Bullets instead of buckshot

[gotin]

It is probably a stupid question, but here goes - can you use cast bullets, lets say 125gr .38 instead of buckshot? I happen to have tons of lead bullets and for various reasons do not want to cast buckshot balls. Can I use the bullets at hand instead of balls and how will that effect the accuracy?

I've never reloaded shotgun hulls and I have no idea if it is even possible, just lining up info before I get into it.
Thanks.

[L1A1Rocker]

That's a very interesting question. Bump!

[longbow]

I'll go out on a limb here and say "Sure you can use them."

As long as the weight is equivalent to a published recipe for a load and they fit into the hull it will be safe to shoot (in cylinder bore anyway).

A lot depends on what bore diameter you are talking about. .38 cal. (0.357") is larger than 00 buck which is .33 cal. In a 12 ga. you might get 2 x 2 stacking using .38 cal. bullets so space would be a problem. In a 10 ga. they would probably stack 3 x 3 in a shotcup.

It is easy to sort that out by using a shotcup or barrel to see how they fit together in twos and threes.

Also, you would most likely have to stack them individually nose up or down (maybe alternated in layers?) as just dropping them in a hull would result in random/messy layers taking even more room.

As for groups, I have to guess they would be poor in comparison to nice round hard buckshot as the bullets would tumble in flight so would tend to veer off in different directions just as deformed shot does. At short ranges maybe not an issue but you won't see nice tight long range groups.

Another consideration might be as to whether this would be choke friendly if a choke is involved. Again, in a 12 ga. whether stacked 2 x 2 alternated nose up/nose down in layers or if they fit 3 x 3 I suspect they wouldn't "give" much in a choke constriction like nice round balls would due to cylindrical contact. Maybe an issue, maybe not. Again in a 10 ga. probably not an issue due to better fit.

If you try it I would be interested to see the results. Just remember that these bullets weigh more than 00 or 000 buck so "pellet" count won't work, you will have to make sure the payload weighs what the recipe calls for.

Just my thoughts.

Longbow

[gotin]

I am getting my first shotgun today and since I've been reloading for all my other guns I will do for the shotgun too. The prices of buckshot I saw - about $4-5 per lb- seemed a bit steep and then I remembered all the cast bullets I have in my garage, hence my question.
I have to experiment and see how they stack and shoot
It seems that 4 125gr bullets will be a bit over 1 oz in weight.

[OnHoPr]

Interesting concept. I'd like to hear what different posters would think. A thought did cross my noodle. Sometimes, (most often) shotgun wad columns tend to collapse canted, which might bring up a bridging issue with that type of projectile. I suppose it would matter if the boolits could possibly get ahead of one another going down the barrel. Also, depending on the fit in the barrel they might bounce off one another. I suppose the concept will linger in the noodle for a while.

[kullas]

At 4 to 5 dollars a lb it would not take to long to pay for a buckshot mold

[gotin]

At 4 to 5 dollars a lb it would not take to long to pay for a buckshot mold

I am considering this too, I just have about 600 lbs of rejected cast boolits, mostly .38 and 9mm. If I can put them to use instead of having to melt them and cast them again, it will save time.

[John in WI]

I didn't do that exact thing, but played around for a while with an idea about "non-spherical shot". I had a pile of bad .38 WC's and cut them in half with a big side cutter. In order to get them to fit 3 in a layer, I had to "persuade" them to fit--by tapping them a little oval in shape with a hammer. since they were WC's, by cutting them in half you get 2 pieces with a flat end and a chisel shaped end. I would stack them with the flat end down on the wad base, and the second layer with the flat side facing up (ie, sharp edge to sharp edge). Then I would dial in the weight to 1 1/8 ounce by adding small bird shot pellets between the big pellets.

It took a really long time to make shells, but the close range devestation on phone books was pretty wicked. I actually was thinking about the non-spherical shot to help spread the pattern at shorter ranges (the way some bird hunters do). But it didn't seem to work in this case. I'm not sure--maybe the pellets are too heavy to be much affected by uneven wind drag (at this close range at least).

Is it safe to do? I put probably 20 of these mongrel through my shotgun without a problem. You can safely sub buckshot for birdshot IF the weight and other components are identical.

You're right--$5/pound is pricy for buck. I got a Sharpshooter mold for under $40 and haven't looked back.

If you give it a shot, I'd be interested to see what you come up with. I was thinking heavy cubic shot would be neat, and even posted a thread about having a mold built to make some. But it might be a solution in search of a problem.

[gotin]

Maybe the time it would take to stack the bullets will be the biggest problem, it may be easier just to remelt the bullets and cast pellets. I just ordered a Lee 00 mold.
I do not intend to hunt, so buckshot will be my only reloading. On the other hand the uneven shape of the bullets may be a benefit at close ranges - only time will tell. A local guy has a used Mec 600 for sale and in a week or two I should have all set and will play with it.

[Bullwolf]

I have done something similar to this.

One weekend, we were trying to cut down a tree stump by shooting at it repeatedly on the Ranch.

I had previously cast a very large pile of Lee 150 grain flat nose boolits out of straight wheel weight lead. I was intending to load them, along with a gas check for use in the .30-30 Winchester.

Had the MEC 12 gauge shotgun press mounted on the bench at the time, and it was already set up for my light trap load.

Ran out of loaded ammo pretty early on, and still had quite a bit of tree stump left to go.

I had previously loaded up 12 gauge 2 3/4 shells with a stacked 8 pellet 00 buck load, and a heavy cast (Lyman) slug load, both using old Hercules Blue Dot powder.

