Scored an old plumbers furnace.

[hunter64]

I work for my local gas utility company and I got a call today to go to a customers home and disconnect the secondary line out to the garage. I showed up at the house and told the lady that I could disconnect the secondary at the back valve and cap it to make it safe. She said that her husband had literally torn down the garage in the back yard by hand on the weekend and there is a pipe sticking out of the ground and could I come and see if it can be removed. So we went out to the back yard and sure enough there was a heap of wood that was a garage and out of the ground was the pipe. I removed the pipe and was walking back to the house and the wife said to me "They had this old heater in the garage". On the other side of the heater was an old plumbers lead furnace with a cast iron pot beside it still full of lead and beside that was bars of lead about 300 lbs of it. The lead furnace still has kerosine in it of some sort and I am kind of excited to see if I can get it to run again. She said just take it if you want it, my husband was going to haul it all to the dump. Well I hauled it all to the van and hauled it again to the garage at home. This almost sounds like one of those porno books "I never thought it would happen to me". I will get a picture of it when I can find my stupid digital camera, darn kids.

[ron brooks]

So did you get the lead too?

[hunter64]

Yup. She just wanted to get rid of all of it, I have lots of pure lead now for the old front loaders.

[shooter575]

Ahhhh,things like that make ya feel good about stuff.I like the "big score" stories.

[GLL]

:) :) !

Jerry

[Bret4207]

Congrats! Those gas/kero furnaces are the cats for smelting down big runs, heating metal to bend it back where it goes and giving the kiddies a real show after dark. Just remember they are an OUTSIDE TOY! The flame will shoot up about 18" in day light and 3-4 feet in the dark. And they are HOT.

For cleaning it I'd empty whats in it, get some fresh gasoiline, (I've heard of but never actually seen one that runs on kero), and a can or SeaFoam or Berrymans B-12 carb cleaner. Add the cleaner first and fill the tank about 3/4 full. Add a few drops of light oil to the plunger, pump it up till you get pressure. There may be a small basin at the bottom of the coil that you fill with gas and light, otherwise turn the handle open till it starts spiting gas and light it with a propane torch. Mind you you do this at arms length with your face down low and away from the thing till you figure it out. You may have to leave the torch running at the base of the coil for a while till the crap clears out and it runs right. My furnace requires I leave the torch there all the time, so I set it on low and lock it open. This is because every now and again it'll just poof out for some reason I haven't figured out yet.

Be advised these things are NOISY. Sounds like a miniature jet engine afterburner. Very, very cool. These things are great for stuff like heating the hub on a rust frozen plow wheel or that 12 foot long hunk of I-beam that got bent when Uncle Ernie hit it with the Caddy back in '73 that you now need.

I had a website on these things saved at one point, but I can't find it now. Google?

[hunter64]

Bret4207: I tried googling it and found nothing, tried plumbers furnace etc. and nothing. It says on the top Clayton & Something(I will clean it off tonight and take some pictures) made in the US. There is a coil in the middle and a handle out the side but for the life of me I don't see an orfice to fire. When I get home tonight from wook I will investigate further. Sounds like a lot of fun if I can get it to run.

[Bret4207]

Clayton and Lambert. Put some gas in it, pump it up and turn the handle. You'll find the outlet!

[hunter64]

Indeed it is Lambert. Here are some pictures that I took, the cast iron pot on top is still 1/2 full of lead.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/1964bigfoot/IM001633.jpg
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/1964bigfoot/IM001632.jpg
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/1964bigfoot/IM001635.jpg
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/1964bigfoot/IM001634.jpg
http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e304/1964bigfoot/IM001631.jpg


There probably is gas in it but it has been in there for how many years I don't know and it smells more like camping naptha or kerosene than gas. So on the third picture down, the brass pump is on the right and it seems to work, I have no idea what is on the left with the big eye loop in the top, and in the middle is some kind of adjustment shaft I would assume but it is rusted and doesn't move. Does this look about what yours looks like?

[hunter64]

Ok: I took it apart and I must be missing something. On the 4th picutre I unscrewed the union at the top of the valve and the curly metal piece in the last picture came out on one piece with the stem with the flat end on picture 3 (middle one). When I pump it up and open the valve sure enough I can smell (smells more like paint thinner now) so the bottom canister and pump are working fine. So the gas goes up inside the curly metal thing and winds around to the bottom and sits there not going anywhere. I finally got the stem out of the bottom and it was hollow inside the stem. I thought there would be an orfice or something down there or at least in the curly tube so the gas can get out and you just adjust the amount by the valve. If I keep unscrewing the stem out I can eventually hear the gas just before the stem is unscrewed and it is bypassing thru the threads. I must be missing a piece with some kind of orfice on this thing.

