-stick Reynolds Foil on my 14 Gage steel plates and then some old screen wire on top of the foil.

The dry powder falls down inside the screen and keeps the base of the bullets free of coating with the powder coat.

This arrangement worked well and may do this all of the time, will need to find some more screen wire.

Keeping the base clean makes putting on gas checks from cola cans a lot easier.

Pictures Below.

[xacex]

Looks like aluminium screen door screen. I just put some new screen like that on my sliding door. It was cheep too. I think I paid 8$ for a roll.

[Dolomite_supafly]

dolomite - are you shooting subsonic with the BO? Have you tried the H-T for SS? I did some green H-T for 30-30 that I'm going to try at plinker loads. The non-stick foil may help with your foil covered noses. I found twisting to break them loose before cooling left less of a divit.

H-T???

So far I am only doing my subsonic bullets which will be blue. I am going to cast a bunch of my supersonic bullets and coat them with red HF powder. 90% of my shooting is with subsonic loads. You cannot push a powder coated bullet hard enough in a 300 Blckout to have a problem.

The problem with my method was I was punching the nose of the bullet through the foil and then only the bottom of the bullet was sticking out. The powder coat was on the bullet as well as on the aluminum foil, fuzing the two. I cannot stand them up because they are too long and fall over. I do not mind doing the wire method because I can sit and watch TV while I do them. It also takes about as long to bake a batch as it does to wire up a batch. It is also the same method I used when I used to plate my bullets using copper sulfate. Copper plating was cheap and easy but very slow going. But it worked and applied enough copper to the bullets to prevent leading. When I remelted the plated bullets down I could skim what looked like a bullet off the top of the melt. It looked just like the bullet except you could crush it by squeezing the "jacket".

Here is a picture of my $20 plating setup:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/Adyth/ced95398.jpg
And the results:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v446/Adyth/f717f0f5.jpg
I gave up because it was extremely slow going. I could do about 20 bullets an hour.


Non-stick foil is a miracle on a roll! I use it about 3-4 times B4 the coat on the foil starts forming "flash" on the boolit bases. Twisting off works. Actually the 1st couple batchs on new foil actually FALL off before I can get them back in the shop to remove them. I do 50-66 (depending on cal) on a sheet x2 racks at a time, so it moves pretty fast. And I have extra racks so I can fill them up while the others are baking.

If you are worring about the base being coated, just do what another member suggested: after baking, pour a little actetone on a rag in a dish, dab the base on the wet rag, tap the base in a thin layer of powder, and bake again laying down. You can use a different color! Black boolits with red "gas checks" look cool.

bangerjim

When I get around to doing pistol bullets I think this is what I will do. Pretty ingenious method for doing this.

Anything I do is going to be a slow process because I cannot stand for very long. Basically I get 30 minutes of working, maybe 45, and then I am done for at least a few hours if not the rest of the day. I was in a helicopter accident in 2008 that changed my life. I cannot do things I once took for granted and my wife has to help me. I have to walk with crutches to keep me from constantly falling. I need help getting dressed most days. I can no longer drive because my legs can give out. I literally spend 16+ hours a day in bed and that is on "good" days. On bad days I will be out of bed 2-3 hours a day. I used to shoot 5-6 days a week and now I am lucky to get to the range once a month so what I can do in a few hours a week will be more than enough to cover my shooting habits now. I can shoot at home but I don't very often unless I am working up test loads.

[popper]

Yes Hi-Tek coating from Bayou bullets, $47 for 1/2 liter delivered. Liquid that goes on like piglet & works great < 1200-1400 fps. No fancy rig to hold the long skinny boolits. It did NOT work for my full house 30-30 loads. No lead but no accuracy. Going to try some plinker loads. Seems like it would be a good easy solution for the BO. I quit doing the PC on pistol (9 & 40) cause the H-T is so easy and works great & I've been shooting a lot of pistol lately. Check out the thread here on the stuff.

[Dolomite_supafly]

I used powder from Powder By The Pound with the piglet method except I used Klean Strip lacquer thinner rather than acetone. With lacquer thinner it is almost fool proof, you only need to make sure you don't use too much powder for the amount of bullets you have. There is no waiting for the lacquer thinner to evaporate, just tumble until the bullets are coated then pour off what is essentially clean lacquer thinner.

Coating pistol bullets are not going to be a problem. I shoot flat points in everything so I will set them out nose down and coat.

This isn't about reducing leading because I did not have a problem with leading. It is about reducing my exposure to lead.

Either way I found what I am going to use to coat the bullets. Just a matter of figuring out which is better for me.

[20gauge]

Hey Guys. Just joined group and I've read a lot of the info posted about PC cast bullets, but I still have a couple of questions. Can you powder coat bullets already lubed? And do you have to clean all bullets before coating? ( with acetone)

[popper]

Got to get the lube and any 'junk' off first. It won't stick to alox.