I took a look at the skeet/trap load that I was using at the time.
*Note this was a good 20 years or so ago when lead shot was inexpensive, and it was still pretty economical to reload light trap and skeet loads*

The skeet load that I was using was a 12 gauge 2 3/4 Winchester AA hull loaded with 21 grains of Unique, or 17.5 grains of Red Dot, and 1 ounce & 1/8th of lead shot, in a Winchester #WAA12 white wad, or Claybuster equivalent.

I had already used up all the lead shot that I had on hand the previous weekend shooting clay pigeons from the launcher. I still had powder though, and W209 primers.

Got the bright idea to stack up 3 of the Lee 150 grain .309 diameter .30-30 boolits minus the gas check, in the bottom of a Winchester #WAA12 white wad and use it along with my skeet load powder charge of Unique, or possibly Red Dot. I went with whichever bushing and powder that I had in the press at the time.

I did not use a nitro card, or any type of over wad with the load.

150 grains x 3 = 450 grains roughly.
1 ounce = 437.5 grains.

Figured this was close enough to 1 and 1/8 ounce to work.

Shot them through a 12 gauge cylinder bore barrel at the tree stump. Crimps were not beautiful, but they were not horrible either. Nothing would fall out of the end, and the shells would easily chamber. Mild recoil, and there were no obvious overpressure signs.

In no time at all, had cut clean through the stump using this cobbled together 12 gauge load. I also used up most of my light shotgun powder, and a fair amount of my pile of 150 grain .309 diameter cast boolits.

Never shot that 3 x 150 grain load for a pattern, or at anything else really. But, it worked just fine for a cutting down a tree stump load.

Not sure how much this experience will contribute to the discussion, but here it is anyways. File it under the "I tried it once, and it sort of worked" category.



- Bullwolf

[ovendoctor]

It is probably a stupid question, but here goes - can you use cast bullets, lets say 125gr .38 instead of buckshot? I happen to have tons of lead bullets and for various reasons do not want to cast buckshot balls. Can I use the bullets at hand instead of balls and how will that effect the accuracy?

I've never reloaded shotgun hulls and I have no idea if it is even possible, just lining up info before I get into it.
Thanks.

Man this just gives me the willies :groner:

I see dolly parton syndrome in spades [10# of mud in a 5# sack]

how about I send ya a small flat rate box of samples to reload

pm me if interested

Doc.:redneck:

[Nazgul]

I have a Serbu Super Shorty, 12ga. with 6.5" barrel. Was looking for something easy to load and came up with a .60" roundball. Made a punch with a shoulder and cup, drop the ball in and whacked it with a hammer. They come out oval shaped and 2 fit inside a 12 ga. cup. Stack them inside, crimp and shoot. The weight is about 1-1/4 oz. They stay within a 12" circle to 25 yards or so.

Don

[Lonegun1894]

I came across a box of old corroded .243 jacketed bullets at a garage sale about a few years ago, and dont have a .243, but wasn't going to pass them up at less than a buck. Fast forward til earlier this year, and still not having a .243, I got curious and figured out that 7 of these will fit inside a 12ga shell. I dont remember the load, but it was lighter than aything I could find in my manuals, and I remember I used Unique. Fired through a NEF Pardner single shot with a modified choke, the patterns varied 1 -2 FEET across at 20yds, so it was very inconsistent, with most of the bullets keyholing. I know it was a waste, but these were corroded enough that I wouldn't have used them in a rifle anyway, and they were just collecting dust, so they got sent down range as an experiment. Now the .243s actually fit very well and packed tightly into the shotcup, but I have not tried so cant comment on your .38s... Let us know?

[gotin]

I got the reloading press (mec650) and some WAA12 wads, but when I tried to make some testing rounds the hull's walls got crushed during the crimping stage.
21gr of Unique, WAA12 wad, Winchester hulls, W219, I tried with 4 125gr .38 RNFP, 4 125gr 9mm RN and even 4 115gr 9mm Rn - no matter how I stack them, they still are too high and cannot be crimped. Are there shorter wads? It seems that they have to be at least 1/8 shorter than the WAA12 I have.

[Mooseman]

YOU are asking for trouble...Havent you ever heard of shot "Bridging " in a barrel...?
You are gonna bulge or burst a barrel.
You may be injured or injure someone else if that happens.

Rich

[LUBEDUDE]

I had some semi-spherical balls so to say, i.e, bad bullets. Loaded a Duplex load with 7 1/2 shot and 3 semis. Gave to a freind. He used them for coyote killers and grackle (big black bird) killers. He loves them!

[shotman4]

mooseman is right. buck shot is round so it can move. you get 3 slugs that lock and you will open up the barrel. and maybe someone nearby

[Spawn-Inc]

i've shot 2.5 158 grain 358 bullets before in a 2 3/4" load. i stacked them on end and filled the rest with cream of wheat. worked no problems, but it was only 1 shot.

i've also ripped apart those crappy rem thunderbolts and used they as buckshot, they weight the same.

[BAGTIC]

Non-spherical flat ended shot stacked end to end should tighten the pattern at closer ranges as it eliminates the camming action that causes round shot to disperse. As most of us load shot cups nowdays if they stack in the shotcup fairly snugly there should be no more danger of bridging than with round shot as they would not be able to tip far enough in any directing to form a bridge..

[BAGTIC]

Buckshot is not round so it can move. It is round for the same reason other shot sizes are round. It is the most convenient shape to manufacture and load.

[gotin]

After many experiments I can't seem to find a combination of wads and bullets that will crimp without crushing or bulging the hulls. Also it takes way too long to stack the darn bullets in the wad.
So I decided to just remelt them and cast Lee slugs - it is much faster and easier to load than stacking bullets in the wad.