[454PB]

Georgeld from this forum very graciously sent me an old plumbers pot very similar to yours. I've been working on it off and on, it had a lot of rusted valves and parts, and the plunger for the air pump was totaled. I built a new plunger rod on my lathe, and I'm most recently working on the fuel control valve. The original was all rusted together into a mass, and I've been trying to get it loosened up by soaking it in Marvel Mystery Oil.

The round handled valve (looks like a hose bib handle) is the air flow control. The horizontal rod with the flattened ends is the fuel control, the cap with the loop is simply the opening to add fuel. That coil is the preheater, and is the real secret to how these things put out so much heat. As Bret said, they require assistance from another heat source (like a propane torch) to get up a head of steam. On my old one, once it started roaring, the propane torch could be removed. That usually took about 5 to 10 minutes. I always dumped about a teaspoon of unleaded gasoline in the center of the preheating coil to prime and light the beast.

As was stated, these things are awesome when they work correctly. I used one for years, but left it behind when I retired and moved. I ran my old one on unleaded gas, and you need to be away from any buildings or flammable materials when using this....it is unpredictable and can flare up, especially when first lit.

[Bret4207]

I made the supreme sacrifice and walked out to the garage, leaving my COFFEE BEHIND!! Mine is the same model as yours. That rod in pic #3 with the flattened end that sticks out horizontally near the bottom of the upright part of the furnace is where the gas comes out. If you can get it out, I'd heat it up good and work it a bit, you'll see there is a tiny hole in the side of the rod that ends up pointing up through the coil. That where the gas comes out. It's really tiny, like .020 tiny. Remember you have evaporated gas flowing through there so it doesn't need to be very big. Wait, you're a gas serviceman!, you know what what I mean. I think the rod is unscrews for cleaning and adjustment. It wants to point right up through the center of the coil.

I'd empty the old gas, add some fresh and some cleaner and try it. Heat the coil with a torch first if you like to avoid the almost certain fire that will result. I usually just turn mine on and let it burn, but I ain't too bright.

[hunter64]

Thanks guys for the info. The small hole must be covered with rust, there has to be a hole somewhere for the fumes to get out and I kind of figured it would be near the top of the coil but I guess I was wrong. The pressure system works great so I think I will just unscrew the rod and let it sit in some penetrating oil for the weekend. I am going to the girlfriends out of town and will be back sunday night so I will keep you guys updated to what I find. This is kind of fun.

[axxman928]

hunter64,
You really scored on this find. The secret to restoring this furnace to working
condition is to take your time.Remember,they no longer make parts for these units.
If you want to sell it,please let me know. I'm always looking for spare parts for
these units. Good luck. axxman928

[Bret4207]

I am going to the girlfriends out of town and will be back sunday night so I will keep you guys updated to what I find. This is kind of fun.

Does your wife know you're going?!!!!

[76 WARLOCK]

I was an apprentice plumber 47 years ago and used one a lot, we only used white gas in them, coleman fuel is the same thing. Auto fuel has additives that will plug them up.

I have one and use it a lot when the weather is nice enough to work outside.

[scrapcan]

The coil is to heat the fuel to create vapor or in other atomize the fuel so it burns more completely. You can build a similar aparatus to make an oil burning forge or crucible furnace. It can be a little hair raising learning to start and operate those types of burners also.

[hunter64]

Thanks for all your help guys. Looking at the end plug type thing and reading some of your comments I figured the little orfice must be somewhere on the rod that is hollow and be positioned inside the coil. I took it off and ran it on the wire wheel and found a small indent. I let it sit all day in penitrating oil and I just got home and turned it on the wire wheel again and sure enough there was a small outline of a hole. I used my orfice drills and with the smallest one I slowly turned it thru the hole because I didn't know how big the hole was. Once I got it thru I started to work all the rust out of it and blew it out with my air compressor. I installed it back on the heater and gave it a few pumps and turned the knob and sure enough you can hear the gas coming out, yes sir. So when I get back from the girl friends on Sunday night I will play with it abit more and fire it up. My biggest concern was that the pump up valve wouldn't work but it works just fine. I wonder how old this thing is, looking on the internet it says that Clayton and Lambert were bought out in the late 30's and the factory moved and then it gets kind of foggy about how long these were in production. There was an extra coil sitting with it so I have that also as a spare.

[trk]

I have one just like it (gas version - red band on the bottom) that I no longer use - if anyone is interested in it. (Located in Virginia)

[0802]

I've got one just like yours back at my parent's house. As stated, works great when it works, but mine has been temperamental.

I think I got some sediment in the coil somewhere, although I did tear the whole thing down and got to the filter inside the coil and fuel lines -- looks like screen from a door. Just as I though I might have gotten it fixed -- some idiot (me) broke the flattened rod with the pinhole in it. Anyone have any ideas on how to make a new one? I'm not machine shop equipped or trained, but have limited access to those who are.

I'd love to get thing back up and running, but this broken piece is obviously holding me back.

Josh

[Fireball 57]

Got one of the above Lambert plumber's pot myself. Put "white gas" in it but couldn't get it hot enough to melt lead=only about 350 degrees. Maybe I need to use gas? Or---maybe it needs cleaning.

[axxman928]

trk,
P.M. sent. Watch your e-mail. axxman928

[Bret4207]

Got one of the above Lambert plumber's pot myself. Put "white gas" in it but couldn't get it hot enough to melt lead=only about 350 degrees. Maybe I need to use gas? Or---maybe it needs cleaning.

Not hot enough? Mine will bring a full dutch oven filler with ww to molten in maybe 8-10 minutes. I have to turn in down or the melt will glow. Yeah, I'd say it needs cleaning or something.

[hunter64]

Two words. Holy Crap This thing sure is loud and man does it heat. Got back late last night from the girlfriends and I just couldn't wait to see how it worked. Dumped all the old what I think was Kerosene out of it and put in some gas just to see if it worked. Fired up the propane torch and stuck it in the little hole and cranked the handle after I had pumped it up for about 30 seconds. Kind of scared me at first with the noise and the flame that was coming out of it, really wasn't sure how loud it was going to be. It didn't take very long for the coil to get white hot and man talk about heat, I put the cast iron pot that was 3/4 full of lead on top and let it heat for about 5 mintues and was stating to get impatient with it because with all that heat it should be melted by now. I grabbed my stir spoon and touched the top and it was melted, just the top layer was full of crap and I couldn't see it. I stired in some flux and removed all the crap out of it and that lovely blue color came shinning thru. I poured it out and 13 lbs. of nice lead. This thing is amazing, I really don't have much use for it because I have another propane heater that I use, not sure what I will do with it but it is kind of neat.

[Bret4207]

I told you! Cool factor of at least 9.7. Burn possibilty factor 10.0!

[hunter64]

0802: Looking at the piece that you are talking about, it is just a 1/4" (didn't measure it )piece of pipe with a small hole drilled in it. I would just go to a plumbers store and get a couple of pieces of the correct size, you could cap the end and drill a very small hole in the pipe to match the other one that is broken. If you screw up that is what the extra pipes are for. The hole in mine is very small and I used orfice drills to clean it out so you will have to experiment with the size, use the smallest one you can find at home depot and if it is still to big then I would peen around the hole with a punch to make it slightly smaller.

[glicerin]

Guys: white gas(camper fuel only). When, not if, you develop a leak, you have a nice flamer in various unwanted directions. Outside only, and not too close to anything you hold dear! I relaxed a lot when I replaced it with an 80000 btu propane cooker.

[hunter64]

glicerin: I think I will try some camp fuel in mine. What I have noticed is when it gets really hot the flame starts to really lift off of the orifice and it flares out. I put a couple of tablespoons of gas in the little cup underneath the orifice and light it on fire and then slowly turn the knob and it fires right up until it gets really hot and then it starts to flare out. I just keep the propane torch on thru the bottom of the hole pointing up and it works great. Maybe the gasoline when it vaporizes is doing this to me and maybe switching to white gas will solve this problem, might not be as volatile. Man this thing sure is fun to play with. Finally figured out what this little handle with a sharp wire on the end was for, it is to clean out the orifice, duh.

[hunter64]

Well I tried camp fuel in it today and the same problem, goes out once in a while when it starts to vapourize. The camp fuel was 5x as expensive as gas and the cost of one propane cylinder is about the difference between the two so I will just run regular gas in it and keep the propane torch on low in case the flame goes out.

glicerin: What kind of propane setup do you have? I have natural gas that I could tap into about 8 feet away from the corner of the garage and with a long bbq hose I could move it outside the back of the garage, just convert the propane to Natural gas and away I go. That way I would not have to keep filling the coleman stove with gas all the time and I would never run out of propane and NG is cheaper.

[axxman928]

hunter64,
Check your pm's. Incomming. axxman928